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TNF: Steelers @ Browns


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9 minutes ago, kevwun said:

If Garret had pushed him and took a swing at him, this would have been a non-issue.  He sort of made Rudolph the victim when he tried to kill him with his own helmet.

Exactly. Garrett got away with a dirty late hit, Rudolph was frustrated by that and his shitty play and instigated a confrontation, then Garrett tried to kill him with a helmet. 

If Garrett just took a swing at him nobody would be saying he should be suspended for the season. People acting like trying to take a helmet off to fight and wielding it as a weapon are anywhere near each other in severity are just being morons. 

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9 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Exactly. Garrett got away with a dirty late hit, Rudolph was frustrated by that and his shitty play and instigated a confrontation, then Garrett tried to kill him with a helmet. 

If Garrett just took a swing at him nobody would be saying he should be suspended for the season. People acting like trying to take a helmet off to fight and wielding it as a weapon are anywhere near each other in severity are just being morons. 

This. I still looks to me like Rudolph's hand was stuck in Garrett's chinstrap or facemask, but I would have been okay with a game for Rudolph. Everything up to the helmet swing was consistent with football brawl. A game or two for each at most. The only people I'm seeing badmouthing Rudolph are aggys and Baker fanbois (i.e., most OU trash fans who hate Rudolph anyways 'cause college). There are probably some ordinary wannabe tough guys who also are on that side, but they too are worthless human garbage.

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Garrett got everything he deserved. But the fact that Pouncey got 3 games and Rudolph got nothing is just ridiculous. The NFL cares more about the optics of the situation, and the fact that this is on good morning America and CNN/Fox News. They don’t care about how it actually started. Rudolph should’ve gotten at least 1 or 2 games. Pouncey did EXACTLY what anyone in his situation should’ve done. 

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9 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

hey don’t care about how it actually started. 

It started with Garrett body slamming Rudolph well after the ball was released on a meaningless play to end the game. Apparently, you don't care how it actually started. 

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11 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

Garrett got everything he deserved. But the fact that Pouncey got 3 games and Rudolph got nothing is just ridiculous. The NFL cares more about the optics of the situation, and the fact that this is on good morning America and CNN/Fox News. They don’t care about how it actually started. Rudolph should’ve gotten at least 1 or 2 games. Pouncey did EXACTLY what anyone in his situation should’ve done. 

Rudolph, 1 or 2 games, for not starting it? 

Lulz.

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14 minutes ago, Deej said:

It started with Garrett body slamming Rudolph well after the ball was released on a meaningless play to end the game. Apparently, you don't care how it actually started. 

 

12 minutes ago, Wally Pryor said:

Rudolph, 1 or 2 games, for not starting it? 

Lulz.

That’s fair. I guess I felt like the body slamming after the play could’ve been argued as a dirty football play and could’ve gotten a 15 yard penalty and a fine. Seemed like Rudolph escalated the situation by not letting the refs take it from there. Because seriously, what are you going to do Rudolph lol? 
 

I get y’all’s point though. Don’t completely agree with it, but it makes sense. 1 to 2 games might be excessive. I’ll admit that 

Edited by youdunnf'dup
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Kinda surprised no one on TV or radio mentioned this - but it has been 50 years. Juan Marichal hit two Dodgers as a pitcher and then while at bat turned and started hitting the Dodger catcher - John Roseboro over the head with his bat. One of the few things I could think of that was close - using a weapon during a game.    Poor quality but there wasn't a lot of video back then

 

 

Edited by AUinHsv
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9 minutes ago, youdunnf'dup said:

 

That’s fair. I guess I felt like the body slamming after the play could’ve been argued as a dirty football play and could’ve gotten a 15 yard penalty and a fine. Seemed like Rudolph escalated the situation by not letting the refs take it from there. Because seriously, what are you going to do Rudolph lol? 
 

I get y’all’s point though. Don’t completely agree with it, but it makes sense. 1 to 2 games might be excessive. I’ll admit that 

I'm just guessing there is nothing for Rudolph to get upset about if he isn't roughed on the play. I just didn't understand the point of that tackle. Game was over and I feel like he was just trying to hurt the guy. Obviously Rudolph felt the same. And what point is a 15 yard penalty with time expired? Garrett had to know he was getting a free shot.

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11 minutes ago, Deej said:

I'm just guessing there is nothing for Rudolph to get upset about if he isn't roughed on the play. I just didn't understand the point of that tackle. Game was over and I feel like he was just trying to hurt the guy. Obviously Rudolph felt the same. And what point is a 15 yard penalty with time expired? Garrett had to know he was getting a free shot.

That's what I saw.

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33 minutes ago, AUinHsv said:

Kinda surprised no one on TV or radio mentioned this - but it has been 50 years. Juan Marichal hit two Dodgers as a pitcher and then while at bat turned and started hitting the Dodger catcher - John Roseboro over the head with his bat. One of the few things I could think of that was close - using a weapon during a game.    Poor quality but there wasn't a lot of video back then

 

 

OldfashionedOpenBoto-size_restricted.gif

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23 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It’s very clear none of you have been hit in the head with an empty football helmet.  All of your arguments are specious at best.

I would also assume that none of us have been hit by an NFL saftey like Juju and Deonte Johnson were hit. Johnson was bleeding from his ear, concussed, and that was as dirty a hit as you can have from a saftey to a wr. Tbh, that saftey is lucky that play is getting swept under the rug. 

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37 minutes ago, Deej said:

I'm just guessing there is nothing for Rudolph to get upset about if he isn't roughed on the play. I just didn't understand the point of that tackle. Game was over and I feel like he was just trying to hurt the guy. Obviously Rudolph felt the same. And what point is a 15 yard penalty with time expired? Garrett had to know he was getting a free shot.

I agree, but I don't think he was trying to hurt Rudolph.  The late hit wasn't brutal, but it was for sure late.  I think he was just getting one last lick in.

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1 hour ago, youdunnf'dup said:

Garrett got everything he deserved. But the fact that Pouncey got 3 games and Rudolph got nothing is just ridiculous. The NFL cares more about the optics of the situation, and the fact that this is on good morning America and CNN/Fox News. They don’t care about how it actually started. Rudolph should’ve gotten at least 1 or 2 games. Pouncey did EXACTLY what anyone in his situation should’ve done. 

I agree, Rudolph should have gotten at least a game suspension.  QBs get hit after the ball is thrown all the time, a defender coming at you full speed isn't always going to be able to stop in time.  There was no need for Rudolph to retaliate which really started the fight, and he certainly wasn't the victim when he charged Garrett as Garrett was being drug away by the Steeler's OL.  If he just walks away he doesn't get hit with his own helmet.  Should have been a suspension.  As far as Pouncey, I thought he'd get 2 games, but he definitely deserved a few too.  I get that you have to protect your QB, but you don't need to punch and kick a guy in the head while he's being held down.  Haynesworth got 6 games for stepping on a defenseless, helmetless player with his cleats, which resulted in 30 stitches.  On paper Garrett's attack is comparable or less egregious, but to be fair I thought Haynesworth deserved a longer suspension at the time.  I think Garrett should get shut down for the season and miss a few games in 2020.

Edited by ulukinatme
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2 minutes ago, ulukinatme said:

I agree, Rudolph should have gotten at least a game suspension.  QBs get hit after the ball is thrown all the time, a defender coming at you full speed isn't always going to be able to stop in time.  There was no need for Rudolph to retaliate which really started the fight, and he certainly wasn't the victim when he charged Garrett as Garrett was being drug away by the Steeler's OL.  If he just walks away he doesn't get hit with his own helmet.  Should have been a suspension.  As far as Pouncey, I thought he'd get 2 games, but he definitely deserved a few too.  I get that you have to protect your QB, but you don't need to punch and kick a guy in the head while he's being held down.  Haynesworth got 6 games for stepping on a defenseless, helmetless player with his cleats, which resulted in 30 stitches.  On paper Garrett's attack is comparable or less egregious, but to be fair I thought Haynesworth deserved a longer suspension at the time.  I think Garrett should get shut down for the season and miss a few games in 2020.

Myles leads the NFL in late hits/roughing penalties this season this isn't a one time thing, he was beginning to earn the moniker of being a dirty player. Hitting someone upside the head with a helmet is beyond dirty. Cleveland was playing Buddy Ryan/Greg Williams style football all evening. Myles blasted Rudolph late in a game that was out of hand, but that wasn't good enough he had to sling him down to the ground well after the ball was in the hands of the intended receiver and wrestled around with Rudolph while he was down prompting him to attempt to rip his helmet off. Rudolph doesn't deserve a suspension, not by a long shot. Pouncey's suspension is justified, but Rudolph? Naw.

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7 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It’s assault but criminally charging a football player for hitting another football player in the head with a helmet during a game sets a really bad precedent.  We watch football, boxing, and MMA because they assault each other.  Keeping the discipline out of the hands of law enforcement is really for the best. 

I'm glad you're not my defense counsel because this is bullshit. Let's pretend for a sec that the helmet caused major damage to Rudolph -- shit, if that helmet had landed a different way it could've killed him. Would that be enough for the police to get involved? Or should they just "keep discipline out of the hands of law enforcement?" in such a scenario?

There's a line between on-field criminal behavior that happens often (fights, etc) and being legally prosecuted. I don't know how that line should be defined, I'll admit. But Garrett sure as hell crossed it, whatever it is.

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Forgot about this one as well.  This was aggravated assault - one year criminal probation.  

But it happened in Canada who has clearer sport-violence standards (because of hockey fighting).

Edited by JBJ
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7 minutes ago, Chad said:

Myles leads the NFL in late hits/roughing penalties this season this isn't a one time thing, he was beginning to earn the moniker of being a dirty player. Hitting someone upside the head with a helmet is beyond dirty. Cleveland was playing Buddy Ryan/Greg Williams style football all evening. Myles blasted Rudolph late in a game that was out of hand, but that wasn't good enough he had to sling him down to the ground well after the ball was in the hands of the intended receiver and wrestled around with Rudolph while he was down prompting him to attempt to rip his helmet off. Rudolph doesn't deserve a suspension, not by a long shot. Pouncey's suspension is justified, but Rudolph? Naw.

Myles hit occurred while the play was still active, Rudolph's retaliation was after the whistle.  He could have left it there, but he charged Garrett while Garrett was being pulled away.  Garrett then swung the helmet in defense with his free arm, if Rudolph doesn't charge him the hit never occurs.  Garrett deserves to be shut down for the season and more, but Rudolph should have gotten at least one game suspension for his part in it.

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4 hours ago, wood said:

Good question. And this wasn't just assault with a deadly weapon. It was assault with a blunt object to the head. The fact that the league has made such a show of supposedly getting serious about head injuries makes it hard for them to go easy on this asshole imho. It's the pure hypocrisy if they give Garrett anything less than 16 regular season games for this shit

Agreed.

In the current environment with all the concussion stories and rules changes to prevent head injuries, they can't let this go lightly. 

I'm okay with a 16-game ban.  I'm also okay with a lifetime ban and aggravated assault charges, but I don't think either of those things will happen.

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13 minutes ago, honolulu horn said:

I'm glad you're not my defense counsel because this is bullshit. Let's pretend for a sec that the helmet caused major damage to Rudolph -- shit, if that helmet had landed a different way it could've killed him. Would that be enough for the police to get involved? Or should they just "keep discipline out of the hands of law enforcement?" in such a scenario?

There's a line between on-field criminal behavior that happens often (fights, etc) and being legally prosecuted. I don't know how that line should be defined, I'll admit. But Garrett sure as hell crossed it, whatever it is.

Have you ever been hit with a football helmet?  It's not like a club, it's hallow and has some give to it.  I'm not saying it doesn't hurt, but it's unlikely you kill a man with one blow.  Like anything else you can probably kill a man with one using repeated blows, but that's not what occurred.  Notice that Rudolph's first response to the hit isn't to hold his head in pain, he throws his arms up in disbelief.  Could this go to court?  Sure, Haynesworth could have gone to court if Guronde had decided to press charges.  I think it would be hard to say the hit could have killed him though.

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9 minutes ago, ulukinatme said:

Myles hit occurred while the play was still active, Rudolph's retaliation was after the whistle.  He could have left it there, but he charged Garrett while Garrett was being pulled away.  Garrett then swung the helmet in defense with his free arm, if Rudolph doesn't charge him the hit never occurs.  Garrett deserves to be shut down for the season and more, but Rudolph should have gotten at least one game suspension for his part in it.

You have to be a special kind of stupid to justify swinging a fucking helmet as "defense".

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Swung the helmet in defense???!!!

 

i must have missed it because surely it was posted and discussed, but this is most like what Marty mcsorely did. Used a piece of equipment to hit someone in the head on purpose and outside the normal course of play. 

Edited by Pato del Muerto
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8 minutes ago, ulukinatme said:

Have you ever been hit with a football helmet?  It's not like a club, it's hallow and has some give to it.  I'm not saying it doesn't hurt, but it's unlikely you kill a man with one blow.  Like anything else you can probably kill a man with one using repeated blows, but that's not what occurred.  Notice that Rudolph's first response to the hit isn't to hold his head in pain, he throws his arms up in disbelief.  Could this go to court?  Sure, Haynesworth could have gone to court if Guronde had decided to press charges.  I think it would be hard to say the hit could have killed him though.

If the crown of that helmet had hit Mason in the forehead or temple, or the top of his head, it absolutely could have killed him.  Keep in mind that the guy swinging it is a steroid monster.

LOL at the helmet's hollow so it's not a deadly weapon.  You're out of your damned mind.

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