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CR: COVID-19 --Political Talk


Mrs Whiggins

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4 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Shit.  Did I miss something?  Are you in the Covid Club?

I can tell you probably by the end of next week when I get my test results back! But I was deep in the plaguelands for three shifts last week, and N95s sure don't hold a seal very well after using them more than once and being covered in face sweat.

(Not that N95s even fully protect you from breathing in viral particles)

Edited by trauma babe
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I need to say I agreed with the initial shutdown, but I have to admit this is an interesting breakdown of the economic effect of past pandemics compared to what we’re experiencing today. 
 


A couple interesting paragraphs here  

 

The 1918–19 pandemic, which caused an astounding ten times as many deaths per million as the 1957–58 pandemic, also failed to produce economic disaster. Although the US entered the 1918–19 pandemic in poor economic shape thanks to the Great War, according to economists Efraim Benmelech and Carola Frydman,

 

 

In reality, the experience of the 1957–58 pandemic—or even the 1918–19 pandemic—gives us no reason to believe that joblessness should be increasing at unprecedented rates and that GDP would collapse by catastrophic levels. In a modern industrialized economy, that sort of economic damage is only achievable through government intervention, such as socialist coups, wars, and forced economic shutdowns in the name of combating disease.

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The economic disaster is due to incompetence and negligence of the Trump Administration.  Full stop. The world’s greatest superpower doesn’t allow a virus like this to spread among its population.  This is a 3rd world government response.  Welcome to shithole America.

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9 minutes ago, trauma babe said:

I can tell you probably by the end of next week when I get my test results back! But I was deep in the plaguelands for three shifts last week, and N95s sure don't hold a seal very well after using them more than once and being covered in face sweat.

(Not that N95s even fully protect you from breathing in viral particles)

Did you get sick?

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15 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

I need to say I agreed with the initial shutdown, but I have to admit this is an interesting breakdown of the economic effect of past pandemics compared to what we’re experiencing today. 
 


A couple interesting paragraphs here  

 

The 1918–19 pandemic, which caused an astounding ten times as many deaths per million as the 1957–58 pandemic, also failed to produce economic disaster. Although the US entered the 1918–19 pandemic in poor economic shape thanks to the Great War, according to economists Efraim Benmelech and Carola Frydman,

 

 

In reality, the experience of the 1957–58 pandemic—or even the 1918–19 pandemic—gives us no reason to believe that joblessness should be increasing at unprecedented rates and that GDP would collapse by catastrophic levels. In a modern industrialized economy, that sort of economic damage is only achievable through government intervention, such as socialist coups, wars, and forced economic shutdowns in the name of combating disease.

Dangerous, stupid, hindsight bullshit.  Of course the lockdown caused the unemployment rate to skyrocket.  The choice at the time was locking down vs a virus the decision makers didn’t really know much about.  Now that we know more about how it spreads, who it attacks, and how deadly it is, the decision is different (hence most places starting to open up).  We got lucky.  This thing could have spread much easier and been far more deadly.  Unfortunately that luck gives dumbfucks like people who write those articles a leg to stand on.  Were this thing more deadly/contagious than the pandemics referenced in the article, there would be no such narrative.  The people deciding whether or not to lock down didn’t have the benefit of hindsight.

Edited by Snake Diggity
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32 minutes ago, trauma babe said:

I can tell you probably by the end of next week when I get my test results back! But I was deep in the plaguelands for three shifts last week, and N95s sure don't hold a seal very well after using them more than once and being covered in face sweat.

(Not that N95s even fully protect you from breathing in viral particles)

What’s the protocol? How long do they wait before you take each test?

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1 hour ago, trauma babe said:

Who's got two thumbs, two tits, and is furloughed from work pending a decrease of symptoms and two negative COVID tests at least twenty-four hours apart? 

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If it was shift work at Chernobyl General, you might have three tits now.

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30 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

The economic disaster is due to incompetence and negligence of the Trump Administration.  Full stop. The world’s greatest superpower doesn’t allow a virus like this to spread among its population.  This is a 3rd world government response.  Welcome to shithole America.

You can blame Trump for a lot, but the economic disaster in its current state is almost totally due to the initial shutdown that 99% of people supported. 
 

38 minutes ago, Snake Diggity said:

Dangerous, stupid, hindsight bullshit.  Of course the lockdown caused the unemployment rate to skyrocket.  The choice at the time was locking down vs a virus the decision makers didn’t really know much about.  Now that we know more about how it spreads, who it attacks, and how deadly it is, the decision is different (hence most places starting to open up).  We got lucky.  This thing could have spread much easier and been far more deadly.  Unfortunately that luck gives dumbfucks like people who write those articles a leg to stand on.  Were this thing more deadly/contagious than the pandemics referenced in the article, there would be no such narrative.  The people deciding whether or not to lock down didn’t have the benefit of hindsight.

I have a feeling the libertarians at Mises Institute were in the 1% against the initial lockdown but whatever. I question why this article is so upsetting to you. 

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Just now, henrygandorf said:

well we thought he was going to use the shutdown to actually do something.

we bought him a lot of time, and then he stuffed it all in his pocket with a hole in the bottom.  but yes, let's blame the people who supported not dying.

This X10000

 

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7 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

You can blame Trump for a lot, but the economic disaster in its current state is almost totally due to the initial shutdown that 99% of people supported.

That 99 percent would include Trump. Except not when he didn't. And also not when he did. If he were president, he could have demonstrated how he would have handled it.

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15 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

You can blame Trump for a lot, but the economic disaster in its current state is almost totally due to the initial shutdown that 99% of people supported. 

Well, that's just stupid.  For starters, the oil price war between Saudi and Russia was already causing massive disruption before CV19 became a big issue here in the US.

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7 hours ago, horn4life said:

Weill happy Memorial day weekend all!  I will stick with the book cover theming.  If you have ever read this book, can you honestly argue that even the Merry Pranksters would have handled this virus better than Trump's "very best people..."

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I'd take Ken Babbs over anyone in Trump's administration.

Also, "President Intrepid Traveller" kind of has a nice ring to it. 

Edited by WhatTheBuck
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46 minutes ago, trauma babe said:

Nausea, fatigue, malaise, but nothing respiratory so far thankfully. Low grade temp. I'm still able taste whatever I'm stress eating, which is nice. 

Hopefully its just stress/anxiety and you don’t get sick.  I have had vague similar symptoms after every shift for about 2 months now that come and go with no fever and  repeated neg tests.  With that said, I have not actually worked in the COVID unit. 

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26 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

You can blame Trump for a lot, but the economic disaster in its current state is almost totally due to the initial shutdown that 99% of people supported. 
 

I have a feeling the libertarians at Mises Institute were in the 1% against the initial lockdown but whatever. I question why this article is so upsetting to you. 

How's Sweden's economy looking these days?

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25 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

You can blame Trump for a lot, but the economic disaster in its current state is almost totally due to the initial shutdown that 99% of people supported. 
 

I have a feeling the libertarians at Mises Institute were in the 1% against the initial lockdown but whatever. I question why this article is so upsetting to you. 

It’s upsetting because it’s the most insidious kind of misinformation.  It’s not blatantly false, but totally (and likely intentionally) misleading.

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18 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

This is like saying the Holocaust was really the fault of a few Nazis that decided to exterminate some Jews, Hitler had little to do with it. 
 

There never would have been a shutdown if we contained the virus abroad.  We didn’t even attempt to do that.  We knew it was coming, we knew it could be bad, Trump called it a hoax. He’s responsible for the consequences of said hoax.

This is such a stupid comment it takes my breath away. 

Trump was dumb when he called it a hoax. He was also a xenophobe when he halted travel from China. 

How many people were saying in January that this was an impending disaster? Spoiler: not many. 

I’ve linked talks here from epidemiologists that said basically given the R0, and time it took to realize it was droplet spread, and Chinese New Year travel, that it was essentially uncontainable. 
 

But FolLow the SciEncE.  
 

24 minutes ago, henrygandorf said:

well we thought he was going to use the shutdown to actually do something.

we bought him a lot of time, and then he stuffed it all in his pocket with a hole in the bottom.  but yes, let's blame the people who supported not dying.

The vast majority of the economic damage thus far is from the initial mandated shutdown. That’s obvious. 

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2 minutes ago, Snake Diggity said:

It’s upsetting because it’s the most insidious kind of misinformation.  It’s not blatantly false, but totally (and likely intentionally) misleading.

How is it misleading?

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17 minutes ago, GRHorn said:


How many people were saying in January that this was an impending disaster? Spoiler: not many. 

I’ve linked talks here from epidemiologists that said basically given the R0, and time it took to realize it was droplet spread, and Chinese New Year travel, that it was essentially uncontainable. 
 

The "not many" excludes almost all expertise whose livelihoods are dedicated, not to garnering attention and adulation, but actually being versed in the subject matter.

Contain doesn't equal constrain- as in an order of magnitude- and there's a plethora of examples that illustrate that.

Edited by Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand
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26 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

The vast majority of the economic damage thus far is from the initial mandated shutdown. That’s obvious. 

Can you show your work on this one? Do you have any facts to put behind this?

Edited by BradInATX
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11 minutes ago, Al Bundy's Napoleon Hand said:

The "not many" excludes almost all expertise whose livelihoods are dedicated, not to garnering attention and adulation, but actually being versed in the subject matter.

Contain doesn't equal constrain- as in an order of magnitude- and there's a plethora of examples that illustrate that.

Like who? There’s examples throughout media, both political parties, the WHO, Chinese media all downplaying it. 
 

The number one vector for the virus entering the Us was travel from Europe into NYC. Halting European travel when we halted Chinese would’ve been the correct move. Almost no one supported such a move. If you have evidence to the contrary let me see it. 

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8 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

Hmmm. Hold on it’s gonna take a while. 

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/UNRATE/

DBCBF80-A-3-B2-A-4-D0-E-A160-F9-C9648-B1

 

 

 

What do you think this proves? It doesn't prove anything. Unemployment rate is one metric amongst a zillion that show economic health. Sweden's economy is in the shitter just like ours, and they've been the loosest country in the modern world with restrictions. 

There's exactly zero hard evidence that proves anything that you're saying. In fact, the early returns show the opposite - that leaving things open won't save your economy. https://nationalpost.com/news/world/sweden-in-deep-economic-crisis-as-per-capita-deaths-rise-despite-soft-lockdown

I'm not making any case for or against the shutdown. I'm just pointing out that you're stating your opinion as some sort of fact, when so far it looks likely that you're completely wrong.

Edited by BradInATX
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3 hours ago, Lobo said:

Wait until both sides realize the "AK church" was not in Arkansas.  Are we just in a race to the bottom at this point?  

Also-Yamiche Alcindor is the best name I've heard today.  There are not enough Haitians turning to Islam during this pandemic who can still provide good journalism.  

 

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11 hours ago, Bateshorn said:

In a vacuum, your correct. The problem is, this line Of thought is fraught with historical racial overtones.  Reagan’s attacks on welfare queens wasn’t directed across racial lines.  It focused on a single demographic.  Moreover there are terms in modern language to describe this behavior (which I will not repeat, but I’m sure people know) which specifically use a racial epithet. 
 

One has to condition this argument from the outset to separate it from race.  

Well, as mentioned, WhatTheBuck was the original poster of the topic and I feel relatively confident that he wasn't dog whistling.

Personally, I have some disdain for profligate spenders who are capable of saving.  That generally doesn't include the underclass, whom I assume are forced to live paycheck to paycheck by "coercion" and circumstances largely beyond their control.

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1 hour ago, GRHorn said:

You can blame Trump for a lot, but the economic disaster in its current state is almost totally due to the initial shutdown that 99% of people supported. 
 

I have a feeling the libertarians at Mises Institute were in the 1% against the initial lockdown but whatever. I question why this article is so upsetting to you. 

I think I can blame Trump for the economic disaster because he didn't have a plan or response team in place for something pretty much everyone could see coming.  Yes, that's right. 

It's May 23rd and I believe he STILL doesn't have a plan.  So, yeah, that's on him.  

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Holy shit! This is what you guys in Texas are up against.  This is a Bexar County GOP official. Note that she weighs probably 250 .lbs. Note how fat all of the people applauding her are. Doesn't this beg so many questions, like why, if the Coronavirus is a hoax perpetrated by the Democrats,  the Republican governor of Texas shut down the state. 
 




Beto won nearly 60% of Bexar County in 2018. 

 

Edited by Horn Under a Bad Sign
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49 minutes ago, GRHorn said:

Like who? There’s examples throughout media, both political parties, the WHO, Chinese media all downplaying it. 
 

The number one vector for the virus entering the Us was travel from Europe into NYC. Halting European travel when we halted Chinese would’ve been the correct move. Almost no one supported such a move. If you have evidence to the contrary let me see it. 

Dude, pull your head out of your ass.  The team Obama left were there to "support that move."  Aren't you paying attention?

Quote

In May 2018, the top White House official in charge of the U.S. response to pandemics left the administration. Rear Admiral Timothy Ziemer was the senior director of global health and biodefense on the National Security Council and oversaw global health security issues, a specialty that had been bolstered under President Barack Obama.

After Ziemer’s departure, the global health team was reorganized as part of an effort by then-National Security Adviser John Bolton. Meanwhile, Tom Bossert, a homeland security adviser who recommended strong defenses against disease and biological warfare, was reportedly pushed out by Bolton in 2018. Neither White House official or their teams, which were responsible for coordinating the U.S. response to pandemic outbreaks across agencies, have been replaced during the past two years.

In November 2019, a bipartisan group of lawmakers and experts formally recommended that health security leadership on the NSC should be restored. And on Feb. 18, 2020, a group of 27 senators sent a letter to current National Security Adviser Robert O’Brien to ask him to appoint a new global health security expert to the NSC.

 

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3 hours ago, Lurch said:


“Ed, how do you abbreviate Arkansas?" He said, "I don't know, just start spelling it, then quit!"
-Mitch Hedberg

Never mind, I was late by a couple of hours.

Edited by Bullneck
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5 hours ago, trauma babe said:

Who's got two thumbs, two tits, and is furloughed from work pending a decrease of symptoms and two negative COVID tests at least twenty-four hours apart? 

spacer.png

Hang in there TB. Hopefully, it's just a well deserved R&R before heading back into battle.

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