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Body cam shows officer shooting at suspect who tried to run him over

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I feel like there's a lot that this cop could have done differently. Not sure if the shooting victim survived or not.

 

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Bad decisions by both parties. The lady was going very slow and the cop could have easily gotten out of the way without shooting into the vehicle numerous times. I think that would be a more prudent course of action. That said, there is more justification for shooting in this case than many. She did drive forward while he was in front of the car.

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I mean, I don't think she was trying to run him over as much as she was just trying to get back on the road and figured if she went slow enough he'd move aside.

Not going to shed any tears though. Saved them a pursuit through a residential neighborhood.

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32 minutes ago, HoustonHorn said:

Bad decisions by both parties. The lady was going very slow and the cop could have easily gotten out of the way without shooting into the vehicle numerous times. I think that would be a more prudent course of action. That said, there is more justification for shooting in this case than many. She did drive forward while he was in front of the car.

Hah. Yeah fuck that. Cops actions were justified. 

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Just now, High Plains Drifter said:

If you are going to shoot people for no good reason, at least do it somewhere other than a residential neighborhood.

Legit lulz. 

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9 minutes ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

While technically justified, I would prefer our police show a little better discretion than that.

That's my take as well

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He was justified in shooting, but he'd be better off today if he'd just stepped out of the way.  Cops woulda easily caught the driver.

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13 minutes ago, Parliament said:

He was justified in shooting, but he'd be better off today if he'd just stepped out of the way.  Cops woulda easily caught the driver.

After a police chase in the snow with possibly a criminal or impaired driver?  Nope. Cop did the right thing. 

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The lady wasn't driving that car.  The driver was probably bleeding out in the drivers seat.  I'm in the "good shoot" camp.

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Not to derail but...

Twice in my life I have been radar'd on a 35 MPH street going 40 (mea culpa). The motorcycle cops were on foot and stepped into my traffic lane in the path of my (speeding) vehicle in order to get me to stop in advance of the residential side street their bike was parked on.

First time I wasn't paying attention, saw cop at last minute, and had to swerve into another lane to avoid her. Second time I locked up my brakes screeching past him as he jumped out of the traffic lane.

I hate to think that those would have been justified shootings.

P. S. - I got verbal warnings both times because 5 over is a joke, cops were too lazy to go back to side street to get tickets once I had past their ticket assembly line street, and my stopped car on the main road was alerting other motorists to their racket.

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7 minutes ago, woohorn said:

Not to derail but...

Twice in my life I have been radar'd on a 35 MPH street going 40 (mea culpa). The motorcycle cops were on foot and stepped into my traffic lane in the path of my (speeding) vehicle in order to get me to stop in advance of the residential side street their bike was parked on.

First time I wasn't paying attention, saw cop at last minute, and had to swerve into another lane to avoid her. Second time I locked up my brakes screeching past him as he jumped out of the traffic lane.

I hate to think that those would have been justified shootings.

P. S. - I got verbal warnings both times because 5 over is a joke, cops were too lazy to go back to side street to get tickets once I had past their ticket assembly line street, and my stopped car on the main road was alerting other motorists to their racket.

neither of those come close to what happened in this video.  

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While technically justified, I would prefer our police show a little better discretion than that.

I don’t think he was in fear for his life. Don’t step in front of an occupied moving car.

Flip side: don’t start no shit won be no shit.

In cases like these, I just wonder if taking the life is the best course of action. What if this was an old lady that was just confused or scared or something?

Block her in with your cruiser. Start there.


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maybe one day we can go to all robotic cops that can make perfect decisions and take out all of the inherent human emotions that happen during encounters, but until then, don't cause a human being to have to make a split second decision regarding your life.

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22 minutes ago, woohorn said:

Not to derail but...

Twice in my life I have been radar'd on a 35 MPH street going 40 (mea culpa). The motorcycle cops were on foot and stepped into my traffic lane in the path of my (speeding) vehicle in order to get me to stop in advance of the residential side street their bike was parked on.

First time I wasn't paying attention, saw cop at last minute, and had to swerve into another lane to avoid her. Second time I locked up my brakes screeching past him as he jumped out of the traffic lane.

I hate to think that those would have been justified shootings.

P. S. - I got verbal warnings both times because 5 over is a joke, cops were too lazy to go back to side street to get tickets once I had past their ticket assembly line street, and my stopped car on the main road was alerting other motorists to their racket.

Not even close to the same situation.  The car was stopped when he approached and intentionally started moving towards the cop.  I'm as ACAB as the next guy, but I really don't see anything wrong in this case.  Cop is lucky he wasn't run over.

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5 minutes ago, Zepol87 said:

lol a slow rolling honda is not causing you to make split second decisions with your life

A Honda moving at him outside his car caused HIM to make a split second decision with the DRIVER’S life. That is exactly what occurred. And the driver put him in that position. 

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4 minutes ago, Zepol87 said:

lol a slow rolling honda is not causing you to make split second decisions with your life

A stomp of the accelerator is a split second away.  A lot of cop are shit this just isn't the hill to make case on.

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5 minutes ago, hopkinsnhorns said:

Not even close to the same situation.  The car was stopped when he approached and intentionally started moving towards the cop.  I'm as ACAB as the next guy, but I really don't see anything wrong in this case.  Cop is lucky he wasn't run over.

Not only that, the car was turned off. The ignition fired up when the cop approached. 

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”Any reasonably trained police officer would understand (Gomez-Guerrero’s) actions to mean he was attempting to turn his car away from the police officer," according to the deceased's attorney.  Sure, Counsel.  Sure.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/suburbs/lake-county-news-sun/ct-lns-waukegan-police-shooting-video-st-0213-20200212-qfwgorguvrga5nlrkag4eql6ju-story.html

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Not only that, the car was turned off. The ignition fired up when the cop approached. 
So time and warning to get out of the way?

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2 minutes ago, woohorn said:
3 minutes ago, Dr. Beeper said:
Not only that, the car was turned off. The ignition fired up when the cop approached. 

So time and warning to get out of the way?

Yeah, no. The driver was an idiot. He/she decided to challenge an armed man and predictably lost. He wasn’t going to get out of the way, and never should. 

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7 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

A stomp of the accelerator is a split second away.  A lot of cop are shit this just isn't the hill to make case on.

So take 2 steps to the right and get out of the way. Not trying to excuse the idiot driver but to act like this guy had no other option is silly. 

Edited by Zepol87

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Sounds like the deceased's family is wrapped up in a lawsuit, trying to get a civil claim of wrongful death, but I don't know if there's a jury in America that would side with the idiot that tried to run down a cop.  Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

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Just now, Zepol87 said:

So take 2 steps to the right and get out of the way

Why?  It’s your job to keep order. There were at least 2 cop cars there. Why?

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So he couldn't have shot the driver from the side if they tried to drive off? Is it standard procedure to approach a vehicle and stand in front of it? 

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Just now, Zepol87 said:

So he couldn't have shot the driver from the side if they tried to drive off? Is it standard procedure to approach a vehicle and stand in front of it? 

If he had, he likely would have hit the 18 year old girl in the passenger seat.

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What is to stop someone from grabbing a gun hidden from the cop's eyes and popping the cop and then hitting the accelerator? And even without that possibility, there is a potential chase that could injure or kill innocent people.

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1 minute ago, Bevo said:

What is to stop someone from grabbing a gun hidden from the cop's eyes and popping the cop and then hitting the accelerator? And even without that possibility, there is a potential chase that could injure or kill innocent people.

Another reason not to stand in front of the car

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Dig up, man.  Dig up.  Defending/justifying the actions of the deceased here just kills any credibility you have relative to other actual bad cop shootings.

Edited by hopkinsnhorns
added some context

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19 minutes ago, po elvis said:

maybe one day we can go to all robotic cops that can make perfect decisions and take out all of the inherent human emotions that happen during encounters, but until then, don't cause a human being to have to make a split second decision regarding your life.

this is one of the major issues I have with the "we need more cops with feelings" type crowd

they demand cops with empathy and sympathy and "feelings" that help them better understand those they are dealing with on a daily basis......but then when those they are dealing with on a daily basis do stupid shit like spit in a cops face with a bloody mouth (not caused by the cop,) or they bow up on the cop and start to fight them over nothing (BUT UNARMED!!!!!) and get their asses shot off then we are all suppose to be mad at the cop for not having a perfect reaction void of any type of emotion or personal survival instinct

we somehow want cops that go around always understanding the imperfections of others, but we demand those same cops always be perfect in every action they take no matter what is being done to them

plus a lot of those people that make those demands are people that would not put up with an ounce of bullshit at their daily bullshit job and are constantly getting fired or transferred because some stupid shit is going on with them or around them because of their lack of emotional control and rational thought process

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22 minutes ago, hopkinsnhorns said:

Dig up, man.  Dig up.  Defending/justifying the actions of the deceased here just kills any credibility you have relative to other actual bad cop shootings.

You can take it that way if you want.  I am simply saying that it probably isn't a good idea to stand in front of a vehicle of a driver who isn't listening to your commands. 

Edited by Zepol87

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also if you watch the video

to start the cop that shot is parked closer than it looks from his camera when you see the angle from the second officers camera......he was walking to the side of the car when the driver started it and backed up and then cut the wheel to line back up with the officer

he is about 1 step away from being fully beside the car when the car backs up quickly and cuts towards him

in the video it goes from the 49 second mark when the cop is about at the side of the car to the 53 second make when the car is moving forward and makes contact with the cops leg.....so 4 seconds which is not a great deal of time

plus when the car makes contact with the cops leg it puts him off balance from what I see in the video and trips him up some which gets him stumbling a bit

yes he possibly could have literally dove out of the way and probably would not have been run over, but it is the cops job to detain people behaving like this and generally not their job to dive out of the way onto pavement because someone is coming at them in their car

and going back to the expected behavior thing if the police had just rolled right up and bumped their tahoes up bumper to bumper with that car on both ends of it the assholes in the car and their shitty family would be talking about hard ass aggressive cops that just roll up while they are sitting there chillaxing and bang into their car and pin them in and make them shit their pants and where is my money for being scared

and really it does not take a great deal of space for a car that is not fully pinned in to smash back and forth and get out

and then if the cops had just let them go after the one dives out of the way there would be other people crying the cops did not roll up and pin them in (or at least try) and their kids got run over around the corner playing in the street because the cops just let these assholes drive off and did not try and stop hem right at the scene

don't go from parked to a cop almost at the side of your car then 4 seconds from there contacting the cop and pushing him off balance with the car that you turned to aim at him and you probably will not get shot

 

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A Dallas cop was just acquitted on a semi- similar thing.

https://www.dallasobserver.com/news/former-dallas-cop-christopher-hess-found-not-guilty-in-genevive-dawes-death-11870282

 

Quote

When officers arrived, they found Dawes and her boyfriend, Virgilio Rosales, sleeping inside an SUV. Officers ordered Dawes and Rosales out of the SUV. Instead, Dawes tried to flee, backing the SUV toward the police cruisers that were blocking her escape path.

 

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1 hour ago, Zepol87 said:

So he couldn't have shot the driver from the side if they tried to drive off? Is it standard procedure to approach a vehicle and stand in front of it? 

yeah, under the umbrella of "what this cop could have done differently", this one really stands out. first the cop fails to properly block in the car, then when the ignition starts the cop *puts himself in front of the car* for zero discernible reason. the car was moving, what, literally 2 mph for several seconds before it was even a threat to run the cop over. that's the cop fucking up twice before any danger was even present to him, both instances he could have/should have easily avoided. the cop literally went out of his way to put himself in a position to potentially be run over, and then fired several rounds into a very slow moving car from very close range when he was afraid he might get run over. the people in here claiming that this was 100% justified while laying zero blame on the cop frankly scare me.

Edited by Goo Punch

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1 hour ago, hopkinsnhorns said:

Dig up, man.  Dig up.  Defending/justifying the actions of the deceased here just kills any credibility you have relative to other actual bad cop shootings.

yeah except for the fact that the cop failed to properly block in the vehicle and then intentionally put himself in harm's way for zero logical reason. that is unless that's what they're teaching at the academy these days. "when dealing with a perp in a motor vehicle, make sure to put your physical body directly in front of the car as quickly as possible." the cop fucked up. so did the driver, no doubt, but to act like this cop did everything right actually kills any credibility you would like to have.

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