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Minneapolis Cop Murders A Black Man


HenryJames

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So.... Eskimo Pie is going to be renamed.  https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/20/business/eskimo-pie-ice-cream-name-change-trnd/index.html
I'm sticking to most of Surly being Eskimo brothers due to South Austin's mom.
But can anybody else think of any businesses or buildings or products with the word "Eskimo" in their name or title, that should be changed?  I'm sure there's a few out there that should maybe think about renaming their businesses or products.
 

I find this to be a disturbing trend and a slippery slope from banning egregious memorials of confederate symbology to restricting innocuous speech that really need deep dives into its historical context.

In other words, they will only change my username when they pry my keyboard from my cold, dead hands.
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I find this to be a disturbing trend and a slippery slope from banning egregious memorials of confederate symbology to restricting innocuous speech that really need deep dives into its historical context.

 

In other words, they will only change my username when they pry my keyboard from my cold, dead hands.

I’ve already registered InuitHorn as a sock account, so you’re pretty much screwed.

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On 6/20/2020 at 9:48 PM, Gatorubet said:

You do not shoot people in the back who are running away and no longer a threat to you.   Shoot him if he is running at you.    You do not shoot people in the back who are no longer pointing a taser at you.   You have an argument if there is a reasonable chance that he will cause you death or great bodily harm.   Thinking that he is running to an MS-13 meeting at the Antifa club might scare you, but it is not reasonable to fear that.      And yes, a panel of Johnny Sack or Swamfortexas  clones will in fact acquit.    But the question is not about what he did in the past.  You can't shoot him for tussling with you.   You can't shoot him for running with a stolen taser.   You can't shoot him after he deploys it and turns around.   Unless you  think that his resistance means that he deserves killing. 

c88ac-william-munny.jpg?w=202&h=303

 Unlike Little Bill,  deserves got nothing to do with it.  You can't kill him for what he did, just what he might do.   

I think that we should only hire cops who can count to two - and ones whose eyes and minds work well enough that they can process that a person running away with their back to them is - well -running away with their back to them.   We'll see.

Have you ever been shot by a taser in the head?   

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I saved this 2017 Joe Rogan podcast with Bret Weinstein where they discuss the mess at Evergreen College. I listened to it again last week (the first half is the best part), and Weinstein was prophetic in what was happening and was about to happen. He was mocked at the time.

The first hour is the best part as it relates to today. 

Joe had him on again a few days ago. They discuss his 2017 predictions coming true, and I pray to God he isn’t as accurate going forward.

This professor is pretty damn progressive, something I’ll never be. Joe is much more of an Obama guy than a Trump guy, especially back in 2017. So, this isn’t coming from a couple of right-wingers.

Again the first half is the best.

 

Edited by ImissWallyPryor
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7 hours ago, ImissWallyPryor said:

I saved this 2017 Joe Rogan podcast with Bret Weinstein where they discuss the mess at Evergreen College. I listened to it again last week (the first half is the best part), and Weinstein was prophetic in what was happening and was about to happen. He was mocked at the time.

The first hour is the best part as it relates to today. 

Joe had him on again a few days ago. They discuss his 2017 predictions coming true, and I pray to God he isn’t as accurate going forward.

This professor is pretty damn progressive, something I’ll never be. Joe is much more of an Obama guy than a Trump guy, especially back in 2017. So, this isn’t coming from a couple of right-wingers.

Again the first half is the best.

 

Cliff notes?

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25 minutes ago, XYZ said:

Cliff notes?

They cover so much ground in the first video. Weinstein was the progressive Evolutionary Biologist professor at Evergreen College who came under fire (grossly understated) for opposing a call by a student organization for a day on campus where white students, teaching faculty, and support personnel would be told to stay home. That organization had been holding a day since the 1970s for blacks students, etc. voluntarily stayed off campus to demonstrate a day without black people. All hell breaks loose on campus, massive capitulation (which was never enough), campus police being orders to stand down if face credible threats against people in charge (lol), students of all colors who spoke against this, and so much more. The university was lost to the mob. 

Edited by ImissWallyPryor
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18 minutes ago, XYZ said:

Cliff notes?

There are subtle structural flaws in society (policing, economy, etc) as byproduct of historical ,systemtic racism

The outcomes of these flaws are coincident with effect of racism -- i.e. poor stays poor

BLM-type movement are ill-informed and rudderless, akin to a grenade, and will cause collateral damage 

The energy of these movement  are misplaced towards attacking the good components of society -- constitution, science, etc

Democratic party also represent business interest and dont give a shit about the people

 

i.e. america is a circus

 

 

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4 minutes ago, ImissWallyPryor said:

They cover so much ground in the first video. Weinstein was the progressive Evolutionary Biologist professor at Evergreen College who came under fire (grossly understated) for opposing a call by a student organization for a day on campus where white students, teaching faculty, and support personnel would be told to stay home. That organization had been holding a day since the 1970s for blacks students, etc. voluntarily stayed off campus to demonstrate a day without black people. All hell breaks loose on campus, massive capitulation (which was never enough), campus police being orders to stand down if face credible threats against people in charge (lol), students of all colors who spoke against this, and so much more. The university was lost to the mob. 

basically, evergreen was a microcosm of whats happening globally today: sound logic gave way to mob rule

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14 hours ago, ImissWallyPryor said:

 

 

This is an excellent guest, should be a must watch.  He understands not just what these insurrections are primarily about and the current landscape, but moreso the tactics and very, very dangerous downside of how it can easily devolve.  How this is likely to play out and escalate.  I don't agree with all his takes, but at least he's talking in a blunt realistic mode, not sloganeering bullcrap.  He seems to hate bullcrap.  

Open the vid on Youtube and at the top of the comments are timestamps for most of the topics.  Though it is worth listening to the whole thing, just like it is worth taking the time one weekend to read Strauss & Howe's 'Generations' and 'The Fourth Turning.'  All 3 are Cliff Notes for the next decade of our history.

 

Yes, #ShutdownSTEM is a thing with a segment of the mental mob.

Edited by clapclapclap
And if you aren't familiar with Mao's Cultural Revolution, it might be wise to read up on it.
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4 hours ago, clapclapclap said:

This is an excellent guest, should be a must watch.  He understands not just what these insurrections are primarily about and the current landscape, but moreso the tactics and very, very dangerous downside of how it can easily devolve.  How this is likely to play out and escalate.  I don't agree with all his takes, but at least he's talking in a blunt realistic mode, not sloganeering bullcrap.  He seems to hate bullcrap.  

Open the vid on Youtube and at the top of the comments are timestamps for most of the topics.  Though it is worth listening to the whole thing, just like it is worth taking the time one weekend to read Strauss & Howe's 'Generations' and 'The Fourth Turning.'  All 3 are Cliff Notes for the next decade of our history.

 

Yes, #ShutdownSTEM is a thing with a segment of the mental mob.

Mostly agreed. I thought it was refreshing. The part on understanding the structural flaws and linking them back up to the Democratic party changes in the 1990s was spot in. I have been saying the same, in some form, for most of my adult life. 

He sure seems to be a bit of a tops down academic guy though, but hey I'm not an anti-dentite. I hear things like "the movement is rudderless" and "I don't know what they really stand for" and they are "leaderless" and then he gets his panties in a wad over "defund the police". He seems to see the world from the top down and doesn't quite understand how what he talks about (structural problems for so long) leading to chaos. He then looks at the chaos expecting coherency. It just makes no fucking sense to me to portray the origins of the problem so clearly and then expect no consequence from the failings.

The defund the police issue is a perfect example. Its a rally slogan. I am sure there are all matters or various proposals out there across the spectrum - from abolish to some kind of reform. He chooses to comment on the abolish ones and gets a bit defensive. Why not talk over the other proposals that he is maybe more on agreement with? Seems like his time (from Evergreen) has him a bit defensive, which I can understand.

But here's my point re: defund the police. Yes, it complex and looking at just one element of the grander problem. But the police are the interface for black folks in terms of where they "see" inequality and racism. Working on that issue and making any gains or progress would be immensely appreciated by the black community. This guy here needs to come off the pedestal of his education and world view a bit and get down and dirty at solving something. I understand to some extent we are all guilty of this, so no real anger or finger pointing from me, but more just commenting that its very easy to pick and choose some irrational proposal from a sea of chaos, talk all whatever, and stall change too. 

@ImissWallyPryor thanks for posting those. I lost half a work day listening to them

 

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On 6/20/2020 at 10:58 PM, atomheartbevo said:

So.... Eskimo Pie is going to be renamed.  https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/20/business/eskimo-pie-ice-cream-name-change-trnd/index.html

I'm sticking to most of Surly being Eskimo brothers due to South Austin's mom.

But can anybody else think of any businesses or buildings or products with the word "Eskimo" in their name or title, that should be changed?  I'm sure there's a few out there that should maybe think about renaming their businesses or products.

 

 

On 6/20/2020 at 11:08 PM, smoky said:
On 6/20/2020 at 10:58 PM, atomheartbevo said:
So.... Eskimo Pie is going to be renamed.  https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/20/business/eskimo-pie-ice-cream-name-change-trnd/index.html
I'm sticking to most of Surly being Eskimo brothers due to South Austin's mom.
But can anybody else think of any businesses or buildings or products with the word "Eskimo" in their name or title, that should be changed?  I'm sure there's a few out there that should maybe think about renaming their businesses or products.
 

Read more  

Shaggy long game

Yeah, but some of us Surlians have a longer "game" than others.......

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Interesting development

_________ taps FBI, Secret Service for help on Minneapolis gun violence

Minneapolis __________has asked for help from local and federal agencies to respond to a spate of gun violence in the city that continued Monday.

Nine people were shot in three separate incidents in north Minneapolis, the Star Tribune reports, though it's not clear if the incidents were related to each other, or to the shooting in Uptown Minneapolis that killed Cody Pollard, 27, and wounded 11 others on Saturday. 

No arrest has been made in that shooting, though Minneapolis Police Department spokesman John Elder said the department is "making good headway" investigating.

Since Memorial Day, 111 people have been shot in Minneapolis, where activists and city council members are just getting started on discussions that could result in radical change with the police department

________said recent violence "only obstructs that vision of change."

The _____said the city will receive assistance from the Hennepin County Sheriff's Department, Metro Transit Police, the State Patrol, the FBI, the Secret Service, and the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms (ATF) to investigate the shootings.

_______said the "unified structure" involving multiple agencies will be "of paramount importance" to curb gun violence, and observed that city police had been met with angry crowds in some recent incidents.

"There have been several instances in which law enforcement, and our police officers have responded to a very serious critical incident, in some cases involving loss of life, where they've been surrounded, pelted bottles, rocks, or even worse," ______said. "That is not a dynamic that will lead to success, that is not a dynamic that will lead to public safety. And it certainly does not serve the victims of shootings or any other form of violence."

ShotSpotter technology has detected more than 1,600 gunshots over the past month, WCCO reports. In one incident Monday afternoon, 41 shots were recorded, wounding four victims; one was treated at a hospital for critical injuries.

Joining ________ at his Monday press conference, Minneapolis Police Chief Medaria Arradondo pointed out "many" of the victims in recent shootings are Black. 

 "The number of gunshot wound victims, specifically to our African Amercian community, in young men -- their lives are not disposable," Arradondo said. 

He added: "This cannot become our normal, as a city. This is unacceptable, and as your chief, I cannot tolerate this here. People have to be held accountable when they come in and do harm to our communities."

 

http://www.citypages.com/news/frey-taps-fbi-secret-service-for-help-on-minneapolis-gun-violence/571439591

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7 hours ago, Johnny Sack said:

Ever have one shot at your head while chasing a fleeing felon?

I think the problem is that you strongly identify with being so stupid and vindictive that you would shoot someone in the back if they fired a taser at you and missed- and then turned around and kept running.  I don't.  But I can see why you would.  If you can't pass 'don't shoot fleeing people in the back because Johnny Sack would' Academy', don't become a cop.

Again, you don't get to kill someone for what they might have done if they'd  been a better taser shot instead of missing.  I know this displeases you.   

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8 hours ago, Gatorubet said:

I think the problem is that you strongly identify with being so stupid and vindictive that you would shoot someone in the back if they fired a taser at you and missed- and then turned around and kept running.  I don't.  But I can see why you would.  If you can't pass 'don't shoot fleeing people in the back because Johnny Sack would' Academy', don't become a cop.

Again, you don't get to kill someone for what they might have done if they'd  been a better taser shot instead of missing.  I know this displeases you.   

So you haven’t.  You’re just Monday morning quarterbacking a split second decision by a cop.  No way he had a reasonable fear of serious bodily injury there, huh?

We will see what a jury says.  

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Nice to see Slorch and Sack are back to backing the blue unequivocally.

Even if the taser were a deadly weapon (it's not) and even if the cop didn't know it was out of charges (he should have) there is still no need to shoot someone in the back when they are running away.

Also, since they were engaged with him for 45 minutes, they knew there were no other weapons, so I don't know wtf Slorch is talking about. 

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Again, we will see what a jury says.  I have a feeling his tox screen is going to show he was on a lot more than alcohol. That is going to impact opinions on the jury.  As will playing the video at regular speed, not frame by frame or in slow motion.  There was very little time between the tazer round sailing past his head and the shots.

And I have a long history on this website.  I certainly do not back the blue unequivocally.  

I think you and Gator are holding these particular officers to a ridiculous standard.

 

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I’m sure this has been posted on the site sometime in the past but it’s an interesting read regarding police violence against African Americans. It’s obviously a multifaceted issue which needs to be addressed from all angles (police and community). 

 

https://harvardcrcl.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/10/2009/06/HLC104_crop.pdf

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9 hours ago, VRHorn said:

Nice to see Slorch and Sack are back to backing the blue unequivocally.

because Gatorbet is so fucking reasonable, right?

and no, I haven't remotely been backing the blue.   Don't get your panties bunched up because of one pause in hopes of one rational thought by the cop hater.

 

You people are so fucking ridiculous.  If someone doesn't hate something with 2000% of the intensity of the sun, they somehow support that something or someone.

Edited by Iceman
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37 minutes ago, Iceman said:

because Gatorbet is so fucking reasonable, right?

and no, I haven't remotely been backing the blue.   Don't get your panties bunched up because of one pause in hopes of one rational thought by the cop hater.

 

You people are so fucking ridiculous.  If someone doesn't hate something with 2000% of the intensity of the sun, they somehow support that something or someone.

What do you mean "you people?!"

/s

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1 minute ago, Gatorubet said:


Not enough cop hate, percentage wise. I can’t change my life experience. Wish I could.

hey,  you're consistent, I'll give you that.  You have a tough line of work and see much of the worst humanity has to offer.

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https://nypost.com/2020/06/23/oregon-county-issues-face-mask-order-exempting-non-white-people/

Oregon county issues face mask order that exempts non-white people

 

I don't understand this.  I can pretty much tell if someone is white or of color even wearing a mask.

 

Health officials announced last week residents must wear face coverings in public settings where they may come within six feet of another individual who is not from the same household.

But people of color do not have to follow the new rule if they have “heightened concerns about racial profiling and harassment” over wearing the masks, officials said.

“No person shall intimidate or harass people who do not comply,” health officials said.

Edited by BNB
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11 minutes ago, BNB said:

https://nypost.com/2020/06/23/oregon-county-issues-face-mask-order-exempting-non-white-people/

Oregon county issues face mask order that exempts non-white people

 

I don't understand this.  I can pretty much tell if someone is white or of color even wearing a mask.

 

Health officials announced last week residents must wear face coverings in public settings where they may come within six feet of another individual who is not from the same household.

But people of color do not have to follow the new rule if they have “heightened concerns about racial profiling and harassment” over wearing the masks, officials said.

“No person shall intimidate or harass people who do not comply,” health officials said.

Trick order.  Oregon only has about 7 people of color.  

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On 6/23/2020 at 10:03 PM, Gatorubet said:

I think the problem is that you strongly identify with being so stupid and vindictive that you would shoot someone in the back if they fired a taser at you and missed- and then turned around and kept running.  I don't.  But I can see why you would.  If you can't pass 'don't shoot fleeing people in the back because Johnny Sack would' Academy', don't become a cop.

Again, you don't get to kill someone for what they might have done if they'd  been a better taser shot instead of missing.  I know this displeases you.   

What a tool.   Clearly gator has never been in a fight or a life threatening situation.  Heart rate is racing.   Huge adrenaline rush.  The perp rolled the dice.   Started a fight and didn’t do the math.  He lost big time and there is zero recourse.  
 

Your lack of logic is tiresome.  

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21 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

It’s almost like they’re holding them face down on the ground for up to 10 minutes or more causing cardiac arrest or blocking airways.

Red herring.

Is there a single person on this website who doesn't think Chauvey is unequivocally guilty of homicide?

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https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/06/24/madison-police-protest-senator/

State Sen. Tim Carpenter (D-Milwaukee) told the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel that he had been heading to the State Capitol to work late Tuesday when he stopped to snap a photo of the protesters.

 

“I don’t know what happened … all I did was stop and take a picture … and the next thing I’m getting five-six punches, getting kicked in the head,” said Carpenter, 60.

 

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What a tool.   Clearly gator has never been in a fight or a life threatening situation.  Heart rate is racing.   Huge adrenaline rush.  The perp rolled the dice.   Started a fight and didn’t do the math.  He lost big time and there is zero recourse.  
 
Your lack of logic is tiresome.  

I can’t keep my head and steer a car at nearly 200 mph either. Heart racing, adrenaline pumping and all. And yet, there are trained people who can perform under those frightening physical and mental challenges, even though I could not handle it. They have adequate training and can perform in that environment with a clear mind when I can’t.

Similarly, I expect highly trained law enforcement to be able to handle the whole “when can I shoot a guy in the back running away...” issue and not some regarded dice rolling analogy. Unless there is some Georgia dice rolling or fight starting law you have and decline to share.

It will be up to a jury if shooting him in the back because he started something will prevail. Not saying it won’t. I’m saying it shouldn’t. Glad your world is black and white. It takes the pressure off that whole totality of the circumstances critical thinking thing.
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22 hours ago, Gatorubet said:


I can’t keep my head and steer a car at nearly 200 mph either. Heart racing, adrenaline pumping and all. And yet, there are trained people who can perform under those frightening physical and mental challenges, even though I could not handle it. They have adequate training and can perform in that environment with a clear mind when I can’t.

Similarly, I expect highly trained law enforcement to be able to handle the whole “when can I shoot a guy in the back running away...” issue and not some regarded dice rolling analogy. Unless there is some Georgia dice rolling or fight starting law you have and decline to share.

It will be up to a jury if shooting him in the back because he started something will prevail. Not saying it won’t. I’m saying it shouldn’t. Glad your world is black and white. It takes the pressure off that whole totality of the circumstances critical thinking thing.

In the minds of many of their tireless defenders, cops are simultaneously the most courageous and brave among us and also scared shitless and unable to act rationally in stressful situations. it's a great gig if you can get it with a significant subset of the population. You're a hero, but you don't have to actually ever act heroically. It's like a 4-year-old with a new costume. You're a superhero just by putting the uniform on. Your actions while wearing the uniform are irrelevant. You have the Superman costume on, you're Superman.

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Like most police officers 

I have 7 years of higher education and mandatory yearly continuing education.

They have an equally difficult job, and yet the ones we hire and the training we mandate is not that - and hardly sufficient - and not fair to them.

Difference is, their insufficiency kills people.
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1 hour ago, Huckleberry said:

cops are simultaneously the most courageous and brave among us and also scared shitless and unable to act rationally in stressful situations.

This.  These are the exact same people who regularly file reports, get warrants, and testify based on statements like "based on my years of experience and extensive training," setting them above and apart from the masses.

And then they are completely excused from acting to a higher standard based on all that experience and training when it comes to harming members of the public.

Well, which is it.....are cops super well-trained heroes, who should be given significant credibility and respect for that.....or are they just regular old chickenshits like the lowest common denominator?  Pick one.

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3 minutes ago, Gatorubet said:


I have 7 years of higher education and mandatory yearly continuing education.

They have an equally difficult job, and yet the ones we hire and the training we mandate is not that - and hardly sufficient - and not fair to them.

Difference is, their insufficiency kills people.

I agree, we need way more training, and not just when they start.  Should be annual.

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4 minutes ago, ChickenSandwich said:

I agree, we need way more training, and not just when they start.  Should be annual.

Yet....we actually have a screening process that weeds OUT the more intelligent candidates.  

As a matter of policy and practice, we have definitively chosen AGAINST having an intelligent, well-trained cadre of law enforcement, in favor of having a brute squad.

tenor.gif?itemid=13675618

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4 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Yet....we actually have a screening process that weeds OUT the more intelligent candidates.  

As a matter of policy and practice, we have definitively chosen AGAINST having an intelligent, well-trained cadre of law enforcement, in favor of having a brute squad.

tenor.gif?itemid=13675618

What is the process that weeds out the intelligent?  I'm not doubting you, I'm just ignorant on it.  I absolutely do think that it's a job that by design more likely than not the intelligent probably would rather do other professions.

Edited by Gene Parmesan
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7 minutes ago, ChickenSandwich said:

I agree, we need way more training, and not just when they start.  Should be annual.

There's been multiple data studies posted in this thread and others that show that the level of training that an PD has doesn't correlate at all with its use of force. Based on the numbers, it always closely correlates (and suggests a causation) with the terms of the police union contract, and how much authority the PD actually has to discipline and fire/prosecute its officers.

Training is all well and good, and important. But we have to take steps that will actually make a difference.

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