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WWII, Nazis Communists and other stuff


BabaYaga

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2 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

*me, walking through Auschwitz*

"Man, these guys were some fucking douche bags!"

 

Walk thru the Siberian Gulags,, and see the results of 20 million murdered by their own communist, dictator "uncle".  You trying to make the USSR out to be anything other than a murderous, genocidal, rogue state is funny.

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2 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

I'm sorry, what's your point about what the USSR did in WWII ?

I said the Soviet Union defeated the Nazis. Which... they did. The vast majority (70-80%) of Hitler's forces were concentrated on the Eastern Front contending with the Soviet army. Without them, Hitler easily defends the Western Front from the UK/US.

It's just history, man, I'm sorry if that triggers and offends your emotions. Sorry your history education was so poor and jingoistic that this hurts your feelings as a grown adult man.

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They were our ally only in we were both fighting a rogue state that directly attacked them, and our allies.

OK

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 Stain was a mass murdering, psychopath no better than Hitler.  The USSRs' game plan was world domination.... still is, it's just not called the USSR any more.

 

The USSR was bad. Nazi Germany was far worse.

Jesus Christ, people

Just now, Onboard 2.0 said:

Walk thru the Siberian Gulags,, and see the results of 20 million murdered by their own communist, dictator "uncle". 

When did I call him "uncle"? When did I even express admiration for him?

What does Stalin and the Soviet Union have to do with the topic of this thread?

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8 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

*me, walking through Auschwitz*

"Man, these guys were some fucking douche bags!"

 

"me walking through the Gulags"

"Man, these guys were some fucking douche bags also!"  But at least they hate them some Nazis....

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25 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Yes, the Soviet Union defeated the Nazis. The Communists not only were Hitler's greatest internal enemies, it was the communist Soviet Union that took on the massive Nazi war machine in the Eastern Front, the largest theater of war in human history. The US tragically lost 400k troops in WWII and the Soviet Union sacrificed nearly 17M people, or 15% of its population, to defeat Hitler.

Just some facts. I know our educational system and society at large wants to pretend we did it ourselves, but that's a lie. :)

 

The Soviet Union HELPED defeat the Nazis.  The Communists were not Hitler's greatest internal enemies.  Yes, the Communist USSR took on the massive Nazi war marching in the Eastern front, agreed, and it was the largest theater of LAND war in human history.  Although sea and air theaters of war involve fewer people, they are just as significant, if not more.  How many people you got killed from your own military is not a metric used by any respected military strategist.  Yes, they lost ~7x the number of people the other Allies did put together in the Eurasian campaign, but that doesn't mean they did anything better. 

Their tactical ineptitude cost millions of lives that didn't need to be lost.  And our educational system does teach about the USSR during WWII, it insists upon it ad nauseam.  For 75 years, much of the world has been trying to reframe Stalin and his military leadership during WWII (and the aftermath)...and they can't fucking do it because it horribly lacking.  We didn't pretend we did it ourselves.  Of course there was propaganda during the Cold War, but at our highest levels of military schooling...it's been proven out time and time again (by both us and Soviet sympathizers)...you don't study the USSR victory in the Eastern Front to see what to do with conventional land warfare...you study it to see what not to do.  

You're romancing the regime, and yes---without them...the Continent probably falls or at least takes us another 2 years and 200,000 Americans to clear.  There is so much of why the Reich fell at the end, and so little of it has to do with Soviet military prowess.  Next, let's do Japan and what Russia was doing there at the end.  And then bad_teammate...for such a continental man...you continuously ignore how the Germans were also defeated by these little-known militaries from Great Britain, Poland, Australia, Norway, Greece, Netherlands, India, and last but certainly not least---Canada.  The army with the most dead guys doesn't get like a special award or anything.  

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4 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

I think some very interesting conversation about the Soviet Union could be had in a relevant thread. This thread is supposed to be about the protests/riots in America this summer. :)

Maybe start a different thread for this irrelevant sidetrack. :)

You mean riots/protests lead my leaders professing the same Marxist ideology as the former Soviet Union and employing many of their same tactics?  Yeah, it's a big fucking mystery?  

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20 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

I'm sorry, what's your point about what the USSR did in WWII ?  They were our ally only in we were both fighting a rogue state that directly attacked them, and our allies.  Stain was a mass murdering, psychopath no better than Hitler.  The USSRs' game plan was world domination.... still is, it's just not called the USSR any more.

@Onboard 2.0 see below for the post that started this discussion:

6 hours ago, BabaYaga said:

A Communist trying to take the high ground against Nazis.  The irony certainly is amusing.  

This isn't ironic. In fact, as @bad_teammate points out, communists were crucial to the defeat of the Nazis, so if anything it is historically consistent. I suppose you could make an argument that it is hypocritical, but I think that is a bit of stretch too. 

I know y'all love your memes and claimed victim-hood, but it would really do y'all good to take a deep breath and perform just the tiniest bit of critical thinking and introspection rather than jumping up and down every time your assertions are even slightly challenged. 

 

Edited by Dahobbs
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20 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

I said the Soviet Union defeated the Nazis. Which... they did. The vast majority (70-80%) of Hitler's forces were concentrated on the Eastern Front contending with the Soviet army. Without them, Hitler easily defends the Western Front from the UK/US.

It's just history, man, I'm sorry if that triggers and offends your emotions. Sorry your history education was so poor and jingoistic that this hurts your feelings as a grown adult man.

OK

 

The USSR was bad. Nazi Germany was far worse.

Jesus Christ, people

When did I call him "uncle"? When did I even express admiration for him?

What does Stalin and the Soviet Union have to do with the topic of this thread?

Everyone one of your posts has been written to make it seem like the USSR was something  they were not.  

Uncle Joe, it's his moniker... so much for your knowledge of history.  I'll put my general knowledge of world history up against yours any day. Pick a topic brah.....

The Soviet Union killed 20 million of its own citizens. Mao very probably killed more. Nazi Germany caused WWII for damn sure, but make no mistake all 3 regimes are in a 3 way tie in many categories of worst regimes, and political systems in history.. 

You aren't triggering anything with me regarding the USSR, and their defeat of Hitler. Yes they played a big part, they sure as hell didn't defeat them single handedly. Hitler defeated himself in 42 when he began fighting a multi front war. He split his forces in 3 locations Africa, Europe, and Eurasia (Russia).  

The USSR was basically fighting a single front war, and relied on tons of material from the US. (fighting a war on 2 fronts as well).  You can say the USSR finally beat a beleaguered Nazi Germany, but you aren't telling the entire story.  

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1 minute ago, bad_teammate said:

This is supposed to be about this country in 2020 not 75 years ago.

I know.  How about we look at the current leadership today of a movement in 2020 and the tactics currently being employed and notice hey, that's the same fucking shit from 75 years ago and it didn't work them either?  Hmmmmmmm....

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Well, the 75th anniversary of VJ-day is coming up next week.  We could split off a separate thread for that.  After all, China suffered nearly 10mm casualties, between civilians and military personnel so that means they are awesome at war and the U.S. didn't do it all themselves.  Maybe the Free French in exile helped us with that one.  

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1 minute ago, BabaYaga said:

I know.  How about we look at the current leadership today of a movement in 2020 and the tactics currently being employed and notice hey, that's the same fucking shit from 75 years ago and it didn't work them either?  Hmmmmmmm....

It will be different this time because of their big brains and huge amount of feels.

...so shut up and write the check

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3 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

@Onboard 2.0 see below for the post that started this discussion:

This isn't ironic. In fact, as @bad_teammate points out, communists were crucial to the defeat of the Nazis, so if anything it is historically consistent. I suppose you could make an argument it is hypocritical, but I think that is a bit of stretch too. 

I know y'all love your memes and claimed victim-hood, but it would really do y'all good to take a deep breath and perform just the tiniest bit of critical thinking and introspection rather than jumping up and down every time your assertions are even slightly challenged. 

 

One more poster trying to make some bizarre point about the USSR, and their defeat of Hitler ? They were attacked by Hitler, and did what any normal country would do, they defended themselves, and used superior numbers to defeat an army fighting a multi front war, led by a man with no military strategic,  experience.

The USSR would have gladly sat out WWII, and would have entered only when it was strategically advantageous to do so given the opportunity. The whole ANTIFA is crusading against Nazis is so much BS. They crusade against anyone who doesn't follow their belief system in lock step (they're modern day brown shirts).  We don't need ANTIFA fighting Nazis for us.

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2 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

One more poster trying to make some bizarre point about the USSR, and their defeat of Hitler ? They were attacked by Hitler, and did what any normal country would do, they defended themselves, and used superior numbers to defeat an army fighting a multi front war, led by a man with no military strategic,  experience.

The USSR would have gladly sat out WWII, and would have entered only when it was strategically advantageous to do so given the opportunity. The whole ANTIFA is crusading against Nazis is so much BS. They crusade against anyone who doesn't follow their belief system in lock step (they're modern day brown shirts).  We don't need ANTIFA fighting Nazis for us.

What does any of that have to do with anything? I don't care what the Soviet Union's motivations were, the fact is that its contributions were critical to the defeat of Nazi Germany. 

Also, everyone should be fighting Nazis, you included. I have no idea why anyone would take issue with someone else fighting Nazis. I get not liking Antifa's tactics or not liking Antifa because you believe they are doing something other than fighting Nazis (e.g., harassing people having nothing to do with Nazism or fascism). But I can't comprehend having an issue with someone who is fighting actual Nazis. That's just bizarre. 

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1 minute ago, Dahobbs said:

What does any of that have to do with anything? I don't care what the Soviet Union's motivations were, the fact is that its contributions were critical to the defeat of Nazi Germany. 

Also, everyone should be fighting Nazis, you included. I have no idea why anyone would take issue with someone else fighting Nazis. I get not liking Antifa's tactics or not liking Antifa because you believe they are doing something other than fighting Nazis (e.g., harassing people having nothing to do with Nazism or fascism). But I can't comprehend having an issue with someone who is fighting actual Nazis. That's just bizarre. 

No one is. Full stop.

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5 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

No one is . . . what? Fighting Nazis or having an issue with people fighting actual Nazis? @Onboard 2.0 seems to have an issue with the latter based on his last post.

I have an issue with any vigilante group trying to do anything like that. We don't need Nazi fighters here in America, but you go ahead and try to argue that.  It'll be fun to watch.

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10 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Also, everyone should be fighting Nazis, you included

Would you also say "Everyone should be fighting socialists?" We don't "fight" people for their views in America (as fucked up as the Nazi's may be). We are a nation of laws.If they break the law, they should be arrested and prosecuted. 

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20 hours ago, BurntEyes said:

Um.. and this might seem like a stupid question, but are there people unaware of the specific associations Netflix has with um, certain political figures? I mean, it's not like they have kept it low key or tried to hide it for crying out loud.

Their donations to a certain, um, yeah, you know, are off the charts and are not some well hidden secret.

But, hey, PROOF POSITIVE BABY!!!

Edited by Cajun
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11 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

What does any of that have to do with anything? I don't care what the Soviet Union's motivations were, the fact is that its contributions were critical to the defeat of Nazi Germany. 

Also, everyone should be fighting Nazis, you included. I have no idea why anyone would take issue with someone else fighting Nazis. I get not liking Antifa's tactics or not liking Antifa because you believe they are doing something other than fighting Nazis (e.g., harassing people having nothing to do with Nazism or fascism). But I can't comprehend having an issue with someone who is fighting actual Nazis. That's just bizarre. 

 I was responding to BTs take that the USSR was somehow the reason Germany was defeated.  

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Just now, Onboard 2.0 said:

I have an issue with any vigilante group trying to do anything like that. We don't need Nazi fighters here in America, but you go ahead and try to argue that.  It'll be fun to watch.

Nor do are we giving a pass for a certain ideology responsible for the deaths of millions just because they are hiding under the auspices of hating Nazis.  This idiotic notion that Communists, Socialists, and Marxists get a pass because of Nazis is something a 5yr old would come up with.  

"yeah, our ideology is responsible for close to a 100M global deaths, but man, those Nazis fucking suck"

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7 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

I have an issue with any vigilante group trying to do anything like that. We don't need Nazi fighters here in America, but you go ahead and try to argue that.  It'll be fun to watch.

That's a HARD disagree, my man.

Nazis, even here in America, kill people. It's an actual, real deadly threat to American lives today. Not destroyed property or laser pointers or chanting, but the murder of human beings.

We 100% need people fighting Nazis. If someone goes out in the street with Nazis shit on, they need to be confronted forcefully. No one should injure or kill an American Nazi, but screaming in their faces and pouring water on their heads is the least of what Nazis deserve. Hound them day and night. I'm actually kind of surprised to making life intolerable for Nazis is a controversial position.

----------------

I will happily discuss WWII in a relevant thread. I'm not talking about it anymore here. Once again, I apologize for taking the bait and extending that off-topic derail. :)

Edited by bad_teammate
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Just now, BabaYaga said:

Nor do are we giving a pass for a certain ideology responsible for the deaths of millions just because they are hiding under the auspices of hating Nazis.  This idiotic notion that Communists, Socialists, and Marxists get a pass because of Nazis is something a 5yr old would come up with.  

"yeah, our ideology is responsible for close to a 100M global deaths, but man, those Nazis fucking suck"

They're just jealous of their great looking uniforms...  Those Mao jackets sucked ass.

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1 minute ago, bad_teammate said:

That's a HARD disagree, my man.

Nazis, even here in America, kill people. It's an actual, real deadly threat to American lives today. Not destroyed property or laser pointers or chanting, but the murder of human beings.

We 100% need people fighting Nazis. If someone goes out in the street with Nazis shit on, they need to be confronted forcefully. No one should injure or kill an American Nazi, but screaming in their faces and pouring water on their heads is the least of what Nazis deserve. Hound them day and night. I'm actually kind of surprised to making life intolerable for Nazis is a controversial position.

----------------

I will happily discuss WWII in a relevant thread. I'm not talking about it anymore here. Once again, I apologize for taking the bait and extending that off-topic derail. :)

We have this thing called law enforcement, and the FBI to handle Nazis. 

Start a WWII thread and I'll gladly patriciate, and enjoy hearing other posters takes on that particular world party.

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7 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

Would you also say "Everyone should be fighting socialists?" We don't "fight" people for their views in America (as fucked up as the Nazi's may be). We are a nation of laws.If they break the law, they should be arrested and prosecuted. 

This, this, a fucking thousand times this. Wish I could rep it more.

 

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10 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

Would you also say "Everyone should be fighting socialists?" We don't "fight" people for their views in America (as fucked up as the Nazi's may be). We are a nation of laws.If they break the law, they should be arrested and prosecuted. 

We fight against people for their views all the damn time. That's what we do. That's what y'all have been doing this whole thread. "Fight" is not limited to physical altercation, and I was not using in that limited sense. If you are, then I agree, physical altercations should be limited in accordance with the law. 

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Jesus fucking Christ. The amount of mental gymnastics a couple of posters will go through to make themselves feel bright and woke is ridiculous. You hit “reply” on your post and sit back and think you did this

dc6b36772c057a00686ff2bf17b3000d.gif

But you really did this

170999fe34c3602929a568626f6d3c24.gif

Give it a fucking rest.

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Just now, Dahobbs said:

We fight against people for their views all the damn time. That's what we do. That's what y'all have been doing this whole thread. "Fight" is not limited to physical altercation, and I was not using in that limited sense. If you are, then I agree, physical altercations should be limited in accordance with the law. 

Give it a rest.  You know damn fucking well he was referring to physical violence.

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2 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

Give it a rest.  You know damn fucking well he was referring to physical violence.

Yeah, but I wasn't. He responded to me, accordingly I clarified the intent of my post. 

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