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Texas Recruiting Notes 2022 - Idiotic Slapfights Unrelated To 2022 Recruiting


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11 minutes ago, golfclap said:

Part of the issue is that it's not just a position coach that develops the player. 

The S&C coach (as well as the training staff and the dietician,(s)) is a huge component to long term development and Sark hired a third tier S&C guy. There's not a modern and multi-faceted approach to full body flexibility and explosive power nor any cutting edge analytics that tailor not only the S&C workouts but more importantly full body recovery that is specific to each player and position group, as well as optimum recovery from nagging minor injuries. The gap between where other schools (specifically Bama, Clemson, tOSU, Oregon) are with S&C and Texas is with Torre Becton is a vast chasm. It's a FAR bigger gap than the gap Sark vs. other QB developers on those staffs would have as an advantage. Similarly, Sarkisian hasn't added former HC/OC/DCs to any of the support roles to speak of, much less an army of them. At Texas there aren't former HC/OC/DCs grading each days position group film, looking for things to work on in the next practice/tells that give away assignments, or grading the effort and drills of those position coaches and their army of assistants coaching along (regardless of the rules). Nor are you going against an entire defense of NFL talent for every rep. For 5 years. Even when it's 3s vs 3s. 

If you ask all of the players, the trainers, the high school and 7v7 coaches if they think the recruit will be developed at Alabama, independent of who their position coach is or will be, they will unequivocally say "yes", because that has proven to be true. No matter the position coach. No matter the position. The system is in place. If you ask even just QBs if they will be developed at Texas under Sarkisian you won't have unanimity and you'll have more than a few tell you that they aren't sure he'll even be the HC by the time this 2022 class finishes. You'll get the same Alabama-type responses at Clemson and tOSU. Beyond those schools it drops to a more position-by-position basis for other schools (like OU, UGa, etc)  and you see the clearly defined gap between the top 3 and everyone else. 

The reality is that Sarkisian is a mediocre head coach taking over a program mired in mediocrity. He's done nothing but make mediocre choices for his recruiting and support staff. All while ALL the other schools have preached since Sark's hire that this is Texas doing "more of the same" -- being mediocre. You can't counter the "more of the same" messaging from EVERY OTHER SCHOOL with "We did X at Bama and developed Player Y" because all of these recruits/trainers/parents/coaches have seen an army of coaches go from Bama say excatly that and do exactly fuckall at their new jobs. So you have do it by showing them that you have changed not only what you've done in the past that was decidedly mediocre (nope) but how the entire org works from the top down to be on par with those top 3 schools. (nope). 

It's not as easy as saying I coached Mac Jones or Alex Leatherwood - because ___________ (insert 30 coaches who have come and gone) coached ______________ (insert 70 names from Alabama since 2011 when Saban's recruiting classes started hitting the draft like a fucking hammer). Sarkisian and his staff will have to prove that development travels with them because the messaging has been countered by every single school in the country using the "more of the same" messaging against Texas. 

Sarksian is going all-in on scheme and preparation. If he succeeds he will be able to quickly sell this staff's ability to scheme, develop, and identify talent and it will resonate. He will be able to flip some guys and really hammer the 2023 class.  If he loses 3 or more games that all-in approach will net him a pink slip before he ever really gets going because the 2022 and 2023 classes will be marginal and we will be doing this dance again in 3-4 years.

So our S&C staff is dogshit now?

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11 minutes ago, texifornia said:

Well he did hire a good coaching staff. So there's that at least. Scheme and preparation should be good, like you allude to.

The support staff is a big leaky balloon. That needs to get fixed.

the disparity between the quality of on-field coaching staff hires and all other roles is pretty confounding, especially for a guy who saw exactly how Bama operates for two years. 

 

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12 minutes ago, golfclap said:

Part of the issue is that it's not just a position coach that develops the player. 

The S&C coach (as well as the training staff and the dietician,(s)) is a huge component to long term development and Sark hired a third tier S&C guy. There's not a modern and multi-faceted approach to full body flexibility and explosive power nor any cutting edge analytics that tailor not only the S&C workouts but more importantly full body recovery that is specific to each player and position group, as well as optimum recovery from nagging minor injuries. The gap between where other schools (specifically Bama, Clemson, tOSU, Oregon) are with S&C and Texas is with Torre Becton is a vast chasm. It's a FAR bigger gap than the gap Sark vs. other QB developers on those staffs would have as an advantage. Similarly, Sarkisian hasn't added former HC/OC/DCs to any of the support roles to speak of, much less an army of them. At Texas there aren't former HC/OC/DCs grading each days position group film, looking for things to work on in the next practice/tells that give away assignments, or grading the effort and drills of those position coaches and their army of assistants coaching along (regardless of the rules). Nor are you going against an entire defense of NFL talent for every rep. For 5 years. Even when it's 3s vs 3s. 

If you ask all of the players, the trainers, the high school and 7v7 coaches if they think the recruit will be developed at Alabama, independent of who their position coach is or will be, they will unequivocally say "yes", because that has proven to be true. No matter the position coach. No matter the position. The system is in place. If you ask even just QBs if they will be developed at Texas under Sarkisian you won't have unanimity and you'll have more than a few tell you that they aren't sure he'll even be the HC by the time this 2022 class finishes. You'll get the same Alabama-type responses at Clemson and tOSU. Beyond those schools it drops to a more position-by-position basis for other schools (like OU, UGa, etc)  and you see the clearly defined gap between the top 3 and everyone else. 

The reality is that Sarkisian is a mediocre head coach taking over a program mired in mediocrity. He's done nothing but make mediocre choices for his recruiting and support staff. All while ALL the other schools have preached since Sark's hire that this is Texas doing "more of the same" -- being mediocre. You can't counter the "more of the same" messaging from EVERY OTHER SCHOOL with "We did X at Bama and developed Player Y" because all of these recruits/trainers/parents/coaches have seen an army of coaches go from Bama say excatly that and do exactly fuckall at their new jobs. So you have do it by showing them that you have changed not only what you've done in the past that was decidedly mediocre (nope) but how the entire org works from the top down to be on par with those top 3 schools. (nope). 

It's not as easy as saying I coached Mac Jones or Alex Leatherwood - because ___________ (insert 30 coaches who have come and gone) coached ______________ (insert 70 names from Alabama since 2011 when Saban's recruiting classes started hitting the draft like a fucking hammer). Sarkisian and his staff will have to prove that development travels with them because the messaging has been countered by every single school in the country using the "more of the same" messaging against Texas. 

Sarksian is going all-in on scheme and preparation. If he succeeds he will be able to quickly sell this staff's ability to scheme, develop, and identify talent and it will resonate. He will be able to flip some guys and really hammer the 2023 class.  If he loses 3 or more games that all-in approach will net him a pink slip before he ever really gets going because the 2022 and 2023 classes will be marginal and we will be doing this dance again in 3-4 years.

How do you know Becton isn't doing any of that stuff?

Also, filling support staff with former HCs etc is basically a Bama thing. Let's not pretend every program is doing that.

Lastly, these coaches CAN point to developing players across multiple programs. Sark has 1st rounders from USC, UW, and Bama. PK has Boise and UW. Joseph has Aggy and ND. And so on. A lot of this success coming with much lower recruiting talent levels than Bama or even Texas.

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17 minutes ago, golfclap said:

Part of the issue is that it's not just a position coach that develops the player. 

The S&C coach (as well as the training staff and the dietician,(s)) is a huge component to long term development and Sark hired a third tier S&C guy. There's not a modern and multi-faceted approach to full body flexibility and explosive power nor any cutting edge analytics that tailor not only the S&C workouts but more importantly full body recovery that is specific to each player and position group, as well as optimum recovery from nagging minor injuries. The gap between where other schools (specifically Bama, Clemson, tOSU, Oregon) are with S&C and Texas is with Torre Becton is a vast chasm. It's a FAR bigger gap than the gap Sark vs. other QB developers on those staffs would have as an advantage. Similarly, Sarkisian hasn't added former HC/OC/DCs to any of the support roles to speak of, much less an army of them. At Texas there aren't former HC/OC/DCs grading each days position group film, looking for things to work on in the next practice/tells that give away assignments, or grading the effort and drills of those position coaches and their army of assistants coaching along (regardless of the rules). Nor are you going against an entire defense of NFL talent for every rep. For 5 years. Even when it's 3s vs 3s. 

If you ask all of the players, the trainers, the high school and 7v7 coaches if they think the recruit will be developed at Alabama, independent of who their position coach is or will be, they will unequivocally say "yes", because that has proven to be true. No matter the position coach. No matter the position. The system is in place. If you ask even just QBs if they will be developed at Texas under Sarkisian you won't have unanimity and you'll have more than a few tell you that they aren't sure he'll even be the HC by the time this 2022 class finishes. You'll get the same Alabama-type responses at Clemson and tOSU. Beyond those schools it drops to a more position-by-position basis for other schools (like OU, UGa, etc)  and you see the clearly defined gap between the top 3 and everyone else. 

The reality is that Sarkisian is a mediocre head coach taking over a program mired in mediocrity. He's done nothing but make mediocre choices for his recruiting and support staff. All while ALL the other schools have preached since Sark's hire that this is Texas doing "more of the same" -- being mediocre. You can't counter the "more of the same" messaging from EVERY OTHER SCHOOL with "We did X at Bama and developed Player Y" because all of these recruits/trainers/parents/coaches have seen an army of coaches go from Bama say excatly that and do exactly fuckall at their new jobs. So you have do it by showing them that you have changed not only what you've done in the past that was decidedly mediocre (nope) but how the entire org works from the top down to be on par with those top 3 schools. (nope). 

It's not as easy as saying I coached Mac Jones or Alex Leatherwood - because ___________ (insert 30 coaches who have come and gone) coached ______________ (insert 70 names from Alabama since 2011 when Saban's recruiting classes started hitting the draft like a fucking hammer). Sarkisian and his staff will have to prove that development travels with them because the messaging has been countered by every single school in the country using the "more of the same" messaging against Texas. 

Sarksian is going all-in on scheme and preparation. If he succeeds he will be able to quickly sell this staff's ability to scheme, develop, and identify talent and it will resonate. He will be able to flip some guys and really hammer the 2023 class.  If he loses 3 or more games that all-in approach will net him a pink slip before he ever really gets going because the 2022 and 2023 classes will be marginal and we will be doing this dance again in 3-4 years.

why is Torre Becton garbage now?  Is he crap cause you hadnt heard of him til he came here?

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6 minutes ago, Tex-19 said:

Also, filling support staff with former HCs etc is basically a Bama thing. Let's not pretend every program is doing that.

This is laughable. Tons of programs all over the country hire former HCs/Coordinators to help evaluate. All the elite ones do, so do TCU and Baylor and lots of others. Hell, even Herman did it with Fedora and added some nice RPO wrinkles that he quickly decided to go away from once he saw they actually worked. 
 

There’s really no debate that our support staff in both coaching and recruiting is subpar right now. Sark either needs to develop it himself, or hand that task off to someone who can. 

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How did people decide CDC or the recruiting support staff are the problem? Is that from 9.95ers? The same ones who don't seem to know shit about anything? This happened when we hired Sark. No one had a clue who we were going to hire yet knew the inner workings of the decision making process? Now we get the same stories in recruiting. You were wrong about where player X was going, but somehow know they didn't choose Texas because of the recruiting support staff? Really? I see why "insiders" put that shit out, but I'm less clear on why anyone would believe them.

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49 minutes ago, golfclap said:

Sarksian is going all-in on scheme and preparation. If he succeeds he will be able to quickly sell this staff's ability to scheme, develop, and identify talent and it will resonate. He will be able to flip some guys and really hammer the 2023 class.  If he loses 3 or more games that all-in approach will net him a pink slip before he ever really gets going because the 2022 and 2023 classes will be marginal and we will be doing this dance again in 3-4 years.

I'm always shocked at the certainty some of you speak with about things you couldn't even fully grasp if you were on the inside.

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12 minutes ago, Tex-19 said:

How do you know Becton isn't doing any of that stuff?

 

11 minutes ago, Zhorn96 said:

why is Torre Becton garbage now?  Is he crap cause you hadnt heard of him til he came here?

Do you guys think S&C happens in a vacuum? Do you honestly think people don't know who different S&C coaches are and what they prefer to do and how they go about their jobs? These guys all speak at events all the time. Giving back to the coaching community is actually part of the requirements of their job and certifications. Torre Becton comes directly from the Ivan Lewis coaching tree - so what he does is known. Do you think if someone is coming from the Mike Leach coaching tree that they are likely to be running the flexbone? Lewis and Becton both worked under Sarkisian previously at USC and UW. It was a comfort hire and I said it when he was hired. This isn't new information. 

By comparison, when Cochran left Alabama for an on-field role at UGa, Saban went and grabbed David Ballou and Dr. Matt Rhea to replace him. Those guys brought in entirely new approaches to recovery and flexibility and a ton of new analytics and research-driven ideas. He didn't even do more of the same and that "the same" at the time was undefeated seasons and guys that look like fucking cyborgs. Saban went and got more cutting edge and advanced. 

If you compare what Becton teaches and does with guys like Joey Batson, Mickey Marotti, Tommy Moffit, Edmond and Hill at Kentucky, that assbag Feld at Oregon it's not comparable. It's Jimbo Fisher vs. Lincon Riley as QB coaches and OCs. Both have success on their resume but which guy is teaching new ideas and techniques? Bennie Wylie is in the same boat - he does a bunch of shit that he's always done because that's what people do. He's not a plus for their program, he's just the guy getting the guys in football shape. No one is choosing OU because of Bennie Wylie and no one is choosing Texas because of Becton. 

If you guys think the S&C guys don't matter in recruiting...  I don't know what to tell you. 

 

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Has anything been coming out about how Becton's program is not up to par?  Dude has a great rep, Cal was willing to make him their highest paid assistant behind the co-ordinators to keep him and he turned down SC the previous year.  You can talk shit all you want about Pac-12 football but Cal maxed out their talent because of Becton and SC isn't going to hire a nobody.

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54 minutes ago, golfclap said:

The reality is that Sarkisian is a mediocre head coach taking over a program mired in mediocrity. He's done nothing but make mediocre choices for his recruiting and support staff. All while ALL the other schools have preached since Sark's hire that this is Texas doing "more of the same" -- being mediocre.

@golfclap is a mediocre poster. In fact, this post was drowning in mediocrity. His entire history of posts is .... you guessed it.... mediocre. You know how we know? Because I said so. And ALL the other posters continue to preach that golfclap and his posts are nothing but mediocre, but he keeps doing the same shit -- being mediocre.

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4 minutes ago, Zhorn96 said:

Has anything been coming out about how Becton's program is not up to par?  Dude has a great rep, Cal was willing to make him their highest paid assistant behind the co-ordinators to keep him and he turned down SC the previous year.  You can talk shit all you want about Pac-12 football but Cal maxed out their talent because of Becton and SC isn't going to hire a nobody.

Nothing. Golfclap is just talking out of his ass again. 

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4 minutes ago, golfclap said:

 

Do you guys think S&C happens in a vacuum? Do you honestly think people don't know who different S&C coaches are and what they prefer to do and how they go about their jobs? These guys all speak at events all the time. Giving back to the coaching community is actually part of the requirements of their job and certifications. Torre Becton comes directly from the Ivan Lewis coaching tree - so what he does is known. Do you think if someone is coming from the Mike Leach coaching tree that they are likely to be running the flexbone? Lewis and Becton both worked under Sarkisian previously at USC and UW. It was a comfort hire and I said it when he was hired. This isn't new information. 

By comparison, when Cochran left Alabama for an on-field role at UGa, Saban went and grabbed David Ballou and Dr. Matt Rhea to replace him. Those guys brought in entirely new approaches to recovery and flexibility and a ton of new analytics and research-driven ideas. He didn't even do more of the same and that "the same" at the time was undefeated seasons and guys that look like fucking cyborgs. Saban went and got more cutting edge and advanced. 

If you compare what Becton teaches and does with guys like Joey Batson, Mickey Marotti, Tommy Moffit, Edmond and Hill at Kentucky, that assbag Feld at Oregon it's not comparable. It's Jimbo Fisher vs. Lincon Riley as QB coaches and OCs. Both have success on their resume but which guy is teaching new ideas and techniques? Bennie Wylie is in the same boat - he does a bunch of shit that he's always done because that's what people do. He's not a plus for their program, he's just the guy getting the guys in football shape. No one is choosing OU because of Bennie Wylie and no one is choosing Texas because of Becton. 

If you guys think the S&C guys don't matter in recruiting...  I don't know what to tell you. 

 

if I can nitpick, they overlapped at UW for a couple years but were at SC at different times.  Sounds like you're basing your opinion on conjecture but havent heard anything since Becton got to UT.  Got it.

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12 minutes ago, Texasrocks said:

How did people decide CDC or the recruiting support staff are the problem? Is that from 9.95ers? The same ones who don't seem to know shit about anything? This happened when we hired Sark. No one had a clue who we were going to hire yet knew the inner workings of the decision making process? Now we get the same stories in recruiting. You were wrong about where player X was going, but somehow know they didn't choose Texas because of the recruiting support staff? Really? I see why "insiders" put that shit out, but I'm less clear on why anyone would believe them.

The support staff thing is pretty easy. In no way does the Brendan Harris experience look or sound remotely like Carrington did when he was motivated, if you want to compare him to a someone we all have seen work.

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3 minutes ago, Zhorn96 said:

if I can nitpick, they overlapped at UW for a couple years but were at SC at different times.  Sounds like you're basing your opinion on conjecture but havent heard anything since Becton got to UT.  Got it.

I'm not talking about Becton in terms of S&C per se - I'm talking about his impact on recruiting. This entire conversation was specific to the original point that a position coach (Sark and Flood) should be able to point to the NFL draft and say we developed X and make it rain on the recruiting trail. I pointed out that the current messaging is that Texas trying to counter the messaging from everyone that Texas was doing more of the same. Hiring Becton was more of the same, which in turn is not a boon to recruiting. I don't think anything there is shocking. 

As a S&C coach he's a good coach - he's a good S&C that is getting his team in game shape. Like I said though "No one is choosing OU because of Bennie Wylie and no one is choosing Texas because of Becton."

There are S&C coaches that do make a recruiting impact and combatting the "more of the same" messaging by hiring one (or multiple) of those coaches away from their current role and into the role at Texas would've helped recruiting as well as perhaps maximizing performance and bringing in new ideas and techniques.  I don't even think that's a controversial opinion.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

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3 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

So golfclap is upset because our S&C coach isn’t a strong recruiter? Got damn, that makes his Drayton take even better and this whole thing super funny. 

It's such an incredibly dumb take and yet people on here believe this guy knows what he's talking about. 

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8 minutes ago, golfclap said:

I'm not talking about Becton in terms of S&C per se - I'm talking about his impact on recruiting. This entire conversation was specific to the original point that a position coach (Sark and Flood) should be able to point to the NFL draft and say we developed X and make it rain on the recruiting trail. I pointed out that the current messaging is that Texas trying to counter the messaging from everyone that Texas was doing more of the same. Hiring Becton was more of the same, which in turn is not a boon to recruiting. I don't think anything there is shocking. 

As a S&C coach he's a good coach - he's a good S&C that is getting his team in game shape. Like I said though "No one is choosing OU because of Bennie Wylie and no one is choosing Texas because of Becton."

There are S&C coaches that do make a recruiting impact and combatting the "more of the same" messaging by hiring one (or multiple) of those coaches away from their current role and into the role at Texas would've helped recruiting as well as perhaps maximizing performance and bringing in new ideas and techniques.  I don't even think that's a controversial opinion.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

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Just now, Rickylovesweed said:

It's such an incredibly dumb take and yet people on here believe this guy knows what he's talking about. 

I knew he was a joke when he was going on and on about how our linebacker room was fine even though our staff was going after just about every linebacker that hit the portal. 

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1 minute ago, SydneyCarton said:

Because I’m pretty sure CDC has fired the entire compliance staff and is using a magic 8-ball that only returns “no” and “that sounds scary.”

It would be interesting to read some examples of NIL stuff that has been shot down.

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12 minutes ago, Texasrocks said:

How did people decide CDC or the recruiting support staff are the problem? Is that from 9.95ers? The same ones who don't seem to know shit about anything? This happened when we hired Sark. No one had a clue who we were going to hire yet knew the inner workings of the decision making process? Now we get the same stories in recruiting. You were wrong about where player X was going, but somehow know they didn't choose Texas because of the recruiting support staff? Really? I see why "insiders" put that shit out, but I'm less clear on why anyone would believe them.

Some folks aren't as far as away from elements of the program or recruiting as you are. It's a free world and obviously your option to buy-in or ignore whatever you like, but what is the purpose of your question? Is it to identify whether or not you think people are just making shit up or projecting? This isn't science. It's people and politics. Shit changes, perceptions of same conversations can differ, people lie, people buy, etc. That's recruiting, that's internal dynamics in a fucking bloated AD and long mediocre giant football program. You guys that read this stuff and go in the direction of taking it all as etched in stone and then get angry and want to mock shit when, gasp!, a recruitment got twisted, are an odd lot. I usually just assume y'all have never managed people. 

The recruiting and analyst support staff is underwhelming. Not you, or anyone else, can present a credible argument to counter that based on the resumes and history of those involved. The Glasscock guy was an uninspired choice after Sarkisian's first plan got nixed by compliance. Searels is actively disappointing the staff. Brandon Harris isn't connecting with recruits and he's not engaged in it at the expectations set for that position. There's a very good chance that all or 2 of those people are fired before the calendar year ends if Sarkisian has the chops for the role and can admit personnel mistakes quickly. 

As to the other issues, like the S&C outlook and football analyst staff, I differ strongly with golfclap's ongoing frothy mouthed rants. 

 

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22 minutes ago, golfclap said:

I'm not talking about Becton in terms of S&C per se - I'm talking about his impact on recruiting. This entire conversation was specific to the original point that a position coach (Sark and Flood) should be able to point to the NFL draft and say we developed X and make it rain on the recruiting trail. I pointed out that the current messaging is that Texas trying to counter the messaging from everyone that Texas was doing more of the same. Hiring Becton was more of the same, which in turn is not a boon to recruiting. I don't think anything there is shocking. 

 

This is so fucking dumb. No recruit is committing to a strength and conditioning coach. Get the fuck out of here. 

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4 minutes ago, Big Woodrows said:

In actual recruiting news, 247 has Evan Stewart as the #1 WR (#9 overall) in the country now

Please take this recruiting news to another forum please.  This thread is to discuss shit no one knows about but writes as if they are in the know, thank you very much.

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  • closetojumping changed the title to Texas Recruiting Notes 2022 - Idiotic Slapfights Unrelated To 2022 Recruiting

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