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Donald Trump 2019


Francisco 2.0

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11 minutes ago, Fozzz said:

Y'all realize the crowd at a PGA tournament is going to be far, far more Republican and right wing than the crowd at a NASCAR event?  

Disagree.  There would be roughly the same number of Republican voters at each event.  But one group has their interests served by the party and the other group has been convinced its libruls, blacks and mexicans that have made them poor white trash.

oh-you-dont-need-to-fight-tuem-you-just-

Edited by Goredho
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41 minutes ago, Mo Horn said:

Probably? Meh, his defense strategy could be I'm guilty as fuck, what are you going to do about it, and the Senate would do absolutely nothing. 

Yesterday I saw a clip of Lindsey Graham saying in so many words that impeachment "would go nowhere" in the Senate.  While I realize that there is no means by which he could be censured for saying that, if he was a man of honor he would recuse himself from any impeachment trial that might arise.  By saying this, he is no different that a juror stating he will not vote guilty regardless of what evidence is presented at trial.

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56 minutes ago, Mo Horn said:

Probably? Meh, his defense strategy could be I'm guilty as fuck, what are you going to do about it, and the Senate would do absolutely nothing. 

Everyone knows that's what's going to happen.

He's going to be impeached but not removed.

It will be a political victory to carry into the election. Let's just hope he loses.

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I'm losing interest in impeachment because I think this is all going to play out predictably.

  • Trump will be rightly impeached
  • The senate will wrongly fail to remove from office
  • The American people will vote Trump's ass out of office by a wide margin
  • The cumulative effects of wanton propaganda, electoral college gamesmanship, election meddling, voter fraud and hacking in support of Trump will keep him in office
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21 hours ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

NASCAR is much like the modern day GOP.  They don't feel like they need to make any changes, because what they have is working, in spite of the rest of the world changing around them on a daily basis.  Of course, Nascar has made some changes with their rules and scheduling, but they have turned off the very fan base they need to survive.  Once the current TV contracts expire in 2024 I suspect things will really be different.  

I actually think there is a lot of symbolic comparisons to be made between the GOP and NASCAR.

NASCAR has been abandoning, or trying to abandon it's older, sometimes smaller (seating-wise), more traditional, less sexy facilities, located around much of their fanbase, and that helped make NASCAR what it is.  NASCAR leadership constantly fights with folks/facilities that could expand the brand.  The various raceways fight with the fans over ridiculous prices, seating, and policies.  The older, more interesting personalities have been retiring/dying off, and far too many of the younger drivers are fucking corporate robots with bland personalities.

I watched a shitload of NASCAR as a kid, up through the 90s (lost interest for several years after Davey Allison was killed), and even into the early 2000s (Dale Sr's death put a damper on things for me).  I have a decent collection of the die-cast cars from the 70s through the 90s, mostly 1/64 and 1/24-scale. 

 I have absolutely no interest in it today, and short of taking my kid to an actual race, I don't know that I could get him much interested.  Even then, the Walmart and Target die-cast aisles, have little to no NASCAR stuff (unlike 15-20 years ago where they would be loaded with the stuff).

NASCAR sold its soul and forget what made it the juggernaut it used to be.  I don't think it's as easy as pointing out a decline in ratings or attendance, it's the cumulation of a number of things.

It's the same way with the GOP, although you could certainly cherry-pick certain events here and there that have definitely changed both - Iraq, Palin being selected as VP, etc. for the GOP, and Dale Sr's death, the crop of 80s/90s stars retiring, the various facility changes (or dumping of said races), the rules changes, the move to a standardized platform, etc.

I do think both the GOP and NASCAR biggest fuckups involve doing or abandoning things that should attract the younger crowds.  They are willing to sell out for short-term gains, while ignoring the long-term. 

Short-sighted greed, plain and simple.  They have decided that trying to squeeze every last penny out of the existing fanbases (or every last vote out of the olds) is more important than doing the things needed to bring the younger crowd in.

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1 hour ago, DigglerontheHoof said:

His entire impeachment response defense strategy is his twattering.  The sad thing is, it'll probably work.  

He doesn't seem very confident that it will.

The fact that he's reduced to trying (and failing far too often) to prevent people from testifying and fight out battles over documents in the courts (and losing in some cases), speaks volumes.  

Here's the thing: he's not ordering Barr to investigate and lock up the Biden, lock up Hillary, etc.   He's not having people arrested to prevent their testimony.  Hell, he's not even trying to fire Vindman, a Lt. Colonel in the Army, under Trump's theoretical leadership.

He's too much of a coward to do this shit, so instead he wants Ukraine, China, etc. to do that stuff.   He's doing his old "SOMEBODY DO SOMETHING" schtick.  

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35 minutes ago, Goredho said:

 

  • The American people will vote Trump's ass out of office by a wide margin

I've seen too many polls to believe there will be any reckoning here.  Rs start with about 190 electoral votes.  He just needs 80 more to get it done.  I don't think he will, but I think it will be very close and probably differs based on who is nominated.

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34 minutes ago, Goredho said:

I'm losing interest in impeachment because I think this is all going to play out predictably.

  • Trump will be rightly impeached
  • The senate will wrongly fail to remove from office
  • The American people will vote Trump's ass out of office by a wide margin
  • The cumulative effects of wanton propaganda, electoral college gamesmanship, election meddling, voter fraud and hacking in support of Trump will keep him in office

Trump's tweets convey absolutely no confidence in him winning next year, or even "winning" when impeachment hits the Senate.  In fact, his tweets point to a belief that he thinks some Rs in the Senate are willing to turn on him, and he's trying to make them aware that he will gladly make their lives hell (deny them campaign money) or even try and take them down if they don't have his back.

The lack of confidence coming through in his tweets is stunning. 

It's political impotence in 280 characters or less.

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15 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Trump's tweets convey absolutely no confidence in him winning next year, or even "winning" when impeachment hits the Senate.  In fact, his tweets point to a belief that he thinks some Rs in the Senate are willing to turn on him, and he's trying to make them aware that he will gladly make their lives hell (deny them campaign money) or even try and take them down if they don't have his back.

The lack of confidence coming through in his tweets is stunning. 

It's political impotence in 280 characters or less.

Trump is going to Trump.  Wake me up when there are Republican Senators are condemning his actions publicly.

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Just a reminder from the past.  Remember when Trump responded to a fucking rally of neo-nazis mad about the removal of confederate statues, who later fucking MURDERED a woman, by saying there were "good people on both sides?"  I remember.  Here's the "side" that he wanted to make sure he didn't insult, the side that he defended -- words from the ORGANIZER OF THE EVENT:

Quote

“We are coming back here like a hundred fucking times,” Spencer can be heard saying on the tape, presumably talking about Charlottesville. “I am so mad. I am so mad at these fucking people.”

“My ancestors fucking enslaved those little pieces of fucking shit." “They don’t do this to fucking me,” said Spencer. “We’re going to ritualistically humiliate them. I am coming back here every fucking weekend if I have to. Like this is never over! I win! They fucking lose!”

President Trump infamously declared after the rally that there were “very fine people on both sides,” though he specifically said he didn’t support any neo-Nazis. The trouble, of course, is that one side had protesters, and the other side was exclusively made up of people like Spencer who have tried to launder their white supremacy through new words like “alt-right.”

“That’s how the world fucking works,” Spencer says on the tape. “Little fucking kikes. They get ruled by people like me. Little fucking octaroons.”

The word “octaroon” is an offensive term for someone who is one-eighth black and is rarely heard outside of white supremacist circles.

The next portion of the tape makes it clear what Spencer would like to see happen to the world and anyone who he doesn’t identify as white.

“I rule the fucking world. Those pieces of shit get ruled by people like me. They look up and see a face like mine looking down at them. That’s how the fucking world works. We are going to destroy this fucking town.”

Just remember, when Trump said there are good people on both sides.....“Little fucking kikes. They get ruled by people like me. Little fucking octaroons.”

Just remember, the next time some Trumpkin fuckstick tells you "it's about heritage, not hate!".....“My ancestors fucking enslaved those little pieces of fucking shit....I rule the fucking world. Those pieces of shit get ruled by people like me. They look up and see a face like mine looking down at them. That’s how the fucking world works."

Just remember, when they tell you "we don't hate minorities, we just believe they shouldn't get special rights."........"I rule the fucking world. Those pieces of shit get ruled by people like me. They look up and see a face like mine looking down at them. That’s how the fucking world works."

Trump is a piece of shit white nationalist.  His supporters are either piece of shit white nationalists, or they are just fine with piece of shit white nationalists.  He's retrograde poison, and its coursing through the veins of every part of the Republic.  Detox is the only way we survive.  And the detox may kill us.  How fun.

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1 hour ago, Goredho said:

I'm losing interest in impeachment because I think this is all going to play out predictably.

  • Trump will be rightly impeached
  • The senate will wrongly fail to remove from office
  • The American people will vote Trump's ass out of office by a wide margin
  • The cumulative effects of wanton propaganda, electoral college gamesmanship, election meddling, voter fraud and hacking in support of Trump will keep him in office

agree with all of these bullet points.  and with the following additions:

- not a single Republican Senator will vote to convict, no matter how overwhelming the evidence of Trump's guilt and complete lack of fitness for the office (and there is already more than enough to warrant his removal)

- the electoral college gamesmanship, election meddling, voter fraud and hacking mentioned above will have the full support of the Republican Party (as it does now)

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The article alleges that this is why Trump showed his belly to Erdogan in regards to the Kurds.  If this this is true, Trump sold out an ally to cover up the fuckups of his worthless son in law.  Is it ok to impeach him now or do we want to wait until he blunders in to WWIII?  Oh and this is why you use secured communication channels and not your own personal iphone, you fucking morons.

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3 minutes ago, kevwun said:

The article alleges that this is why Trump showed his belly to Erdogan in regards to the Kurds.  If this this is true, Trump sold out an ally to cover up the fuckups of his worthless son in law.  Is it ok to impeach him now or do we want to wait until he blunders in to WWIII?

Let the voters decide if WWIII helps own the libs.

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19 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

Holy fucking shit if this is anywhere close to true:

 

From the article.

Quote

According to Cockburn’s source about the seven whistleblowers, there’s more. It is that Kushner (allegedly) gave the green light to MBS to arrest the dissident journalist, Jamal Khashoggi, who was later murdered and dismembered in the Saudi consulate in Istanbul. A second source tells Cockburn that this is true and adds a crucial twist to the story. This source claims that Turkish intelligence obtained an intercept of the call between Kushner and MBS. And President Erdogan used it to get Trump to roll over and pull American troops out of northern Syria before the Turks invaded. Cockburn hears that investigators for the House Intelligence Committee know this whole tale and the identities of some of the people telling it. Whether any of this is true is another matter but Adam Schiff certainly seems to be smiling a lot these days.

 

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18 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

Holy fucking shit if this is anywhere close to true:

 

well, we all know it is probably true. the only reasons that saudi arabia would do such a brazen thing would be 1) because we said it was ok, or 2) to test our resolve. we failed both tests.

look, we know that kush is in deep with the saudis. following a visit of his to saudi arabia, bin salman arrested and tortured a couple hundred dissidents. and following that, he murdered khashoggi. mighty big coincidence, that, huh?

it's very possible that kushner thinks his mandate as peacemaker in the middle east requires the wooing of khashoggi. it's also possible that he's simply helping his brother's financial interests.

whichever it is, kushner is just as evil as miller.

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It fell off this page due to the obligatory kush-MBS hookup, but yall should really check out the deposition transcripts released so far. They also produced "key excerpts" documents from Yovanovitch and McKinley testimonies, and ho-lee-fuk, there's a whole lot of "there" there.

Quote

Q: Also on page 4, at the top, President Trump said, “The former ambassador from the United States, the woman, was bad news and the people she was dealing with in the Ukraine were bad news, so I just want to let you know that.” Do you see that?

A: Yes.

Q: What was your reaction when you saw that?

A: Again, I hate to be repetitive, but I was shocked. I mean, I was very surprised that President Trump would—first of all, that I would feature repeatedly in a Presidential phone call, but secondly, that the President would speak about me or any ambassador in that way to a foreign counterpart.

Q: At the bottom of that same page, President Trump says, “Well, she’s going to go through some things.” What did you understand that to mean?

A: I didn’t know what it meant. I was very concerned. I still am.

Q: Did you feel threatened?

A: Yes.

Quote

Q: When did you first become aware that Rudy Giuliani had an interest in or was communicating with anyone in Ukraine?

A: Probably around November, December timeframe of 2018.

Q: And describe those circumstances when you first learned about it.

A: Basically, it was people in the Ukrainian Government who said that Mr. Lutsenko, the former prosecutor general, was in communication with Mayor Giuliani, and that they had plans, and that they were going to, you know, do things, including to me.

Q: So you first heard about it from Ukrainian officials?

A: That’s correct.

Quote

Ambassador McKinley “had never seen” efforts to use the State Department to dig up dirt on a political opponent “in 37 years in the Foreign Service.” (Page 112)

Q: I think you’ve also said that part of the reason why you decided to resign was that you couldn’t be blind to what was happening, and what was happening was efforts to use the State Department to dig up dirt on a political opponent. Is that fair as well?

A: That is fair. And if I can underscore, in 37 years in the Foreign Service and different parts of the globe and working on many controversial issues, working 10 years back in Washington, I had never seen that.

And it goes on and on and on. It's going to be a fucking shitstorm this week.

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9 minutes ago, Captainant said:

It fell off this page due to the obligatory kush-MBS hookup, but yall should really check out the deposition transcripts released so far. They also produced "key excerpts" documents from Yovanovitch and McKinley testimonies, and ho-lee-fuk, there's a whole lot of "there" there.

And it goes on and on and on. It's going to be a fucking shitstorm this week.

yovanovitch's testimony is important because of the timeline it sets out.  the ukraine situation was ongoing and very large.  it wasn't just a phone call.

implying ukraine is just about the phone call is like saying nixon's dirty tricks campaign was just about the break-in.

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9 minutes ago, Captainant said:

It fell off this page due to the obligatory kush-MBS hookup, but yall should really check out the deposition transcripts released so far. They also produced "key excerpts" documents from Yovanovitch and McKinley testimonies, and ho-lee-fuk, there's a whole lot of "there" there.

And it goes on and on and on. It's going to be a fucking shitstorm this week.

The average american won't read it but when they recall some of these people to testify about these statements in public hearings it will be quiet interesting to see the democrats asking questions while the republicans loose their shit on the impeachment process being illegal because there is no defense for what happened.

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3 minutes ago, sachick said:

Promoting your kid's book. I'm sure the Republicans would not have an issue with this if Clinton was president and Chelsea came out with a book.

 

Isn't he the one who just last week said he wished his name was Hunter Biden so he could make millions off his dad's presidency?  Never mind the fact that Biden wasn't the president...but he was the closest white guy to it, so I guess that's what he meant.

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4 hours ago, David Dennison said:

Everyone knows that's what's going to happen.

He's going to be impeached but not removed.

It will be a political victory to carry into the election. Let's just hope he loses.

 

Maybe, maybe not. A lot of dirt is coming to light.

Regardless, its the right thing to do. History needs a record of how the various Reps and Senators voted on the Criminal in Chief.

 

4 hours ago, 4th&Five said:

 

 

Turns out, this guy was on his cabinet at one time.

 

edit; Or a campaign manager.

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Jesus fuck, I'm reading more of the excerpt documents. There's some bad bad bad shit in there.

I'm just gonna put a few more "top line" quotes from excerpts in line here just to underscore how fucked everything is right now.

  • In late 2018, Ukrainian officials informed Ambassador Yovanovitch about Rudy Giuliani’s plans to target her. (Page 27-28)
  • In the same time period, Ambassador Yovanovitch learned that Rudy Giuliani met with Yuriy Lutsenko, the Prosecutor General of Ukraine, who was looking to “hurt” her “in the U.S.” (Page 31-32)
  • Mr. Giuliani sought to override a visa denial for former Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin—whom consular officials determined was ineligible based on his “known corrupt activities”—by claiming to the White House and State Department that Ambassador Yovanovitch was improperly blocking the visa. (Page 264-266)
  • When Ambassador Yovanovitch sought advice from Gordon Sondland, the U.S. Ambassador to the European Union, he recommended that she tweet her praise of President Trump. (Page 267-268, 306)
  • In March 2019, Ambassador Yovanovitch transmitted a classified email, at the request of Under Secretary of State David Hale, documenting the disinformation campaign against her. (Page 61)
  • The smear campaign and social media postings questioning Ambassador Yovanovitch’s loyalty “cut the ground out from underneath” U.S. diplomatic efforts. (Page 313-314)

 

  • Ambassador McKinley proposed issuing a public statement in support of Ambassador Marie Yovanovitch in the aftermath of the release of the President’s July 25, 2019, call record. (Page 38-39)
  • Ambassador McKinley asked Ambassador Yovanovitch if she would welcome a statement from the State Department, and she told him he was the first senior Department official to contact her. (Page 60, 65)
  • Senior State Department officials supported Ambassador McKinley’s proposal, but Secretary Pompeo “decided that it was better not to release a statement at this time.” (Page 57-58)
  • Secretary Pompeo was non-responsive when Ambassador McKinley requested multiple times that the State Department defend Ambassador Yovanovitch—including when Ambassador McKinley told the Secretary he was resigning because “this is unacceptable.” (Page 47-48, 49)
  • On October 3, 2019, Deputy Assistant Secretary George Kent emailed Ambassador McKinley a memo documenting the Department’s failure to timely gather information for Congress and questioning the accuracy of Secretary Pompeo’s letter to the Committees two days earlier. (Page 92-94)
  • Ambassador McKinley sent Deputy Assistant Secretary Kent’s memorandum to other senior State Department officials because it identified “allegations of intimidation and bullying,” as well as questions about “accuracy” and whether there were “lies in statements.” (Page 94, 100-101, 110)

There's a pretty goddamn verifiable paper trail here. And this is just the first two witnesses testimony being released. Buckle the fuck up, buckaroos.

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