Jump to content

Realignment talk not going away


The Tower

Recommended Posts

What do we really need the NCAA for anyhow?  The SEC completely separating is the best thing that could happen to college football.

The SEC just gets to go be it's own incestual circle jerk, and the tens of millions of college sports fans in the rest of the country can go back to enjoying college sports without having to listen to constant media discussion of one league that none of us give a shit about.  If you go back through pre UT to the SEC times on this board, you will remember that no Texas fans gave a fuck about the SEC prior to absorption either.  

It's all ESPN cares about, and they've been destroying the sport to satisfy this end.  I can't think of any better way for the rest of the sport to recover than for this cancer be exorcised from the body of college football and given it's own life.  ESPN will learn how quickly the rest of the the country doesn't care, but the fervor within the SEC footprint will be enough to keep this product viable.

It kinda gives everyone what they really want.  ESPN and the SEC get to put themselves on a pedestal as next to the NFL, and the rest of college football doesn't have to even deal with it.

Edited by Al_4_ISU
  • Hook 'Em 5
  • Like 2
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:

...If you go back through pre UT to the SEC times on this board, you will remember that no Texas fans gave a fuck about the SEC prior to absorption either.  

true story

Now aggy wants to continue ducking UT by aligning with LSU and the Mississippis in a redneck pod. Too funny

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

56 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:

What do we really need the NCAA for anyhow?  The SEC completely separating is the best thing that could happen to college football.

The SEC just gets to go be it's own incestual circle jerk, and the tens of millions of college sports fans in the rest of the country can go back to enjoying college sports without having to listen to constant media discussion of one league that none of us give a shit about.  If you go back through pre UT to the SEC times on this board, you will remember that no Texas fans gave a fuck about the SEC prior to absorption either.  

It's all ESPN cares about, and they've been destroying the sport to satisfy this end.  I can't think of any better way for the rest of the sport to recover than for this cancer be exorcised from the body of college football and given it's own life.  ESPN will learn how quickly the rest of the the country doesn't care, but the fervor within the SEC footprint will be enough to keep this product viable.

It kinda gives everyone what they really want.  ESPN and the SEC get to put themselves on a pedestal as next to the NFL, and the rest of college football doesn't have to even deal with it.

Yeah it’s like the SEC is doing the “anti-NFL”. The NFL is successful for many reasons, but a main one is maintaining interest across the entire US through successful franchises in places like Green Bay, Pittsburgh, Boston, LA, Kansas City, etc.  It’s not some walled-off garden where only a subset of regional teams have a chance to succeed.
 

An SEC-only playoff is lose/lose. It further regionalizes interest while damaging the national appeal of CFB. It may be a short-term money gain for the SEC, but it’s likely a long-term loss for the sport.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Left Coast said:

 

Yeah it’s like the SEC is doing the “anti-NFL”. The NFL is successful for many reasons, but a main one is maintaining interest across the entire US through successful franchises in places like Green Bay, Pittsburgh, Boston, LA, Kansas City, etc.  It’s not some walled-off garden where only a subset of regional teams have a chance to succeed.
 

An SEC-only playoff is lose/lose. It further regionalizes interest while damaging the national appeal of CFB. It may be a short-term money gain for the SEC, but it’s likely a long-term loss for the sport.


If that were to actually happen, do you not think they will expand? Even the NFL had to start somewhere. This would be where the NFL-lite starts. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Al_4_ISU said:

What do we really need the NCAA for anyhow?  The SEC completely separating is the best thing that could happen to college football.

The SEC just gets to go be it's own incestual circle jerk, and the tens of millions of college sports fans in the rest of the country can go back to enjoying college sports without having to listen to constant media discussion of one league that none of us give a shit about.  If you go back through pre UT to the SEC times on this board, you will remember that no Texas fans gave a fuck about the SEC prior to absorption either.  

It's all ESPN cares about, and they've been destroying the sport to satisfy this end.  I can't think of any better way for the rest of the sport to recover than for this cancer be exorcised from the body of college football and given it's own life.  ESPN will learn how quickly the rest of the the country doesn't care, but the fervor within the SEC footprint will be enough to keep this product viable.

It kinda gives everyone what they really want.  ESPN and the SEC get to put themselves on a pedestal as next to the NFL, and the rest of college football doesn't have to even deal with it.

The point is: if the SEC leaves, the best teams from the BIG, ACC and PAC are following them at some point. There won't be a rest of college football. All the big dogs will play each other at some point. 

I think it is best for competition. The ratings will be there hru the roof. They can actually enforce rules for once.

I also feel the best of the rest should form a league, minus the bread, and have a championship with a 16  team playoff at the end. Play only 9-10 regular season games and then a playoff format. You can have other games going on as well to make sure everyone gets to play more than 9. The winner of the championshion should get a spot in the National Championship Playoff as the last seed. Not well thought out, but they can come up with something that works. It would be a win-win for everyone IMO.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Left Coast said:

 

Yeah it’s like the SEC is doing the “anti-NFL”. The NFL is successful for many reasons, but a main one is maintaining interest across the entire US through successful franchises in places like Green Bay, Pittsburgh, Boston, LA, Kansas City, etc.  It’s not some walled-off garden where only a subset of regional teams have a chance to succeed.
 

An SEC-only playoff is lose/lose. It further regionalizes interest while damaging the national appeal of CFB. It may be a short-term money gain for the SEC, but it’s likely a long-term loss for the sport.

An SEC playoff is just a way to end the NCAA and force BIG, ACC and PAC to stop holding onto hope of some amateurism remaining in a billion dollar sport. The Bluebloods need better schedules, enforceable rules and a pay scale. Right now, college football is broken.

I grew up the biggest fan of the sport and I haven't watched a full game in nearly a decade. It's not competitive. The integrity of the sport (recruiting) has gone from really bad to undescribable.

A threat of an SEC playoff can also force concessions within the NCAA (like the playoff expansion, rules, etc). SEC has a lot of options.

If the SEC leaves, the best of the rest will eventually join them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The point is: if the SEC leaves, the best teams from the BIG, ACC and PAC are following them at some point. There won't be a rest of college football. All the big dogs will play each other at some point. 
I think it is best for competition. The ratings will be there hru the roof. They can actually enforce rules for once.
I also feel the best of the rest should form a league, minus the bread, and have a championship with a 16  team playoff at the end. Play only 9-10 regular season games and then a playoff format. You can have other games going on as well to make sure everyone gets to play more than 9. The winner of the championshion should get a spot in the National Championship Playoff as the last seed. Not well thought out, but they can come up with something that works. It would be a win-win for everyone IMO.
 
 

Yeah, I’m not so sure about that.

With the SEC out of the way, there’s an opportunity for the biggest brands in those other leagues to dominate a playoff that would still generate a ton of revenue.

I think winning football games and making money matters more than bragging about being in Prestige Worldwide to most schools. Ohio State and Michigan are getting paid no matter what.

The SEC is assuming that the whole country is enamored with their prestige and other mega brands will just fall in line with that.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

47 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:


Yeah, I’m not so sure about that.

With the SEC out of the way, there’s an opportunity for the biggest brands in those other leagues to dominate a playoff that would still generate a ton of revenue.

I think winning football games and making money matters more than bragging about being in Prestige Worldwide to most schools. Ohio State and Michigan are getting paid no matter what.

The SEC is assuming that the whole country is enamored with their prestige and other mega brands will just fall in line with that.

So we actually believe tOSU, Michigan, USC are all going to turn down massive amounts of money to keep playing glorified high schools in the BIG and PAC? When they can increase the competition and get way more money? And also deal with ESPN saying the real champion is the SEC champion? Because those other schools play too many cupcakes? Yeah, that's not happening for more than a few years.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So we actually believe tOSU, Michigan, USC are all going to turn down massive amounts of money to keep playing glorified high schools in the BIG and PAC? When they can increase the competition and get way more money? And also deal with ESPN saying the real champion is the SEC champion? Because those other schools play too many cupcakes? Yeah, that's not happening for more than a few years.

They’ve been doing this for years. At any point in the past they could have moved on from their current arrangements to make more $ and they haven’t. They even went out and publicly declared an anti SEC alliance. As useless as that has proven, it does signal a certain mindset.

Ohio State and Michigan are not like Texas. They have always been content to generate revenue for institutions with smaller followings.

Past behavior is the best predictor of future behavior.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:


They’ve been doing this for years. At any point in the past they could have moved on from their current arrangements to make more $ and they haven’t. They even went out and publicly declared an anti SEC alliance. As useless as that has proven, it does signal a certain mindset.

Ohio State and Michigan are not like Texas. They have always been content to generate revenue for institutions with smaller followings.

Past behavior is the best predictor of future behavior.

We will see.

tOSU is not that way IMO and never has been. Neither is USC. Those are two of the most power hungry schools in America. They would leave eventually. That gives ND and Michigan very little leverage. Don't forget that the pay4play has to be fixed and the current format is not sustainable. It's hard to get anything done in the NCAA. This is more about having enforceable rules and paying players their fair share before they get rightfully sued again.

The examples you posted did not include the SEC basically separating from the rest of the field. That changes everything. Like I said, USC and tOSU have their eyes on money and power as much as anyone. And the big issue is the legal ramifications and wild west show that is going on right now. Right now, tOSU is in a good spot. They won't be if the SEC separates. USC is in a tough spot and still not sure how to react. Right now, because of geography, they don't have a lot of options. If the money gap widens, the geography will no longer matter.

Do you not agree college football is broken? There are no rules and it is the Wild Wild West. In fact, it hasn't been competitive in years. Big schools need to play big schools and there needs to be rules to make sure everyone is competitive in recruiting and that kids get their fair share of the pie.

I can see it ending up with 30-45 schools in the end. If the other schools would workout something like I mentioned earlier, it would be a better format for them as well. Even better than the current format. They would actually have a seat in the big playoff. Games would be way more interesting and more competitive across the board. 

The big winners are the fan, who gets way more competitive matchups; and the players, who finally get paid their worth.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just don't see how anyone still invests serious time and money into whatever it is that college football has become. It's only slightly more interesting than the NFL these days which makes it good for an occasional game or background noise. Maybe it will get better someday, but it has been getting worse for years.

  • Hook 'Em 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/24/2022 at 8:17 AM, Al_4_ISU said:

I honestly hope that happens.  Let the SEC just be it's own thing and let the rest of college football go about it's business.

*its

 

8 hours ago, Al_4_ISU said:

What do we really need the NCAA for anyhow?  The SEC completely separating is the best thing that could happen to college football.

The SEC just gets to go be it's own incestual circle jerk, and the tens of millions of college sports fans in the rest of the country can go back to enjoying college sports without having to listen to constant media discussion of one league that none of us give a shit about.  If you go back through pre UT to the SEC times on this board, you will remember that no Texas fans gave a fuck about the SEC prior to absorption either.  

*its

Link to comment
Share on other sites

42 minutes ago, Al_4_ISU said:

College football is broken as hell, and that’s why I want this SEC circle jerk to go it’s own way.

What’s left will actually go back to resembling college football.

Nothing will ever go back to "resembling college football" until we get a handle on buying players (NIL) and free agency (the portal). And since that's mostly thanks to the Supreme Court, the NCAA is (even more) emasculated. About the only thing we can hope for is that Congress fixes it statutorily. And what the fuck has Congress fixed in the last 50 years?  Face it, Flounder: we fucked.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, TrashMaster G said:

According to SI, the pod setup is a no-go.

https://www.si.com/college/2022/05/24/sec-football-schedule-future

 

ESPN wants 9 conference games. So we’re playing 9 conference games. I assume Sankey’s marching orders will be 1 Power 5 OOC opponent, and do whatever you need to do to keep the other 2 OOC games at home. 
 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, TrashMaster G said:

According to SI, the pod setup is a no-go.

https://www.si.com/college/2022/05/24/sec-football-schedule-future

 

An eight-game conference schedule with only one permanent rivalry game would be asinine. If each school gets three permanent games, I'd do it like this:

Texas: Oklahoma, Texas A&M, Arkansas
Oklahoma: Texas, Missouri, Kentucky
Texas A&M: Texas, LSU, Arkansas
Missouri: Oklahoma, South Carolina, Arkansas
LSU: Texas A&M, Ole Miss, Miss. State
Arkansas: Texas, Texas A&M, Missouri
Miss. State: Ole Miss, Alabama, LSU
Ole Miss: LSU, Miss. State, Vanderbilt
Alabama: Auburn, Tennessee, Miss. State
Auburn: Alabama, Georgia, Florida
Tennessee: Vanderbilt, Kentucky, Alabama
Vanderbilt: Tennessee, Kentucky, Ole Miss
Kentucky: Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Oklahoma
Georgia: Auburn, Florida, South Carolina
South Carolina: Georgia, Missouri, Florida
Florida: Georgia, South Carolina, Auburn

Even though this format would maximize each team's rivalries, it, too, would have its own problems. Notably, Auburn, which would have a gauntlet each season. All that said, as long as our three permanents are OU, A&M, and Arkie, I'll be happy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

38 minutes ago, Left Coast said:

Wouldn’t having 3 permanent rivals essentially equate to being in a pod?

There is just no other way to feasibly manage this many teams. They may call it something completely different than pods, perhaps even banning the use of the word in any official capacity. But when everything is finally decided and put down on paper, it will be some glorified version of pods.

Edited by ouflak
Link to comment
Share on other sites

44 minutes ago, Left Coast said:

Wouldn’t having 3 permanent rivals essentially equate to being in a pod?

Not exactly, because you're not forced to have THE SAME permanent rivals.  In @Saint Austin 's scenario, for example, Texas plays the ags, pigs, and ousux, but the ags don't have to play ousux, they'd get LSU instead.

I actually kind of dig that setup.  Auburn does indeed get screwed but that's their problem not mine.

 

 

  • Hook 'Em 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

45 minutes ago, Left Coast said:

Wouldn’t having 3 permanent rivals essentially equate to being in a pod?

I think the difference is that each team would have different rivals, whereas a "pod" would presumably have four teams in each pod where each team has the same rivals.

For example, a "pod" would be something like: Texas, OU, Arkansas, Missouri.

Whereas the suggested 3-6 schedule could have each of those teams with a different collection of rivals.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, utee94 said:

Not exactly, because you're not forced to have THE SAME permanent rivals.  In @Saint Austin 's scenario, for example, Texas plays the ags, pigs, and ousux, but the ags don't have to play ousux, they'd get LSU instead.

I actually kind of dig that setup.  Auburn does indeed get screwed but that's their problem not mine.

 

 

I do not see any way that they give anyone that tough of a schedule, this seems more likely:

https://www.si.com/college/2022/05/24/sec-football-schedule-future

image.png.1d0613fd2fe6b84c3ecb7eb22d52b617.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 hours ago, Sandbagging Steve said:

And also deal with ESPN saying the real champion is the SEC champion?

Espn is losing millions of subscribers a year. There are fewer and fewer people that hear what they're saying or care about it. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Espn is losing millions of subscribers a year. There are fewer and fewer people that hear what they're saying or care about it. 

Or people like me that have ESPN but only watch broadcasts.

I mean, they still talk about how great the SEC is in non-SEC broadcasts, but there’s just that much less room for it.
  • Hook 'Em 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Sandman said:

Espn is losing millions of subscribers a year. There are fewer and fewer people that hear what they're saying or care about it. 

It is almost like promoting only one corner of the country as the only part that matters in a bizarre effort to turn a national obsession into a niche regional one was a bad business decision.

Most businesses try to expand to new markets, ESPN works to shrink to smaller markets. I mean I am not one to tell them what to do or anything but...

Edited by Valmy77
  • Hook 'Em 4
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Valmy77 said:

It is almost like promoting only one corner of the country as the only part that matters in a bizarre effort to turn a national obsession into a niche regional one was a bad business decision.

Most businesses try to expand to new markets, ESPN works to shrink to smaller markets. I mean I am not one to tell them what to do or anything but...

I see what you are saying here, and I do not necessarily disagree.  But I'm pretty sure almost all of the carriage losses for ESPN over the last year have to do with people cutting cable and not somehow cutting ESPN from their cable subscription.  The gained about the same number of new ESPN+ subscribers as they lost traditional cable ESPN subscribers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/25/2022 at 2:48 PM, Okie State said:

I just don't see how anyone still invests serious time and money into whatever it is that college football has become. It's only slightly more interesting than the NFL these days which makes it good for an occasional game or background noise. Maybe it will get better someday, but it has been getting worse for years.

I agree with all of this, except I’d argue that college football less interesting than the NFL…and the NFL isn’t that interesting.

Yeah yeah, part of that is that Texas has been boringly bad for years, but mostly it’s because of all the other points being made in this page. 

  • Hook 'Em 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Valmy77 said:

It is almost like promoting only one corner of the country as the only part that matters in a bizarre effort to turn a national obsession into a niche regional one was a bad business decision.

Most businesses try to expand to new markets, ESPN works to shrink to smaller markets. I mean I am not one to tell them what to do or anything but...

The 'sports talk - hot take' thing from espin is literally just CNN now too. They don't even cover sports lol

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, TKthunder2 said:

Didn’t Ohio State and Nebraska try to sue the Big Ten when they tried to cancel football for player safety during COVID? And people think they’ll be content to play in the Junior division?

It'll only be the junior division to the SEC crowd and ESPN.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Al_4_ISU said:

It'll only be the junior division to the SEC crowd and ESPN.

I get it, I hated the SEC hype as much as anyone, but if the TV ratings and dollars start going towards one direction then other will be a junior division.  People made the same argument when they split FBS/FCS.  You want to claim Michigan, Stanford, and Notre Dame will be content in a true college league with academic requirements and I can buy that, but Ohio St, Penn St, Nebraska, Clemson, Florida St, USC, Oregon and many others will not and once a school or two decides to make the jump, the flood gates open you’ll see many of the top teams move over.

I just think it’s shitty that the state of Mississippi with bad academics, little population, and very little historical success will have 2 schools in this league while better options will be left behind.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I get it, I hated the SEC hype as much as anyone, but if the TV ratings and dollars start going towards one direction then other will be a junior division.  People made the same argument when they split FBS/FCS.  You want to claim Michigan, Stanford, and Notre Dame will be content in a true college league with academic requirements and I can buy that, but Ohio St, Penn St, Nebraska, Clemson, Florida St, USC, Oregon and many others will not and once a school or two decides to make the jump, the flood gates open you’ll see many of the top teams move over.
I just think it’s shitty that the state of Mississippi with bad academics, little population, and very little historical success will have 2 schools in this league while better options will be left behind.

There would still be too many big brands and large passionate fanbases in the other side.

The Big 10 might be behind Bama and LSU on the field, but there’s just as much money and eyeballs there. They don’t need to do what the SEC does.

Throw in the big fanbases from the ACC, PAC 12, and Big 12, and there’s absolutely enough money there for those programs to simply refuse the SEC game and no one inside those circles would see it as lesser product. Yes, ESPN will refer to it as such - no argument there. But their influence will decline the longer they stay married to specific non-inclusive agendas, and other tech giants start into live sports.

This idea that the SEC does their own thing separate from the rest of CFB is financially viable for both groups.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Al_4_ISU said:

Throw in the big fanbases from the ACC, PAC 12, and Big 12, and there’s absolutely enough money there for those programs to simply refuse the SEC game and no one inside those circles would see it as lesser product.

This is the problem.  The fan bases of most ACC/PAC12 schools are fair weather fans at best and the ones that are not will (already are) looking for exits. Like you said the Big 12 has a lot brands with solid support and is more similar to the Big Ten and SEC is that aspect.  Unfortunately the population centers that drive casual non alumni engagement has always been a weakness.  Will there be a market for those team, obviously yes, but there will be a major difference once those flood gates open the the era of the super league officially begins.  If the SEC is making $100 million+ a year and the ACC is making $50 million a year, do you really think university administrators will turn their noses away from that kind of cash infusion?  Some might (like UVA, Stanford, ND, Michigan) but many/most that get an invite aren’t going to turn it down.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Al_4_ISU said:


There would still be too many big brands and large passionate fanbases in the other side.

The Big 10 might be behind Bama and LSU on the field, but there’s just as much money and eyeballs there. They don’t need to do what the SEC does.

Throw in the big fanbases from the ACC, PAC 12, and Big 12, and there’s absolutely enough money there for those programs to simply refuse the SEC game and no one inside those circles would see it as lesser product. Yes, ESPN will refer to it as such - no argument there. But their influence will decline the longer they stay married to specific non-inclusive agendas, and other tech giants start into live sports.

This idea that the SEC does their own thing separate from the rest of CFB is financially viable for both groups.

In the BCS/playoff era there’s only 2 teams who have won national championships from outside the new SEC footprint, USC and fOSU.   That’s 24 years with 12 different teams.  
 

As much as I have disliked the SEC bias and built in advantages of scheduling and pre-season rankings, there’s little question that the best teams are usually in the region.   There’s already a perception the SEC is the best football conference, and that will just grow stronger if they were to separate and remove any chance to compare.  
 

There’s quite a few teams who won’t be content being perceived as D2 or having an asterisk next to their championship.  I think it’s more likely there will be a big shakeup in the next few years than the SEC splintering away from the rest.   With all the money at stake and NIL, an NFL model seems more likely in my opinion.   Something like a slimmed down SEC/ACC conference and B1G/PAC with regional divisions N/S/E/W .    
 

On 5/26/2022 at 12:06 PM, utee94 said:

Not exactly, because you're not forced to have THE SAME permanent rivals.  In @Saint Austin 's scenario, for example, Texas plays the ags, pigs, and ousux, but the ags don't have to play ousux, they'd get LSU instead.

I actually kind of dig that setup.  Auburn does indeed get screwed but that's their problem not mine.

 

 

It does seem that’s the most likely outcome, but it would be funny as hell if it simply split down the middle with an SEC and SWC…. Because aggy.  
College station would sink into the soft, tear soaked earth

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/26/2022 at 12:55 PM, ouflak said:

There is just no other way to feasibly manage this many teams. They may call it something completely different than pods, perhaps even banning the use of the word in any official capacity. But when everything is finally decided and put down on paper, it will be some glorified version of pods.

Well with pods, everyone in the pod plays the same 3.  You also can still have two divisions by moving pods around.  This proposal is a 3 fixed, 6 rotating with no divisions.  For example, Alabama could play Auburn, Tennessee and LSU every year, but Auburn could play Alabama, Georgia and Mississippi St. every year.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.



×
×
  • Create New...