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camel at sea

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Posts posted by camel at sea

  1. 23 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

    Two former Sooners to coordinate Oklahoma offense

    Former fullback Seth Littrell and former tight end Joe Jon Finley will coordinate the Sooners' offensive efforts.

    ZACH BARNETT     51 MINUTES AGO

    Seth Littrell and Joe Jon Finley have been promoted to co-offensive coordinators at Oklahoma following Jeff Lebby's departure for Mississippi State.  Littrell will coach quarterbacks while co-coordinating the offense, while Finley will continue coaching tight ends.

    Both men played for OU while Venables coordinated the Sooners' defense. Littrell was a fullback on the Oklahoma's 2000 national championship team, while Finley played tight end from 2004-07. (Lebby is also a former Sooner, though he worked as a student assistant at OU.)

    After a 5-year NFL career, Finley returned as a GA in 2012 and then again as tight ends/H-backs coach in 2021.

    Littrell began coaching in 2002 and did not return to his alma mater until this current season as an offensive analyst. He coordinated offenses at Arizona, Indiana and North Carolina and went 44-44 in seven seasons as the head coach at North Texas.

    "I'm thrilled to announce two former OU players as our new brain trust on offense," 😂  said Venables, "Seth and Joe Jon are going to make an amazing duo and lead a fantastic group of offensive coaches."

    "Yes, this was an easy and convenient move," said Venables, "but it was also the best move for our program, our players and our staff. I went through a thorough process and vetted and visited with a lot of candidates, including sitting head coaches, former head coaches, NFL assistants, quarterback gurus and others. But everything kept bringing me back to this duo and our offensive staff as a whole."

    The rest of Oklahoma's offensive staff returns intact for Year 3 under Venables and Year 1 in the SEC. 

    Bill Bedenbaugh has coached Oklahoma's offensive line since 2013; DeMarco Murray, another former Sooner, has coached the running backs since 2020; and wide receivers coach Emmett Jones joined the staff in January.

     

    Probably about the best that Venables could do.  There isn't a realistic can't-miss OC on the market and this move maximizes continuity from what was a really good offense.  They'll succeed or fail next year based on whether Arnold lives up to his hype.  It'll be easier to make that happen if he's not learning a new offense.  

    I kind of expect Venables to replace Ted Roof (DC/LB) this offseason, too.  We'll see.  

  2. 2 hours ago, TXSooner518 said:


    lol no

    Yeah, no chance of that and for a lot of reasons (NIL, the two rosters, proximity to home, etc.)  Maybe OU has to keep an eye on one of their '24 QB recruits.  I could see Zurbrugg or Hawkins flipping.  I expect Lebby to bring Joe Jon Finley with him, though, and make him the OC.  That might make the Mitchell kid (TE) in the '24 class a flip candidate.

    If you told me that Littrell ends up the OC / TE coach, and that OU moves J.P. Losman into an on-field coaching role as QB coach, I wouldn't be surprised.   Littrell seems like the most obvious on-staff fit and Losman has been with Venables since they were both at Clemson.  

    • Like 1
  3. 4 hours ago, Aqua Buddha said:

    I keep asking the same thing.  He only wins in college when he has an overwhelming talent advantage and in the NFL, everyone has essentially the same talent level, with a few exceptions.  

    He was really good at East Carolina with a talent disadvantage and he was good early on at OU against good defenses.  He's gotten more reliant on QB play since becoming a HC.  That doesn't hold up as well on its own against good defenses.  I don't think he got dumber.  He's just bad at managing a football team and his HC role is hurting his OC role.  

    He's basically Mark Helfrich, but at better jobs and with more QB talent.  He's the sort of guy that should do a tour of duty as an analyst for Saban or Kirby Smart.  I don't get the impression that he's humble enough for that, but if he wanted to find out his own deficiencies, those guys could show him.   

  4. 6 hours ago, bullet said:

     

    That's a good add for them.  Who are the biggest brands (you know, relatively speaking) in that league now?  Army, Navy, Memphis, Tulane?  They really need a couple of their big enrollment members to take off.    

  5. I was dead wrong about Oklahoma State after the OOC slate.  That was as bad as I've seen a Gundy team look and now here they are set to win 8 or 9 games.  Incredible.  There's a godo chance the Pokes are in the Top 25 if they get past Cincinnati at home this weekend.  That should set up a fun Final (for now) Bedlam.  

    My guess is that Bedlam gets scheduled annually at some point in the 2030s, but it ends up being played in September instead of late in the year.     

     

      

     

    • Hook 'Em 1
  6. 1 hour ago, ztejas said:

    Fucking dumb.

    I think Yormark is trying to position the Big 12 to be so strong in hoops that 1) he can separate the hoops media deal from the football deal, and 2) the B1G/SEC can't fully separate from them down the road.  You couldn't really have a serious "Top Tier" basketball tourney without Kansas, Gonzaga, Houston, Arizona, etc. 

    The geography is still a mess though, but I'm a proponent of the Big 12 and ACC eventually swapping Calford for WVU/Cincy/UCF.  The Zags make a lot more sense if the Big 12 is on the west coast.  

    • Hook 'Em 1
  7. 3 hours ago, closetojumping said:

    Like I said, you’re simply wishcasting. Big 12 alumni bases in Houston showing up to fill the stadium will happen exactly zero times without it being Texas doing it. 

    UH averaged close to a sellout in 2016.  They then pissed that momentum away almost immediately.  If their next coach is someone who gets the fanbase excited, maybe they start showing up again.  Their history suggests they land on good coaches pretty frequently.  They'll just have to hang onto that guy for longer this time around.  

    Most of the programs that have seen big and sustained attendance growth got there because they landed a really good coach who hung around for a long time.  UH hasn't done that yet.  The Big 12 invite at least gives them a chance.  Kelvin Sampson has had their arena full in basketball for a few years.  

  8. 12 hours ago, Constant said:

    IMG_5401.thumb.jpeg.3d18cca95e2986f2d080964cd8a70adf.jpeg

     

    IMG_5400.thumb.jpeg.9cecc522c12a9b48565d204377a31d65.jpeg

    Trouble in paradise. These problems seem familiar. 

    He needs to replace Wylie, Grinch, and then grow his recruiting staff to mirror what the other elite programs are doing.  I can't see him doing any of that willingly.  

  9. 4 hours ago, Jabberwocky said:

     

    I still think we're going to eventually see some membership shuffling between the ACC and Big 12 once the ACC's big brands get poached.  The Zags would fit well in the Big 12 if it was more overtly a "Western" conference. 

  10. 3 hours ago, NoName said:

    idk how anyone can say anything definitive after the dumpster fire that was 2022 and the schedule you guys have had so far this year.

    "recruiting is better than it was under Riley"

    • 17: #8
    • 18: 9
    • 19: 6
    • 20: 13
    • 21: 10
    • 22: 8
    • 23 YTD: currently 5...Florida has almost the same avg with 4 fewer recruits. USC has a better avg with 2 fewer recruits. ND has a better avg with 3 fewer recruits. A&M has a better avg with just 15 recruits. there is also almost no hope of beating tOSU at this point as they have 5 fewer recruits, more point and an average that's almost points higher than OU.

    Assuming you guys finish at 5 is a huge stretch at this point. Long way to go to NSD1 and 2.

    he's literally the other end and has been his whole career. he's a guy who drives the car but doesn't build it. Baylor was all Briles. UCF was Gus Malzahn. Ole Miss was Lane Kiffin.

    this is the first time as a coach where he has ever had to build the car.

    image.png.ddf1c50905490c823cc9b7798c623f16.png

    yeah. you can't say you are having a good rebuild then say stuff like this. it simply doesn't work that way, not in the B12 and absolutely not in the SEC, as you pointed out.

     

    first time GIF

    ask me how i know...

      Reveal hidden contents

    Warehiem:

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    Wickline:

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    again: no clue how the rebuild is actually going.

    Year 1 was was the worst OU season since John Blake was on campus. You guys have the #80 SOS this year per FPI, whats left on the schedule is in the 40s (Texas is at 26 ROS for comparison) so who knows what exactly you can tell after this year.

    i will say this: if Venables doesn't win 10 games this year you should tarmac him in Provo after the BYU game.

    You skipped OU's '23 recruiting cycle.  The one you labeled '23 is actually '24.  OU's completed '23 class was ranked composite 5th nationally (higher than any Riley class) and landed two 5 star defenders along with a 5 star QB.  OU's '24 class (the current one) has a 5 star DT commit (the first for OU since Venables was OU DC 15 years ago.)  They also have a commit from a 5 star RB - a position Riley notoriously struggled to close.  BV's staff is recruiting better.  Obviously the sample size is smaller but it is what it is.

    Nobody is arguing that year 1 at OU was anything but bad for Venables but you've got to put it in context.  Riley completely gutted the QB room on his way out, Grinch left Venables maybe one 300 lb interior defensive linemen, and Grinch's "Speed D" scheme was so simplistic that the learning curve for the personnel who stayed was higher than it should have been.  I've read on Dirtburglars (from the board owner) that OU LBs had not read a play sheet or keys within a play since HS.  Riley also decimated the S&C program by putting Bennie Wylie in charge of it for four years.  OU got steadily worse on the LOS throughout Riley's tenure.  

    I consider Lebby a question mark.  He's always had the training wheels of an offensive minded HC who could curb his bad instincts as a play-caller.  He doesn't have that anymore and it shows.  He'll either get better or he'll move on.  But the talent is being restocked, either way.  On the whole, the offense has looked better this year than last year.  Gabriel has been better.  The WR room is much better. We'll see if the run game clicks at some point. It eventually did a year ago.

    As bad as things were a year ago, 5 of OU's 7 losses were one score games.  The lack of roster depth crushed them late in games.  The '21 OU team won something like 6 one score games. The margin was already thinning for Riley before he bounced.  Caleb Williams made a difference.  Venables didn't need to see a lot of improvement this year to get back on the other side of the win/loss column more often.  From what I've seen so far, the current team has made big strides.  If you told me that OU loses to Texas, Kansas, and maybe TCU, I wouldn't be shocked.  But I think they at least split those last two, and probably win both.  We'll see.     

    • Hook 'Em 1
  11. 11 minutes ago, statsman said:

    No, you pay T1 money for T2 content so that Texas and OU can leave
     
    As someone else pointed out- if UT and OU were getting the best slots on ABC and ESPN while playing OSU and TCU, they’re still going to get those same slots, or better, when they’re playing LSU and Ole Miss. 

    I don’t see Disney saying, “We’d really like to have Texas-Arkansas on ABC, but, dang it! We have to do right by the Big XII! Let’s show UH-KSU instead.”

    The Big 12 signed a six year, $2.3B deal.  ESPN and FOX didn't overpay the Big 12 by many hundreds of millions of dollars to get UT and OU out one year early.  That makes no financial sense at all.

    Whether you agree or not, the networks thought the Big 12's one or two best games each week would deliver pretty good TV audiences on ABC, FOX, and ESPN.  

    • Hook 'Em 1
  12. On 9/27/2023 at 8:02 AM, ChiTownDoc said:

    Even adjusted for schedule OU had the most efficient overall team (defense and offense) after 3 weeks.  After Cincy still top 3.  You want to see big improvement year 1 to 2 and we are seeing a massive improvement - especially on D where his expertise is.  

    Talking about hitting eject right now is moronic.  And lol at talking his winning % after one season, where he had a ton of talent raided.  This isn’t John Blake loading a team up with talent and taking none of it.  Jury still out.  

    You guys have spent huge chunks of your history wandering the desert.  I get why you see a blip and immediately assume gloom and doom. 
     

    edit: updated for after week 3

    Yeah.  The OU rebuild is going well. The head-scratching sideline communication issues from a year ago have not resurfaced.  The defense is quite a bit better.  Recruiting is better than it was under Riley.  Lebby is a downgrade as an OC from Riley. He seems like a guy who knows how to build the car but not how to drive it.  Riley also dug him a huge hole in the QB room to climb out of, so maybe some of that looks better with Arnold at QB.  The one big question mark I have about OU going forward is at OL.  They start slow up front every year and around the midway mark flip a switch and start playing well.  It's a Bedenbaugh staple and has happened under Heupel, Riley, and now Lebby.  You can get away with that in the Big 12 but it'll get you beat early next year. 

    If OU can get the run blocking switch flipped in the next couple of weeks, they're an 11 win team given the light schedule after Texas.  If not, then they're still probably a 9 or 10 win team with the rebuild still on track.            

     

  13. 2 hours ago, statsman said:

    I have no idea. When the Texit was announced, they feared they would get low to mid 20s per school, per year. Instead, they got low 30s. 
     
    My guess would be that their real value is around mid to high 20s per school, per year? That would be comparable to the ACC ( which is probably worth more)?

    It was a good deal for them. They survived until the next contract

    Most of the "low to mid twenties" projections were coming from PAC media sycophants who ended up being wrong about everything.  The "365 sports" Baylor guys ended up being pretty accurate throughout, and the deal ended up about where they were predicting it would land.    

    If you assume that the new Big 12 members were all actually worth ~$30M per, that means the payoff to let UT/OU walk away for nothing was $1.7M per x 16 schools x 6 years.  $163.2M  That fits pretty well with what the league thought it would be getting from UT and OU in buyout.  But that also means that even without UT and OU, the media side thought the new Big 12 had good value on their own.  The $1.7M per payoff is a relatively small part of the payout.  Adding in NCAA and CFP money, they'll be distributing around $60M per by the end of their rights deal.    

  14. 4 minutes ago, statsman said:

    It’s becoming clear that the Big XII contract was a payoff to let Texas and OU go free. They have been slapping each other on the back, congratulating themselves on how they don’t need Texas. Reality will hit hard on the next media contract.
     
    Oh, well, they survived and the PAC didn’t. 

    The new Big 12 deal was for six years and $2.3B.  How much of that do you believe is a payoff?

    • Hook 'Em 1
  15. 14 hours ago, bullet said:

    Prime Time does know how to promote himself.  That was the highest rated after dark game ever.

    I still don't know how good a coach he will be, but he is a GREAT salesman.

    He hired a really good coaching staff and did a full overhaul of a horrible roster in one offseason.  A lot of work and really good evals went into that.  His players are pretty bought in and they play well together.  That's really good coaching.  This season might be the best that the PAC has ever been, top to bottom, so if he gets them to 7-5 / 8-4, he will be a national coach of the year candidate. 

    Is it sustainable? We'll see.  He'll have to start landing elite LOS talent if he wants to compete for national titles someday.  He can make the CFP and win the new Big 12 without that, though.  His players are producing and people want to watch on TV, so all of that will help him recruit. 

    • Hook 'Em 2
  16. 54 minutes ago, Pokoloco said:

    We're still going 2-10, 7-5 would be an absolute miracle.

    I think ISU is winnable but it's on the road.  Same with Houston.  After that, it gets tough to find possible Ws.  WVU in Morgantown will be very tough.  They returned their entire OL and their defense appears to be improved.  KSU and KU are both probably Ls, even if they are at home.  @UCF looks like an L.  BYU looks like an L.  Oklahoma is an L.  I'd pick Cincinnati to beat OSU on a neutral field (better on LOS, better QB), but maybe that's a W for Gundy at home. 

  17. 2018: 7-6
    2019: 8-5
    2020: 8-3
    2021: 12-2
    2022: 7-6

    2023 looks like it will be Gundy's first losing season since 2005.  The offense has been in decline for years and that's Gundy's area of expertise.  I think Jim Knowles's time in Stillwater is the reason Gundy isn't already on the hot seat.  We'll see how the new DC eventually works out, but it's a major rebuild on that side and the landscape of roster building in college football has changed.  Usually in Gundy's tenure, there have been things to point out to give you optimism about the future.  I don't see any of that currently.

    The other thing that is lowkey hurting the Pokes is that OU can put together PWO NIL packages for in-state kids that outstrip OSU's scholarship offers.  Oklahoma HS recruits are often undervalued nationally and Gundy has feasted on that.  Now OU can talk high 3 star Okies into taking a PWO spot in Norman without disrupting out of state recruiting plans.  OSU needs to get its NIL situation sorted well enough to deter that.  

  18. 5 hours ago, BurntOrange&White said:

    Slight difference between struggling and getting skull fucked by South Alabama. 

    Yeah.  That was the worst loss in the entire conference so far this year and by a fairly wide margin.  One of the Pokes might know better than I do, but I can't think of a worse loss for Oklahoma State since the 90s, factoring in quality of the opponent and the margin of the defeat.

  19. The Big 12 this year has a lot of squads capable of pushing pretty good teams and just as capable of losing to bad teams.  Outside of Texas and OU, I'd guess a couple of them end up in the ten wins range by the end of the season.  I just have no idea who it will be.  It's a coaching / development league, and most of the league is between up cycles.   

    That said, it is pretty shocking to see how bad Oklahoma State is this year.  They looked untalented all over the field on Saturday.  Gundy has been good there for a really long time, but he doesn't strike me as someone who should be trusted to navigate the recent changes with the portal and NIL.  

    • Haha 1
  20. 18 hours ago, Hookem2147 said:

    Nigel Smith and Zina Umeozulu share a lot of similarities from a peaked sophomore year and have seen their ranking steadily drop since standpoint.

    I think Smith just outgrew the elite DE projections.  Supposedly he's already pushing 270 lbs at Melissa.  If so then I think he adds weight and slides inside in Norman and probably becomes a high ceiling DT. 

     

  21. 36 minutes ago, TKthunder2 said:

    I agree with your points but I think UVA has finished in the top ten of the director’s cup 9 times and Kansas has 0. UVA also is a pretty solid baseball school which matters in the SEC. Kansas wins the basketball head to head but UVA isn’t a slouch there either. Both suck at football but UVA draws better both in attendance and with viewership and is in a better state for the SECN, but yes Kansas has more revenue.

    So Kansas has bball+AD revenue and UVA has basically everything else. I don’t think Kansas is a shoe in.

    Also I agree UVA/UNC aren’t attached at the hip, but I do think they both end up in a P2 in the next major round of realignment. Kansas likely has lower odds of making the cut.

    I think UVA is massively overrated in realignment.  They're an east cost Cal.  I think they're overrated largely because of a combo of the idea that UNC would require them to come along to wherever they go and a cable-industry view of "value" that emphasizes market size, rather than actual eyeballs.  There's an argument that VaTech is a better add than UVA because the Hokies have a larger football fanbase, larger gameday attendance, etc.

    On the other hand, I think university Presidents will need to be convinced of UVA's negatives because the school itself is elite and in a great location.  I just think that's gonna happen.  UNC breaking with them publicly, over the expansion issue, is an indicator of that.  The TV networks successfully made a similar argument to the B1G re: Stanford and Cal.      

    If we're comparing KU vs. UVA... KU hoops would (hypothetically) be additive to their entire SEC hoops schedule.  UVA hoops is great, but doesn't move the interest needle.  KU outdrew UVA in football attendance last year, at the very first sign of life, with multiple sellouts.  KU's current football investment is better with a major facilities upgrade on the way.  UVA is great at Olympics, but Stanford and Cal just proved that the networks don't care about that at all.  If Leipold keeps the Jayhawks out of the ditch for another 3-4 years, I think the argument for KU's media rights value gets a lot stronger.        

    • Hook 'Em 3
  22. 9 minutes ago, TKthunder2 said:

    UVA is far more desired than Kansas (I have nothing against KU and agree they would work fine for all the reasons you listed). My opinion on this is subject to change if the SEC/B1G ever decide to fully breakaway from the NCAAbb tournament and do their own thing, then a school like Kansas could be very valuable.

    Still even if a 4th team left the ACC always has UConn in its back pocket that could be a quick add plus AAC schools like USF, Memphis, Tulane, Rice, Temple that it could get to leave immediately just like West Virginia did back in 2012.

    KU's AD is worth more and is better supported than UVA's AD, even if UVA is worth a lot more more than KU as a university.  The TV side cares about AD value - which is why Stanford and Cal are where they are.  It's arguable that VaTech athletics are more valuable than UVA athletics.  I also think it's notable that UVA and Duke seem to be on opposite sides from UNC on the ACC expansion issue.  To me, that indicates some internal division as to priorities.  There are significant cracks in the Tobacco Road foundation.  It reminds me of how the extinct mantras, "SC will never leave the other CA schools" and "Texas won't leave without several in-state partners," first began to crumble.

    I think the ACC is going to survive realignment.  There are too many decent ADs on the east coast for that not to happen.  If they can get away with only losing FSU, Clemson, and UNC, they're going to be in strong shape.  They could - as you suggest - add UConn.  They might also be able to lure away WVU, UCF, and/or Cincinnati at some point, too.        

    • Hook 'Em 1
  23. 3 hours ago, redswingline said:

    Right. As soon as it's financially viable to pay the exit fees, 3-4 schools are going to bounce and that is going to be well before 2036.

    Yeah.  There seems to be some smoke around the idea that the ACC contract provides that they won't lose per-team payout during the life of their current contract, provided they stay at 15 members.  They now have 18 members.  FSU, Clemson, and UNC are the three squeaky wheels.  I'd guess they're SEC bound.  ESPN can smooth the exit since they're the primary rights holder on both sides.  There's no reason for ESPN to smooth an exit toward a FOX backed conference.  That move also probably protects and stabilizes the ACC because I'm not sure how motivated the B1G would be to add schools like UVA, Duke, Miami, or Georgia Tech on their own. 

    If it plays out that way, I think there's a pretty good chance that SEC #20 is Kansas.  The Jayhawks would fill out the map in the west, give the SEC a 3rd crown jewel in men's basketball, and they'd give Mizzou back its primary rival.    

  24. 1 hour ago, bullet said:

    TCU lost a load of starters.  It was a very junior-senior laden team last year.

    Agreed, but I think they're still probably as talented as anyone outside of UT and OU.  They'll put points up on people in Big 12 play if they can stay healthy.  

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