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Foosters

Burnt Ends
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Posts posted by Foosters

  1. 2 hours ago, blacklab said:

     

    I’m with Mikey on this one. Sure we could argue semantics on whether or not wanting the destruction of Israel is anti semetic or not, but it certainly implies you want to kill every resident of the country. I’m sure you’ll argue you don’t but it sure sounds like it to me. 

    National survey of college students conducted by the Univeristy of Chicago:

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    Pape, of the University of Chicago, said some fears are driven by a “tragic misunderstanding” of the other side’s intentions. The most frequently used pro-Palestinian protest chant — “From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free” — is understood in dramatically different ways by various students.

    The survey found that 66% of Jewish students interpreted it as a call for the expulsion and genocide of Israeli Jews, a perception closely linked to fears for their safety.

    By contrast, 14% of Muslim students interpreted the chant that way. Rather, 76% of those surveyed understood it as a call for Palestinians and Israelis to live side by side in two separate countries or in one state.

    Among all students, 42% understood the chant as a call for mutual existence, compared with 26% of those who believed it advocates for the expulsion and genocide of Israeli Jews.

    The overwhelming share of students, including Jews and Muslims, said they abhor political violence and that calls for genocide were unacceptable.

    https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2024-05-02/student-fears-triggered-by-israel-palestinian-tensions-skyrocket

    Can anyone find the survey tweeted by a citizen journalist so that Sack knows he can trust it?

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  2. https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2024-05-02/student-fears-triggered-by-israel-palestinian-tensions-skyrocket

     

    Quote

    A new national study led by the University of Chicago has for the first time documented in detail the extent of those fears and reasons for them — along with student attitudes toward genocide, antisemitism, Islamophobia and possible ways to calm tensions.

     

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    The study found that 58% of students who identified as Jewish and 52% of those who said they were Muslim have feared for their safety since Oct. 7. An additional 16% of neither background also expressed fears. This represents as many as 3 million students across the country.

    “The campus fears are more intense and more widespread than what we’ve previously known,” said Robert Pape, a University of Chicago political science professor and director of the Chicago Project on Security and Threats who wrote the report.

    The nonpartisan analysis is based on a nationally representative sample of 5,000 college students at more than 600 four-year academic institutions included in two commissioned surveys between mid-December and mid-January — before the most recent clashes at numerous universities throughout the nation, including USC, the University of Texas at Austin and Columbia. The surveys were conducted at the University of Chicago by NORC, previously the National Opinion Research Center, and College Pulse, with narrow margins of error from 1% to 1.94%.

    In one finding, about 10% of college students would permit student groups to call for genocide against Jews, and 13% of college students say that when Jews are attacked, it is because they deserve it. The same percentage would permit that call against Muslims.

    Quote

    Other students at UCLA, like fifth-year art history graduate student Benjamin Kersten, said they similarly feel safe on campus, outside the occasional Zionist protester walking through.

    “You never want to be called a traitor and have death wished upon your family,” said Kersten, who is an anti-Zionist Jew. “It’s not fun; but otherwise, I haven’t felt unsafe on campus.”

    Pape, of the University of Chicago, said some fears are driven by a “tragic misunderstanding” of the other side’s intentions. The most frequently used pro-Palestinian protest chant — “From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free” — is understood in dramatically different ways by various students.

    The survey found that 66% of Jewish students interpreted it as a call for the expulsion and genocide of Israeli Jews, a perception closely linked to fears for their safety.

    By contrast, 14% of Muslim students interpreted the chant that way. Rather, 76% of those surveyed understood it as a call for Palestinians and Israelis to live side by side in two separate countries or in one state.

    Among all students, 42% understood the chant as a call for mutual existence, compared with 26% of those who believed it advocates for the expulsion and genocide of Israeli Jews.

    The overwhelming share of students, including Jews and Muslims, said they abhor political violence and that calls for genocide were unacceptable.

    The survey found that college students are not particularly antisemitic, as measured by agreement with such traditional tropes as that Jews have too much power and are unfair business competitors. But rather, they hold highly negative views of Israel as a state.

    “Campus anger is mainly against Israel as a state and not the Jewish people per se,” Pape said.

    Islamophobia is also relatively low among college students — lower than attitudes by American adults, the survey found.

     

     

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  3. 44 minutes ago, DixonHur said:

     

    It is also exactly why the CR has the bad reputation it does.  Once upon a time differing opinions were welcome on the UT message boards (Hornfans, Shaggy, and early Surly), but now if you have an opinion that doesn't conform to "the group" you get negged into oblivion.

     

    This is patently untrue. The problem, as it has been discussed ad nauseum, is that one of our major political parties peddles untruths, conspiracy theories, and racist/anti-Semitic narratives. Exclusively. Can you provide an example of a contemporary GOP principal that does NOT demonize or villify a group?

    -The media is the enemy of the people

    -Immigrants "poison the blood of our country"

    -Democrats are the party of pedophiles

    -Gay people want to groom our kids. they are also pedophiles

    -Trans people want to groom our kids. They are also pedophiles.

    -Leftists want to indoctrinate children. They are also pedophiles.

    -College Professors are leftist agitators trying to indoctrinate students.

    -The 2020 election was stolen by Democrats!

    -Joe Biden is an illegal president. He should be imprisoned or executed.

    -Women should be imprisoned or executed if they have an abortion. Even if its to save their own life.

    -Muslims should not be allowed to enter the country.

    -Russia is a good, Christian nation and they are only defending themselves from Ukrainian Nazis.

    -Vaccines are dangerous. 

    -Climate change is a hoax perpetuated by Democrats to push their green narrative.

    The above are not just positions you see in conspiracy theory chat rooms. They are the mainstream, national political positions of the GOP, echoed by the leader of the GOP and his minions on a regular basis. So, if you are a member or ally to ANY of the above groups, and someone tells you that "yes, Muslims should not be able to enter our country," or "hey, you're probably ok, but I don't trust the Trans community and see no problem with people exercising their 2nd amendment rights outside gatherings of Trans individuals," or "gay people probably shouldn't be telling their students that they're gay" then its hard to see how its anything but a direct attack on you and your way of life. 

    Gone are the days where we sit around arguing about marginal tax rates, military spending, and the role of the government at large. 

    What does constructive dialogue look like between a member of a targeted group and someone seeking their removal or erasure? 

     

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  4. Quote

    University administrators canceled classes at UCLA on Wednesday, hours after violence broke out at a pro-Palestinian encampment set up on campus.

    Just before midnight, a large group of counterdemonstrators, wearing black outfits and white masks, arrived on campus and tried to tear down the barricades surrounding the encampment. Campers, some holding lumber and wearing goggles and helmets, rallied to defend the encampment’s perimeter. The violence occurred hours after the university declared that the camp was “unlawful and violates university policy.”

    Videos showed fireworks being set off and at least one being thrown into the camp. Over several hours, counterdemonstrators threw objects, including wood and a metal barrier, at the camp and those inside, with fights repeatedly breaking out. Some tried to force their way into the camp, and the pro-Palestinian side used pepper spray to defend themselves.

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    One representative of the camp said the counterdemonstrators repeatedly pushed over barricades that outline the boundaries of the encampment, and some campers said they were hit by a substance they thought was pepper spray. As counterprotesters attempted to pull down the wood boards surrounding the encampment, at least one person could be heard yelling, “Second nakba,” referring to the mass displacement and dispossession of Palestinians during the 1948 Arab-Israeli war.

    Daily Bruin News Editor Catherine Hamilton said she was sprayed with some type of irritant and repeatedly punched in the chest and upper abdomen as she was reporting on the unrest. Another student journalist was pushed to the ground by counterprotesters and was beaten and kicked for nearly a minute. Hamilton was treated at a hospital and released.

    “I truly did not expect to be directly assaulted. I know that these individuals — at least the individual who initiated the mobilization against us — knew that we were journalists,” she said. “And while I did not think that protected us from harassment, I thought that might have [prevented us from being] assaulted. I was mistaken.”

    Quote

    “What we’ve just witnessed was the darkest day in my 32 years at UCLA,” said David Myers, a professor of Jewish history at UCLA who is working on initiatives to bridge differences on campus. He called the situation a “complete and total systems failure at the university, city and state levels.”

    “Why didn’t the police, UCPD and LAPD, show up? Those in the encampment were defenseless in the face of a violent band of thugs. And no one, wherever they stand politically, is safer today,” Myers said.

    Ananya Roy, a professor of urban planning, social welfare and geography, echoed concerns about the university’s lack of response when faced with a violent counterprotest.

    image.thumb.png.4faf88d6d477bbe8738131f9cab095a8.png

    image.thumb.png.b71ccf35307eb7c05b805106669b9e1b.png

    https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2024-04-30/ucla-moves-to-shut-down-pro-palestinian-encampment-as-unlawful

  5. 21 hours ago, Foosters said:

    Can you name a Biden lie that is equal-to-or-worse than the continued assertion that Joe Biden and the Democratic party illegally rigged the 2020 presidential election in multiple states to override the will of the people and install Biden as an unelected despot?

    Well, guess I know why he didn't address this one. He doesn't think it's a lie.

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  6. 20 minutes ago, ztejas said:

    K but I think this situation is a bit more morally ambigious than apartheid or Vietnam or whatever.

    In retrospect, maybe. But not necessarily at the time.

    Hell, in a Gallup poll taken shortly after 4 college students were killed by the national guard while protesting, 58 percent of respondents blamed the students. 

    Also this:

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    Students from Kent State and other universities often got a hostile reaction upon returning home. Some were told that more students should have been killed to teach student protesters a lesson; some students were disowned by their families.

     

  7. 10 minutes ago, HotSauce said:

    Kind of beautiful how the typical hard line liberals who attack anything that isnt blatant leftist groupthink are shutting the fuck up in this thread. 

    Well, you guys need somewhere to discuss leftist group think, and we've seen how scary the CR can be. You're safe here.

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  8. 3 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

    Yeah, also this. The rest of it is an interesting legal discussion. This is the primary point. 

    This is my main beef with Hartzell - that the governor of the State publicly supported the arrests of ALL of the protestors based on the content of their message. And Hartzell just fucking sat there. THAT is the moment when a University President is supposed to lead.

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  9. 17 minutes ago, Skipper said:

    I read the U of Chicago statement many praised.  I think there is a reasonable argument it is the correct approach.  I also think it's 50/50 whether they end up requesting the police take action before this is over.  They took a strong position without drawing any clear lines in the sand.  I know how that works with my kids.  Personally I prefer UF's statement that their campus isn't a daycare.

    For anyone saying what has happened on other campuses is irrelevant to the discussion of what is going on at UT's campus I completely disagree.  Those campuses are real world examples of what has happened when you let "protestors" violate university policies without consequence.  It is absolutely a critical piece of the analysis.  Because that reality100% influenced this universities response.  Like others have said, there have been protests for months without issue.  Only recently have the protestors decided they weren't getting enough attention and ramped things up.   And by the way, UT is absolutely not alone in taking a firm stance this week regarding encampments.  If people want to focus on what happened last week, fine, I'll agree the response was probably over the top.   But Texas made it abundantly clear no encampments were permitted.  Those students yesterday intentionally crossed that line and Texas didn't blink.   

    There are reasonable discussions and debate to be had around first amendment and what the line should be but I don't think it's a coincidence that those most outraged screaming "fascism" over and over are a combination of those that have been the most critical of Israel for months on this forum and those so obsessed with MAGA/Abbot that they look at any excuse to yell at the clouds.  I doubt many have the same energy if police cleared out the KKK after setting up tents on campus.

     

     

    I saw what happened the last time a large group of people wearing MAGA gear marched on a building. We can't let that happen again, obviously, so we should start cracking skulls when they start to gather.

    Ok, I'm sold.

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  10. 5 minutes ago, hornbri said:

    But we are talking about that happened today right? There were clear tents on campus today and it is clear they did that today to escalate the situation. Maybe now that tent question will get answered in court. 

    fine, we'll get opaque tents

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  11. Anyone ever been to Mian?

    Not new, I guess, but I just learned that they have a Houston location. Is one of my favorite noodle/szechuan shops in all of LA.

    https://www.yelp.com/biz/mian-houston

    Quote

    The flavors are bright and clean, informed as much by the tart funkiness of Sichuan pickles as by pure chile heat; the noodles (handmade, although not necessarily in-house) have an integrity and chew you might associate with good Italian pasta...

    Hot-sour noodles, a popular Chengdu specialty, are softer and thinner than the Chongqing noodles, serving almost to thicken the tangy broth. Beef pickle noodles are garnished with sliced meat and submerged in a tingly, green Sichuan pepper-rich broth that may remind you of the green pepper water-boiled fish at Chengdu Taste across town. The noodles are in a mild chile sauce that's spiked with soft, barely gamy bits of chicken gizzard and comes across almost as a Sichuan take on Thanksgiving giblet gravy: both novel and familiar as a folk song...

    But you're probably here for the zhajiangmian, a bowl whose surface is paved with ground pork and scallions, and whose noodles have a distinct chewy pull. These are noodles with a mean streak, a potent lashing of hot chile and oil, laced with just enough Sichuan peppercorn to numb your palate, to make the next bite not just tolerable but actually kind of great.

     

  12. its the internet, stupid.

    The rise of anonymous social media platforms allowed individuals to discuss and celebrate what had heretofore been markers of failure and shame.

    See, 2chan in Japan and the Otaku. See, 4chan in the west and Incels.

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  13. 19 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

    To be fair, this is sort of trial 101 stuff. You don't leave the client alone. Nothing about this is unusual, and it has been done at every trial I've participated in. 

    Damn, I've never had co-counsel on a single trial. The best is when you get to leave your client alone at the table while you go into chambers for a sidebar. I've come back several times to have the bailiff whisper in my ear that my client was doing some weird shit by himself while the jurors just watched in silence.

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  14. 11 minutes ago, LTtxfan said:

    Belichick giving McCarthy a lot of love.  If he was still with Patriots sounds like he would have picked McCarthy over Maye.

    Belichick?

    The guy who waited 6 rounds to draft Tom Brady?

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