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Posts posted by Thatguy
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8 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:
And instead of working off the successful game manager performance, Sark went back to hero ball and set up Arch to fail again, outside of a few crucial open throws he absolutely needs to complete.
What is it you think Sark did different from last game to this game?
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30 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:
I dont mean he doesn't know the plays at all. He can call the plays. I mean he doesn't know them so well that he can see them in his head during the game. He is calling the play and then walking to the line and seeing blank. He doesn't see a defensive player moving and say to himself "that means x or y is open". He cant recall what x or y was supposed to do until he sees them do it.
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24 minutes ago, Thatguy said:
Bro. I honestly think this dude just doesn't know the plays bro. Lol. It seems obvious to me. Anything that dude can see or truly knows, like a deep ball, he is accurate as hell. He is accurate when its scramble drill time. He is only inaccurate when its in the confines of the offense. Anyone who played sports knew a guy who didnt have the plays down. Whether it was he didnt study or was plane just dumb. I honestly this Arch just doesn't know the plays and therefore plays with zero anticipation.
Plain
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7 minutes ago, CooterBrown said:
Ewers was ass. Nothing changes that. However, Manning is a herpes crusted ass spewing diarrhea all over the field at a cost of $4M+ per year.
We are 6-0 with Ewers and yall are still complaining he cannot hit the deep ball.
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2 minutes ago, Drew said:
Based on what?
look I know you we all think Sari has issues. But arch isn’t completing basic college level passes.
That’s not coaching or scheming guys open(sark has done that).
maybe Kane improved mechanics…but a coach can’t make a guy a better processor. Not be late on throws. How he sees the field.
This is not a “the coach is making arch worse because he’s not calling the right plays” situation.
he didn’t evaluate the QB properly and allowed the OL and Weapons to become less the elite when he should have done better.
Bro. I honestly think this dude just doesn't know the plays bro. Lol. It seems obvious to me. Anything that dude can see or truly knows, like a deep ball, he is accurate as hell. He is accurate when its scramble drill time. He is only inaccurate when its in the confines of the offense. Anyone who played sports knew a guy who didnt have the plays down. Whether it was he didnt study or was plane just dumb. I honestly this Arch just doesn't know the plays and therefore plays with zero anticipation.
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1 minute ago, RomaVicta said:
Being easier on Arch isn't saying that he's good. In fact, my post never said that he is. I mainly commented on what appeared to me to be a goal when the game started. Release fast no matter what and accuracy will follow. The former didn't last long and the latter never happened. I watched the game, and, while not nearly as astute as you, I could see what you do.
I've got to remember that it's all or nothing around here. If you look at my posts from earlier in the season, and I don't know why anybody would, you will see that I was a ridiculed proponent of the notion that he was not performing at even nearly a competent level, and, if it were to continue, we should give someone else a try. I'm still there.
Performance is everything.
Here is the thing bro. I dont think its all that serious. I will post what I think it is in another post in a second.
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1 minute ago, B00M said:
drag routes are off the table. Just brutal.Didn’t Herman give Ehlinger almost nothing but curls in the middle of the field?
Hard to remember that far back but I do remember his routes he threw to being high schoolish. You are right though. Certain routes need to be off the table. Maybe revisit it when his processing picks up but right now....nay
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2 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:I'm easier on Arch this week than two weeks ago. I got the feeling that the goal for this game was that he throw at the moment he should. Period. Early, to my uneducated eyes, he was doing just that. Even if he missed on the throw, he was meeting the goal of timing. My guess is that the belief, if I'm anywhere near correct, is that his accuracy will come after mastering speed of release.
Of course, that disintegrated with deplorable play of the OL. It's hard not to revert back to bad habits under such duress
Roma, the dude is late on everything. He is late on his reads. He is late on coming off his reads. He is late on his incompletions and he is late on his completions. He is just late. Everything is so slow, and a large part as to why the O-line looks the way it does. Blitzes and rushes that should never get home get there because he cannot get the ball out. For example, the play where he got sacked trying to throw to Livingstone coming across the formation, Parker was open on the break and Arch waiting until he was well past the center to throw it. If he throws it right away the rush never gets there and Parker is running for a 1st down. Its like he doesn't have the plays memorized and it just out there throwing to whatever he sees open like back yard football. There is zero pre snap recognition for what should be open. Its all just wait and see.
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4 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:
Thinking about it, I actually think it is the same problem we saw against Ohio State. Arch processes slow, but when he does see where to throw the ball he then rushes the throws. With screens, Arch knows where the ball is supposed to go, so he rushed the screen rather than let it develop.
I think you are 100% correct on your observation. But where do you go from here is the question?
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1 minute ago, Dahobbs said:
Yeah, it was clear Tre had a limited pitch count. I don't understand why we did just use Simon instead of not running. But I also don't understand why when we did run, we choose shit like that nonsense first play of OT. The team showed it could run outside zone and inside zone. Why not do that?
They had the box loaded up pretty good so I think Sark was simply playing the numbers. I dont think he truly has let it sink in that he just can't run the offense the way he wants to. He has to dust off his ole Jake Locker playbook. Spread. Rudimentary route combos. Run and run some more even with the QB. That is what Ole Miss is doing. I think he's had so much success that he expects his players to simply adapt to him and not the other way around. Its clear Arch cannot run his offense. So let's find out what he can run.
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5 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:
Arch sucks at throwing screens. He either floats it the receiver, giving the defense a ton of time to blow it up or throws it immediately before it can develop, usually rifling it somewhere that takes away all the receivers momentum. We ran like 10 against OU and all but maybe 2 went for negative or short yardage.
You are 100% correct and most of Surly just doesn't see it. Good screens require good timing. Don't look over there until its time. Accurate ball placement gives the runner a chance to make someone miss. We seem to look and throw too soon or throw something requiring an adjustment and thereby killing momentum.
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2 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:
A very large part of it is Arch's inability to consistently throw short passes. Another very large part of it is game plan. Outside zone feasted against OU. We didn't run it all against Kentucky. What the fuck are we trying to do on offense? Regardless, if Arch just hits the wide open hot reads, teams would have to stop blitzing.
I said during the game it appeared they were intentionally not running Tre, IE a pitch count. Something is going on there and Sark is notorious for keeping a small circle with his skill guys. He needs to get these young guys going so they can help take the pressure of Tre. Have you noticed under Sark that every RB that has done well here we found by accident? When we had no choice. He needs to quit being stubborn with his skill guys. Find a use for Niblet who is great with the ball in his hands. Quit trying to force fucking Wingo to be the dude when 13 is better than him.
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13 minutes ago, TwiceHorn said:
You're a much more sophisticated observer than I.
I don't see this as being contradictory, I was just speaking in broad strokes about why Arch may have appeared to be the solution to our woes last year.
When Arch was in last year, he wasn't asked to do much. If and when he was pressured, he gave the appearance of being more composed than QE. He ran pretty well. He threw better deep balls and, therefore, as stated by gmr, everyone assumed he could throw the short/intermediate passes when called upon to do so. That turned out to be a terrible assumption. And, as you note, it seems he can't see the middle of the field. He's a DC's dream.
Arch is most definitely a gamer in the fact that he is pretty elusive in the pocket. But a lot of WHY he is having to dodge bodies is his own fault. Every drop back ends the same way. Waiting too long to make a decision. Even on completions. For example there was a simple tight end out he threw and the TE got tackled as soon as he caught it at the LOS. However, if you watch it again he waits until the defender closes all the way down to throw it when he is open immediately. If he had thrown it right away the TE could've gotten their head around and stiff armed, but the late throw gives hom no time for that. People keep saying receivers arent open. They are open. On the break. But if you dont throw it on the break it allows for DBs to recover. The whole thing is frustrating to watch. Im just venting really.
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4 minutes ago, Gut Wagon said:
Good points. Even with all our troubles, if Arch throws that single slant to Mosley a couple feet lower as the blitz arrives, we might well win in regulation and feel a wee bit better about last night. Credit to Stoops for dialing up the pressure, but I'm sad we weren't able to diagnose and avoid the heat much better than we did.
Yeah man, the best way to handle this dude is to spread the field and make diagnosing as easy as possible for this dude. 4 and 5 wide you cannot disguise coverage. Then give the dude easy routes to throw. I know Sark can do it because thats exactly what he did with Jake Locker. Arch is the 2.0 of that dude, big armed dude with questionable processing skills. He got that dude drafted first round.
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9 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:
Where was the screen game last night? When it was obvious our OL just let everyone through, and Arch was panicked, some boots or a screen could have helped. Instead we did zone read and got destroyed.
Lol. Everyone here was pised about the screen game because it was just a throwaway down anytime we used it, it was getting blown up so much. Look. I think the only solution with this guy is to adjust the route concepts. Routes need to be end somewhat stationary because he cannot hit anything moving with any regularity. He also cannot feel when its time to abort and hit the checkdown. Last week he was going to it excessively. This week its back to not seeing it. Not sure what's going on there.
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1 hour ago, TwiceHorn said:
Yeah, we did have a more functional line and running game last year, which helped disguise Arch's flaws. That was fool's gold.
1 hour ago, Gut Wagon said:I think there was broad belief Arch would be much better throwing downfield than Quinn was, so it was assumed he'd have no issues throwing the short or intermediate routes. Plus, he'd add a lot more ability to make plays with his legs. Some of those pluses were seen in spot duty, but not as a starter.
I guess another way of looking at it is, how would Quinn look standing behind this OL and without Golden, Bijan, Worthy, Helm, Sanders or Blue to throw to? We haven't seamlessly reloaded our weaponry, that's for sure.
Both you know I hold no ill will towards either of you. I encourage you two to hop on Texas Clips on YouTube and watch the condensed version of last year's Kentucky game. Kentucky has at least two to three guys off the ball all game. They played a light box and tried their version of the flyover quite a bit. A lot of zone. In my opinion that why our running game was better in spurts last year because everyone was trying to take away Quinn. Now look at this years game. A lot of man coverage from Kentucky and a lot more attempts at heating up the pocket. And not just any blitzing. What it looked like to me was a lot of QB depth rushes from the edge and blitzing and stunting in the middle. Looked lile they were trying to keep him in the pocket and then bring pressure in his face. Obviously you two know that when you do that you leave the middle wide open but if the QB doesn't see it then why wouldn't you? Kentucky's handling of the offense is night and day different. So its my opinion that they wouldn't just recklessly blitz like they did yesterday because they know 3 would hurt them on the back end.
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51 minutes ago, WBT said:
He apparently can't beat out the jagger part-time starter at Troy.
It starts and ends there for me. Last year people calling to bench Quinn were dreaming on the Manning name. Now you have a part-time QB from a below .500 sunbelt team waiting in the wings. And a failed Ryan Williams package deal who's unreadiness is the reason we had to bring in the Troy guy. Good luck with all that.
Bro. They clearly dont wanna burn his shirt.
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5 hours ago, Gut Wagon said:
I'm sick about our offense, but the fact Arch looked better in it last year suggests to me that our weak OL and lackluster receiver play are largely to blame. Few guys block consistently well. No current WR or TE can get separation play after play. I'm sure not saying Arch is blameless, because he's made a TON of bad throws...but this is a shadow of the offensive group who surrounded him as a backup.
What are you guys talking about? He looked exactly like this in every game except one. He played solid vs MSU. They also won 2 games last year. If you paid attention to the other outings they were like this, but instead people choose to hold onto how he looked vs a team that let Toledo score 41 on them.
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1 hour ago, UpperWestside said:
Awesome man! I also like the John Wick inspired sign from the person beside y'all. Tik Tok TFG.
Yep. 5 ft nothing blonde lady. Her friends sign said, "I like my country like I like my drinks...Neat(no ICE motherfucker). Everyone seemed surprised to see me there like, "I thought yall were staying home?".
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7 minutes ago, UTEE97 said:
Are you comparing him with the third-year Quinn? Quinn would have made the intermediate throws but he would also have been sacked many more times and would have missed some of the tight strikes that Arch did. What you're experiencing is the recency bias.
Where do you guys get this "Quinn would be sacked many more times"? Somehow you think what Arch does is what Quinn would do. Quinn gets rid of the football and is going to hit receivers that are open. So all the blitzing KY was doing dont happen. Last year almost everyone played us with a light box because they aere afraid of Quinn lighting us up. That said Arch doesn't get the same respect and if you were paying attention tonight we KY had the box loaded up and refused to allow us to run on them.
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Just now, dcar00 said:
cognitive dissonance?
Quinn had us in every game his whole career. Last year we were bitching about scoring 31. Its crazy to me that we act like the two QBs are even remotely the same.
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6 minutes ago, UTEE97 said:
Last year, the scapegoat was Quinn. This year, it's Arch. Guess what, Caldwell is not going to save this offense. There are fundamental issues with this offense that makes star QBs play like shit. The next backup is not the answer.
The fuck is wrong with yall? Quinn never looked like this ever.
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5 minutes ago, BurntEyes said:
And Ewers regressed each year he was here. Our run game sucked. Our game plan didn't align to the talent. Our game plan didn't take what thr defense gave.
We've been subjected to such shitty offensive coaching for so fucking long we can no longer see it for what it is.
How long you ask?
2005 was the last time we had a truly dominating offense. 20 fucking years.
Ewers did not regress each year he was here lol.
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Arch Manning: Scores every way possible
in Football
Posted
I know you did Twice, but a lot of lurkers may not so i chose to elaborate. And you are correct. When things align for him he shows his abilities.