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2023 Poker in the Rear


Lurch

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3 hours ago, CBT said:

Shit, isn't a pot bet like $300 at that point? Does UTG cover you? Is he an OMC?  I'm probably just ripping it in, yea. That kind of raise reeks of 99-QQ. I'm good with flipping with the dead money in the middle. 

Pot bet was $200 (7 @ $31).  The only caller was a younger asian guy but he was MP with lots of people to act behind.  Seems impossible to believe that he called but I guess top pair was enough for him.

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27 minutes ago, Lurch said:

I don’t mind either play preflop. Don’t think bluff jamming flop from early position was EV+ though. Too likely some of the 7 opponents had SPR spots where they’d call even if you showed them AA (which a flop jam screams here)

Pretty much a rule to never bluff when 4-way+

I absolutely agree, but I felt stuck at this point.  I tried to convince myself I had fold equity although the initial caller had 3:1 odds and anyone after that was even better.  I was hoping the absolute value of the money may convince people to fold.  What would you do, check/fold if you don't improve?  I'm sure that's the EV+ play.  Maybe I like the rush more than the money lol.

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44 minutes ago, Lurch said:

I don’t mind either play preflop. Don’t think bluff jamming flop from early position was EV+ though. Too likely some of the 7 opponents had SPR spots where they’d call even if you showed them AA (which a flop jam screams here)

Pretty much a rule to never bluff when 4-way+

At some point, can't fold tho, we have $500 back and there is over $2000 in the pot. Dunno if there was a diamond or not on flop (75% chance based on post ha).  If we are never going to fold no matter what, I'd rather jam and get folds from hands like 66 or QT or whatever rather than let them realize their non-zero equity. Agree, it's a terrible spot either way at this point. Just the cost of doing business in an incredible game where 7 people are willing to get 100 bigs in pre with money still behind. 

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25 minutes ago, Hugh G. Rection said:

Pot bet was $200 (7 @ $31).  The only caller was a younger asian guy but he was MP with lots of people to act behind.  Seems impossible to believe that he called but I guess top pair was enough for him.

You said 7 people called the $31, so that should be 8x31 is $248 ignoring blinds. For you to pot would be $310 (to calculate pot you put in the call, then raise the amount of the pot). If there were only 6 callers (so the $31 raiser and six more so 7 people), pot raise is $279. No one is calling $200 pre with JTo to fold top pair lol. 

20 minutes ago, Hugh G. Rection said:

I absolutely agree, but I felt stuck at this point.  I tried to convince myself I had fold equity although the initial caller had 3:1 odds and anyone after that was even better.  I was hoping the absolute value of the money may convince people to fold.  What would you do, check/fold if you don't improve?  I'm sure that's the EV+ play.  Maybe I like the rush more than the money lol.

If the raise was $200 called 6 ways, it's closer, but check-folding equity away is brutal in a massive massive pot. You had almost 30% equity against JT, assuming one diamond was on the flop. 

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14 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

At some point, can't fold tho, we have $500 back and there is over $2000 in the pot. Dunno if there was a diamond or not on flop (75% chance based on post ha).  If we are never going to fold no matter what, I'd rather jam and get folds from hands like 66 or QT or whatever rather than let them realize their non-zero equity. Agree, it's a terrible spot either way at this point. Just the cost of doing business in an incredible game where 7 people are willing to get 100 bigs in pre with money still behind. 

My assumption is that a fold would be quite likely at this point.  Especially if we saw a lot of action past our check.  If there's a bet and then a raise/jam, for example, I doubt our odds are frequently favorable (would depend on stack sizes, of course) to make a call

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3 hours ago, TXSooner518 said:

At some point, can't fold tho, we have $500 back and there is over $2000 in the pot. Dunno if there was a diamond or not on flop (75% chance based on post ha).  If we are never going to fold no matter what, I'd rather jam and get folds from hands like 66 or QT or whatever rather than let them realize their non-zero equity. Agree, it's a terrible spot either way at this point. Just the cost of doing business in an incredible game where 7 people are willing to get 100 bigs in pre with money still behind. 

That was my thinking at the time.  Had to bluff.  No, no diamond on the flop so I didn't improve in any way.

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3 hours ago, TXSooner518 said:

You said 7 people called the $31, so that should be 8x31 is $248 ignoring blinds. For you to pot would be $310 (to calculate pot you put in the call, then raise the amount of the pot). If there were only 6 callers (so the $31 raiser and six more so 7 people), pot raise is $279. No one is calling $200 pre with JTo to fold top pair lol. 

If the raise was $200 called 6 ways, it's closer, but check-folding equity away is brutal in a massive massive pot. You had almost 30% equity against JT, assuming one diamond was on the flop. 

Yeah, my raise was $200 even, I used "pot" in the writing as shorthand.  Sorry for the confusion.  

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8 minutes ago, Hugh G. Rection said:

Yeah, my raise was $200 even, I used "pot" in the writing as shorthand.  Sorry for the confusion.  

No worries, just matters when we are looking at the math. Definitely a different story going to a $1400 pot with $600 back than a $2100 pot with $500 back. Working against us is our pot odds are worse, so we need more equity when called. Working for us is that the bet is bigger, both in raw $ and compared to the pot, so we have more fold equity. I'd prob check here with the different pot size and given no diamonds. 

If your opp jammed and showed you JT, you would need to call $600 to win $2000 more so we need 6/26 or 23% equity. We have 23.3% vs his exact hand. So just slightly over break even on the $ going in on the flop, so don't feel too bad about it at all. 

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9 minutes ago, TXSooner518 said:

No worries, just matters when we are looking at the math. Definitely a different story going to a $1400 pot with $600 back than a $2100 pot with $500 back. Working against us is our pot odds are worse, so we need more equity when called. Working for us is that the bet is bigger, both in raw $ and compared to the pot, so we have more fold equity. I'd prob check here with the different pot size and given no diamonds. 

If your opp jammed and showed you JT, you would need to call $600 to win $2000 more so we need 6/26 or 23% equity. We have 23.3% vs his exact hand. So just slightly over break even on the $ going in on the flop, so don't feel too bad about it at all. 

Thanks!  I appreciate you working through the math.  

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Tried my hand at my first PLO tourney.  $180 - $5k guarantee at Champions in Houston.  A lot more fun than the typical NLH tournies which I expected. We hit 28 entries after late reg with a prize pool of over $10k after rebuys and add ons.  Made final table but out in 8th.  Brandon Cantu and some others from the Helmuth livestream came and entered after the livestream.  Cantu was the chip leader when I busted out.  Helmuth hung around and watched and acted like he was gonna late reg but never did.

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Still Wynn, Aria, Venetian with some liking Resort World, though I’ve not tried it.

Wynn is most comfortable/highest quality. Aria is most packed (can be to its detriment as fish aren’t as likely to wait for a seat). Venetian tends to have more availability.

MGMs room is dark and low stakes only. I’d avoid it unless others were out of reach.

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i had a nice 7 session win streak that got me back.

 

but yet again, ran into the AK vs whatever the fuck I have loss combo tonight. 

 

started with $200,  played a round no action, 195 behind I get dealt 99hd.  1 limper, i make it $15 from LP,   aggressive 21-22yo something makes it $65. which  screams, I dont want a flop.  I reshove- which is almost the total amount he has..... he says lets rock and its all low cards until the river K.  he flips over AK, so of course my 99 no good. 

rebuy for $200 more, get it up to $350 on the verge of breaking even, get dealt AKo UTG, and limp with the full intention of going after the 2-3 aggressive players in later positions. 

same kid who won against me with AK make it $15 from EP. LP makes it $50, folds to me, I am SB, and I shove.    kid snap calls, LP folds... and we run it out, no ace no king, nothing. 

he flips over 33.    are you kidding me? 

rebuy for another 200, play for a while, get it up to $300 again. and am the button with AKss.  UTG makes it $15, gets 2 callers, CO makes it $50.    I fucking shove, because duh. 

 

folds to the 2nd caller of the original 15, hes got $325 behind and calls and everyone else folds. 

flop is all red, Q J 8 - X X    he flips over 99..... and of course wins. 

I leave with my tail between my legs, down $700

all 3 major loses with AK or against AK, and I just cant fucking win with that fucking hand, nor can I fucking beat it. 

 

i get that they are all flips, but Its becoming beyond frustrating.  If I slow play AK, i lose, if i fast play, i lose, if I raise hard and actuallly hit WITH AK the moment I bet everyone folds, but if I miss entirely and Continue Bet, I lose. 

 

Its starting to become a fucking joke. 

 

 

Edited by AUS-97HORN
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