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2020 Democratic Nominee

used2b

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Bama Chick

Bama Chick 28595

Posted
Posted
Positivity and persuasion? Are you a child?

You guys lash out like angry children and you expect others to help you cradle you, rub your shoulders, and sing you a nice little song while you calm down?

If you guys want a good faith conversation that's great, but that's not what is happening here.

If you want to fight, that's also fine, but don't throw punches then fucking cry when they come flying back.


Fuck off with name calling and double standards and more gaslighting.
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Huckleberry
Huckleberry

No it doesn't, this is absurd selfishness on a grand scale. Nobody is getting punished. My wife and I paid off our student loans, and you know what I think about younger people or even those in our ge

henrygandorf
henrygandorf

i’ve really enjoyed the 900 posts from bt explaining how bernie people aren’t aggressive, obsessive, and very-online.  truly a learning experience. 

Bill Clinton
Bill Clinton

3rd or 4th thread but whos counting.  Name recognition and ability to collect money is most important to the Democratic Party. They aren't trying to win 2020, they are trying to rebuild and colle

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13018

Posted
Posted
I guess we're at the point where we shouldn't take any journalism seriously? If MSNBC is full of establishment hacks (they are), can we not criticize hacks on the left as well? 


Criticize away!

Post the Tweets and dunk on the tweeter all day. That's what this whole place is for.

But don't...
- be a passive aggressive concern toll giving bullshit advice like you want what's best for them
- refer to your own experience with abuse victim language
- act like you're not starting a fight when you're starting a fight
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Hank Kingsley

Hank Kingsley 19820

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, GSU&UT said:

I'm done with this shit man, you are creating a scenario that is being played out in your head that has no basis in reality. 

There's no basis in reality that if Bernie Sanders becomes President we see leftist and socialist publications have more influence? Ok, man. 

BTW, I have zero problem with them having more influence. I do expect them to act like grownups though. 

 

 

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mchookem

mchookem 15429

Posted
Posted
15 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Positivity and persuasion? Are you a child?

You guys lash out like angry children and you expect others to help you cradle you, rub your shoulders, and sing you a nice little song while you calm down?

If you guys want a good faith conversation that's great, but that's not what is happening here.

If you want to fight, that's also fine, but don't throw punches then fucking cry when they come flying back.

there's been like a years worth of good faith conversation on this site. you have been consistent in your MO throughout.

it's important because BERNIE NEEDS EVERYBODY TO BE ON HIS SIDE TO WIN. in the microcosm that is this site you are not doing him any favors. 

having said that, no, most of us are not children and luckily for Bernie (and the country) we realize that you are not him.

so keep doing you.

and lol at calling somebody else an angry child 🙄

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softlynow

softlynow 1612

Posted
Posted
49 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

The actual context of the Castro shit...

A word of advice for those new to the Bernie train*:

Before you freak out when someone accuses Bernie of something or shows you a partial quote, be patient. 99 times out of 100, all you need is the actual context of the quote to explain whatever it is that you found bothersome or worrying. Basically, do your research before jumping to conclusions and it's not a bad idea to trust (but verify!) Bernie. If a quote looks like it's really stupid or bad, read the whole thing (usually a lot is being hidden for a reason, as it was here) before feeling the need to respond.

If you're confused, ask a fellow Bro. We're here to help. And we're always holding.

  Reveal hidden contents

* - If you're not on the Bernie train I'm not talking to you. I'm not trying to convince you to come over. Not every song is about you.

Things you want us to be patient with may not actually get us riled up. I'm probably not alone among the skeptical who usually know what he's really saying even hearing only a breathless, pearl-clutching snippet pulled to feed the outrage machine. I think a bunch of us know that campaigns are won by feeding that machine, and Bernie has enough to power it for a couple lifetimes.

It sure looks like we're gonna see if things are so fucked up that enough Dem-inclined voters will not be deterred by the tag that Dems have been tirelessly avoiding for 70 years. 

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13018

Posted
Posted
Things you want us to be patient with may not actually get us riled up. I'm probably not alone among the skeptical who usually know what he's really saying even hearing only a breathless, pearl-clutching snippet pulled to feed the outrage machine. I think a bunch of us know that campaigns are won by feeding that machine, and Bernie has enough to power it for a couple lifetimes.
It sure looks like we're gonna see if things are so fucked up that enough Dem-inclined voters will not be deterred by the tag that Dems have been tirelessly avoiding for 70 years. 
I think they'll be fine. A lot of pundits this it's still 1988.
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Hank Kingsley

Hank Kingsley 19820

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

So tease it out, Hank, what's going to potentially happen with this lady that you're worried about?

It's commentary, not a prediction. 

Establishment media/journalism is a fucking joke. I agree with all the Bernie people about what a disaster they have been for a very long time. 

I hope it's replaced with something better. I'm not confident. 

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softlynow

softlynow 1612

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, bad_teammate said:
5 minutes ago, softlynow said:
Things you want us to be patient with may not actually get us riled up. I'm probably not alone among the skeptical who usually know what he's really saying even hearing only a breathless, pearl-clutching snippet pulled to feed the outrage machine. I think a bunch of us know that campaigns are won by feeding that machine, and Bernie has enough to power it for a couple lifetimes.
It sure looks like we're gonna see if things are so fucked up that enough Dem-inclined voters will not be deterred by the tag that Dems have been tirelessly avoiding for 70 years. 

I think they'll be fine. A lot of pundits this it's still 1988.

Pundits speak to the engaged, especially the junkies. It's the anchors, headline writers and memers that reach the rest. The Buckley / Vidal debates were notable, but it was Cronkite that reached folks consistently. Bernie's gonna need his army out getting folks to read past the byline. WTF am I saying, they need to get folks to read, period. That should give you and your fellow trav..., eh activists reason enough to tone down the hate in your proselytizing.

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tigol

tigol 2374

Posted
Posted
52 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Ok so how many people here have "How nice Internet posters are to me" in their top 5 factors in deciding between Sanders, Trump, or not voting for president in 2020 should Bernie win?

Raise your hands.

I dislike you.  You bring nothing of substance or honesty.  Fuck you for being a fucking asshole.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13018

Posted
Posted

Also, it's a fantastic idea because it will employ a LOT of people in extremely important jobs and those workers won't need a lot of advanced education.

Giving the top a haircut to create jobs is exactly what we should be doing. The economic benefits of a healthier and more liquid middle class should be fairly evident.

"ACCOUNT FOR EVERY PENNY OF SPENDING!" is a right wing frame used to kill social progress for generations and we shouldn't feel the need to respect their disingenuous framing devices.

No one does it. Only the Democrats feel hampered by it. We have to stop dancing to their tune.

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13018

Posted
Posted

It's a popular policy idea. It's something we can afford. It's a policy whose benefits will be transformative.



Follow the link to the Family Fun Pack (a cute name for a suite of truly transformative family-focused proposals) for more detail. The link in the tweet focuses on the popularity of the program and one funding option.

Imagine how many social ills result from health insecurity and lack of childcare options. It makes employment more tenuous. It increases stress and unhappiness in the home. It decreases birthrates. It increases divorce. It discourages marriage.

If we invest in good, stable homes we won't even have to worry nearly as much about issues like crime and delinquency. With universal healthcare the kids will be healthier which will lead to healthier adults. Young mothers will have more support to raise and feed their babies well. When pregnant, they'll get better prenatal care which will prevent many future problems for her and the child.

The question isn't how we are going to pay for it. The question is why we have been neglecting this for so long.
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HenryJames

HenryJames 64901

Posted
Posted
53 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

"ACCOUNT FOR EVERY PENNY OF SPENDING!" is a right wing frame used to kill social progress for generations and we shouldn't feel the need to respect their disingenuous framing devices.

No one does it. Only the Democrats feel hampered by it. We have to stop dancing to their tune.

This. 

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Dbeasy

Dbeasy 14733

Posted
Posted

I see multiple references by Bernie Bro’s to either not caring at all about the costs of his proposed programs, or generic references to there being plenty of money to afford all of it by re-allocating from the military budget, etc.

These same Bro’s rail against other candidates and dipshit Trump for lying and being disingenuous with voters. Yet, there are massive questions about how his taxes, programs, and re-allocation of funds will truly impact citizens at each income level.

His rhetoric is all about corporate greed and billionaires, but the reality is that these programs will touch a very big percentage of the population, with a lack of clarity about how much.

Trumpers and Republican voters deserve nothing but disdain for their disgusting behavior. But telling voters about all of these wonderful things they will get without clearly articulating how much it will really cost them is pretty disingenuous too. Right now, even Moderate Democrats believe his proposed policies are fantasy. That’s a pretty big indictment.

So my question to the Bernie Bro’s is this. You are obviously passionately supporting him. Is it because a) you really don’t care if there are major new costs to a significant percentage of the population because you resonate with the concept of spreading the wealth? b) you believe the cost to all people below $100k in income will be modest? c) you just like his ideas and want to see something/anything implemented to offset the terrible policies of the rich in the past, and figure that the costs issue will just get worked out somehow, or d) something else?

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Dropout

Dropout 355

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

I see multiple references by Bernie Bro’s to either not caring at all about the costs of his proposed programs, or generic references to there being plenty of money to afford all of it by re-allocating from the military budget, etc.

These same Bro’s rail against other candidates and dipshit Trump for lying and being disingenuous with voters. Yet, there are massive questions about how his taxes, programs, and re-allocation of funds will truly impact citizens at each income level.

His rhetoric is all about corporate greed and billionaires, but the reality is that these programs will touch a very big percentage of the population, with a lack of clarity about how much.

Trumpers and Republican voters deserve nothing but disdain for their disgusting behavior. But telling voters about all of these wonderful things they will get without clearly articulating how much it will really cost them is pretty disingenuous too. Right now, even Moderate Democrats believe his proposed policies are fantasy. That’s a pretty big indictment.

So my question to the Bernie Bro’s is this. You are obviously passionately supporting him. Is it because a) you really don’t care if there are major new costs to a significant percentage of the population because you resonate with the concept of spreading the wealth? b) you believe the cost to all people below $100k in income will be modest? c) you just like his ideas and want to see something/anything implemented to offset the terrible policies of the rich in the past, and figure that the costs issue will just get worked out somehow, or d) something else?
 

Def b and c. I do not believe there will be major new costs to a significant percentage of the population. That is how unbalanced the scale is. America doesn’t worry about costs when we want to go to war and start some killing. I won’t allow costs to make me believe we can’t do good for people instead.

Any costs to individuals that may actually feel it will be offset by the uplifting of an entire society by helping those that need it have access to things like healthcare and a higher education. That’s even if he can enact any of these proposals. He is the best shot though.

Idk if that was an answer you were looking for. Ask away.

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FORTY NINE TO ZERO

FORTY NINE TO ZERO 2617

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Posted
45 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

It's a popular policy idea. It's something we can afford. It's a policy whose benefits will be transformative.
 

 


Follow the link to the Family Fun Pack (a cute name for a suite of truly transformative family-focused proposals) for more detail. The link in the tweet focuses on the popularity of the program and one funding option.

Imagine how many social ills result from health insecurity and lack of childcare options. It makes employment more tenuous. It increases stress and unhappiness in the home. It decreases birthrates. It increases divorce. It discourages marriage.

If we invest in good, stable homes we won't even have to worry nearly as much about issues like crime and delinquency. With universal healthcare the kids will be healthier which will lead to healthier adults. Young mothers will have more support to raise and feed their babies well. When pregnant, they'll get better prenatal care which will prevent many future problems for her and the child.

The question isn't how we are going to pay for it. The question is why we have been neglecting this for so long.

 

Free child care would be a great policy. Probably easy to fund too, just take it from the military. 

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Cheeseweasel

Cheeseweasel 26437

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Aqua Buddha said:

Serious question, why can't people take care of their own kids?  If you want to make child care part of welfare to work or whatever, that's fine but that's not what we're talking about here.

The problem is that it's going to tied to employment (like health insurance). Mobility of employment will suffer further.

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GSU&UT

GSU&UT 1798

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

Serious question, why can't people take care of their own kids?  If you want to make child care part of welfare to work or whatever, that's fine but that's not what we're talking about here.

 

Dude just go ahead and vote Republican, this is a policy that Warren was pushing for as well. At least you'd be honest with yourself.

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RDCanecutter

RDCanecutter 25767

Posted
Posted
9 hours ago, bad_teammate said:

Ok so how many people here have "How nice Internet posters are to me" in their top 5 factors in deciding between Sanders, Trump, or not voting for president in 2020 should Bernie win?

Raise your hands.

I only agree with you when you are mean to me.

Because I am a bad bad bad bad shameful person.

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FondrenRoad

FondrenRoad 4378

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

Serious question, why can't people take care of their own kids?  If you want to make child care part of welfare to work or whatever, that's fine but that's not what we're talking about here.

 

If you make it welfare only, then you get class segregated child care facilities which exacerbates the poverty cycle. If you make it "free" for all, you get class mixed facilities that nearly every kid goes to. You also get rid of the stigma associated with welfare. 

NYC already does this with pre-K and school lunches, and is rolling out after school day care. It has worked very well. Wealthy parents "pay" via their taxes.  

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Huckleberry

Huckleberry 32141

Posted
Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

Why can’t we worry about the cost for all of it?

Well some of us do, but the disingenuous bullshit that Republicans (like you) spit out where you act so concerned about covering the cost for domestic welfare programs while not caring even a little bit about the deficit when Republicans are starting wars all over the planet is tiresome.

Edited by Huckleberry
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Aqua Buddha

Aqua Buddha 13897

Posted
Posted
Just now, Huckleberry said:

Well some of us do, but the disingenuous bullshit that Republicans (like you) spit out where you act so concerned about covering the cost for domestic welfare problems while not caring even a little bit about the deficit when Republicans are starting wars all over the planet is tiresome.

My wife (no pics) and I have voted Dem president in every election since 2000.  The fact that you’re running us off is kind of the point.

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Aqua Buddha

Aqua Buddha 13897

Posted
Posted
Just now, Huckleberry said:

Yes, you dunce, your taxes pay for things for other people all the time. Just like my taxes pay for things you use.

No kids here yet I vote for every education bill that comes down the pike because I don’t want to be surrounded by dullards.  Now you’re telling that on top of that you want me to pay for your day care and student loans but you prolly spend $200/mo on cell phone plans and streaming subscriptions.  M’kay.

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bonnieblue

bonnieblue 542

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

So, my taxes are paying off your student loans and taking care of your kids?  That’s awesome.

Assuming the world isn't gone by then, those kids will then grow up, get jobs, pay taxes, and start subsidizing your old, dying self. It's a cycle.

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FondrenRoad

FondrenRoad 4378

Posted
Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

Why can’t we worry about the cost for all of it?

What you're missing is that we already pay for all of it, and we do so at a much higher cost per capita. I recently had a similar conversation with a friend.  In the middle of it, he looked up the employer part of his premium for his family of 3.  It was $3200 a month on top of the 1200 he paid a month. He had never even bothered to look it up before. 

The money is already there. 

Edited by FondrenRoad
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Aqua Buddha

Aqua Buddha 13897

Posted
Posted
Just now, bonnieblue said:

Assuming the world isn't gone by then, those kids will then grow up, get jobs, pay taxes, and start subsidizing your old, dying self. It's a cycle.

So, cradle to grave?

Difference is I’m paying into that old people system now.  In addition, you’re wanting me to bail people out of bad student loan situations.

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