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Hugo Stiglitz

The MSM Embarrassment that is Chuck Todd

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7 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Ah, I see, you're trying out for the role of Anastasis. Carry on.

You can think that if it makes you feel better. You can give me a label and adhominem your way to dismissing. Another option, as I pointed out is to step back, realize that maybe this isn’t a real outrage thing, maybe the countless other things that are outraging these days are actually hollow and manufactured, and maybe you have been programmed by social media into part of the outrage cancel culture hive mind.

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32 minutes ago, GW Hayduke said:

You can think that if it makes you feel better. You can give me a label and adhominem your way to dismissing. Another option, as I pointed out is to step back, realize that maybe this isn’t a real outrage thing, maybe the countless other things that are outraging these days are actually hollow and manufactured, and maybe you have been programmed by social media into part of the outrage cancel culture hive mind.

Or....

1. Cancel culture is overblown in some cases

2. Chuck Todd is a monumental fucktard

Both of these can be true.

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7 minutes ago, VRHorn said:

Or....

1. Cancel culture is overblown in some cases

2. Chuck Todd is a monumental fucktard

Both of these can be true.

I only addressed no. 1. Of course both can be true.

Cancel outrage victim culture is beyond dumb in most cases. This is a perfect example of it.  That doesn’t speak to the quality of Todd as a journalist or talking head. 

Todd is the weakest and less-informed of all of the Sunday morning political talking heads. That has no bearing on the magnitude or appropriateness of cancel outrage victim culture.

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2 hours ago, GW Hayduke said:

Chuck Todd has officially been CANCELED!!!?!

Bernie and his supporters are again the VICTIMS!!!?!

I’m no fan of Chuck but Jesus please people, drop the outrage culture BS. It is transparent and dumb.

 

You keep crying about cancel culture when nobody has been cancelled.

Saying Chuck Todd sucks and can go fuck himself is just downright American.

Go be outraged about outrage somewhere else.

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I could barely hear this very short clip but it sounded to me like he was quoting someone else.  Without hearing more I don't think outrage is necessarily the reaction here.

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2 hours ago, GW Hayduke said:

There are appropriate things to diss on Todd about and then there are utterly dumb, fake, and manufactured things that social media regurgitates at you that you don’t need to swallow hook line and sinker. It’s more of a mock of outrage cancel culture that you have been drawn into with this. Suggest folks step back when they start to feel that rumbling boil of outrage and see if it really something or if there are other things out there that actually matter

This is dumb and here's why.  Nobody here is "outraged."  Not a single person.  The delight being taken in watching Chuck Todd get raked is that it's a dose of the same medicine he used as leverage to define his profile as "above the fray" and "too civil for caustic language."  Watching people get served their own bullshit is fantastic, no matter who it is.  People getting their nosed rubbed in their hypocrisy puddle is satisfying.  

The "outrage culture" and "cancel culture" that you are attributing everyone else being vulnerable to is nonexistent, especially with most of the denizens here.  Social media, particularly Twitter, uses outrage to fuel every aspect of political discourse.  And it comes from all sides and every idiotic angle.  As you recognized in another post, victimization is used by every side, often manufactured out of thin air for a distinct result or general persuasion.  You know, politics. 

When a sophomore from Occidental College who is for the first time recognizing and initiating her ideological voice on Instagram it's incumbent upon you to recognize that her inexperience in that realm doesn't define an entire side or political party.  In fact, her political opposition will use and amplify her voice as a tool to inaccurately define their political opposition as "ravenous and zany" or whatever.  When some nitwit on Huffington Post uses Dylann Roof to define all of the conservative sphere, nobody here will buy into that.  You're the one who has bought into that tactic "hook line and sinker" while you warn others not to be gullible.

Cancel culture is indeed real but it's more of a nervous response from corporate media and the mainstream entertainment industry.  It's just soothing for simpletons to brush off opposing viewpoints as coming from an irrational and crazed motivation.  Sarah Silverman, unarguably liberal and highly political, has suffered career wise because her pissed off political opposition dug into her past to point out a skit she did in blackface or a generalization she made about Asians in her comedy.  The people who amplified her past weren't wild-eyed, bleeding heart liberals out to erase her because they were actually traumatized by her insensitivity.  They just don't like her and want to fuck her up.  That's cancel culture.  Verizon and Gatorade aren't going to take the time to evaluate the nuances, they'll usually just respond to the slight chance that they're leaving money on the table and opt for a safer alternative.    

You're directing people how to process information when it's apparent to everyone here that you process discourse and the political breaking pitch from a fundamental and foggy position of rudiment understanding.    

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28 minutes ago, Chooky said:

Nobody here is "outraged."  Not a single person.  The delight being taken in watching Chuck Todd get raked

Its not outrage. It’s delight!!

 

28 minutes ago, Chooky said:

The "outrage culture" and "cancel culture" that you are attributing everyone else being vulnerable to is nonexistent

 

28 minutes ago, Chooky said:

Cancel culture is indeed real

👍

 

28 minutes ago, Chooky said:

You're the one who has bought into that tactic "hook line and sinker" while you warn others not to be gullible.

I recommend you watch the video in question. This is as manufactured as manufactured gets. This is great example.  I’ll link in a second.

https://www.newsweek.com/fire-chuck-todd-trends-quote-article-comparing-bernie-sanders-supporters-brownshirts-1486641

Edited by GW Hayduke

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19 minutes ago, GW Hayduke said:

 

Its not outrage. It’s delight!!

 

 

👍

 

I recommend you watch the video in question. This is as manufactured as manufactured gets. This is great example.  I’ll link in a second.

Nothing wrong with comparing the only Jewish candidate's supporters (the one that had his fathers side of his family wiped out by the Holocaust) to Nazis! Nothing at all

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Just now, Calihorn said:

Nothing wrong with comparing the only Jewish candidate's supporters (the one that had his fathers side of his family wiped out by the Holocaust) to Nazis! Nothing at all

If folks can’t watch the video in the Newsweek article I linked, here is a quote.

 

Hosting a panel discussion on MSNBC yesterday, Todd said: "I want to bring up something that Jonathan Last put in the Bulwark today, and it was about how—and Ruth we've all been on the receiving end of the Bernie online brigade.”

"Here's what he says: 'No other candidate has anything like this sort of digital brownshirt brigade. I mean, except for Donald Trump. The question no one is asking is this: What if you can't win the presidency without an online mob?'“

"'What if we now live in a world where having a bullying, agro social media army running around popping anyone who sticks their head up is either an important ingredient for, or a critical marker of, success?'”

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31 minutes ago, GW Hayduke said:

 

Its not outrage. It’s delight!!

 

 

👍

 

I recommend you watch the video in question. This is as manufactured as manufactured gets. This is great example.  I’ll link in a second.

https://www.newsweek.com/fire-chuck-todd-trends-quote-article-comparing-bernie-sanders-supporters-brownshirts-1486641

It's almost as if the backlash to his quote proved the point that the quote was making and that he was putting up for discussion.

Maybe bad_teammate can explain all of this for us.

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7 minutes ago, Calihorn said:

Nothing wrong with comparing the only Jewish candidate's supporters (the one that had his fathers side of his family wiped out by the Holocaust) to Nazis! Nothing at all

You do know that Chuck Todd is Jewish, right?

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2 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

You do know that Chuck Todd is Jewish, right?

And? Tht's not  comparison nybody should be making in American politics

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Just now, DDD Dad said:

It's almost as if the backlash to his quote proved the point that the quote was making and that he was putting up for discussion.

Maybe bad_teammate can explain all of this for us.

It has been rather bizarre to watch unfold.

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6 minutes ago, GW Hayduke said:

If folks can’t watch the video in the Newsweek article I linked, here is a quote.

 

Hosting a panel discussion on MSNBC yesterday, Todd said: "I want to bring up something that Jonathan Last put in the Bulwark today, and it was about how—and Ruth we've all been on the receiving end of the Bernie online brigade.”

"Here's what he says: 'No other candidate has anything like this sort of digital brownshirt brigade. I mean, except for Donald Trump. The question no one is asking is this: What if you can't win the presidency without an online mob?'“

"'What if we now live in a world where having a bullying, agro social media army running around popping anyone who sticks their head up is either an important ingredient for, or a critical marker of, success?'”

Which changes nothing

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Just now, Calihorn said:

Which changes nothing

Look, I think it's great that Sanders has such tremendous grassroots public support.  It's refreshing to see young people especially want to be involved and actually getting involved in supporting a candidate of their choice.

That said, I think that the commentary that Todd quoted that was being presented for discussion was fair, if the terminology was unfortunate.  One need only look through the Bernie Bro aggressive posts on this site to see that there is at least a glimmer of truth in what the columnist was saying.  That Todd's firing was being immediately demanded across the Internet merely proved the point.

I am personally troubled by what I see as a growing reflection in many Bernie supporters of a lot of what has driven Trump's support amongst his base.  I think both reveal very dangerous threats to our republic, and they seem to feed off of one another.

None of this of course really relates to Chuck Todd as a journalist.  He sucks.  But even a broken clock is right twice a day.

 

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This manufactured episode reminds me of an interview a former VP of Facebook gave and he described how Facebook and social media in general is being used to “rip apart our social fabric,” “tapping into short term dopamine feedback loops,” and that “you don’t realize it but you are being programmed.”

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/blogs-trending-42322746

 

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10 minutes ago, Calihorn said:

And? Tht's not  comparison nybody should be making in American politics

What, that two current candidates on opposing sides of the political spectrum both appear to have blind supporters who attack anyone who disagrees with them, not unlike a horrible group of blind supporters of an evil dictator who came to power about 90 years ago?

Those who forget (or choose to ignore) the past are condemned to repeat it.  (or something like that)

Edited by DDD Dad

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Just now, DDD Dad said:

Look, I think it's great that Sanders has such tremendous grassroots public support.  It's refreshing to see young people especially want to be involved and actually getting involved in supporting a candidate of their choice.

That said, I think that the commentary that Todd quoted that was being presented for discussion was fair, if the terminology was unfortunate.  One need only look through the Bernie Bro aggressive posts on this site to see that there is at least a glimmer of truth in what the columnist was saying.  That Todd's firing was being immediately demanded across the Internet merely proved the point.

I am personally troubled by what I see as a growing reflection in many Bernie supporters of a lot of what has driven Trump's support amongst his base.  I think both reveal very dangerous threats to our republic, and they seem to feed off of one another.

None of this of course really relates to Chuck Todd as a journalist.  He sucks.  But even a broken clock is right twice a day.

 

How in any way does that make Bernie supporters equivalent to brownhirts?

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1 minute ago, Calihorn said:

How in any way does that make Bernie supporters equivalent to brownhirts?

Did you read the quoted commentary?  You do understand that those weren't Todd's words, right?

It's like I'm playing cards with my sister's kids.

Edited by DDD Dad

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The base of my argument is that Todd is a jackass that tried to make a point really badly, do either of you disagree?

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3 hours ago, GW Hayduke said:

I understand you feel that way. Outrage and victimhood is an unfortunate thing these days with certain groups of political voices.  Looking at the mirror image of bernie’s outraged victims is a group of maga hat wearers that are also outraged victims. There is another way of civil and political dialogue and thought which is very much less dumb

Yea fuck off. These two things are not the same.

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16 minutes ago, Calihorn said:

The base of my argument is that Todd is a jackass that tried to make a point really badly, do either of you disagree?

No, that seems to be a pretty solid take.

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1 hour ago, GW Hayduke said:

 

Its not outrage. It’s delight!!

 

 

👍

 

I recommend you watch the video in question. This is as manufactured as manufactured gets. This is great example.  I’ll link in a second.

https://www.newsweek.com/fire-chuck-todd-trends-quote-article-comparing-bernie-sanders-supporters-brownshirts-1486641

The Bernie Bros going after Todd aren't really outraged.  They're attacking a critic with a means to an end tactic.  And all of the people who think they're fueling a "get rid of Chuck" campaign aren't all Bernie Bros.  A lot of them just simply hate Chuck Todd.  Few of them believe Chuck Todd is an Anti-semite.  The few that do are too stupid to embrace long enough for a discussion.  I don't need to watch the video because I watched the segment and I know the context was presented as the subject of an editorial.  My point stands.  Outrage and cancel culture isn't spawned by hypersensitive liberals.  It's a tool that works in a variety of ways and the main use is to spray shit on an individual, a group or an entire ideology.  Sometimes it's just used to get a pundit or a comedian or anyone fired.  And then the bandwagoning makes it effective or gives it volume.  I'm sure you want to believe this is all the product of sensitive "soy boys" or "libcucks" or "nazis" or "cuckflakes" or whatever pejorative is currently in vogue.  

Again, nobody here is "outraged."  You appear to be outraged at the outrage culture because some outrageous people pointed and told you who was outrageously ruining political discourse.  And you're attributing the tactic to mostly one side of the political spectrum.  It's like you're complaining about one soccer team flopping while the entire league is flopping around like fish.  Most people here recognize it as a device and you're acting as if you're advising people how to process the strategy when you're buying into it on the most fundamental level.    

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39 minutes ago, Chooky said:

The Bernie Bros going after Todd aren't really outraged.  They're attacking a critic with a means to an end tactic.

Being on purpose (or manufactured) doesn't mean it isn't also outrage.  #FireChuckTodd was trending 7th last night.

 

39 minutes ago, Chooky said:

I don't need to watch the video because I watched the segment and I know the context was presented as the subject of an editorial.  My point stands.

That's too bad. You should watch and read the quote. This being manufactured is critical to understanding the situation.

39 minutes ago, Chooky said:

I'm sure you want to believe this is all the product of sensitive "soy boys" or "libcucks" or "nazis" or "cuckflakes" or whatever pejorative is currently in vogue. 

Strawmen are a sign of a weak position.

39 minutes ago, Chooky said:

And you're attributing the tactic to mostly one side of the political spectrum.  It's like you're complaining about one soccer team flopping while the entire league is flopping around like fish.

Maybe another strawman or maybe you haven't read this thread.

Quote

Outrage and victimhood is an unfortunate thing these days with certain groups of political voices.  Looking at the mirror image of bernie’s outraged victims is a group of maga hat wearers that are also outraged victims. There is another way of civil and political dialogue and thought which is very much less dumb

 

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3 hours ago, GW Hayduke said:

That's too bad. You should watch and read the quote. This being manufactured is critical to understanding the situation.

You're right.  These are same people who wouldn't let us say Merry Christmas anymore.

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10 hours ago, Chooky said:

You're right.  These are same people who wouldn't let us say Merry Christmas anymore.

WhAtAbOuT Christmas!!  It has been awkward watching you grasp at straws. I used to think only one side uses the BoTh SiDeS fallacy. 

Edited by GW Hayduke

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