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Beau Vine

2020 Hall of Fame Thread

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7 hours ago, Pato del Muerto said:

I won’t try to call this an intelligent argument by any stretch but 4000 hits is 4000 hits. 

And 10328 outs is 10328 outs.

 

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5 hours ago, Beau Vine said:

And 10328 outs is 10328 outs.

 

Yeah, but he ran back to the dugout each and every time.  

It is weird that a guy that hit over .300 FIFTEEN TIMES, is only a .303 lifetime hitter.  

csb/ One of the last baseball games I ever saw with my father was at Wrigley Field in 1985 when Rose tied the record.  The game bizzarely ended in a tie, I think it rained (IIRC).  It would be three more days before he finally got 4,192 off Eric Show (fuck him for 1984).  I always liked Rose for that, he gave my father and I a fun afternoon during an otherwise challenging time for the both of us.  But if he did bet on his own team, and not saying he did, then fuck him.  He said he didn't, then he said he did, then he said he did but only to win the games.  I dunno, but it's been 30 years since he left the game...let's make  decision one way or the other.  

But sorry, fuck Bonds.  I don't care if all the other girls in the class were doing it.  

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1 minute ago, Lobo said:

I dunno, but it's been 30 years since he left the game...let's make  decision one way or the other.  

???

The decision has been made.

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That he bet against the Reds?  I've only ever read/heard rumors, never anything concrete.  

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8 minutes ago, Lobo said:

That he bet against the Reds?  I've only ever read/heard rumors, never anything concrete.  

Not betting for the Reds every game is functionally the same as betting against the Reds:

https://thegruelingtruth.com/baseball/pete-rose-bet-reds-let-show/

And at this point, there's no reason to assume that he didn't bet against the Reds.

It doesn't matter anyways.  Betting on baseball is subject to a penalty of permanent ineligibility, which he got (voluntarily accepted even), and the league doesn't care whether it's for or against your team, whether you're a player or a manager (both for him). 

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If Pete Rose is allowed into the Hall of Fame, then rules essentially mean nothing. Any rule.

The biggest and most important rule was posted in every clubhouse in baseball. That's how we know it was the biggest and most important. How we know it was the cardinal rule. There is zero doubt he knew the rule, there is zero doubt he knew the consequences. And that's exactly why he lied about it for decades.

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We got another Jeter/Omar-only ballot:

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That makes two Jeter/Omar-only ballots and two Jeter-only ballots.  

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1 hour ago, Beau Vine said:

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This moron voted for Sheffield, but not Bonds or Clemens.

Paul Konerko??? And yeah, you'd have to perform some pretty serious mental gymnastics to justify a vote for Sheffield but not Bonds/Clemens. Vizquel isn't a great candidate either, but better than Konerko.

What a goddamn idiot. 

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41 minutes ago, Pablo said:

Griffey Jr should have been the first unanimous player.

fucking NY media

I’m wondering if at least one NY voter won’t vote pujols so that it’s only Yankees (or a yankee) with that honor for a while.  Or if having the first is enough for their egos. 

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Jeter in but not unanimous. Got 99.7% of the vote. Walker in, too. 
The retard who didnt vote for Jeter must have not watched baseball from what, 97 or 98 until 2012? What a GD moron. Probably did it so he can write an article about it in 6 months to a year like that other "look at me" writer did a few years ago for clicks.

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11 minutes ago, Underdog said:

Alright, Jeets.  May have to start camping out for a spot in Cooperstown now, shit's going to be lit for one Mr. Jeter. 

Place is gonna be swarmed with Harold Baines fans.

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3 hours ago, Huckleberry said:

Do we know of any votes for JJ Putz? I mean his name is JJ Putz, I would have thrown him a vote.

 

 

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2 hours ago, markstanco said:
3 hours ago, Jive Turkey said:
Jeter in but not unanimous. Got 99.7% of the vote. Walker in, too. 

The retard who didnt vote for Jeter must have not watched baseball from what, 97 or 98 until 2012? What a GD moron. Probably did it so he can write an article about it in 6 months to a year like that other "look at me" writer did a few years ago for clicks.

Maybe they only watched him play defense? 

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7 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:

Maybe they only watched him play defense? 

What do you call a slow ground ball up the middle when Jeter is playing SS?

Spoiler

A single to center.

 

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12 minutes ago, markstanco said:
20 minutes ago, Huckleberry said:
Maybe they only watched him play defense? 

Might be missing your sarcasm, but 5 gold gloves isnt anything to stick your nose up at.

He won those because he's Derek Jeter, not because he's good defensively.  See also, Palmeiro, Rafael.

Actually, if you really want to understand, read this: http://fieldingbible.com/jeter.asp

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2 hours ago, markstanco said:
3 hours ago, Jive Turkey said:
Jeter in but not unanimous. Got 99.7% of the vote. Walker in, too. 

The retard who didnt vote for Jeter must have not watched baseball from what, 97 or 98 until 2012? What a GD moron. Probably did it so he can write an article about it in 6 months to a year like that other "look at me" writer did a few years ago for clicks.

is this your first experience with the baseball writers?

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He won those because he's Derek Jeter, not because he's good defensively.  See also, Palmeiro, Rafael.
Actually, if you really want to understand, read this: http://fieldingbible.com/jeter.asp
Yall made me google it, assholes.

Omar vizquel is the best at SS all time at .9847. Jeter is at .9762 in fielding.

Do explain to me how .0085 makes him shitty against the best fielder percentage wise of all time.

Yes stats are a little lame when it comes to range, I get it. But he was far from a defensive liability.

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11 minutes ago, markstanco said:

Yall made me google it, assholes.

Omar vizquel is the best at SS all time at .9847. Jeter is at .9762 in fielding.

Do explain to me how .0085 makes him shitty against the best fielder percentage wise of all time.

Yes stats are a little lame when it comes to range, I get it. But he was far from a defensive liability.

If you wanted to understand, you could have read the article I linked instead of posting something as insipid as fielding percentage.  

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9 minutes ago, markstanco said:

Omar vizquel is the best at SS all time at .9847. Jeter is at .9762 in fielding.

Do explain to me how .0085 makes him shitty against the best fielder percentage wise of all time.

Fielding % isn't held in very high regard within the realm of more advanced defensive analysis because it only measures the success/error on balls that the player actually gets to (and ignores those he doesn't, and getting to the ball is an important part of defense); also, the success/error scoring often contains a lot of subjective noise. 

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Just now, Hank Chinaski said:

Fielding % isn't held in very high regard within the realm of more advanced defensive analysis because it only measures the success/error on balls that the player actually gets to (and ignores those he doesn't, and getting to the ball is an important part of defense); also, the success/error scoring often contains a lot of subjective noise. 

Bingo.  And that's where the joke I posted earlier comes from:

Q: What do you call a slow ground ball up the middle when Jeter is playing SS?

A: A single to center.

Not an error, but a play that Jeter was absolutely abysmal at making (to the point that he recognized it and worked on it more later in his career) COMPARED TO OTHER SHORTSTOPS.  

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If you wanted to understand, you could have read the article I linked instead of posting something as insipid as fielding percentage.  
I clicked on the longcat but didnt care enough to read it. Yall trying to figure out and argueing why he is terrible on defense is mind bottling. I also noted his lack of range. My entire point originally was his clutch play as a player. No douche shouldn't have not voted for him. And I hate the Yankees.

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Fielding % isn't held in very high regard within the realm of more advanced defensive analysis because it only measures the success/error on balls that the player actually gets to (and ignores those he doesn't, and getting to the ball is an important part of defense); also, the success/error scoring often contains a lot of subjective noise. 
Did you only read like the first 5 words of my post and not the part where I mentioned his lack of range? JC the ADHD is showing here.

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2 minutes ago, markstanco said:
14 minutes ago, Beau Vine said:
If you wanted to understand, you could have read the article I linked instead of posting something as insipid as fielding percentage.  

I clicked on the longcat but didnt care enough to read it. Yall trying to figure out and argueing why he is terrible on defense is mind bottling. I also noted his lack of range. My entire point originally was his clutch play as a player. No douche shouldn't have not voted for him. And I hate the Yankees.

I would have voted for him, and I think anyone who didn't is stupid.  However, you're charging in here with the absolute wrong reasons to vote for him.  He was a fantastic offensive player for a SS and a terrible defensive SS. 

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I would have voted for him, and I think anyone who didn't is stupid.  However, you're charging in here with the absolute wrong reasons to vote for him.  He was a fantastic offensive player for a SS and a terrible defensive SS. 
Calm TF down. I am on your side now, he was a massive liability on defense, he only got those gold gloves because of his name. Terrible fielder who cost them numerous titles.

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2 minutes ago, ss13 said:

Now that that’s settled, who voted for Brad fucking Penny?! 

Brad Penny had a hell of a lot better career than JJ Putz.

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1 minute ago, Beau Vine said:

Brad Penny had a hell of a lot better career than JJ Putz.

Was really just trying to change the subject. The bottom names are fun each year. 

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6 minutes ago, markstanco said:
20 minutes ago, Hank Chinaski said:
Fielding % isn't held in very high regard within the realm of more advanced defensive analysis because it only measures the success/error on balls that the player actually gets to (and ignores those he doesn't, and getting to the ball is an important part of defense); also, the success/error scoring often contains a lot of subjective noise. 

Did you only read like the first 5 words of my post and not the part where I mentioned his lack of range? JC the ADHD is showing here.

So you knew the answer but posed the question anyway?

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