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The Democratic Party


Hugo Stiglitz

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@FondrenRoad

Democrats have 2 more reconciliation bills (Oct 1, 2021 - Sept 30, 2022) and again Oct 1, 2022 through the new congress. 

$15 min wage still won’t meet the requirements to be included. Not even paired with credits for small business and penalties for big companies, Bernie tried that. 

The last min wage increase was attached to a defense Bill, not in reconciliation 

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13 minutes ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

Do you think the entire Republican Party would put a no on a single issue bill like that?  I would think the commercials would write themselves for ripping into any politician that refused to vote yes for a minimum wage increase.

Joe Biden getting the minimum wage raised to $15 would be an enormous legislative victory and the Republicans will obstruct it on that basis alone.  

Moreover, b/c the White House decided not to overrule the parliamentarian, it neutralizes the House’s ability to play hardball with the minimum wage issue. It would take an unattainable 60 senate votes to overrule the parliamentarian on the minimum wage issue.

The House is going to pass this watered down Senate bill in the name of expediency. 

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1 minute ago, David Dennison said:

And when the bill fails in the Senate, then what? Start over on a $1.9 trillion bill? 

OK.

Perhaps. Or perhaps the Senate's bluff finally gets called. 

The attitude you have here is the problem.  You are blaming the House for the Senate not doing something. The Senate is a failed institution, and the only way to even start to fix it is to hold it accountable. And popular bills like this are the best way to do that. 

The Senate will pass this bill if they know there is no alternative and if they actually take heat for it. 

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22 minutes ago, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

Do you think the entire Republican Party would put a no on a single issue bill like that?  I would think the commercials would write themselves for ripping into any politician that refused to vote yes for a minimum wage increase.

Exactly. Put their asses on the record!

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3 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Joe Biden getting the minimum wage raised to $15 would be an enormous legislative victory and the Republicans will obstruct it on that basis alone.  

Moreover, b/c the White House decided not to overrule the parliamentarian, it neutralizes the House’s ability to play hardball with the minimum wage issue. It would take an unattainable 60 senate votes to overrule the parliamentarian on the minimum wage issue.

The House is going to pass this watered down Senate bill in the name of expediency. 

Of course they are.  Dems always fold.  Its why the GOP always doubles down even with a shit hand. 

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2 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

Perhaps. Or perhaps the Senate's bluff finally gets called. 

The attitude you have here is the problem.  You are blaming the House for the Senate not doing something. The Senate is a failed institution, and the only way to even start to fix it is to hold it accountable. And popular bills like this are the best way to do that. 

The Senate will pass this bill if they know there is no alternative and if they actually take heat for it. 

Pretty sure Chuck Schumer and the White House were told in no uncertain terms that this bill would not pass if it included the minimum wage.

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3 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Pretty sure Chuck Schumer and the White House were told in no uncertain terms that this bill would not pass if it included the minimum wage.

Overruling the parliamentarian didn’t have 50 votes

The amendment didn’t have 50 votes

the bill with the non-passable amendment wouldn’t get 50 votes 

ThE sEnAtE sHoUlD jUsT pAsS iT

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Just now, David Dennison said:

Pretty sure Chuck Schumer and the White House were told in no uncertain terms that this bill would not pass if it included the minimum wage.

Probably, but the "no uncertain terms" are a bluff designed to make Chuck and the WH fold. And they did fold just like they always do.  Now imagine instead that the Senate was told this is the only bill they are going to get. "Not only does Manchin not want you West Virginians to have a fair wage, he also doesn't care about how you've been suffering economically during the pandemic." 

You know how often Mitch and Trump folded?  0 times. 

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2 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Overruling the parliamentarian didn’t have 50 votes

The amendment didn’t have 50 votes

the bill with the non-passable amendment wouldn’t get 50 votes 

ThE sEnAtE sHoUlD jUsT pAsS iT

I'm not disagreeing on the current state of affairs. What I am saying is that it is absolutely the fault of the Senate if this or any other covid relief bill doesn't pass. And you have already given the Senate a free pass on it. 

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2 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

Probably, but the "no uncertain terms" are a bluff designed to make Chuck and the WH fold. And they did fold just like they always do.  Now imagine instead that the Senate was told this is the only bill they are going to get. "Not only does Manchin not want you West Virginians to have a fair wage, he also doesn't care about how you've been suffering economically during the pandemic." 

You know how often Mitch and Trump folded?  0 times. 

But their signature piece of legislation died very publicly on the floor.

Do you want that to happen when people need help? They can start all over after a bill fails, but it takes time and that's one thing this relief package does not have.

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4 minutes ago, FondrenRoad said:

I'm not disagreeing on the current state of affairs. What I am saying is that it is absolutely the fault of the Senate if this or any other covid relief bill doesn't pass. And you have already given the Senate a free pass on it. 

If progressives don’t like the senate rules, they should stop blaming the senate and look at where we lost nail biting senate races in PA and WI in 2016 and FL and TX in 2018 and NC in 2020. And work to win races in PA/WI/NC in 2022. 

50 is the most precarious situation to be in, and more so when you have Joe Manchin as one of those 50

And without Manchin, you have Majority Leader McConnell and this bill never sees the light of day. 

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4 minutes ago, Chuckie Finster said:


Goodness. There’s been some wildly politically ignorant sentences typed on this website over the years, but this is up there.

When did they ever fold?  Mitch passed everything he wanted to and killed everything he didn't. He killed an impeachment twice.  Once he even voted no on removal and then immediately made a statement implicating Trump for the exact thing he voted no against. 

Mitch even still has his Senate team in lockstep.

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Just now, FondrenRoad said:

When did they ever fold?  Mitch passed everything he wanted to and killed everything he didn't. He killed an impeachment twice.  Once he even voted no on removal and then immediately made a statement implicating Trump fo the exact thing he voted no against. 

Mitch even still has his Senate team in lockstep.

They couldn’t even repeal the ACA with a 52-48 majority 

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1 minute ago, FondrenRoad said:

When did they ever fold?  Mitch passed everything he wanted to and killed everything he didn't. He killed an impeachment twice.  Once he even voted no on removal and then immediately made a statement implicating Trump fo the exact thing he voted no against. 

Mitch even still has his Senate team in lockstep.

https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2018/05/trump-almost-always-folds/560948/

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3 minutes ago, Chuckie Finster said:


Goodness. There’s been some wildly politically ignorant sentences typed on this website over the years, but this is up there.

While the statement isn’t accurate, it does illustrate how good Trump/McConnell were at creating the perception they never folded.  

Trump’s most infamous fold was when he couldn’t get border wall money out of Congress and shut down the government for months only to fold and then declared a national emergency to steal money from the military to build a border wall. 

Actually, the Obamacare fold might have been more infamous. 

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6 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

While the statement isn’t accurate, it does illustrate how good Trump/McConnell were at creating the perception they never folded.  

Trump’s most infamous fold was when he couldn’t get border wall money out of Congress and shut down the government for months only to fold and then declared a national emergency to steal money from the military to build a border wall. 

Actually, the Obamacare fold might have been more infamous. 

But both of those folds were actually to Mitch. So I guess I was inaccurate about Trump never folding. It was really just Mitch. 

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12 minutes ago, Js1 said:

If progressives don’t like the senate rules, they should stop blaming the senate and look at where we lost nail biting senate races in PA and WI in 2016 and FL and TX in 2018 and NC in 2020. And work to win races in PA/WI/NC in 2022. 

Joe Biden is the President, the democrats have majority in both houses and progressives had a lot to do with it.  John Ossoff, Stacey Abrams, and Raphael Warnock are not moderate democrats but they got it done in Deep South Georgia. Progressives can and should hold leadership accountable when they balk at the first sight of trouble. 

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all i have to say is fuck joe manchin. have some democratic integrity and some self pride. you're 73 fucking years old. yeah, you have a reelection in a reddish - purple state next year, but that means you'll be fucking 80 when the next election comes up. vote your spine, retire, if necessary, but goddamn, dude. have some pride.

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6 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

all i have to say is fuck joe manchin. have some democratic integrity and some self pride. you're 73 fucking years old. yeah, you have a reelection in a reddish - purple state next year, but that means you'll be fucking 80 when the next election comes up. vote your spine, retire, if necessary, but goddamn, dude. have some pride.


His term is up for re-election in 24.
 

6 other senators in safer seats than him spiked the minimum wage as well. They get my wrath more then him from me. I hope King, Shaheen, Carper, Sinema, Hassan and Coons all get primaried from the left and lose. 

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2 minutes ago, Firemans4Horn said:


His term is up for re-election in 24.
 

6 other senators in safer seats than him spiked the minimum wage as well. They get my wrath more then him from me. I hope King, Shaheen, Carper, Sinema, Hassan and Coons all get primaried from the left and lose. 

Cool, I also hope Biden loses his senate majority for 2 years of his first term and we get no judges or actual legislation!  That’ll show those darn republicans what’s what! 

Primarying a bunch of Dems over a procedural vote on an amendment to a COVID relief bill that wasn’t going to pass is super smart big brain politics.

Why not wait until an actual minimum wage bill comes down the pipe to be angry?  Senate Dems aren’t giving up on it as much as the internet says they definitely are. 

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Number of Senate Democrats who crossed the aisle to help the American people by supporting the $1.9T CARES Act in 2020 when Republicans held the White House: 47

 

Number of Senate Republicans who crossed the aisle to help the American people by supporting Biden’s $1.9T Covid bill in 2021 when Dems held the White House: 0

 

BUT UNITY!!! 

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4 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Cool, I also hope Biden loses his senate majority for 2 years of his first term and we get no judges or actual legislation!  That’ll show those darn republicans what’s what! 

Primarying a bunch of Dems over a procedural vote on an amendment to a COVID relief bill that wasn’t going to pass is super smart big brain politics.

Why not wait until an actual minimum wage bill comes down the pipe to be angry?  Senate Dems aren’t giving up on it as much as the internet says they definitely are. 


cool! The point remains there 6 people to be a lot more pissed at than a Dem from West Virginia. 

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1 minute ago, Welch said:

Number of Senate Democrats who crossed the aisle to help the American people by supporting the $1.9T CARES Act in 2020 when Republicans held the White House: 47

 

Number of Senate Republicans who crossed the aisle to help the American people by supporting Biden’s $1.9T Covid bill in 2021 when Dems held the White House: 0

 

BUT UNITY!!! 

And they had the audacity after the vote to blame democrats for not being bipartisan. Fuck ‘em to hell, your ire and rage should be with Republicans. 

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But both of those folds were actually to Mitch. So I guess I was inaccurate about Trump never folding. It was really just Mitch. 

Mitch simply didn’t bring anything to the floor that didn’t have the votes, thus never having a perception of folding. And apparently that is a very effective strategy.
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3 hours ago, David Dennison said:

War should be over the voting rights bill. That has to get passed or Democrats are screwed for the foreseeable future.

War should be waged on both fronts. There’s nothing radical or unreasonable about pushing for a minimum annual salary of 31,000 for full time workers.

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41 minutes ago, Satchel said:

War should be waged on both fronts. There’s nothing radical or unreasonable about pushing for a minimum annual salary of 31,000 for full time workers.

Outside of the next reconciliation, Biden isn’t getting anything of substance through the Senate without filibuster reform and that would be the case even if the Senate split was 55-45 democrat.

The good news is many Senators are already vocally calling to outright abolish the filibuster.  Manchin/Sinema/Feinstein can say they’ll defend the filibuster every day...until they don’t. Biden will likely need to take up that fight if he wants to get another legislative accomplishment. 

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5 minutes ago, Chuckie Finster said:

I understand Democrats have their issues, but allowing the opposing party to claim 100% credit for the most popular bill in decades seems like political malpractice.
 

 


(Yes I realize this tweet is an attempt to reduce that popularity, but it seems a bit late for that.)

 

Kinda wish Democrats would message the massive recovery bill wouldn’t have been necessary if the last administration hadn’t catastrophically fucked up the national response to the pandemic while the Republicans watched half a million Americans die.

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Kinda wish Democrats would message the massive recovery bill wouldn’t have been necessary if the last administration hadn’t catastrophically fucked up the national response to the pandemic while the Republicans watched half a million Americans die.

I think the country realizes this. I know it’s hard to reconcile with the reactions from the #alwaysonline crowd, but Biden is very popular right now considering the current polarity of the country. His handling of COVID is at 70%, including a near majority (44%) of *REPUBLICANS* and that will surely only go up once the checks arrive.
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1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Outside of the next reconciliation, Biden isn’t getting anything of substance through the Senate without filibuster reform and that would be the case even if the Senate split was 55-45 democrat.

The good news is many Senators are already vocally calling to outright abolish the filibuster.  Manchin/Sinema/Feinstein can say they’ll defend the filibuster every day...until they don’t. Biden will likely need to take up that fight if he wants to get another legislative accomplishment. 

They should be made to defend the racist origins of the filibuster and the harmful residue that remains from its still indefensible existence.

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This will be my last trolling of this thread unless someone engages me. I want to be the Texas government/politics guy, and not the hair-pulling we lost everything National guy.

The galactic speed some of y’all require for shit to get done is unreal. Spare the theatrics, get off the internet and drink a fuckin handle on your back porch while the sausage gets made.you got an hour and a half before the sun goes down 

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Murkowski along with every Alaska official will be put to the test with RCV(rank choice voting in Alaska). She is just as much a kingmaker as Chuck, or Manchin or Sinema or any Republican or Dem who can get some extra cash. Schumer and to a lesser extent McConnell don’t have “leadership” when it’s 50/50

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2 minutes ago, StassneyHorn said:

Murkowski along with every Alaska official will be put to the test with RCV(rank choice voting in Alaska). She is just as much a kingmaker as Chuck, or Manchin or Sinema or any Republican or Fem who can get some extra cash

Trump declared today they are going after her hard. 

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