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Yes: Pools are worth it....


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54 minutes ago, Landomatic said:

Yeah, I'm sure mine has an iron-clad contract and I'm just fucked either way.  Doesn't mean I can't try to apply pressure though.  This is the second pool I've used them for.  Also the last.

And yeah, it's fucked the industry, but as I mentioned in the last post, there are still ways to handle it right and this company is not handling it right.

That's unfortunate.  We make at least weekly calls to all no matter the stage.  Supply for gunite/shotcrete should be better going into 2021 (not that this helps you).  This has been a black swan year for most of the country and I'm plugged into all the major distributors, manufacturers and builders.  Be patient.  In 5-10 years you probably won't be grinding over the weeks delays from 2020.

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1 hour ago, Poolflood said:

In 5-10 years you probably won't be grinding over the weeks months delays from 2020.

Fixed it for me

And yeah, I know you're right, but this is beyond ridiculous.  Again, have a neighbor who was somehow magically able to get theirs done in much shorter time under the same covid conditions.  Not to mention a few guys on here.

And it's really just a combination of a lot of shit.  There are 3 major payments due and after the first 2 payments were made, we literally sat for over a month with no progress, nobody even showing up, both times.  Now tell me that's not them being squirly with the scheduling/financials.  That's just not operating in good faith, I don't give a fuck what the contract says.

And along with our back yard being torn to shit and completely unusable, our driveway is the same.  There is a giant pile of dirt and trash running just about the entire length of our driveway.  We have a car in the garage we can't even get out.

Our yard and most of the landscaping is pretty much all dead because we haven't had our sprinklers.  And sure, all of those inconveniences are to be expected and, this being my 3rd pool (second with this company), I know to expect some of that for a few weeks.  But this is SIX fucking months.  Our last pool was 21 days from dig to decking.

On top of taking forever, they have literally had to redo just about every phase because it's been done wrong.  Plumbing (hottub jets in the wrong place), coping (horribly mismatched cuts and irregular/inconsistent stone sizes), tile (wrong pattern in some places and they're on I can't even tell you what round of having to replace tiles that are missing), and now decking (installed the wrong color pavers).  So quality control is also slipping and I'm very concerned about how good of a product I'm getting.

Shit.  Show.  And I'm over it.

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30 minutes ago, Landomatic said:

Fixed it for me

And yeah, I know you're right, but this is beyond ridiculous.  Again, have a neighbor who was somehow magically able to get theirs done in much shorter time under the same covid conditions.  Not to mention a few guys on here.

And it's really just a combination of a lot of shit.  There are 3 major payments due and after the first 2 payments were made, we literally sat for over a month with no progress, nobody even showing up, both times.  Now tell me that's not them being squirly with the scheduling/financials.  That's just not operating in good faith, I don't give a fuck what the contract says.

And along with our back yard being torn to shit and completely unusable, our driveway is the same.  There is a giant pile of dirt and trash running just about the entire length of our driveway.  We have a car in the garage we can't even get out.

Our yard and most of the landscaping is pretty much all dead because we haven't had our sprinklers.  And sure, all of those inconveniences are to be expected and, this being my 3rd pool (second with this company), I know to expect some of that for a few weeks.  But this is SIX fucking months.  Our last pool was 21 days from dig to decking.

On top of taking forever, they have literally had to redo just about every phase because it's been done wrong.  Plumbing (hottub jets in the wrong place), coping (horribly mismatched cuts and irregular/inconsistent stone sizes), tile (wrong pattern in some places and they're on I can't even tell you what round of having to replace tiles that are missing), and now decking (installed the wrong color pavers).  So quality control is also slipping and I'm very concerned about how good of a product I'm getting.

Shit.  Show.  And I'm over it.

Yeah.  Sorry haven't kept up with your timeline... that's just not good at all.  Ask for lien release before you release plaster check.  Esp equipment,  plumbing, tile and coping and gunite.  

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56 minutes ago, Poolflood said:

Yeah.  Sorry haven't kept up with your timeline... that's just not good at all.  Ask for lien release before you release plaster check.  Esp equipment,  plumbing, tile and coping and gunite.  

What does that mean?  And what good would it do me?

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1 hour ago, Landomatic said:

What does that mean?  And what good would it do me?

If your pool builder has not paid his contractors/vendors they can put a lien on your property.  So, you're asking for his contractors to sign a document releasing your property from a future lien due to non payment.  They will happily sign if they are being paid.  Oh and in addition to above, also ask from deck contractor. 

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3 hours ago, Landomatic said:

Fixed it for me

And yeah, I know you're right, but this is beyond ridiculous.  Again, have a neighbor who was somehow magically able to get theirs done in much shorter time under the same covid conditions.  Not to mention a few guys on here.

And it's really just a combination of a lot of shit.  There are 3 major payments due and after the first 2 payments were made, we literally sat for over a month with no progress, nobody even showing up, both times.  Now tell me that's not them being squirly with the scheduling/financials.  That's just not operating in good faith, I don't give a fuck what the contract says.

And along with our back yard being torn to shit and completely unusable, our driveway is the same.  There is a giant pile of dirt and trash running just about the entire length of our driveway.  We have a car in the garage we can't even get out.

Our yard and most of the landscaping is pretty much all dead because we haven't had our sprinklers.  And sure, all of those inconveniences are to be expected and, this being my 3rd pool (second with this company), I know to expect some of that for a few weeks.  But this is SIX fucking months.  Our last pool was 21 days from dig to decking.

On top of taking forever, they have literally had to redo just about every phase because it's been done wrong.  Plumbing (hottub jets in the wrong place), coping (horribly mismatched cuts and irregular/inconsistent stone sizes), tile (wrong pattern in some places and they're on I can't even tell you what round of having to replace tiles that are missing), and now decking (installed the wrong color pavers).  So quality control is also slipping and I'm very concerned about how good of a product I'm getting.

Shit.  Show.  And I'm over it.

That sounds fucking terrible. 

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3 hours ago, Poolflood said:

If your pool builder has not paid his contractors/vendors they can put a lien on your property.  So, you're asking for his contractors to sign a document releasing your property from a future lien due to non payment.  They will happily sign if they are being paid.  Oh and in addition to above, also ask from deck contractor. 

Got it.  Might as well I guess.  It would have never crossed my mind, but you never know I guess.  Thanks for the advice.

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1 hour ago, Landomatic said:

Got it.  Might as well I guess.  It would have never crossed my mind, but you never know I guess.  Thanks for the advice.

Oh and you can push but I wouldn't worry.  Based on msg they aren't going to be a problem with payment.  Was concerned you were with a smaller guy that may be in cash crunch.

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took 36 hours, but finally got the pool filled with water over the weekend. buuuuut there was a good sized gouge on the spa bench that they needed to fix. apparently you can‚Äôt patch pebble bc they came and¬†chipped it all out this morning¬†ūü§∑ūüŹĹ‚Äć‚ôāÔłŹ

they also forgot the spotter tile things. the builder offered to chip out the entire pool and start over but fuck all that noise. i want them to just finish and gtfo. the sod is coming tmrw so the fucking plaster guys better get their shit done early. 

keep telling myself it’s almost over but not sure i really believe it. 

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How long did yalls digs take? On a week and a half here and probably 2/3 dug. Still have the deep end which is about where the jackhammer is resting on the ground.

Pure limestone. Not a shovel full of dirt to be found. At least I know the pool won't go anywhere.

Builder has been communicative and good so far. Fingers crossed.

6017d4f42c3ec39ef03e31a25fb8103e.jpg

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1 hour ago, BradInATX said:

How long did yalls digs take? On a week and a half here and probably 2/3 dug. Still have the deep end which is about where the jackhammer is resting on the ground.

Pure limestone. Not a shovel full of dirt to be found. At least I know the pool won't go anywhere.

Builder has been communicative and good so far. Fingers crossed.

 

 

Mine is a little bit smaller than yours but it took 2 weeks with 2 rain delay days half way through, so 8 full days of digging.  They had the form boards up and leveled around 3 sides of it from day one.  I guess they'll come back and re-layout the more precise edges at some point.

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1 hour ago, BradInATX said:

How long did yalls digs take? On a week and a half here and probably 2/3 dug. Still have the deep end which is about where the jackhammer is resting on the ground.

Pure limestone. Not a shovel full of dirt to be found. At least I know the pool won't go anywhere.

Builder has been communicative and good so far. Fingers crossed.
 

two days, but there’s no limestone in derkaville. 

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2 hours ago, BradInATX said:

How long did yalls digs take? On a week and a half here and probably 2/3 dug. Still have the deep end which is about where the jackhammer is resting on the ground.

Pure limestone. Not a shovel full of dirt to be found. At least I know the pool won't go anywhere.

Builder has been communicative and good so far. Fingers crossed.

6017d4f42c3ec39ef03e31a25fb8103e.jpg

Dang, that is some tough digging... Houston area, no rock... 18x38 took about 4 hours

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Half day on the 16x44, backhoe and a dump truck to move it to another spot on our property knocked it right out. Now I think I overpaid based on others having multi day dig times. Plain ole dirt was a big advantage although they did hit the old septic tank which slowed them down a little.

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3 hours ago, Brew said:

Half day on the 16x44, backhoe and a dump truck to move it to another spot on our property knocked it right out. Now I think I overpaid based on others having multi day dig times. Plain ole dirt was a big advantage although they did hit the old septic tank which slowed them down a little.

My builder told me that they price based on an average dig time, which for my area is about a week, and it all evens out in the end. So yeah, the easier digs I guess subsidize the tough digs a bit. The cost of the dig in all of the quotes we got from builders was pretty steep. They definitely knew what they were getting into out in my hood. 

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They just finished filling the pool at my new house yesterday. All that's left to do is some clean up work pressure washing all the tilework, and then getting the chemicals balanced and firing up the pumps. 

pool.jpg.f727f82ebe41ab256a0a5e0ac32d667d.jpg

I was genuinely shocked at how quick each part of the pool construction went. The only reason it took a while to complete was that pool guy often had to wait while my builder and the drainage contractor finished other tasks. 

I think if I add up the total time the pool builder's crew were on site and working, it probably came out to roughly 2 weeks or less of actual labor. And that's for a 16x32 pool, firepit and fair amount of tile decking. 

 

 

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Deck done Monday, cleanup done Tuesday.  Amazing how much shits getting done since I threatened to sue.  Nobody acknowledged it, but that’s fine by me as long as there is work being done.  Hate being that way, but clearly the squeaky wheel is getting the grease

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On 11/16/2020 at 6:54 PM, joe dirt said:

took 36 hours, but finally got the pool filled with water over the weekend. buuuuut there was a good sized gouge on the spa bench that they needed to fix. apparently you can‚Äôt patch pebble bc they came and¬†chipped it all out this morning¬†ūü§∑ūüŹĹ‚Äć‚ôāÔłŹ

they also forgot the spotter tile things. the builder offered to chip out the entire pool and start over but fuck all that noise. i want them to just finish and gtfo. the sod is coming tmrw so the fucking plaster guys better get their shit done early. 

keep telling myself it’s almost over but not sure i really believe it. 

Ugh man. ¬†I think you must be using the same builder as me. ¬†I‚Äôm dreading what all may¬†go wrong after¬†mine is ‚Äúfinished‚ÄĚ

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8 hours ago, joe dirt said:

the peeps at tfp seem a bit judgy toward those of us who don’t go with salt water generators. i’d rather not risk salt water eroding my decking since replacing water is a hell of a lot better than replacing travertine. 

Skip the salt water pool.  But do the borates.   Tfp will direct you to borax but I would recommend going to a local pool store and finding pH balanced version.  Just make sure that you balance your pH and alkalinity prior to adding.

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the peeps at tfp seem a bit judgy toward those of us who don’t go with salt water generators. i’d rather not risk salt water eroding my decking since replacing water is a hell of a lot better than replacing travertine. 

They also push liquid chlorine bleach. Their big issue is that pucks or sticks or powder chlorine add either CYA or calcium. If you don’t backwash often (and if you have a cartridge filter they are not backwashed) and replace water you will have problems.
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12 hours ago, joe dirt said:

the peeps at tfp seem a bit judgy toward those of us who don’t go with salt water generators. i’d rather not risk salt water eroding my decking since replacing water is a hell of a lot better than replacing travertine. 

Agree, although a "bit judgy" is putting it very mild. I wouldn't be surprised if they looked up your address and came and dumped algae in your pool. The other stuff on their site is good but the fact that it's run and managed by people selling you "testing" kits, chemicals, etc. makes their chemical judgement suspect to me, especially as SWG pools are falling out of favor more and more now.

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Thought I heard several pool builders won’t even do salt water pools anymore?  Our first one was salt and it tore up all the stonework around the fountains pretty bad, in just the first couple years.  Unless they’ve improved the technology substantially, I wouldn’t do another one.  Salt never even came up as an option on our current build.

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Thought I heard several pool builders won’t even do salt water pools anymore?  Our first one was salt and it tore up all the stonework around the fountains pretty bad, in just the first couple years.  Unless they’ve improved the technology substantially, I wouldn’t do another one.  Salt never even came up as an option on our current build.


What kind of stone? I’m doing SWG and have Oklahoma flagstone which was builders recommendation for SWG.

Getting close...supposed to get pebble next week.
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3 minutes ago, PantsTent said:

What kind of stone? I’m doing SWG and have Oklahoma flagstone which was builders recommendation for SWG.

Getting close...supposed to get pebble next week.

 

It's been a while, but lueders limestone sounds familiar.  Pretty much everywhere the fountains could blow or splash was really pitted in under 2 years.  The rest of the stone held up fine.  However, I was concerned that if a little blowing/splashing could do that much damage in under 2 years, what else was going to be fucked down the road.  Sold the house so don't care anymore.  I just know it scared me enough not to do it on our next two pools.

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1 hour ago, PantsTent said:

 


What kind of stone? I’m doing SWG and have Oklahoma flagstone which was builders recommendation for SWG.

Getting close...supposed to get pebble next week.

 

Seal it.  And seal it often.  And look for the clause in your contract that the builder isn't responsible when the flagstone turns to sand.

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1 hour ago, PantsTent said:

 


What kind of stone? I’m doing SWG and have Oklahoma flagstone which was builders recommendation for SWG.

Getting close...supposed to get pebble next week.

 

I had a SWG and travertine coping and decking and had no issues.  I sealed it every year and occasionally washed it down with fresh tap water.  I would not have another pool without a SWG.  I would choose the building materials around the SWG and avoid all sandstone.  With the SWG and the Polaris 280, I didn't need a pool man.  The only thing I had to buy was a bag of salt each year or so (only because of splash out and rain) and some muriatic acid every month or two--the SWG naturally causes pH to rise.  Whatever you do, add borates.  It makes the water feel and smell great and generally helps stabilize the chemistry of the pool.

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They finally "finished" my dig, three and a half weeks was the final count. Builder came out today to look at it.. and it's two feet short. So they're going to come out and fix it next week, supposedly. No big deal, builder was actually the one who caught it. So far so good with the company I chose. Communication has been good, honest, etc.

He said we're 9 weeks out on the gunnite, maybe a little sooner since it looks like their workload is slowing down some as we get towards EOY.  Glad I started when I did, hoping to have the pool done in late Feb/early March, but anything before end of April will be a win in my book. 

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Hose is in the pool and a little over half way full I'd say.  11.5 weeks from start of dig so not bad. But have to wait 3 weeks before heating hot tub for pebble to cure.

Still need fence repaired, Sundek surface on deck and existing patio, as well as a few other cleanup/details, and irrigation/lawn repair.  Shit, typing that out seems like a ways to go yet.

We took 2 months from "let's do it" to start of dig so add that as well.  Will be six months start to finish once the above is done.

 

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21 minutes ago, Poolflood said:

If you have lots of trees dropping leaves, it makes sense.  Otherwise spend money elsewhere.

Yes, I have a lot of trees.  This is a $6K bump.  I like the idea of the cleaning silt off the bottom that vacuums don't get would be nice but not worth that much

 

 

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2 minutes ago, TexasEd said:

Yes, I have a lot of trees.  This is a $6K bump.  I like the idea of the cleaning silt off the bottom that vacuums don't get would be nice but not worth that much

 

 

It's the leaves your paying to have cleaned.  6k isn't bad for an infloor.   All have a version of leaf catcher on the deck.  Make sure included.

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If you can't keep up with maintainance or don't want to those floor jets make sense to me. Salt water cell, floor jets, a robot and  you won't have to do much to it.

Got to sweep it a lot more in winter because no one is churning up the water, the jets would minimize that.

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On 12/6/2020 at 9:41 PM, billfromlaketravis said:

If you’re going to spring for the pool, you should add a hot tub/spa. Even in muggy Houston, a hot tub has value. 

This is the correct line of thought.  I just watched the Cowboys game from the spa tonight and it was fantastic.  I watched the game last night from the spa as well.  It will be money very well spent. 

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11 minutes ago, Hate said:

This is the correct line of thought.  I just watched the Cowboys game from the spa tonight and it was fantastic.  I watched the game last night from the spa as well.  It will be money very well spent. 

Your heat tolerance is impressive. When I have my tub at the highest temperature with the jets on, I have to bail after 30 minutes. 

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