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1 minute ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

My point was to illustrate the cost and consequences of doxxing people simply because their tweet was broadcast on cable news and you disagreed with them politically. 

Sure, but Bernie didn't dox him and neither did his campaign.

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9 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I don’t agree with my boss politically but that doesn’t mean I’m going to stop selling my labor to him.  I am still going to speak out online to promote my values.  Doing it anonymously protects me from my boss holding it against me.

Basically you would get fired for fucking off online all day during work hours.

11 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

Sure, but Bernie didn't dox him and neither did his campaign.

Okay, now show me where they’re condemning the practice? 

This is the bullshit people hate with Bernie and his campaign.  They take no accountability and demonstrate no moral leadership when their supporters cross a line to advance Bernie’s political campaign.  It’s a war for the Berners.  You’re either on their side or an enemy.  It’s not surprising though when your strategy is political revolution.

5 minutes ago, F250 said:

Basically you would get fired for fucking off online all day during work hours.

Let’s not muddy the waters here. 

Edited by Hugo Stiglitz

Just now, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Okay, now show me where they’re condemning the practice? 

16 hours ago

Quote

This is the bullshit people hate with Bernie and his campaign.  They take no accountability and demonstrate no moral leadership when their supporters cross a line to advance Bernie’s political campaign.

lol ok

Reality doesn't matter, Conspiracy Hugo is on a roll!!

 

 

 

Warren needs to win Iowa or she's done. The electability avalanche will crush her if she doesn't start with a win. I think her team knows that which is why she's spending a lot of resources there. 

13 minutes ago, Bruh Man said:

Warren needs to win Iowa or she's done. The electability avalanche will crush her if she doesn't start with a win. I think her team knows that which is why she's spending a lot of resources there. 

If she finishes second to Biden, why wouldn't it just narrow the race to the two of them going forward? 

13 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

16 hours ago

Well that's better than nothing but it looks like she's covering her ass after she put up a signal that could be easily misinterpreted to dox the guy.  

2 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

If she finishes second to Biden, why wouldn't it just narrow the race to the two of them going forward? 

Yeah 2nd in Iowa would be good for her. Especially if it’s a less than 5 point win for Biden. She should be able to gain momentum for New Hampshire since it’s her backyard. 

If anyone needs to win Iowa, it’s Joe. A loss would cripple him in terms of eLeCtAbiLiTy

3 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

If she finishes second to Biden, why wouldn't it just narrow the race to the two of them going forward? 

If Biden wins Iowa, he'll win New Hampshire & South Carolina too and that 2nd place finish in Iowa will mean nothing. People are itching for a reason to jump on the Warren train but they want to see her win first. 

NYT had an article about it today. 

 

2 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

If she finishes second to Biden, why wouldn't it just narrow the race to the two of them going forward? 

If Biden wins Iowa, it's all but over.  Warren's perceived weakness is proving she's electable among black voters.  Beating Biden and winning lily white Iowa destroys that perception and it would likely cause a fracturing of Biden's base, the black vote.  If Warren doesn't win Iowa, her battle is much tougher.

1 minute ago, Js1 said:

Yeah 2nd in Iowa would be good for her. Especially if it’s a less than 5 point win for Biden. She should be able to gain momentum for New Hampshire since it’s her backyard. 

If anyone needs to win Iowa, it’s Joe. A loss would cripple him in terms of eLeCtAbiLiTy

The northeast isn't really falling head over heels for Warren. She's down double digits in NH. A second place finish in Iowa will do little for her there. 

If Biden wins Iowa, it's all but over.  Warren's perceived weakness is proving she's electable among black voters.  Beating Biden and winning lily white Iowa destroys that perception and it would likely cause a fracturing of Biden's base, the black vote.  If Warren doesn't win Iowa, her battle is much tougher.
Wait, so winning lily white Iowa would destroy the perception that she's weak with black voters?
2 minutes ago, BradInATX said:
7 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:
If Biden wins Iowa, it's all but over.  Warren's perceived weakness is proving she's electable among black voters.  Beating Biden and winning lily white Iowa destroys that perception and it would likely cause a fracturing of Biden's base, the black vote.  If Warren doesn't win Iowa, her battle is much tougher.

Wait, so winning lily white Iowa would destroy the perception that she's weak with black voters?

Yeah that didn't make much sense to me either. Warren needs to not finish in 4th or 5th place in South Carolina where she's far behind.

8 minutes ago, Bruh Man said:

The northeast isn't really falling head over heels for Warren. She's down double digits in NH. A second place finish in Iowa will do little for her there. 

There’s high quality polling that she’s running tied for 2nd or close to it in NH. Right behind Bernie and not that far behind Joe. 

Edited by Js1

10 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

If Biden wins Iowa, it's all but over.  Warren's perceived weakness is proving she's electable among black voters.  Beating Biden and winning lily white Iowa destroys that perception and it would likely cause a fracturing of Biden's base, the black vote.  If Warren doesn't win Iowa, her battle is much tougher.

 

11 minutes ago, Bruh Man said:

If Biden wins Iowa, he'll win New Hampshire & South Carolina too and that 2nd place finish in Iowa will mean nothing. People are itching for a reason to jump on the Warren train but they want to see her win first. 

NYT had an article about it today. 

 

That analysis doesn't make sense to me in a race with so many contenders.   Harris, Sanders, and Buttigieg will all have significant support still by Iowa.   You're telling me that Warren beating all three of them wouldn't show, or at least improve the perception, that she's the strongest alternative to Biden for their supporters?  I don't buy it.

Edited by Mojo Hand

Yeah that didn't make much sense to me either. Warren needs to not finish in 4th or 5th place in South Carolina where she's far behind.

1 minute ago, BradInATX said:
6 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:
If Biden wins Iowa, it's all but over.  Warren's perceived weakness is proving she's electable among black voters.  Beating Biden and winning lily white Iowa destroys that perception and it would likely cause a fracturing of Biden's base, the black vote.  If Warren doesn't win Iowa, her battle is much tougher.

Wait, so winning lily white Iowa would destroy the perception that she's weak with black voters?

The data indicates the bulk of black voters value perceived electability over everything else.  They want the candidate that can for sure beat Trump.  If Biden can't beat Warren in white boy farm country, what leads anyone to believe he's the best option to defeat Trump?  This phenomenon occurred in 2008 with Hillary and Obama.  The black vote was with Hillary until Iowa because she was considered most electable.  Once Obama won Iowa the black vote went to him almost over night.  The black voting block is extremely risk-averse and powerful when it comes to choosing candidates, and for good reason. 

The data indicates the bulk of black voters value perceived electability over everything else.  They want the candidate that can for sure beat Trump.  If Biden can't beat Warren in white boy farm country, what leads anyone to believe he's the best option to defeat Trump?  This phenomenon occurred in 2008 with Hillary and Obama.  The black vote was with Hillary until Iowa because she was considered most electable.  Once Obama won Iowa the black vote went to him almost over night.  The black voting block is extremely risk-averse and powerful when it comes to choosing candidates, and for good reason. 
I feel like there might be other reasons why blacks rallied behind Obama..
Just now, BradInATX said:
2 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:
The data indicates the bulk of black voters value perceived electability over everything else.  They want the candidate that can for sure beat Trump.  If Biden can't beat Warren in white boy farm country, what leads anyone to believe he's the best option to defeat Trump?  This phenomenon occurred in 2008 with Hillary and Obama.  The black vote was with Hillary until Iowa because she was considered most electable.  Once Obama won Iowa the black vote went to him almost over night.  The black voting block is extremely risk-averse and powerful when it comes to choosing candidates, and for good reason. 

I feel like there might be other reasons why blacks rallied behind Obama..

giphy.gif

6 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

We're going to be stuck with grandpa Biden, aren't we?

Best house in a bad neighborhood

10 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

 

That analysis doesn't make sense to me in a race with so many contenders.   Harris, Sanders, and Buttigieg will all have significant support still by Iowa.   You're telling me that Warren beating all three of them wouldn't show, or at least improve the perception, that she's the strongest alternative to Biden for their supporters?  I don't buy it.

Sanders' people will not abandon him after one state. They are loyal to that man. Biden leads as the "second choice" for Harris and Pete's voters so he'd gain the most from an Iowa win. 

4 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

I feel like there might be other reasons why blacks rallied behind Obama..

Which is why I don't think a Warren victory in Iowa completely sinks Biden.  It will hurt his perceived chances against Trump though and that's really the only thing holding his campaign together. 

Super Tuesday is only 3 days after the South Carolina primary.  I think Warren would like to take Iowa which would give her a full month of momentum ahead of Super Tuesday but a close 2nd in Iowa and close 2nd in New Hampshire would be fine for Warren as long as the gap is closing and she wins some states on Super Tuesday like Minny, Colorado or Virginia, and Mass of course.  Eventually she'll need to break through and beat Biden somewhere but a close 2nd in Iowa shouldn't create panic.  A lot will depend on who's still in the race as well.  A lot of folks will drop out after Iowa/NH.  Warren in 2nd in a lot of preferred candidate polls.

 

5 minutes ago, Bruh Man said:

Sanders' people will not abandon him after one state. They are loyal to that man. Biden leads as the "second choice" for Harris and Pete's voters so he'd gain the most from an Iowa win. 

No, Warren has overtaken Biden as the second-choice candidate for both Harris and Buttigieg:

https://morningconsult.com/2020-democratic-primary/

And she has much more upside to grow on that by Iowa than Biden, IMO. 

45 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Well that's better than nothing but it looks like she's covering her ass after she put up a signal that could be easily misinterpreted to dox the guy.  

tenor.gif?itemid=9264828

5 minutes ago, Mojo Hand said:

No, Warren has overtaken Biden as the second-choice candidate for both Harris and Buttigieg:

https://morningconsult.com/2020-democratic-primary/

And she has much more upside to grow on that by Iowa than Biden, IMO. 

Morning consult are online-based only. WaPo/ABC News have an A+ rating from 538. Here's what they showed last month. 

8. (ASK IF LEANED DEMOCRAT AND PREFER/LEAN TOWARD CANDIDATE) After [NAMED CANDIDATE],
who would your second choice be? Which candidate would you lean toward as your second
choice?
 -- 7/1/19 ---
 Reg
 All voters
Joe Biden 23 20
Bernie Sanders 18 18
Elizabeth Warren 15 18
Kamala Harris 14 17
Pete Buttigieg 5 6
Beto O'Rourke 4 3
Cory Booker 3 3
Julian Castro 2 2
Andrew Yang 2 2
Amy Klobuchar 1 2
Bill de Blasio 1 *
Michael Bennet 1 *
John Delaney * *
Tulsi Gabbard * *
John Hickenlooper * *
Tim Ryan * *
Eric Swalwell * *
Kirsten Gillibrand * 0
Marianne Williamson * 0
Steve Bullock 0 0
Jay Inslee 0 0
Seth Moulton 0 0
Other 1 1
None of these 3 3
Would not vote 0 0
No opinion 6 5

 

3 minutes ago, Bruh Man said:

Morning consult are online-based only. WaPo/ABC News have an A+ rating from 538. Here's what they showed last month. 


8. (ASK IF LEANED DEMOCRAT AND PREFER/LEAN TOWARD CANDIDATE) After [NAMED CANDIDATE],
who would your second choice be? Which candidate would you lean toward as your second
choice?
 -- 7/1/19 ---
 Reg
 All voters
Joe Biden 23 20
Bernie Sanders 18 18
Elizabeth Warren 15 18
Kamala Harris 14 17
Pete Buttigieg 5 6
Beto O'Rourke 4 3
Cory Booker 3 3
Julian Castro 2 2
Andrew Yang 2 2
Amy Klobuchar 1 2
Bill de Blasio 1 *
Michael Bennet 1 *
John Delaney * *
Tulsi Gabbard * *
John Hickenlooper * *
Tim Ryan * *
Eric Swalwell * *
Kirsten Gillibrand * 0
Marianne Williamson * 0
Steve Bullock 0 0
Jay Inslee 0 0
Seth Moulton 0 0
Other 1 1
None of these 3 3
Would not vote 0 0
No opinion 6 5

 

Am I missing something or does this not say anything about who the second choice is specifically for Harris and Buttigieg voters? 

And Morning Consult is a legit poll with a respectable B- from 538.   You make it sound like the drudge internet poll. 

14 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

This would help explain why everyone is freaking. 

Lol this is so swingy I barely believe it. Didn’t this have Pete in first not that long ago? 

4 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Lol this is so swingy I barely believe it. Didn’t this have Pete in first not that long ago? 

Yeah, it has a low sample size (just under 700) but Pete was a real force not too long ago and Iowa is his demographic. 

Everyone is jumping to discredit it because Biden is so far behind but in my opinion, Biden is still too high. 

 

8 minutes ago, Js1 said:

Lol this is so swingy I barely believe it. Didn’t this have Pete in first not that long ago? 

I believe that one random poll with Buttigieg at 25% or whatever was involved with Crooked Media. 

Here are the changes in latest poll from previous numbers. 

 

15 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

I believe that one random poll with Buttigieg at 25% or whatever was involved with Crooked Media. 

Here are the changes in latest poll from previous numbers. 

 

A 16 point swing is....questionable. That’s ridiculous af. 

Just now, Js1 said:

A 16 point swing is....questionable. That’s ridiculous af. 

Well, it is over a 3 month period of time, and Warren has made some big gains in that time period. 

21 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

I believe that one random poll with Buttigieg at 25% or whatever was involved with Crooked Media. 

I also think it was from June

15 minutes ago, Js1 said:

A 16 point swing is....questionable. That’s ridiculous af. 

Yeah, but it can’t be completely off base. Warren invested the most organizational infrastructure in Iowa and she did it really early.  Since the last poll she’s had no major setbacks and she won both debates convincingly. 

1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I can't compete with the goalpost gif.  You got me. 

Brie didn't call for HW to be doxxed and opposed it openly when it happened.

But that doesn't fit your narrative, so you shift the goalposts.

Is there an award for this? Incredible. 

 

He doesn’t hit 40 in high quality polling? That’s.....well, bad. 

Top four Dems are basically statistically tied now too.  Bernie and Biden have to be getting at least two bonus points solely on name recognition alone.  

4 hours ago, BradInATX said:
4 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:
The data indicates the bulk of black voters value perceived electability over everything else.  They want the candidate that can for sure beat Trump.  If Biden can't beat Warren in white boy farm country, what leads anyone to believe he's the best option to defeat Trump?  This phenomenon occurred in 2008 with Hillary and Obama.  The black vote was with Hillary until Iowa because she was considered most electable.  Once Obama won Iowa the black vote went to him almost over night.  The black voting block is extremely risk-averse and powerful when it comes to choosing candidates, and for good reason. 

Read more  

I feel like there might be other reasons why blacks rallied behind Obama..

No.

Berners not happy with Nate and this take:

My hope is Biden drops off completely before Iowa and we get a more organic primary.  Because Biden is not even close to the best candidate available, like shouldn’t even be in the top five, it becomes more obvious by the day.  Booker, Klobuchar, and Gillibrand are better candidates than Biden. 

Edited by Hugo Stiglitz

The others need to find a way to get Biden in front of a microphone more often.

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