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Summer riots/protests damage & tactics documentation thread (no politics, please)

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1 hour ago, Brisketexan said:

We have managed to find the money for creating a massive prison industrial complex, to finance a multi-trillion dollar "war on drugs" that hasn't had any measurable effect, to bail out business and industries the benefit the wealthiest, to pave and repave the streets in the "nice" neighborhoods while spending nothing on the streets in the "not nice" neighborhoods, on creating the worlds largest and most expensive military by several orders of magnitude and have used it mostly to protect the interests of our richest industrialists, etc. etc. ad nauseum.

Our problem isn't lack of money.  It's allocation.

Oh, and to the extent that it IS lack of money....I'm happy to see my taxes go up to repair our busted social infrastructure.  Some years, I forego the nice vacation because I've gotta take care of some serious deferred maintenance -- roof, AC, etc.  So be it.  That's what responsible people, and responsible societies, do.

Joking aside, we are going to need to do better than the above. The above as an explanation and solution is a loser politically and personally. We gotta sell people on why it's in their best interest to pay a little bit more (notice I said "little bit" and not "lot bit"), and sell it better then the above because that dog won't hunt.

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2 minutes ago, Rougarou said:

We gotta sell people on why it's in their best interest to pay a little bit more

The day Washington becomes fiscally responsible, I'll support this. I won't hold my breath.

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13 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

The day Washington becomes fiscally responsible, I'll support this. I won't hold my breath.

Racial equality and social harmony are less important than some extremely vague concept of "fiscal responsibility".

Cool. :)

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39 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

The day Washington becomes fiscally responsible, I'll support this. I won't hold my breath.

We are so past that. Millennials hold 1.4 trillion in student loan debt which is more than the entire US had not too long ago. And the cost of living has gone up as well, leaving millennials without a clear path towards home ownership and good healthcare. And now millennials outnumber baby boomers. Further, more people receive money from government than the number of people who contribute. And not surprisingly, millennials are turning towards socialism as a path to prosperity as they are already highly reliant on the government.

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2 minutes ago, Bevo said:

We are so past that. Millennials hold 1.4 trillion in student loan debt which is more than the entire US had not too long ago. And the cost of living has gone up as well, leaving millennials without a clear path towards home ownership and good healthcare. And now millennials outnumber baby boomers. Further, more people receive money from government than the number of people who contribute. And not surprisingly, millennials are turning towards socialism as a path to prosperity as they are already highly reliant on the government.

I wonder what the break down of degrees are. Also funny enough is that I'm a small portion of that number, but decided to get out of it because of my lazyness. Yay being lazy. I'm probably better off doing trade work than put my life in the whole that is college loans.

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21 minutes ago, workswithseed said:

I wonder what the break down of degrees are. Also funny enough is that I'm a small portion of that number, but decided to get out of it because of my lazyness. Yay being lazy. I'm probably better off doing trade work than put my life in the whole that is college loans.

I have friends who are younger than I am who paid 50K per year undergrad plus grad student loans. Grad school alone was $60K alone in tuition for them and probably 20K in living expenses. So $80K for 4 years leaves $320K in debt and by the time they are able to pay, they owe close to $400K just in grad student loans. Those loans are at about 8% interest annually for graduate students so they have $32K a year in interest. If they do income based repayment, they could pay $2000 per month and have their principal grow each year. If government forgave 25K it wouldn't do a lick of good. The only thing that would help is to lower interest rates to 1% or so.

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2 minutes ago, Bevo said:

I have friends who are younger than I am who paid 50K per year undergrad plus grad student loans. Grad school alone was $60K alone in tuition for them and probably 20K in living expenses. So $80K for 4 years leaves $320K in debt and by the time they are able to pay, they owe close to $400K just in grad student loans. Those loans are at about 8% interest annually for graduate students so they have $32K a year in interest. If they do income based repayment, they could pay $2000 per month and have their principal grow each year. If government forgave 25K it wouldn't do a lick of good. The only thing that would help is to lower interest rates to 1% or so.

it is basically modern day indentured servitude.

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Just now, hayden_horn said:

it is basically modern day indentured servitude.

....and a giant poison pill for an economy that depends on consumer spending to drive growth.  When a huge chunk of the dollars today's college graduates earn don't go towards buying a house, or a car, or a vacation, or a new TV, or what have you, and instead are just sent to a bank, those dollars are taken out of the flow of consumer spending.

If yesterday's college grad getting a job for $75k meant that he had $30k to spend on consumer goods (and he did, a mere generation ago), juicing the economy, and today's grad with the same job only has $15k to spend on consumer goods, the economy gets a lot less juice from exactly the people who should be equipped to juice it the most.

Exhibit 11 jillion why we have broken systems.  But fuck it, the narrative is that millenials are lazy and shit, let's stick with that, and not just some cold hard numbers.

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4 hours ago, Rougarou said:

The thing that jumped out at me from reading this (h/t badteammate; https://www.gphistorical.org/mlk/mlkspeech/) is that this issue is an economic issue. 

You do know the entire point of the southern strategy was explicitly to reframe racial bias as economic issues right? Like it's explicitly the objective

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I think it'd be cool to have the government spend money responsibly. But imagine if we had the current degree of irresponsible government spending, but instead of grifting and corporate handouts it was on helping people.

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@workswithseedbe safe out there

https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/14/us/oregon-armed-checkpoints-wildfires-looting-trnd/index.html

Clackamas County Sheriff Craig Roberts said several people in the county, in efforts to "protect property," had been conducting armed checkpoints, stopping cars they didn't recognize.

"The first thing I'd ask them to do is please stop that," Roberts said during a Sunday news conference. "It is illegal to stop somebody at gunpoint."

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3 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

How about the President of the United States?  He did the same shit as the knuckle-dragging "sportsfans" you are excusing.  

He's a fucking moron and everyone in here is convicted of that fact.  Now what does that have to do with the opportunist looting and rioting you seem to excuse?

 

Orange man mean so I smash a window?

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Just now, 52-80 said:

Now what does that have to do with the opportunist looting and rioting you seem to excuse?

 

Orange man mean so I smash a window?

Care to cite where I said that opportunist looting is excused?   Nope?  Okay then.  Nice straw man, you beat the hell out of it.  Toto and Dorothy must be impressed.

Black people have protested peacefully and been told to STFU and worse, consistently and repeatedly, by many of the loudest and most powerful voices in the country.   We can argue the point, but it's just fucking silly to do so at this point.  It happened, and we all know it.

When you tell people that 1) the rule is "peaceful protests only," but when they peacefully protest, you tell them 2) "STFU you sonsabitches".....what would you expect the outcome of that process to be? 

The people who are angry enough about an issue to protest are told to shut up and fuck off.....how would you expect them to react to that messaging?  Let's set aside this exact issue, or that we're talking about black Americans.  Let's imagine these same people are Belarusian, they peacefully protest an important issue to them, and the people in power tell them to STFU and fuck off.  Human psychology tells us what about their likely reaction?

I'm just suggesting the following wacky idea: maybe, when black Americans spent decades telling us that we have a broken policing and justice system, we should have said "okay, we're listening" instead of "shut up and fuck off."  That might have saved everyone a lot of headaches and trouble.

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1 hour ago, hayden_horn said:

it is basically modern day indentured servitude.

 

1 hour ago, Bevo said:

I have friends who are younger than I am who paid 50K per year undergrad plus grad student loans. Grad school alone was $60K alone in tuition for them and probably 20K in living expenses. So $80K for 4 years leaves $320K in debt and by the time they are able to pay, they owe close to $400K just in grad student loans. Those loans are at about 8% interest annually for graduate students so they have $32K a year in interest. If they do income based repayment, they could pay $2000 per month and have their principal grow each year. If government forgave 25K it wouldn't do a lick of good. The only thing that would help is to lower interest rates to 1% or so.

But it's not, really. This is probably not the thread to get into it, but if you are taking on that sort of debt and doing it wisely, there is not only a path out of it, but up and above it. There is no reason a person with a good graduate degree as you have outlined above should not be able to have, at least a few years but probably much more, pulling in 250k-500k/year during their prime earning years if they (and don't miss the following because these three points are important) are a)wisely investing their education into forward-thinking and in demand knowledge/skills and disciplines are b)managing their careers correctly and c) get a little lucky.

If you aren't doing any of those three things, then, well...that's Showbiz America, baby!

Edited by Rougarou

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21 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Care to cite where I said that opportunist looting is excused?   Nope?  Okay then.  Nice straw man, you beat the hell out of it.  Toto and Dorothy must be impressed.

Black people have protested peacefully and been told to STFU and worse, consistently and repeatedly, by many of the loudest and most powerful voices in the country.   We can argue the point, but it's just fucking silly to do so at this point.  It happened, and we all know it.

When you tell people that 1) the rule is "peaceful protests only," but when they peacefully protest, you tell them 2) "STFU you sonsabitches".....what would you expect the outcome of that process to be? 

The people who are angry enough about an issue to protest are told to shut up and fuck off.....how would you expect them to react to that messaging?  Let's set aside this exact issue, or that we're talking about black Americans.  Let's imagine these same people are Belarusian, they peacefully protest an important issue to them, and the people in power tell them to STFU and fuck off.  Human psychology tells us what about their likely reaction?

I'm just suggesting the following wacky idea: maybe, when black Americans spent decades telling us that we have a broken policing and justice system, we should have said "okay, we're listening" instead of "shut up and fuck off."  That might have saved everyone a lot of headaches and trouble.

Keep going.  Keep your fingers plugged in your ears and cry foul.  What cogent message have been broadcast over these decades other than "there's 1 oppressed group because you're all racists"? That'll definitely work.  Why did the Rodney King incident make news?  Because Americans were uphauled, or because enjoyed seeing black men getting beat on TV?  

What skin color are the parties involved in the Belarusian conflict?  Maybe, just maybe, the unrest and strife there, and at every point in time and in everywhere in the world, including 1860s America, is more rooted in Class than it is in Race.  

And while there is significant overlap, coincidence is distinct from cause.  When lots of blacks wrestle with cops and lots of those blacks get shot, that's not a coincidence.  When lots of PCP hillbilly crackers wrestle with cops and lots of them get shot, that's not a coincidence.

There is a vicious cycle of poverty and drugs and broken households and crime and police run ins and ad infinitum.  It's a big problem in America with a big chunk of Americans of all colors hooked, including lots of blacks.

What might help? Education, better resource allocation, easing W.O.D., etc.

You know what doesn't help?  When a dude with a rap sheet and an outstanding warrant breaks terms of trespass so his associate (of the same skin color) calls the police, and he escalates he situation by fucking WRESTLING with the fucking police, and he gets shot.......

....you say "clearly because he's black and the rest of you are all racist", and then smash a Walgreens.

That probably doesn't help.  

I don't imagine that will help improve things for decades to come either.

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18 hours ago, 52-80 said:

If you want to talk non-fatal shootings, then bring up the numbers for non-fatal shootings.  I don't contend police shootings doesn't exist in America.  I contend they exist as a natural consequence of lots of run ins with lots of bad actors. 

Per FBI, there are 2000+ annual assaults on officers with firearms, and 1000+ assaults with knives or other cutting instruments.  There are 50 annual felonious deaths of officers, almost entirely by firearms. 

You know how many British, Irish, Australian, and New Zealand police died in action, in this ENTIRE DECADE combined?  10.

 

Shit doesn't happen in a vacuum.  But when you mix enough of the ingredients, it'll happen.  Sometimes unjustified (like Floyd).

As for Blake - are you certain of the facts?  what did you think would happen?  do you know whether the police were alerted of his outstanding warrants and trespassing?  whether he was armed when he was wrestling with the cops and whether or not he was still armed when he walked away? 

You know why stuff like this doesnt blow up in a place like Denmark?  because they never escalate to the point where its common for felons wrestling with cops, getting tased, and continue obstructing.

 

   First, you did not respond to my storytime that was in response to you. Tisk.

 

  Secondly, this post sounds as if you are excusing the obviously excessive force that police display on a daily basis as a result of dealing with a lot of bad actors. So my question to you, 52-80, is how many times have you been cuffed and tossed around by police? How many times have you been followed home or stopped without any violations? How many times have you been searched or your car searched?

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17 hours ago, 52-80 said:

 

Your placing the blame on police totalitarian is so disingenuous.  Is it too much to ask people not to bruise their fucking feelings and "cop" an attitude when they're caught breaking the fucking law?  Yes, we know the "many cops were kids who got bullied" trope (of which I am a subscriber), but don't tell me this bullshit doesn't run both ways.

Show me all these analyzed data and videos of totally unsolicited beatings? 

Black People are unruly and therefore must be punished.....

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17 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

200.gif

No man, he keeps repeating that. He does it again here.

 

12 hours ago, 52-80 said:

Keep going.  Keep your fingers plugged in your ears and cry foul.  What cogent message have been broadcast over these decades other than "there's 1 oppressed group because you're all racists"? That'll definitely work.  Why did the Rodney King incident make news?  Because Americans were uphauled, or because enjoyed seeing black men getting beat on TV?  

What skin color are the parties involved in the Belarusian conflict?  Maybe, just maybe, the unrest and strife there, and at every point in time and in everywhere in the world, including 1860s America, is more rooted in Class than it is in Race.  

And while there is significant overlap, coincidence is distinct from cause.  When lots of blacks wrestle with cops and lots of those blacks get shot, that's not a coincidence.  When lots of PCP hillbilly crackers wrestle with cops and lots of them get shot, that's not a coincidence.

There is a vicious cycle of poverty and drugs and broken households and crime and police run ins and ad infinitum.  It's a big problem in America with a big chunk of Americans of all colors hooked, including lots of blacks.

What might help? Education, better resource allocation, easing W.O.D., etc.

You know what doesn't help?  When a dude with a rap sheet and an outstanding warrant breaks terms of trespass so his associate (of the same skin color) calls the police, and he escalates he situation by fucking WRESTLING with the fucking police, and he gets shot.......

....you say "clearly because he's black and the rest of you are all racist", and then smash a Walgreens.

That probably doesn't help.  

I don't imagine that will help improve things for decades to come either.

   The Black People are unruly card has been the go to since the 1860's. It's been framed differently, but we all still recognize it.

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38 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

 

 

is how many times have you been cuffed and tossed around ? How many times have you been followed home ? 

We talking about shit hot chicks have done to folks ?

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2 minutes ago, ChickenSandwich said:

Black people should be allowed to assault the police while being arrested......

  Plenty of Black People get the same without assaulting police officers. All a Black Man needs to do is speak of for himself in order to receive the "Respect my Authoritie"

these-corgis-on-this-merry-go-round-is-a

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5 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

  Plenty of Black People get the same without assaulting police officers. All a Black Man needs to do is speak of for himself in order to receive the "Respect my Authoritie"

these-corgis-on-this-merry-go-round-is-a

Cops will deliver that response to anyone they perceive as lacking power or resources.  

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1 minute ago, alincoln said:

Cops will deliver that response to anyone they perceive as lacking power or resources.  

  Exactly, thus the story a couple pages back. When I was young and poor I got assaulted and profiled. Now that I have a little money I simply get profiled. It no longer comes with assault.

   I liken it to how servers in a restaurant treat a table of teenagers vs adults. The kids get the shitty service because what the fuck are they gonna do? Doesn't matter if they were good well behaved kids or not. They are kids, so they don't deserve my service or attention.

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I'm still curious why people who think that the problem is violence and guns think that America isn't as capable as other countries at addressing those issues.

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3 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

I'm still curious why people who think that the problem is violence and guns think that America isn't as capable as other countries at addressing those issues.

We can't even get people to wear a mask in Walmart... that might be why.

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13 hours ago, 52-80 said:

Keep going.  Keep your fingers plugged in your ears and cry foul.  What cogent message have been broadcast over these decades other than "there's 1 oppressed group because you're all racists"? That'll definitely work.  Why did the Rodney King incident make news?  Because Americans were uphauled, or because enjoyed seeing black men getting beat on TV?  

What skin color are the parties involved in the Belarusian conflict?  Maybe, just maybe, the unrest and strife there, and at every point in time and in everywhere in the world, including 1860s America, is more rooted in Class than it is in Race.  

And while there is significant overlap, coincidence is distinct from cause.  When lots of blacks wrestle with cops and lots of those blacks get shot, that's not a coincidence.  When lots of PCP hillbilly crackers wrestle with cops and lots of them get shot, that's not a coincidence.

There is a vicious cycle of poverty and drugs and broken households and crime and police run ins and ad infinitum.  It's a big problem in America with a big chunk of Americans of all colors hooked, including lots of blacks.

What might help? Education, better resource allocation, easing W.O.D., etc.

You know what doesn't help?  When a dude with a rap sheet and an outstanding warrant breaks terms of trespass so his associate (of the same skin color) calls the police, and he escalates he situation by fucking WRESTLING with the fucking police, and he gets shot.......

....you say "clearly because he's black and the rest of you are all racist", and then smash a Walgreens.

That probably doesn't help.  

I don't imagine that will help improve things for decades to come either.

When someone accuses you of presenting a straw man argument and follows it with a black/white, false cause fallacy......you might want to put them on ignore....

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42 minutes ago, Thatguy said:

   First, you did not respond to my storytime that was in response to you. Tisk.

 

  Secondly, this post sounds as if you are excusing the obviously excessive force that police display on a daily basis as a result of dealing with a lot of bad actors. So my question to you, 52-80, is how many times have you been cuffed and tossed around by police? How many times have you been followed home or stopped without any violations? How many times have you been searched or your car searched?

I asked to hear for your proposal of what should be done (e.g. reduce sentencing, stricter police hiring, etc).  You replied with a personal storytime. 

Story #1 was a shirtless shoeless person, in your words, "rummaging around" in a car.  When questioned, person rummaging had no ID.  Person's family .... not at home.  Person couldn't answer where family was.  You really expect any other person in that situation  to not have raised suspicion?  The gun being drawn was excessive.  But the resolution?  cop walked with you to a neighboring building to a family friend for identification.  If someone wanted to give you a hard time, you would've been at the stations hours waiting for official family.

Story #2 you were stopped and questioned.  Not sure how that equates to claims in here of people undeservedly being beaten and shot???  I assume you werent.  Moreover, what do you propose be done about it?

I've been pulled over on Lavaca, by 3 highway cruisers with flashing lights.  I was on a bicycle.  They issued me multiple tickets.  Excessive?  totally.  Was I tossed around?  No.  Im guessing not getting into a fight about it helped.  (tickets were later dismissed in court).  I've been cuffed, but not tossed around.  I wasn't armed or fighting a tazer.  Wild. 

My mom was once pulled over for the first and only time in her life.  At that time she barely spoke a lick of English.  Cop was the known asshole in our little town.  She was so nervous she left the car in drive, and it crept forward at all of 0.5mph while he was speaking to her, and he barked at her so damn loud it could've broken the window.  We didn't get shot though.  Do you suppose it was because he liked our particular brand of ethnicity, or because he didn't like it?

 

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Just now, Onboard 2.0 said:

We can't even get people to wear a mask in Walmart... that might be why.

I think you can chalk that up largely to the assault on information and the embrace of insane conspiracy theories by mainstream politicians and other leaders in the country. I think that that is demonstrably causing more violence but is also a problem (and largely causing a different type of violence) than the base level violence that is indicated by whatever stats 52-80 found.

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2 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

I think you can chalk that up largely to the assault on information and the embrace of insane conspiracy theories by mainstream politicians and other leaders in the country.

I think there is a LOT more mental illness in this country than we realize. People road raging/calling people racists/yelling at each other/anti-mask/destroying property/etc. are not healthy people. Media feeds this rage for views. Politicians exploit this rage for votes. Not sure how we get people to chill, but Facebook/Twitter/FoxNews/CNN need to go before any change can be made.

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Do you mean we need to dismantle the news media and social media before we can try doing whatever it is that other countries do to be better at the problem than we are, or do you mean that other countries have already done those things, or do you mean that there is something special and different about other countries (or special and different about the US) that makes us uniquely unable to work on this problem?

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10 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

I think you can chalk that up largely to the assault on information and the embrace of insane conspiracy theories by mainstream politicians and other leaders in the country. I think that that is demonstrably causing more violence but is also a problem (and largely causing a different type of violence) than the base level violence that is indicated by whatever stats 52-80 found.

That's a fair assessment, but just points out how we/some of us are so easily swayed by the fringe elements.

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When the APD beat up Antonio Buehler, everyone here roasted them for it.  Chief Acevedo might be a bigger public enemy here than is Bob Stoops.

When that white chick in Dallas accidentally shot up the black guy in his own apartment, everyone here roasted her for it.

When the Floyd video emerged, everyone here were outraged.

But suddenly, if an angroid bald WHITE manlet got shot because he was chasing down a kid and you dont mourn with his death, well apparently you're part of the 50% on the other side of the fence who are overnight racist cop-sympathizers.  That's apparently how this game works.

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22 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

Do you mean we need to dismantle the news media and social media before we can try doing whatever it is that other countries do to be better at the problem than we are, or do you mean that other countries have already done those things, or do you mean that there is something special and different about other countries (or special and different about the US) that makes us uniquely unable to work on this problem?

I don't think we can do anything about it--our first amendment covers it. But I believe we've reached a tipping point in humility. I fear that there's no turning back.

Perhaps we could create new legislation where social media is responsible as a publisher, but that's a slippery slope.

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30 minutes ago, 52-80 said:

When the APD beat up Antonio Buehler, everyone here roasted them for it.  Chief Acevedo might be a bigger public enemy here than is Bob Stoops.

When that white chick in Dallas accidentally shot up the black guy in his own apartment, everyone here roasted her for it.

When the Floyd video emerged, everyone here were outraged.

But suddenly, if an angroid bald WHITE manlet got shot because he was chasing down a kid and you dont mourn with his death, well apparently you're part of the 50% on the other side of the fence who are overnight racist cop-sympathizers.  That's apparently how this game works.

 

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13 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

I don't think we can do anything about it--our first amendment covers it. But I believe we've reached a tipping point in humility. I fear that there's no turning back.

Perhaps we could create new legislation where social media is responsible as a publisher, but that's a slippery slope.

So you think the underlying problem for why America has a violence and mental illness problem unique from other countries is freedom of press, religion, assembly, speech, and protest?

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6 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

 

response bingo:

 

(1) if he was black, they wouldve shot him to death 5 minutes earlier

(2) police started it all by threatening to tazer him

(3) why didnt they calm him down by talking to him gently

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1 hour ago, Cheeseweasel said:

I think there is a LOT more mental illness in this country than we realize. People road raging/calling people racists/yelling at each other/anti-mask/destroying property/etc. are not healthy people. Media feeds this rage for views. Politicians exploit this rage for votes. Not sure how we get people to chill, but Facebook/Twitter/FoxNews/CNN need to go before any change can be made.

It's funny that "calling people racists" is on this list but "actually being racist" isn't.

1 hour ago, 52-80 said:

But suddenly, if an angroid bald WHITE manlet got shot because he was chasing down a kid and you dont mourn with his death, well apparently you're part of the 50% on the other side of the fence who are overnight racist cop-sympathizers.  That's apparently how this game works.

False victimhood. This is not how it went down at all.

1 hour ago, 52-80 said:

response bingo:

 

(1) if he was black, they wouldve shot him to death 5 minutes earlier

(2) police started it all by threatening to tazer him

(3) why didnt they calm him down by talking to him gently

Again, just fabricating nonsense out of thin air to be outraged about.

Pathetic stuff.

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still not sure what it is about America in particular that a lot of the posters here think makes us uniquely incapable of decreasing violence and mental illness

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1 hour ago, Celery Man said:

So you think the underlying problem for why America has a violence and mental illness problem unique from other countries is freedom of press, religion, assembly, speech, and protest?

No. I believe it is timing. We are at a tipping point in our country. The spread between the top and the bottom is WAAAAAY too big. The bottom have nothing to lose and the top have too much money to care. Our middle class is nonexistent compared to 50 years ago. 

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2 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

still not sure what it is about America in particular that a lot of the posters here think makes us uniquely incapable of decreasing violence and mental illness

just look at badteammate as an example.  how can anyone possibly fix that mental illness?

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Just now, 52-80 said:

just look at badteammate as an example.  how can anyone possibly fix that mental illness?

you mentioned that the reason police kill so many people in this country is because we are more violent and have more guns than other countries. Lets set aside guns for a second, do you think there is a reason why America is more violent, and do you think there is a reason why we can't do anything about it (if that is what you believe), and what are those reasons?

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2 minutes ago, Celery Man said:

still not sure what it is about America in particular that a lot of the posters here think makes us uniquely incapable of decreasing violence and mental illness

Are you sure you're not sure?

*thujone-picture-of-gump-tapping-sumlin-portrait*

1 minute ago, Cheeseweasel said:

No. I believe it is timing. We are at a tipping point in our country. The spread between the top and the bottom is WAAAAAY too big. The bottom have nothing to lose and the top have too much money to care. Our middle class is nonexistent compared to 50 years ago. 

You make a good point, after all...

The history of all hitherto existing societyis the history of class struggles.

Freeman and slave, patrician and plebeian, lord and serf, guild-master and journeyman, in a word, oppressor and oppressed, stood in constant opposition to one another, carried on an uninterrupted, now hidden, now open fight, a fight that each time ended, either in a revolutionary reconstitution of society at large, or in the common ruin of the contending classes.

In the earlier epochs of history, we find almost everywhere a complicated arrangement of society into various orders, a manifold gradation of social rank. In ancient Rome we have patricians, knights, plebeians, slaves; in the Middle Ages, feudal lords, vassals, guild-masters, journeymen, apprentices, serfs; in almost all of these classes, again, subordinate gradations.

The modern bourgeois society that has sprouted from the ruins of feudal society has not done away with class antagonisms. It has but established new classes, new conditions of oppression, new forms of struggle in place of the old ones.

 

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3 minutes ago, Cheeseweasel said:

No. I believe it is timing. We are at a tipping point in our country. The spread between the top and the bottom is WAAAAAY too big. The bottom have nothing to lose and the top have too much money to care. Our middle class is nonexistent compared to 50 years ago. 

If it was simply timing, it seems like it would be a new problem. Although I think the gap between the haves and the have nots is a fine enough reason to believe that this country suffers from more violence than others. Do you think we are unable to do anything, societally, to address the issue?

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