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Saban and Bama

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6 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

I'm sorry your feelings are hurt because I didn't agree with you. The fact we are actually discussing this is so fucking knee jerk. They lost one fucking game this year. Big deal. Bama is going to be fine indefinitely. No different than crowning Bama the best team ever as Derka did after they beat OU. You aren't going to win every game.

How is Bama worse off than Clemson right now? Both have exactly the same resumes the last 4 years.

This is the same junk being discussed every time the Pats don't win it all. And they are just fine going forward.

Okay you're so certain here is a wager for you.

I'll wager there is no SEC team in the champ game next year. That obviously includes Bama.

If you accept we can determine the stakes.

Edited by BurntEyes

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46 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Ehhhh. This same narrative was talked about after Aggy beat Bama their first year in the SEC. Or when OU dominated Bama in 2013. And Clemson beating them in 2016. Then all is well when Bama wins it again the next year. Then when they lose again, this happens. Wash, rinse, repeat.

Losing 2 out of 3 years to the same team and in such devastating fashion this year seems different than those other events.  Clemson didn't have a talent that only comes around every 40 years for a program when doing it.  They also dominated on both sides of the ball and made Bama look confused and desperate, not merely outplayed.  Clemson is certainly no anomaly this year.  Bama ain't over but they've got a genuine peer dynasty building and the foundation Dabo has built actually looks more sustainable than what Saban has put together in Tuscaloosa in many respects.

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None of the players on the upcoming 2019 Bama squad knows what it’s like to lose a second time in the same college football season. Saban might not be done just yet.

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32 minutes ago, sushihorn said:

Losing 2 out of 3 years to the same team and in such devastating fashion this year seems different than those other events.  Clemson didn't have a talent that only comes around every 40 years for a program when doing it.  They also dominated on both sides of the ball and made Bama look confused and desperate, not merely outplayed.  Clemson is certainly no anomaly this year.  Bama ain't over but they've got a genuine peer dynasty building and the foundation Dabo has built actually looks more sustainable than what Saban has put together in Tuscaloosa in many respects.

Outliers happen. And let's not act like Bama didn't move the ball. They did. They just bogged down and had very questionable playcalling. They are going to be just fine. 

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38 minutes ago, sushihorn said:

Losing 2 out of 3 years to the same team and in such devastating fashion this year seems different than those other events.  Clemson didn't have a talent that only comes around every 40 years for a program when doing it.  They also dominated on both sides of the ball and made Bama look confused and desperate, not merely outplayed.  Clemson is certainly no anomaly this year.  Bama ain't over but they've got a genuine peer dynasty building and the foundation Dabo has built actually looks more sustainable than what Saban has put together in Tuscaloosa in many respects.

Losing 2 out of the last three years to the same team and in such devastating 24-6 fashion this time seems different than past events. Clemson has built up its talent but couldn’t overcome an underclassman sub at QB. Bama dominated both sides of the ball. Yada yada 2017 season version.

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10 minutes ago, Vic Mackey said:

Outliers happen. And let's not act like Bama didn't move the ball. They did. They just bogged down and had very questionable playcalling. They are going to be just fine. 

I see you're still running your trap but not taking my bet.

Same shit different thread.

You take a position contrary to the general consensus which is has a high probability. You don't back it with much in the way of sound logic. "they are going to be just fine" is not sound logic and please provide your  data on how well Bama moved the  ball in the Clemson game relative to the rest of their season.

Someone calls you on your bullshit and you flat out ignore it because you don't have the sack to actually back your contary opinion with anything other than your typical gross generalizations.

Take the bet or STFU and let the adults continue speaking.

Edited by BurntEyes

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1 hour ago, Magus Ossis said:

None of the players on the upcoming 2019 Bama squad knows what it’s like to lose a second time in the same college football season. Saban might not be done just yet.

I’m not saying he’s done, but the lack of stability in the staff will make it harder and harder. Clemson has stability where Bama does not. It’s one reason dynasties eventually fall. 

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1 hour ago, BurntEyes said:

You take a position contrary to the general consensus which is has a high probability. You don't back it with much in the way of sound logic. "they are going to be just fine" is not sound logic and please provide your  data on how well Bama moved the  ball in the Clemson game relative to the rest of their season.

This seems oddly beligirent.  You think there is general consensus that bama isn't going to be fine?  Clemson outgained them by 40 yards.

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Until he loses coaches for lateral moves or voluntary demotions, it’s a whole lot of reading into nothing.
And now he is.

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1 hour ago, Vic Mackey said:

They just bogged down and had very questionable playcalling

Amazing answer considering the OP 

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2 hours ago, sushihorn said:

Losing 2 out of 3 years to the same team and in such devastating fashion this year seems different than those other events.  Clemson didn't have a talent that only comes around every 40 years for a program when doing it.  They also dominated on both sides of the ball and made Bama look confused and desperate, not merely outplayed.  Clemson is certainly no anomaly this year.  Bama ain't over but they've got a genuine peer dynasty building and the foundation Dabo has built actually looks more sustainable than what Saban has put together in Tuscaloosa in many respects.

 

Yeah..... that team that showed up for Bama earlier this week vs Clemson didn't just lose, They Shit The Bed In All Three Phases.....

Will be interesting to see if Saban can get his 2019 Team to rise like a Phoenix from the ashes of that Clemson Beat Down.....

Edited by LTtxfan

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I know that I wish I could be pissed about not winning that 6th national title in the last 10-11 years, along with a couple of runner-ups.
Man I can only imagine what it must be like to have to deal with losing in that natty 2 out of 3 years, being in the playoffs every year and only having 2 additional trophies to show for it....man that really sucks.

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What none of us knows but is of paramount importance is how much Saban wants to keep winning. If he still has the fire, he has everything he needs at his disposal. He is not superhuman, but he understands football and running a team. The REC will keep him stocked with talent, and the AD will open the checkbook for any staff he needs. Like many who are highly successful at what they do, he is not inclined to make major changes to the processes the have led to that success. He has shown some ability to change, however. In the end, he is self-aware and capable enough to win if he desires. He has a better situation for winning before him than when he showed up.

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Bama was different this year.  They had times of complete lapses - see Citadel 1st half. Saban basically raised the white flag early in championship game.
Biggest thing for me though was the player demeanor on the sideline during the game. Players seems to realize they had no answer to Clemson, but also an expression of don't care.
The staff turnover will have to start hitting recruiting in next couple years.  They will still dominate, but I do think they have reached and passed their pinnacle.
So you are saying Bama didn't want to be there in Santa Clarabell. That because they would have rather been in the Sugar Bowl they didn't care and didn't bring their a game.

Makes sense. Sec sec sec.

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This seems oddly beligirent.  You think there is general consensus that bama isn't going to be fine?  Clemson outgained them by 40 yards.
Loser stat

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9 minutes ago, Magus Ossis said:

What none of us knows but is of paramount importance is how much Saban wants to keep winning. If he still has the fire, he has everything he needs at his disposal. He is not superhuman, but he understands football and running a team. The REC will keep him stocked with talent, and the AD will open the checkbook for any staff he needs. Like many who are highly successful at what they do, he is not inclined to make major changes to the processes the have led to that success. He has shown some ability to change, however. In the end, he is self-aware and capable enough to win if he desires. He has a better situation for winning before him than when he showed up.

He's also 67, although he looks to be in good health. He could be a guy that coaches until he drops (Paterno, Bear Bryant) or he could be a Royal or Grant Teaff, who quits and lives for decades. They got their ass kicked in the title game, and a lot of people that wanted to see Bama get humbled are enjoying it. Curious as to what the future holds. Saban and Belichick have always been weird, in that they never seem to get happy about winning. They get pissed about losing, but after a championship, they just move on to next year. Saban won't hang around if they don't keep winning at a high level. 

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41 minutes ago, MrPhlegm said:
18 hours ago, SDG said:
What do the Acc and Sec have in common?  
 
Hint; it’s an even number.  

Is it MULEDICK?

Close

Image result for dickbutt

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Only time will tell whether Monday night was a mutual watershed event like the 2010 BCS Rose Bowl.    Who could have seen that coming?  Texas was two Shipley catches away from tying up that game, whereas Bama was moidalized by Clemson.

Bama may bounce right back.  Or not.  It's taken until this season, but Texas is definitely back.  

Based on the last three games' seive defense and the exodus of coaches and players since, the Alabama mojo has taken a big hit.  Well, bad shit happens when you lose after being outplayed, outprepared and outcoached.  

We'll know about six or eight games into the fall if the downhill flow has been checked.  I'm just going to enjoy watching the pageantry and crazy bullshit of another season and not worry.  If Bama never wins another title with Nick, so be it.  I wouldn't bet against it.  

BTW, this is a fine board and you are all sick snd twisted little monkeys.

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14 minutes ago, Bama Llama said:

Only time will tell whether Monday night was a mutual watershed event like the 2010 BCS Rose Bowl.    Who could have seen that coming?  Texas was two Shipley catches away from tying up that game, whereas Bama was moidalized by Clemson.

Bama may bounce right back.  Or not.  It's taken until this season, but Texas is definitely back.  

Based on the last three games' seive defense and the exodus of coaches and players since, the Alabama mojo has taken a big hit.  Well, bad shit happens when you lose after being outplayed, outprepared and outcoached.  

We'll know about six or eight games into the fall if the downhill flow has been checked.  I'm just going to enjoy watching the pageantry and crazy bullshit of another season and not worry.  If Bama never wins another title with Nick, so be it.  I wouldn't bet against it.  

BTW, this is a fine board and you are all sick snd twisted little monkeys.

Blowouts happen in sports. Even to the top teams. It has just never really happened to Bama under Saban so everyone loses their mind when it does happen. The difference in college football, is you don't get many mulligans and every loss is magnified. Unlike the NFL, you can get blown out and move on the next week like nothing. Patriots were dominated a few times this year and they are still a 2 seed. This reminds me of back in 2014, the Pats were blown out by the Chiefs on MNF. And the narrative was that they were done. The dynasty was over. But then they went on to win 2 Super Bowls in 3 years. And another appearance last year. Bama is pretty much like the Pats. They won't win every season but they are going to be fine next season. And most likely back in the playoffs.

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1 hour ago, Richard Kimball said:

Saban and Belichick have always been weird, in that they never seem to get happy about winning. They get pissed about losing, but after a championship, they just move on to next year. Saban won't hang around if they don't keep winning at a high level. 

Watching Saban and Bama this season was different.  The pass defense was no where near Bama's standard.  Their offense seemed to pass more on 3rd downs than prior years which exposed Tua to more hits.  Saw a clip on ESPN where analyst made a funny comment that next year Bama's OL#73 is moving to DB because he was so good at backpedaling.

No doubt Saban might be able to get this Bama team to come back with a vengeance during 2019 season and win another Naty.  But Bama's Staff just got whipped by Clemson's Staff Monday.  After Clemson's 44-16 Beat Down, other SEC Teams probably fear Bama less.  Florida, Georgia, and LSU should all be better in 2019 so things aren't getting easier for Saban or Bama next year.

Edited by LTtxfan

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16 hours ago, Vic Mackey said:

Outliers happen. And let's not act like Bama didn't move the ball. They did. They just bogged down and had very questionable playcalling. They are going to be just fine. 

I wouldn't count Bama out as long as Saban is there and getting top 5 recruiting classes every year but I think from here on out its going to be harder. That game was the first real crack in the armor we've seen since he got the program rolling in 09. Plus now he has 6 rings and is closing in on 70. So he's just not going to bring the same fire and will to win every day that he has for the last 10 years. That all trickles down and will probably result in one year where they lose a couple games by 20+ points and Saban hears the rumblings from the fans and says fuck it and retires. Could be next year, could be 5 years from now but I bet he already mentally has one foot out the door. The rest of the sec just has to improve enough to push him through.

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4 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

Watching Saban and Bama this season was different.  The pass defense was no where near Bama's standard.  Their offense seemed to pass more on 3rd downs than prior years which exposed Tua to more hits.  Saw a clip on ESPN where analyst made a funny comment that next year Bama's OL#73 is moving to DB because he was so good at backpedaling.

No doubt Saban might be able to get this Bama team to come back with a vengeance during 2019 season and win another Naty.  But Bama's Staff just got whipped by Clemson's Staff Monday.  After Clemson's 44-16 Beat Down, other SEC Teams probably fear Bama less.  Florida, Georgia, and LSU should all be better in 2019 so things aren't getting easier for Saban or Bama next year.

aggy beat LSU, why dont u have aggy in that list, aggy is bestest and haz jimbo, (already haz trophy with date ready to be added)

/aggy sad

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He's also 67, although he looks to be in good health. He could be a guy that coaches until he drops (Paterno, Bear Bryant) or he could be a Royal or Grant Teaff, who quits and lives for decades. They got their ass kicked in the title game, and a lot of people that wanted to see Bama get humbled are enjoying it. Curious as to what the future holds. Saban and Belichick have always been weird, in that they never seem to get happy about winning. They get pissed about losing, but after a championship, they just move on to next year. Saban won't hang around if they don't keep winning at a high level. 
Royal DID NOT QUIT YOU GOATFUCKING COCKSUCKING SACK OF SHIT.

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29 minutes ago, MrPhlegm said:

Royal DID NOT QUIT YOU GOATFUCKING COCKSUCKING SACK OF SHIT.
 

I don't know about the rest of you, but I felt a lot of love in Phlegm's post.

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3 minutes ago, Surlybastard said:

Makes me wonder if Sark was told he could be the heir apparent there if he came back as oc.

Not a chance. 

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13 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

 

 

Responses to Russini Tweet:

While it's not yet clear what position Sarkisian would be taking at Alabama, Aaron Suttles of The Athletic doesn't believe he'll be the offensive coordinator again:

So...while Sark is a possible addition to Bama coaching staff..... Sark may not end up as the offensive coordinator

Edited by LTtxfan

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15 hours ago, MrPhlegm said:

Royal DID NOT QUIT YOU GOATFUCKING COCKSUCKING SACK OF SHIT.
 

Actually he did. It was very well documented in Jan Reid’s interview with Royal published 12/01/82 in TexasMonthly. It is in his own words, and he is very specific as to why he choose to call it quits at that time, even with a returning, and then healthy Earl. And where he was when he finally decided to to call it quits (Lubbock, in his hotel room). 

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Saban was the Houston Oilers DB coach for 1988 and 1989. No wonder those DBs like Bubba McDowell were so good. 

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22 minutes ago, NowThis said:

Saban was the Houston Oilers DB coach for 1988 and 1989. No wonder those DBs like Bubba McDowell were so good. 

Yeah during Bama practices, Saban works with DBs quite a bit.....

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On 1/11/2019 at 10:32 PM, sushihorn said:

the foundation Dabo has built actually looks more sustainable than what Saban has put together in Tuscaloosa in many respects.

Do what. Bama has been doing this since 2009. There's no way you can project what Clemson will be doing 7 years from now, given no other team has come remotely close to a 10 year run like Saban has had.

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On 1/12/2019 at 3:48 PM, Surlybastard said:

That game was the first real crack in the armor we've seen since he got the program rolling in 09.

They lost 3 games in 2010 and finish 4th not in the SEC, but in their division.

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1 hour ago, G650 said:

Do what. Bama has been doing this since 2009. There's no way you can project what Clemson will be doing 7 years from now, given no other team has come remotely close to a 10 year run like Saban has had.

The past isn't that relevant because things have changed in Tuscaloosa.  Clemson's model today looks more sustainable than current Bama.  As a matter of fact, this Clemson program looks much more like Saban's most dominant period than Alabama does now.  Saban had tremendous continuity on his staff for years; he now has huge staff turnover constantly.  Kirby was with him for 8-9 years.  Since then, it's 2 new guys in 3 years.  Kiffin was with him for 3 years.  Seems like a new OC every year now.  The staff continuity is all on Dabo's side.

Saban used to have very little serious competition for the top players in the SEC, which allowed him to dominate opponents on the talent front and give him a good chance to go undefeated in conference play.  That hasn't been true since Kirby took over in Athens.  He ended Saban's decade streak of #1 classes in a big way this year - pushing Bama down to #5.  Saban is back at #1 for 2019 but Georgia is now bringing in comparable talent, threatening Bama's recruiting dominance while LSU hangs out a half step lower.  Dabo has dominant talent in his conference now.  His classes are usually smaller so FSU looks close but with lower average talent and more signees.

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29 minutes ago, sushihorn said:

The past isn't that relevant because things have changed in Tuscaloosa.  Clemson's model today looks more sustainable than current Bama.  As a matter of fact, this Clemson program looks much more like Saban's most dominant period than Alabama does now.  Saban had tremendous continuity on his staff for years; he now has huge staff turnover constantly.  Kirby was with him for 8-9 years.  Since then, it's 2 new guys in 3 years.  Kiffin was with him for 3 years.  Seems like a new OC every year now.  The staff continuity is all on Dabo's side.

Saban used to have very little serious competition for the top players in the SEC, which allowed him to dominate opponents on the talent front and give him a good chance to go undefeated in conference play.  That hasn't been true since Kirby took over in Athens.  He ended Saban's decade streak of #1 classes in a big way this year - pushing Bama down to #5.  Saban is back at #1 for 2019 but Georgia is now bringing in comparable talent, threatening Bama's recruiting dominance while LSU hangs out a half step lower.  Dabo has dominant talent in his conference now.  His classes are usually smaller so FSU looks close but with lower average talent and more signees.

You are misinterpreting what I'm saying. I have no idea what Alabama is going to so from here on out. I'm saying the chances of Clemson having a ten year run like Alabama has just had is slim to none.

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2 minutes ago, G650 said:

You are misinterpreting what I'm saying. I have no idea what Alabama is going to so from here on out. I'm saying the chances of Clemson having a ten year run like Alabama has just had is slim to none.

And you're missing the point that the 10 year run is irrelevant because it was accomplished under very different conditions.

Today's Clemson program looks more sustainable than TODAY'S Alabama program to me and I gave you the reasons why I think that.  Feel free to refute them.

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On 1/12/2019 at 10:00 PM, Surlybastard said:

Makes me wonder if Sark was told he could be the heir apparent there if he came back as oc.

tenor.gif

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On 1/12/2019 at 10:05 AM, Bama Llama said:

Only time will tell whether Monday night was a mutual watershed event like the 2010 BCS Rose Bowl.    Who could have seen that coming?  Texas was two Shipley catches away from tying up that game, whereas Bama was moidalized by Clemson.

Bama may bounce right back.  Or not.  It's taken until this season, but Texas is definitely back.  

Based on the last three games' seive defense and the exodus of coaches and players since, the Alabama mojo has taken a big hit.  Well, bad shit happens when you lose after being outplayed, outprepared and outcoached.  

We'll know about six or eight games into the fall if the downhill flow has been checked.  I'm just going to enjoy watching the pageantry and crazy bullshit of another season and not worry.  If Bama never wins another title with Nick, so be it.  I wouldn't bet against it.  

BTW, this is a fine board and you are all sick snd twisted little monkeys.

I don’t know that I agree Texas is back. Recruiting is as uncertain as ever with significant misses on DL/OL and regular hard recruiting battles vs Bama just reload etc. 

i think coaching staff is still weak (Meh/Ware) and that while Texas gets up for big games, consecutive losses to Maryland still indicate potential issues. 

The Georgia win is great and I hope that it is a great springboard to being back but I’m not sure Texas truly is yet. 

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4 minutes ago, BrazilHorn said:

I don’t know that I agree Texas is back. Recruiting is as uncertain as ever

No, it isn't.

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http://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/25755578/alabama-coaching-departures-nick-saban-seeking-answers

Interesting info on Enos:  "If you're looking for a silver lining in Enos' departure, it's this: For as well-regarded a playcaller and developer of talent that he is, he has never run the style of offense Locksley did. And fitting a pro-style playcaller with a spread call sheet -- as we saw with Brian Daboll a year earlier -- can have its issues. Wherever Saban goes next for his offensive coordinator, he would do well to look for someone adept at using multiple receivers and the run-pass option game." 

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30 minutes ago, BrazilHorn said:

I don’t know that I agree Texas is back. Recruiting is as uncertain as ever with significant misses on DL/OL and regular hard recruiting battles vs Bama just reload etc. 

i think coaching staff is still weak (Meh/Ware) and that while Texas gets up for big games, consecutive losses to Maryland still indicate potential issues.

Look at the 2018 class.  Herman was able to RS both QBs, all the OL and (I think) 2 DL.  The true frosh DL that played in the Sugar made some solid contributions.  Ossai was a monster.  Coburn was more than solid.  Ojomo got some quality snaps to spell the big guys inside.  Outside the lines, freshmen made big marks at RB and DB.  2017 class produced a number of good players despite the unusually low ranking and small class size (17).  That gave us Sam, Cosmi, Kerstetter, Ta'Quon Graham, Gary Johnson and Josh Thompson as well as Brewer and Leitao - one of which will likely start at TE next year.  Pretty good hit rate (40%) from class that wasn't ranked high.  Talent identification, recruiting and development are not really on my list of concerns.

The staff embarrassed a solid UGa staff that had more talent to work with.  The same could be said for OU also.  It would be difficult for me to call that a weak staff.

Edited by sushihorn

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20 minutes ago, sushihorn said:

 

Look at the 2018 class.  Herman was able to RS both QBs, all the OL and (I think) 2 DL.  The true frosh DL that played in the Sugar made some solid contributions.  Ossai was a monster.  Coburn was more than solid.  Ojomo got some quality snaps to spell the big guys inside.  Outside the lines, freshmen made big marks at RB and DB.  2017 class produced a number of good players despite the unusually low ranking and small class size (17).  That gave us Sam, Cosmi, Kerstetter, Ta'Quon Graham, Gary Johnson and Josh Thompson as well as Brewer and Leitao - one of which will likely start at TE next year.  Pretty good hit rate (40%) from class that wasn't ranked high.  Talent identification, recruiting and development are not really on my list of concerns.

The staff embarrassed a solid UGa staff that had more talent to work with.  The same could be said for OU also.  It would be difficult for me to call that a weak staff.

I guess I’m looking at losses at major RB recruits, losses at OL\DL. Leitao hasn’t shown anything to date (hope he does). 

I’m just saying Texas isn’t at what I would call “back” level yet. Also I think the Texas staff has a lot of “minus” recruiters to make up for. Also losing to WVU,OSU lots of 4th qtr collapses isn’t “back”

moving in right direction I just think people are potentially over-stating where Texas is today. 

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