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Chilly Water

2018 Lawn and Landscape Thread

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Not really. You could stir in some compost if you want to but it's another expense. If anything I would top dress with peat moss after a month or so after the sod is down. A little phosphorus of some kind would be good for root development.

 

Peat moss has shown good results for suppressing Take all root rot. I'll see if I can dig up the study. It was conducted in the DFW area.

 

Quote

CONCLUSIONS There is no indication of varietal resistance to take-all root rot since the disease has been noted on all of the commercial St. Augustine grass varieties. The use of fungicide applications is also limited with only a few fungicides that are approved for use on this disease. Although there is good evidence that fungicides are capable of controlling the disease, environmental conditions and vigor of the turf may pose some limitations on the effectiveness of fungicide treatments. At this time we have no explanation as to why we observed a lack of uniformity in fungicide effectiveness on different lawns. The use of organic topdressing to control turf grass disease is a relatively new approach to controlling turf grass diseases. Because of the complexity of microbial antagonism, fertility values of topdressing materials, different types of diseases and susceptibility of pathogens to pH, most of this type of research is directed by trial and error experimentation. We do have good evidence that the acid peat moss topdressings result in control of TARR on St. Augustine grass on Dallas area home lawns. In comparison studies, peat moss topdressing reduced symptoms of TARR for longer periods than cow manure compost and is thus considered the more effective disease control product. Additional research will address the best time to apply peat moss topdressing products as well as possible effects on other turf grass pathogens and diseases.

PEATMOSS TOPDRESSING CONTROL OF TAKE-ALL ROOT ROT ON ST. AUGUSTINE GRASS

Edited by cactusflinthead
Peat explanation, study

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On 4/4/2018 at 9:18 AM, Damor said:

I have a new Zoysia (Palisades) lawn, ignorance, and a black thumb.  So many questions... BUT, I figured the best way to start was this:

What should I absolutely NOT do?  My greatest fear is putting something on it (weed killer, excess fertilizer, etc) that will kill or otherwise screw it up?  Remember, I'm a moron.

I have thought about this for a couple of days. It's a reversal of what is usually asked. What NOT to do? it required a bit of thought

1) don't mow it too tall. Thatch build up is a problem with zoysia. I shave mine at the house as low as the mower will go. Obviously if you're hitting high spots and dirt then you have to back it off some. 

2) don't drown it. Make the plant use the water you give it. Very few things like to sit in standing water all the time. Most shit dies when that happens. It is not going to kill it to let it get dry and then water the hell out of it. This means you get to play with the water for a while. Crank on the irrigation and see how long it takes to make it runoff or puddle. Learn how long it takes to get the turf a good soaking and then how long it takes to use that water. Use the manual setting for a bit until you know what it likes. There will be some areas that dry out faster than others and some that seem to stay wet forever. Get a cold beverage of your choice and spend some time playing in the water. 

3)Don't neglect to read the directions on the chemicals. I cannot harp on this enough. READ THE GOT DAM DIRECTIONS. /allcaps

 

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I had some of the Take All Root Rot on a patch last year and did some interwebz study to find the peat moss top dressing suggestion.  That did the trick....YMMV

Edited by Surly Bevo

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Unless you can keep the dogs out of the area it's a losing battle. Some sod staples will help to make the pieces stay put but they will pound the hell out of it.

Dogs aren't the only culprits. People will beat a cow trail where they want to go. Unless you exclude them with a fence they will make bricks like Moses in the mud pit.

Some bags of mulch might be the best investment.

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Thanks. I didn't even think about going with actual sod. I was thinking of trying Scott's Patch repair. Real grass makes more sense, though. I know I've seen the Houston Garden Center selling for $1/square last year.

And I will definitely fence it off to keep the dog out. No Idea why he likes that area so much.

Edited by Brothahorn

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It is going to be a lot like smoothing concrete with it this wet. Sorta smear it flat and stay off. Work back to front so you aren't stomping it down as you place it. A good sharp machete is an integral tool for laying sod. If you are doing a cut in around some object or the wall or whatever, the blade gives it a good clean cut. If you want the sod at grade with the rest of the turf you will have to dig it out with a mattock or square head shovel or combo of both. Sometimes you can fade it back into low spots and not have to haul dirt, but the odds are pretty good your hound has made a few craters around the place that you can fill with what you take out for the sod. Guaranteed there are places in Houston that sell nothing but sod. It's a lot like buying fresh seafood or something highly perishable. You want that stuff on the dirt and off the pallet as quickly as possible; straight from the farm to the seller. I don't want it sitting around the HD for a week before I take it home. 

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Just moved into our new home in Cypress Forest subdivision (west Kyle)  The front lawn came with 419 tifway.    I had to order 10 additional pallets for the back yard and install it myself (had a very specific budget)

So I'm 3 weeks into the backyard being installed and have been doing rotating waterings each day, no more than about 10 minutes per area.  Also have had two good rains on the yard since it was installed.  Every corner I've lifted up to check, I'm finding it rooting into the subsoil/black dirt.  

I'm planning on moving to watering only once a week now through the spring until the summer begins.  My question is - coming from a well kept SA lawn - when should I begin to fertilize and what would brand would you recommend?  When would be the best time to start mowing?

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Any suggestions for some seed to fill a very high shade area?  The area is under a couple oaks, and along my neighbors terraced hedge row.  Would like to throw somethign out there to make it less of a mud slick.  

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Don't do any pre on the new stuff until this fall at the earliest. Post is ok and recommended. 

There are several options for good quality fertilizer. The first round could be higher in phosphorus for root development. 

Site One is probably going to have the best price per pound. 

If you want to do liquid feed with the hose end sprayer and fish emulsion, kelp, and whatever else is on the organic shelf that's cool too. 

I like to get about 4 mowings before I fertilize. But, it can be booted up some if it is rooting out well. Go easy at first. Lower rates are ok.

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1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

Any suggestions for some seed to fill a very high shade area?  The area is under a couple oaks, and along my neighbors terraced hedge row.  Would like to throw somethign out there to make it less of a mud slick.  

Fescue is our best deep shade turf. It is going to take a few rounds of reseeding to get a dense stand. 

Some of the zoysia cultivars can withstand shade. They can get thin in a very deep shady spot. 

There's also the fuck it and mulch option. 

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On 4/5/2018 at 9:40 PM, cactusflinthead said:

I have thought about this for a couple of days. It's a reversal of what is usually asked. What NOT to do? it required a bit of thought

1) don't mow it too tall. Thatch build up is a problem with zoysia. I shave mine at the house as low as the mower will go. Obviously if you're hitting high spots and dirt then you have to back it off some. 

2) don't drown it. Make the plant use the water you give it. Very few things like to sit in standing water all the time. Most shit dies when that happens. It is not going to kill it to let it get dry and then water the hell out of it. This means you get to play with the water for a while. Crank on the irrigation and see how long it takes to make it runoff or puddle. Learn how long it takes to get the turf a good soaking and then how long it takes to use that water. Use the manual setting for a bit until you know what it likes. There will be some areas that dry out faster than others and some that seem to stay wet forever. Get a cold beverage of your choice and spend some time playing in the water. 

3)Don't neglect to read the directions on the chemicals. I cannot harp on this enough. READ THE GOT DAM DIRECTIONS. /allcaps

 

Thank you!

I watered the hell out of it at first like the installer recommended, and have backed off now, fortunately for my water bill.  As an aside, I put in one of the Hunter Hydrawise controllers based on advice from the old board (thanks to @Blain, I think), and I love it.

Are there any herbicides I should avoid on zoysia before I try to nuke the weeds that are already infiltrating?

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16 minutes ago, cactusflinthead said:

Fescue is our best deep shade turf. It is going to take a few rounds of reseeding to get a dense stand. 

Some of the zoysia cultivars can withstand shade. They can get thin in a very deep shady spot. 

There's also the fuck it and mulch option. 

Yeah, I am close "fuck it, put some stone or rock down" conclusion. 

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Have 2 big dogs and a back yard that is mostly dirt. Also is heavily shaded. Is there anyway something could grow out there or am I SOL?

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10 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Yeah, I am close "fuck it, put some stone or rock down" conclusion. 

There are a lot of shade loving plants if it's a visible area. Good strong survivors. Cast iron plants live up to their name.

Access area or hidden? Who cares! 

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@Damor nothing comes to mind at the moment. Standard reply is check the label. Guaranteed if it causes damage they are going to mention it on there. It might be buried in the middle of a tiny print paragraph of Faulknerian proportions but the liability is too great to leave it out. 

@Schnitty3

If you can keep the dogs out long enough to get a stand yeah maybe. Again if the goal is to eliminate the mud, mulch is an option. Fescue is not very traffic tolerant. Dwarf monkey grass will work, but you still have to keep them out until it's rooted out. I have put big ass rocks in an effort to keep them from digging up something. Sometimes it even works.

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I'm about to put down some Scott's fertilizer for San Augustine grass...  Today or tomorrow.

I try to use the rule of thumb of waiting until my 3rd mowing because by then the ground is warm enough.  This recent cold snap in Austin has me scratching my head though.

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3 hours ago, Schnitty3 said:

Have 2 big dogs and a back yard that is mostly dirt. Also is heavily shaded. Is there anyway something could grow out there or am I SOL?

I resodded my entire yard with St. A when I moved in. Two big dogs, two kids constantly running around, and none of the yard sees more than 1-2 hours of direct sunlight per day. If you keep it watered well enough to get established, you'll be mostly alright. The dogs are going to create paths and several dead spots where they lounge around, but most of the yard will hold up.

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Yesterday after work I put down a bag of Scott's Turf Builder southern weed & feed.  I have mostly san augustine grass with a mix of some bermuda in spots.  Watered this morning...

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Any recommendations for sprinkler service in Round Rock?  Adjustments, maybe raise a few heads.  Nothing fancy just dont want to deal with it myself.

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9 hours ago, RexWilson said:

Any recommendations for sprinkler service in Round Rock?  Adjustments, maybe raise a few heads.  Nothing fancy just dont want to deal with it myself.

I used these guys. Did something similar. They did a good job. 

http://www.austexsprinklers.com/

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Can anyone tell what type of trees these are? Can probably get close ups c68cb61af9613760a3ad2ae2cc924fdf.jpg

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On 4/11/2018 at 10:51 AM, cactusflinthead said:

Fescue is our best deep shade turf. It is going to take a few rounds of reseeding to get a dense stand. 

Some of the zoysia cultivars can withstand shade. They can get thin in a very deep shady spot. 

There's also the fuck it and mulch option. 

@Anastasis  What he said.  I have a shaded hill where my TIF419 won't grow that I seed with Fescue about 4 times a year.  Since it does not spread it doesn't invade my sunny lawn and because it is from seed I don't use pre-emergent in that area.

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3 hours ago, TXs said:

Can anyone tell what type of trees these are? Can probably get close ups c68cb61af9613760a3ad2ae2cc924fdf.jpg

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From that distance would be more of a guess than an identification and I know trees.  Left guess is Red Oak and right is better guess of live oak.

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From that distance would be more of a guess than an identification and I know trees.  Left guess is Red Oak and right is better guess of live oak.
Thanks, builder actually confirmed was a red oak and live oak. Good guess!

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I feel builders always plant new trees too close together.

No shit. I have two oaks maybe 10ft apart. I don’t get it. They do this for a living and HOA says I have to maintain two trees. So I either have to live with it, or relocate them a little further apart if water lines even allow it.

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I might pull back the curtain a little on the landscaper side of this equation. Here's a teaser, most of the time the crew installing it doesn't have a lot of choice in the matter. 

 

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A landscaper is constrained by the budget of the job, the requirements of the HOA and the city, and what the customer is willing to accept. 2-3 trees and some bushes of a very limited selection are what usually goes in. The flowers are whatever might be in season and most of the time they get chucked in the dirt with a dressing of mulch. There are a lot of yards that only get the front with sod and soil prep for that sod is limited to smoothing  out  the dirt somewhat. Not everyone has gotten the memo to plant a bit above grade. And a lot of them don't give a shit anyway. Unless you are hiring your own landscape crew to do the job on your place they are down the road and gone by the time you get in the house and they know it. 

There are many things I would do differently if I was in charge of selection and placement of the shrubs and trees. It irks me no less than you to see a fucked up landscape.

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I need help with my sprinklers

I have 2 zones that will not pop up properly. The other 4 work fine. It worked last summer, but now the heads don't pop up worth a shit.

Is there a way to trouble shoot this with out having to dig up my whole front yard?

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2 hours ago, TXLNGHRN10 said:

I need help with my sprinklers

I have 2 zones that will not pop up properly. The other 4 work fine. It worked last summer, but now the heads don't pop up worth a shit.

Is there a way to trouble shoot this with out having to dig up my whole front yard?

could you have a broken line or stuck valve in those zones?  That would reduce water pressure and not allow the heads to pop up.

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Getting some green up now.  Not thick yet but I've learned this is is a slow process to get it thick. Once the temps stay over 80 it will be on.  High traffic area close to my feet in this picture is the end of a sidewalk to the lawn where the dog traffic keeps it thin over the winter.  It should fill in.

 

20180416_083912_zpsov1fnnrh.jpg

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could you have a broken line or stuck valve in those zones?  That would reduce water pressure and not allow the heads to pop up.

Would that cause the next zone to not pop up?



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2 minutes ago, TXLNGHRN10 said:


Would that cause the next zone to not pop up?
 

Depends...

Anything reducing pressure to a section would cause that.  It could be before the zone or inside the zone.  Two most likely causes are broken lines and stuck valves.  When you are starting up after the winter is most likely time to find new issues.  With a diagram of your zones and valve placement you might be able to see if there is a common valve to the zones that don't work.

I'm not an expert but I think there are ways to manually open the valves so try that first.  If you think they are open start doing some leak detection work.  

Of course if your heads are bad fix those but since you said it was a several heads per zone it makes me think it is a pressure problem.

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If it is a leaky valve there is usually standing water. Leaky lateral lines or a head that isn't holding pressure is my bet. On the valves there is usually a bleeder screw or twisting the solenoid to turn them on manually. If you can get the valve zone to come on, start at the heads and look for damage, anything that would cause it to lose pressure. 

 

Leaking or broken lateral lines will usually blow out a spot or form a puddle too. 

Edited by cactusflinthead

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21 hours ago, TXLNGHRN10 said:


Would that cause the next zone to not pop up?



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My zones in my previous yard started doing this and it was just bad solenoids.  Just find the box where those all live and find the ones that dont test out on a multimeter.

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Looking for small trees for privacy fence. Anyone know what these are? The white bark with the Holly type berries is the serrated leaves. The darker bark (2nd pic) is the rounder leaf.d9b0f6753f04206f58bb60fcc8916c2e.jpgbde7095d7a20e942bd7c79e7c1fdd981.jpg41076b05374c58629863178b462a518e.jpg

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Edited by TXs

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On 4/16/2018 at 4:07 PM, TXLNGHRN10 said:

I need help with my sprinklers

I have zones that will not pop up properly.

Is this a euphemism?

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Has anyone ever dealt with a Dallisgrass invasion? It’s all over my side yard. Will Celsius work on it? I’m hoping to avoid Roundup as it seems like I would probably do a lot of damage to the St. Aug growing in.

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1 hour ago, TXs said:

Looking for small trees for privacy fence. Anyone know what these are? The white bark with the Holly type berries is the serrated leaves. The darker bark (2nd pic) is the rounder leaf.d9b0f6753f04206f58bb60fcc8916c2e.jpgbde7095d7a20e942bd7c79e7c1fdd981.jpg41076b05374c58629863178b462a518e.jpg

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Yaupon Holly (Ilex vomitoria) and Crepe Myrtle

 

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57 minutes ago, Chilly Water said:

Has anyone ever dealt with a Dallisgrass invasion? It’s all over my side yard. Will Celsius work on it? I’m hoping to avoid Roundup as it seems like I would probably do a lot of damage to the St. Aug growing in.

That stuff sucks.  I go out after a heavy rain or a good soaking from the sprinklers and pull it.

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So - after 3 weeks of having this sod installed, I'm really starting to regret not just paying the builder for the sprinkler system.  My uncle has run a turf grass and irrigation company for 30 years and told me it was a ripoff (hell even the sales guy told me it was a ripoff)

What sort of cost should I be expecting for a 2500 sq ft front yard and a 4500 sq ft backyard for parts and installation?  Lugging these sprinklers around is a pain in the ass.  Accidentally left my small soaker on all night last night in the front because I passed out drunk on the couch.  Not sure how much longer I can continue.

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