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87th Texas Legislature


StassneyHorn

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(Anyone responsible for education) may not:  (A)  require or make part of a course inculcation in the concept that:

(i)  one race or sex is inherently superior to another race or sex;

(ii)  an individual, by virtue of the individual's race or sex, is inherently racist, sexist, or oppressive, whether consciously or unconsciously;

(iii)  an individual should be discriminated against or receive adverse treatment solely or partly because of the individual's race or sex;

(iv)  an individual's moral character, standing, or worth is necessarily determined by the individual's race or sex;

(v)  an individual, by virtue of the individual's race or sex, bears responsibility for actions committed in the past by other members of the same race or sex;

(vi)  an individual should feel discomfort, guilt, anguish, or any other form of psychological distress on account of the individual's race or sex;

 (vii)  meritocracy or traits such as a hard work ethic are racist or sexist or were created by members of aparticular race to oppress members of another race;

 (viii)  the advent of slavery in the territory that is now the United States constituted the true founding of the United States; or

 (ix)  with respect to their relationship to American values, slavery and racism are anything other than deviations from, betrayals of, or failures to live up to the authentic founding principles of the United States, which include liberty and equality;

 (B)  teach, instruct, or train any administrator, teacher, or staff member of a state agency, school district, or open-enrollment charter school to adopt a concept listed under Paragraph (A); or (C)  require an understanding of the 1619 Project.

I can make an argument with this language every educator is in violation of this law. Overbroad is by one of many objections. Dumb.

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9 minutes ago, washparkhorn said:

(i)  one race or sex is inherently superior to another race or sex;

(ii)  an individual, by virtue of the individual's race or sex, is inherently racist, sexist, or oppressive, whether consciously or unconsciously;

(iii)  an individual should be discriminated against or receive adverse treatment solely or partly because of the individual's race or sex;

(iv)  an individual's moral character, standing, or worth is necessarily determined by the individual's race or sex;

(v)  an individual, by virtue of the individual's race or sex, bears responsibility for actions committed in the past by other members of the same race or sex;

(vi)  an individual should feel discomfort, guilt, anguish, or any other form of psychological distress on account of the individual's race or sex;

If an individual finds prohibiting teaching these things in public school offensive, it's better off for all of us that that individual resides in another state. 

Edited by Anastasis
depersonalized
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13 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

If an individual finds prohibiting teaching these things in public school offensive, it's better off for all of us that that individual resides in another state. 

Who is all of us

It is going to cost a shit-ton (and Texas does not have its own federal reserve) and educators will need to be trained. 

This appears to be socialism for lawyers with all the litigation that will commence. 

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1 minute ago, washparkhorn said:

Who is all of us

It is going to cost a shit-ton (and Texas does not have its own federal reserve) and educators will need to be trained. 

This appears to be socialism for lawyers with all the litigation that will commence. 

The residents of this state.

BuT iT WilL cOsT tOo mUCh tO tRaIn tHem NoT tO tEAcH tHat OnE rAcE iS NoT iHerEntLy SuPErioR tO aNy oThEr!

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It doesn’t matter what that stupid ass statute says, passing laws as to what can and cannot be taught by teachers in the classroom is stupid as shit and is full on Orwellian. Totally on brand for the Texas nazi Republican Party though. Ignore the grid and focus on complete bullshit.

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11 minutes ago, washparkhorn said:

The reputation of Texas will continue to suffer with them in charge. 

I'll be sure to tell that to my new neighbor that is in process of fucking up my TCAD appraisal next go around.  Maybe I should ask him if he has a problem prohibiting teaching children that one race is superior to another. At least I will be able to determine if he gets an invite to the next BBQ. 

Edited by Anastasis
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12 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

I'll be sure to tell that to my new neighbor that is in process of fucking up my TCAD appraisal next go around.  Maybe I should ask him if he has a problem prohibiting teaching children that one race is superior to another.

No one with any commonsense would teach a child that one race is superior to another. Read on. 

Edited by washparkhorn
cherry-picking is the term for the rhetorical device you deployed. The socratic method is far more effective for this type of discussion (if truth matters as a first principle).
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4 minutes ago, staboner said:

how's it going texas? i see. trying to get another black eye done eh?

The grid hasn’t collapsed again yet but wait until it hits a hundred degrees three days in a row then all bets are off. Because that never happens. 

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1 hour ago, Anastasis said:

This list?

I don't take issue with the bolded sections.  I take issue with the struck through bolded sections. The italicized bolded portions are concerning to me and I need more information to understand the legislative intent to draw a conclusion.  

 

                          (ix)  with respect to their relationship to

 American values, slavery and racism are anything other than

 deviations from, betrayals of, or failures to live up to the

 authentic founding principles of the United States, which include

 liberty and equality;

        

   

 

58 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

If an individual finds prohibiting teaching these things in public school offensive, it's better off for all of us that that individual resides in another state. 

I don't understand how ix can be enforced if we are going to continue to teach Article 1 Section 2 of the Constitution.  Or that many of our founders were slave owners.  Those things do not comport with the idea that those are deviations from the founding principles since it was the fucking founders that set it up that way.  So yeah, if you think I need to leave Texas for thinking that's some big giant bullshit, I've got to wonder what beliefs you are hiding behind the veneer you show us on this forum.  If I'm misunderstanding your point, then let's talk.   

Edited by NameAlreadyInUse
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1 minute ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

 

I don't understand how ix can be enforced if we are going to continue to teach Article 1 Section 2 of the Constitution.  Or that many of our founders were slave owners.  Those things do not comport with the idea that those are deviations from the founding principles since it was the fucking founders that set it up that way.  So yeah, if you think I need to leave Texas for thinking that's some big giant bullshit, I've got to wonder what beliefs you are hiding behind the veneer you show us on this forum.  If I'm misunderstanding your point, then let's talk.  If I understood it correctly you can go fuck yourself.  

And I'll call myself out, I skipped a section of your post and maybe the section I kept was bolded and italicized.  Until you clarify I'll edit out the go fuck yourself.

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5 minutes ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

 

I don't understand how ix can be enforced if we are going to continue to teach Article 1 Section 2 of the Constitution.  Or that many of our founders were slave owners.  Those things do not comport with the idea that those are deviations from the founding principles since it was the fucking founders that set it up that way.  So yeah, if you think I need to leave Texas for thinking that's some big giant bullshit, I've got to wonder what beliefs you are hiding behind the veneer you show us on this forum.  If I'm misunderstanding your point, then let's talk.   

You're referring to the sections that I bold italicized as potentially problematic, right?

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3 minutes ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

And I'll call myself out, I skipped a section of your post and maybe the section I kept was bolded and italicized.  Until you clarify I'll edit out the go fuck yourself.

Right, I already highlighted those sections as concerning. Taken at face value, they appear to promote an extremely superficial understanding of the history of slavery in the context of the founding of this country. Also concerning, nothing about genocide. 

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9 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Right, I already highlighted those sections as concerning. Taken at face value, they appear to promote an extremely superficial understanding of the history of slavery in the context of the founding of this country. Also concerning, nothing about genocide. 

I guess I'm not understanding your take, because you marked just as many things as bad or maybe bad as you marked as ok.  Seems weird you'd get so fired up about the good stuff that you took a love it or leave it stance, as if the bad and maybe bad parts could just be ignored.  That's what got my dander up on your earlier posts.  I'd love to better understand your thought process here.

Edited by NameAlreadyInUse
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8 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Also concerning, nothing about genocide. 

I am sure I misunderstand your post. The list is of things that shall not be taught. I can't imagine you want to prohibit teaching about genocide? Right?

I assume genocide is part of the list of subjects educators may or shall teach.

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I am seriously at a loss why the republicans/Nazis are worried about all this. But I think I might know. 
 

The (rich) white man owned the black slaves. It’s an indisputable fact. Why deny it?

The white man killed the red man and took over their land. Just look around you. It’s an indisputable fact. Why deny it? 
 

It’s not like Greg Abbott and his shithead supporters personally owned a bunch of slaves to pick the cotton or killed off a bunch of Indians to stake their claim. 
 

What this is is a bunch of manufactured nonsense designed to keep the RUBES down.  That’s all this is. And of course it’s working. 

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4 hours ago, washparkhorn said:

(Anyone responsible for education) may not:  (A)  require or make part of a course inculcation in the concept that:

(i)  one race or sex is inherently superior to another race or sex;

(iii)  an individual should be discriminated against or receive adverse treatment solely or partly because of the individual's race or sex;

(iv)  an individual's moral character, standing, or worth is necessarily determined by the individual's race or sex;

 (vii)  meritocracy or traits such as a hard work ethic are racist or sexist or were created by members of aparticular race to oppress members of another race;

 (ix)  with respect to their relationship to American values, slavery and racism are anything other than deviations from, betrayals of, or failures to live up to the authentic founding principles of the United States, which include liberty and equality;

4 hours ago, washparkhorn said:

I can make an argument with this language every educator is in violation of this law. Overbroad is by one of many objections. Dumb.

Teaching what Texas's leadership in the run-up to the Civil War put down on paper would probably get a history teacher thrown in jail, if Republicans had their way.

https://www.tsl.texas.gov/ref/abouttx/secession/2feb1861.html

Texas abandoned her separate national existence and consented to become one of the Confederated States to promote her welfare, insure domestic tranquility [sic] and secure more substantially the blessings of peace and liberty to her people. She was received into the confederacy with her own constitution, under the guarantee of the federal constitution and the compact of annexation, that she should enjoy these blessings. She was received as a commonwealth holding, maintaining and protecting the institution known as negro slavery--the servitude of the African to the white race within her limits--a relation that had existed from the first settlement of her wilderness by the white race, and which her people intended should exist in all future time. Her institutions and geographical position established the strongest ties between her and other slave-holding States of the confederacy. Those ties have been strengthened by association. But what has been the course of the government of the United States, and of the people and authorities of the non-slave-holding States, since our connection with them?

 

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5 hours ago, NameAlreadyInUse said:

I guess I'm not understanding your take, because you marked just as many things as bad or maybe bad as you marked as ok.  Seems weird you'd get so fired up about the good stuff that you took a love it or leave it stance, as if the bad and maybe bad parts could just be ignored.  That's what got my dander up on your earlier posts.  I'd love to better understand your thought process here.

I am not sure what is hard to understand.  My starting point was a statement that I wish we could try to do something more substantive, maybe actually discuss the text of the bill. I posted the full text of SB3.  I was asked about the prohibition section, and I then marked up the parts that I do and do not take issue with, and those parts that are concerning and require closer inspection. I am not sure why that resulted in you accusing me of duplicity and half ass retracting it when you saw your error, but here we are. I got not problem with you NAIU, just be less reactive. 

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5 hours ago, washparkhorn said:

I am sure I misunderstand your post. 

Stop playing stupid washpark. It is beneath your station. We've had enough interactions on various topics for you to develop a strong prior. And complaining about cherry picking in this exchange is chef's kiss. 

Edited by Anastasis
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21 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

I am not sure what is hard to understand.  My starting point was a statement that I wish we could try to do something more substantive, maybe actually discuss the text of the bill. I posted the full text of SB3.  I was asked about the prohibition section, and I then marked up the parts that I do and do not take issue with, and those parts that are concerning and require closer inspection. I am not sure why that resulted in you accusing me of duplicity and half ass retracting it when you saw your error, but here we are. I got not problem with you NAIU, just be less reactive. 

The text of the bill is irrelevant. The purpose of the bill is not.

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6 hours ago, JimmyJames said:

It doesn’t matter what that stupid ass statute says, passing laws as to what can and cannot be taught by teachers in the classroom is stupid as shit

 

Should we consider leaving the particulars of curriculum decision to the local control of the school districts?  I am inclined to think so.  If not the state lege, or the local school districts, who should be driving curriculum decisions in your opinion? 

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2 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

 

 

Should we consider leaving the particulars of curriculum decision to the local control of the school districts?  I am inclined to think so.  If not the state lege, or the local school districts, who should be driving curriculum decisions in your opinion? 

Teachers.

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23 minutes ago, StassneyHorn said:

Curriculum decisions at a local level will be just as political as they are at the SBOE

Agree, but as a parent I have a much greater ability to impact those decisions when they are made directly at the local level.  The further and further the decision making moves away, the harder that becomes. 

 

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27 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Anastasis gets excited sometimes.

Unlike GRUHorn he can be pretty entertaining and is smart regardless. 
 

I’d rate him a slight net positive for the board given his clear vaccine positions.  GRUHorn is a 99 percent net negative as a killing fools troll. 

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