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Posted
16 hours ago, Loch Ness Monster said:

Netanyahu is a legit psychopath. Asking him nicely to agree to a cease fire isn't gonna work. 

Have nothing against Israel but their current leader is evil and is not going to voluntarily stop in the name of peace.

The thing is, it isn't as easy imo as just Netanyahu is evil.  You can find all kinds of evil quotes and ideas through out government positions in Israel.  google searches, reddit, e.t.c.  And the big Israeli protest recently was for the right to rape Palestinian prisoners.  The settlers raiding homes have been doing this for decades now.  It isn't netanyahu personally sniping children.  Or sniping protestors in the past.  Sure there is absolutely some dissent about the actions of the Israeli government within Israel right now.  Most noticably many of the families of hostages who quite undertand that the actions being taken really have nothing to do with freeing hostages. 

But something about being a colonizing ethnostate goes beyond just one party or leader within that place.  

Posted
1 minute ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

The thing is, it isn't as easy imo as just Netanyahu is evil.  You can find all kinds of evil quotes and ideas through out government positions in Israel.  google searches, reddit, e.t.c.  And the big Israeli protest recently was for the right to rape Palestinian prisoners.  The settlers raiding homes have been doing this for decades now.  It isn't netanyahu personally sniping children.  Or sniping protestors in the past.  Sure there is absolutely some dissent about the actions of the Israeli government within Israel right now.  Most noticably many of the families of hostages who quite undertand that the actions being taken really have nothing to do with freeing hostages. 

But something about being a colonizing ethnostate goes beyond just one party or leader within that place.  

There's a growing opposition movement in Israel, even though it is brutally suppressed.

  • Like 1
Posted

Only tangentially related but there sure quite a few Palestinian hostages as well these days.  And they're being tortured and there's no real talk of why or of release.

Just now, chainsaw said:

There's a growing opposition movement in Israel, even though it is brutally suppressed.

yes

Posted
1 hour ago, chainsaw said:

There's a growing opposition movement in Israel, even though it is brutally suppressed.

On the other hand, the majority of Israelis polled didn't think the guy that raped Palestinians to death in a prison camp should have been tried, so just maybe their society is a bit sick.

  • Like 1
Posted
2 hours ago, Brian Fantana said:

On the other hand, the majority of Israelis polled didn't think the guy that raped Palestinians to death in a prison camp should have been tried, so just maybe their society is a bit sick.

No doubt about that. They are in desperate need of an awakening.

  • Like 1
Posted
26 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

Most aggression happens between neighbors. History and all that. Mongols did not invade the Aborigines.

And then there’s the creation of the state of Israel. 

Posted

Biden must summon the courage to use the considerable he has to force a cease fire. This won’t be precedent setting:

https://www.axios.com/2024/05/13/us-presidents-red-lines-israel

Other U.S. presidents have also threatened to withhold aid from Israel.

Dwight Eisenhower

During the Suez Crisis of the 1950s, then-President Dwight Eisenhower leveraged the threat of sanctions to convince Israel to withdraw from the Sinai Peninsula, per AP.

  • In 1953, the Eisenhower administration also temporarily delayed $26 million in funding to Israel over its construction of a hydroelectric project on the Jordan River.
  • Ronald Reagan

    Back in 1981, former President Ronald Reagan indefinitely delayed two shipments of F-16 fighter jets to Israel over the ''escalating level of violence'' in the Middle East.

  • The following year, the Reagan administration warned Congress that Israel might have violated its arms agreement with the U.S. by using American-made weapons during its invasion of Lebanon, the New York Times reported.
  • In 1983, Reagan reaffirmed that he would not send F-16 jets to Israel until Israel withdrew its forces from Lebanon. 
  • "While these forces are in the position of occupying another country that now has asked them to leave, we are forbidden by law to release those planes,' he said.

 

  • In 1992, the Bush administration threatened to withhold the delivery of $10 billion in loan guarantees to Israel if it continued building settlements in the occupied West Bank and Gaza, the Washington Post reported.

 

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Posted

All we have to do is enforce our own laws:

The Leahy Laws or Leahy amendments are U.S. human rights laws that prohibit the U.S. Department of State and Department of Defense from providing military assistance to foreign security force units that violate human rights with impunity. It is named after its principal sponsor, Senator Patrick Leahy (D-Vermont).

  • Like 1
Posted

We are about to reach the one year anniversary of the Israelis promising us they were going to get rid of Netanyahu.

I still remember the infographic of the IDF standing in front of the Israeli people as the shield as a gotcha moment, well for the past 10+ years they abandoned their people and are standing in front of Netanyahu.

The rot, the MAGA like rot. is the majority over there. A real friend would start witholding weapons and funds right about now.

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Posted
6 hours ago, linux said:

The rot, the MAGA like rot. is the majority over there. A real friend would start witholding weapons and funds right about now.

 

You don't withhold until their enemy is disarmed or agrees to peace.  It's not rocket science.  

 

 

 

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Posted

Make people suffer enough and they'll be willing to be subject to certain indignities in exchange for some peace. The natural instinct for self-preservation in some form or fashion makes it easy to understand why people would choose the less shitty option--not that everyday civilian Palestinians really have a choice. But, if the IDF's oppressive occupation of the West Bank and the history of Israeli settlers are guides, I could certainly understand why some would be reluctant, knowing that any right-wing Israeli government will take things too far and eventually prompt a future uprising.

image.thumb.png.b8460b2b71cdcf393b5e451795187cea.png

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/09/04/world/middleeast/gaza-war-cease-fire-israel.html

https://archive.is/wM9kk

Cease-fire talks in Gaza have stalled again, in part over Israel’s demand to retain a military presence in the territory, which Hamas and Egypt oppose. But the view among some Gazans on that point is less clear-cut.

Their lives have been devastated after almost a year of war and they say they find the idea of Israeli soldiers staying on — and of the checkpoints becoming permanent — disturbing. But if that helps bring an end to the war, it is a price they are willing to pay. Other Gazans expressed serious misgivings about allowing an Israeli military presence in Gaza, and some opposed it outright.

“Of course I do not accept the presence of checkpoints on our return to the north,” said Mohammad Qadoura, 40, who was displaced from his home in Gaza City.

“But if this would lead to the end of the war, I would reluctantly agree.”

Abdul Aziz Said, 33, a social worker from central Gaza, said that if an Israeli presence in the territory was “what it takes to end this war, I would totally agree.” He added, “I want this war to come to an end now and at any cost.”

Israel has said that the presence of its soldiers in Gaza after a permanent cease-fire is necessary to prevent Hamas from regrouping and weapons from being smuggled across the territory. In particular, Israel wants some Israeli troops to patrol part of the Egypt-Gaza border because it believes Egypt has not done enough to prevent Hamas from smuggling arms. And Israel believes that having Israeli troops within Gaza would aim to prevent Hamas fighters from going back en masse to regroup in the northern part of the enclave.

The latest high-level effort to reach a cease-fire agreement in Gaza ended on Aug. 25, with Israel and Hamas, the group that governs the enclave, remaining far apart on several critical issues. One of those, according to an American official who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss the sensitive negotiations, is whether Israeli forces will remain on the Gaza side of the border with Egypt, and if so, how many.

This has emerged as a crucial issue. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of Israel considers an Israeli military presence in the area, which Israel calls the Philadelphi Corridor and Egypt calls Salah Al Din, vital to preventing Hamas from rearming after the war or rebuilding tunnels to Egypt.

Hamas rejects a continued Israeli presence in the area and is demanding a complete Israeli withdrawal from Gaza. Egypt says that keeping Israeli troops in the Philadelphi Corridor would raise national security concerns and be unacceptable to the Egyptian public.

Additionally, Israeli forces have built a security road, which they call the Netzarim corridor, that cuts across Gaza from east to west. Israeli officials have said that they want troops to keep patrolling that road, through which Palestinians must travel between the north and south of Gaza. While the negotiators haggle over the terms of a cease-fire, nine Gazans said in interviews with The New York Times in recent days that they were mainly concerned about getting home safely after multiple displacements and months of relentless bombardment.

Israel operates a number of checkpoints across Gaza that are often mobile and temporary. Many Gazans say they fear that the checkpoints will become permanent or expand if a cease-fire deal is reached that includes the Israeli demands.

Hundreds of thousands of Palestinians have fled their homes after repeated Israeli evacuation orders and moved from the north to the south since the war began. For many, returning home could mean confronting Israeli troops and passing through the Netzarim corridor, where they could be subjected to searches, interrogations and arrest.

Even though growing numbers of Gazans appear to fault Hamas for its role in starting the war and helping to bring death and destruction upon them, they blame Israel first and foremost.

Mohamed al-Sek, 44, a teacher and father of four from Gaza City who was displaced to central Gaza, said that he was not concerned about passing through Israeli checkpoints or being searched.

He said that only those affiliated with Hamas should be worried. “My priority is to return to my home in Gaza City and restore my old life,” Mr. al-Sek said.

But Salah Gharbia, 57, who crossed a checkpoint across the Netzarim corridor while evacuating to central Gaza from Gaza City with his seven daughters without too much trouble a few months ago, said he was worried that other families with young sons could have a more difficult time at checkpoints “even if they are not Hamas.”

The continued presence of Israeli checkpoints in Gaza would just create “more obstacles and suffocating procedures for Palestinians,” he said.

But not all Gazans were able to stomach the idea of Israel’s presence after the war ends.

“Arrests and oppression will continue,” Faten Alyan, 40, a housewife from northern Gaza, said of having Israeli troops and checkpoints in Gaza after the war. “The brutality of the occupation will confront us in a humiliating way.”

Nedaa Adel, 27, a therapist from Gaza City who was displaced to central Gaza, said she worried that Israeli troops could arrest her husband at checkpoints because she said he worked for the Hamas government but was not a militant.

“I want this war to end now, but not with this condition,” Ms. Adel said.

Najlaa al-Ghalayiny, 44, a social activist from Gaza City who now lives in a tent in an area Israel has designated a humanitarian zone after multiple displacements, said it would be difficult for Palestinians to accept the regular sight of Israeli soldiers near their homes.

A prolonged Israeli presence in Gaza “might be the first step of reoccupying” it, she added, referring to the years before Israel withdrew its decades-long military presence on the ground from Gaza in 2005.

Fadel al-Tatar, 47, said he believed that Israel wanted to “place its authority on Gaza,” in a similar way to what it had done in the occupied West Bank, where Israeli checkpoints and settlements are widespread.

“I am afraid of having more checkpoints in the future that will divide the Gaza Strip into pieces,” he added.

Still, Mr. al-Tatar said that if a cease-fire deal was reached, he would go back to his home in the north “without caring about the procedures the army can place.”

He said that many others would also do the same, “leaving behind their makeshift tents and painful memories.”

 

 

Posted
5 hours ago, PRONG HORN said:

 

You don't withhold until their enemy is disarmed or agrees to peace.  It's not rocket science.  

 

 

 

Lol we are 20+ years on that strategy, they don't want Hamas to disarm because peace is a threat to their power.

Real friends withold money from their junkie friends.

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Posted
1 hour ago, linux said:

Lol we are 20+ years on that strategy, they don't want Hamas to disarm because peace is a threat to their power.

Real friends withold money from their junkie friends.

Ding ding ding.

Bibi helped create the monster, then holds on to power with a promise of "you need me to protect you from the monster."  Then, when the monster does....what monsters do....says "now you REALLY need me.  And also, let's kill all those people there."

Quote

According to various reports, Netanyahu made a similar point at a Likud faction meeting in early 2019, when he was quoted as saying that those who oppose a Palestinian state should support the transfer of funds to Gaza, because maintaining the separation between the Palestinian Authority in the West Bank and Hamas in Gaza would prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state.

Israel continues to give the arsonists the task of putting out the fire they helped set.  Fucking insanity.

Posted
8 hours ago, PRONG HORN said:

 

You don't withhold until their enemy is disarmed or agrees to peace.  It's not rocket science.  

 

 

 

Would this require Bibi to no longer fund the activities of Hamas in order to keep his foil viable?

Posted
On 9/1/2024 at 10:30 AM, InkaUtexas said:

Most aggression happens between neighbors. History and all that. Mongols did not invade the Aborigines.

 

On 9/1/2024 at 10:57 AM, WhatTheBuck said:

And then there’s the creation of the state of Israel. 

 

On 9/1/2024 at 11:37 AM, InkaUtexas said:

Um, yeah, that is the point. Neighbors usually attack neighbors.

hall of fame game missed the point GIF

  • Like 1
Posted
2 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Ding ding ding.

Bibi helped create the monster, then holds on to power with a promise of "you need me to protect you from the monster."  Then, when the monster does....what monsters do....says "now you REALLY need me.  And also, let's kill all those people there."

Israel continues to give the arsonists the task of putting out the fire they helped set.  Fucking insanity.

So, just a week after Hamas popped caps into the heads of defenseless hostages, because they would rather they be dead, than lost to them as barter to get murderers out of captivity, we’re going to criticize Israel for not managing the Hamas relationship better. Because, if Israel had used the period of relative inactivity by Hamas to turn the screws on Gaza, all of Israel’s critics would have understood. 
 
I guess no one else sees a disconnect between criticizing Israel/Likud/Netanyahu for trying to live with Hamas pre-Oct 7, and criticizing Israel for not agreeing to a cease fire that will require them to live with Hamas going forward?

The cease fire is a myth. Israel won’t agree to one that allows Hamas to exist- that would be a surrender for Israel and a victory for Hamas. Hamas won’t agree to a cease fire that doesn’t guarantee their survival. Israel plays along to satisfy its (dwindling) western allies. Hamas plays along to satisfy Qatar and Egypt. Neither side will give. I suppose Israel could change governments, and the new one could make a deal and let the old one get tagged for the blame…of trading over a thousand murderers for a couple dozen surviving hostages, which seems like a really awful agreement. (Sinwar is free today because he was released in a similar deal before). 
 
I get that family members of hostages want any deal, no matter how bad, if it gets their loved ones back. It has to be agonizing, knowing that the hostages are being abused, tortured and killed, with no one in Hamas particularly invested in them living. They have to realize, at some level, that all these ceased negotiations are just a show. 

Posted
20 minutes ago, statsman said:

So, just a week after Hamas popped caps into the heads of defenseless hostages, because they would rather they be dead, than lost to them as barter to get murderers out of captivity, we’re going to criticize Israel for not managing the Hamas relationship better.

Oh, that criticism pre-dates the SHIT out of Hamas' latest act of evil criminality.  It goes all the way back to willingly and knowingly allowing Hamas to arm up, having advance knowledge of their planned attack, and letting it happen to provide political advantage and a pretext to do what Likud has wanted to do all along: ethnically cleanse Gaza and make it fully Israeli territory again.

Bibi and Likud weren't being nice to Gaza -- they were playing them up as a foil against the PA (who, at all costs, Bibi and Likud had to keep from having any path to becoming a legitimate government of what might become an actual Palestinian State).  Bibi and Likud bolstered Hamas (including allowing funding and resulting arming) in order to prevent, at all costs, a Palestinian State.  Their strategy cost a shitload of Israeli and other lives on October 7th.  And, in return, we are rewarding them with exactly what they've always wanted: brutal elimination of the Palestinian people and identity sufficient to prevent there from EVER being a "two-state" solution.  Likud fed the beast to prevent peace.  It worked.

Posted
11 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Oh, that criticism pre-dates the SHIT out of Hamas' latest act of evil criminality.  It goes all the way back to willingly and knowingly allowing Hamas to arm up, having advance knowledge of their planned attack, and letting it happen to provide political advantage and a pretext to do what Likud has wanted to do all along: ethnically cleanse Gaza and make it fully Israeli territory again.

Bibi and Likud weren't being nice to Gaza -- they were playing them up as a foil against the PA (who, at all costs, Bibi and Likud had to keep from having any path to becoming a legitimate government of what might become an actual Palestinian State).  Bibi and Likud bolstered Hamas (including allowing funding and resulting arming) in order to prevent, at all costs, a Palestinian State.  Their strategy cost a shitload of Israeli and other lives on October 7th.  And, in return, we are rewarding them with exactly what they've always wanted: brutal elimination of the Palestinian people and identity sufficient to prevent there from EVER being a "two-state" solution.  Likud fed the beast to prevent peace.  It worked.

That is some crazy paranoid conspiracy talk. 
 
The PA was on a track to being a state? Do you know why the Pa doesn’t have elections in the WB? Because Hamas would win them. 
 

Posted
Just now, statsman said:

That is some crazy paranoid conspiracy talk. 
 
The PA was on a track to being a state? Do you know why the Pa doesn’t have elections in the WB? Because Hamas would win them. 
 

What's crazy and paranoid about what I said?  Seriously, what fact is wrong?  Bibi and Likud said these things (some externally, some internally).  I didn't make them up.  Likud pretty plainly stated and followed a "divide and conquer" path to ensure that the PA never got any power or legitimacy.  I never said the PA was "on track" to becoming a state -- indeed, the efforts of the Israeli right helped ensure that they would never, ever, even get on that track.  Likud much preferred feeding the militant Palestinian beast and starving/crippling the potentially functionally governing Palestinian beast because the Israeli right 1) needed a monster to be the protectors against, and 2) needed to ensure that Palestinian statehood never, ever happened (a militant Palestinian governing entity, like Hamas, was never going to be able to garner enough support globally to give birth to a Palestinian state).

These are strategies that Likud and their hardline pals have made little secret of.

And again, no excusing the shitbaggery of Hamas.  It just, ummm, might have been nice for Israeli leadership to have spent the effort they took to boost Hamas to instead boost the PA in the WB.  But they were never, ever going to do that because they want to take the entire WB, and they sure as shit never want a Palestinian state.  The Israeli right has gotten what it wanted.  It only cost stacks of dead Israelis and now even bigger stacks of dead Palestinians.  Hamas played exactly the role that they needed to play, because they are stupid, bloodthirsty shitheads: the role of the monster.

Posted
7 minutes ago, Satchel said:

It’s hard to imagine the number of little baby terrorists being formed amidst the carnage and death in Gaza and Rafah.

Tens of thousands of children, maybe more, with severe PTSD. Wait. You can't actually call it post-traumatic, cause the trauma is still ongoing. And our politicians literally the sign the bombs. Decency. We the people. And whatever other delusions help us sleep better at night. 

 

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Posted
13 hours ago, Satchel said:

It’s hard to imagine the number of little baby terrorists being formed amidst the carnage and death in Gaza and Rafah.

I think a bigger problem is the small Palestinian children being told, “Here where we live? This isn’t our home. That place 50 miles away? That’s our home. It was taken from your great grandparents by those bad people and you need to grow up and take it back”. 

Posted
4 minutes ago, statsman said:

I think a bigger problem is the small Palestinian children being told, “Here where we live? This isn’t our home. That place 50 miles away? That’s our home. It was taken from your great grandparents by those bad people and you need to grow up and take it back”. 

It’s nice to see that, over the past 11 months, your takes haven’t gotten any less shitty.

  • Haha 2
Posted

Today, an American woman was murdered while protesting illegal Israeli settlement expansions. As the piece below documents, she's not the first and certainly won't be the last.

Oh, and yesterday, the IDF shot and killed a 13yo Palestinian girl.

 

Israeli soldiers fatally shot an American woman at a West Bank protest, witnesses say

NABLUS, West Bank (AP) — Israeli soldiers killed an American woman demonstrating against settlements in the West Bank on Friday, according to two witnesses who said what began as a peaceful demonstration devolved into a clash between stone-throwing protesters and troops firing live ammunition. Two Palestinian doctors said 26-year-old Aysenur Ezgi Eygi of Seattle was shot in the head.

The U.S. government confirmed Eygi’s death but did not say whether the recent graduate of the University of Washington, who was also a Turkish citizen, had been shot by Israeli troops. The White House said it was “deeply disturbed” by the killing of a U.S. citizen and called on Israel to investigate what happened.

The Israeli military said it was looking into reports that troops had killed a foreign national while firing at an “instigator of violent activity” in the area of the protest.

The killing came amid a surge of violence in the West Bank since the Israel-Hamas war began in October, with increasing Israeli raids, attacks by Palestinian militants on Israelis, attacks by Israeli settlers on Palestinians and heavier military crackdowns on Palestinian protests. More than 690 Palestinians have been killed, according to Palestinian health officials.

On Thursday, Israeli troops shot and killed a 13-year-old Palestinian girl, Bana Laboom, in her village outside the West Bank town of Nabul, Palestinian health officials said. There was no immediate military comment on the report.

Eygi, a volunteer with the activist group International Solidarity Movement, was attending a weekly demonstration against settlement expansion that has been held for years and has often brought Israeli crackdowns and protester stone-throwing.

Jonathan Pollak, an Israeli participating in Friday’s protest, said the shooting occurred shortly after dozens of Palestinians and international activists held a communal prayer on a hillside outside the northern West Bank town of Beita overlooking the Israeli settlement of Evyatar.

Soldiers surrounded the prayer, and clashes soon broke out, with Palestinians throwing stones and troops firing tear gas and live ammunition, Pollak said.

The protesters and activists retreated and clashes subdued, he said. He then watched as two soldiers on the roof of a nearby home trained a gun in the group’s direction and fired.

He said he saw Eygi “lying on the ground, next to an olive tree, bleeding to death.”

Mariam Dag, another ISM activist at the protest, also said she saw an Israeli soldier on a rooftop, then heard the firing of two live bullets. One hit a Palestinian protester in the leg; the other hit Eygi. Dag said she saw blood coming from the fallen woman’s head.

“The shots were coming from the direction of the army,” she said.

Eygi had just arrived in the West Bank on Tuesday, Dag said. She had been “very excited this morning to start. She was really keen on coming to the demonstration.”

“This has been happening to Palestinians for decades. This happened because of the impunity which the Israelis act with,” while Western governments do little, she said.

Two doctors confirmed Eygi was shot in the head — Dr. Ward Basalat, who administered first aid at the scene, and Dr. Fouad Naffa, director of Rafidia Hospital in Nablus where she was taken.

ISM said 17 Palestinians have been killed by Israeli forces at the weekly Beita protests since March 2020. A month ago, an American, Amado Sison, was shot in the leg by Israeli forces, he said, as he tried to flee tear gas and live fire.

At the University of Washington, where Eygi recently graduated with a degree in psychology, Aria Fani, a professor of Middle Eastern languages and cultures, recalled Eygi’s activism earlier this year at a pro-Palestinian encampment, and remembered her as someone with a gift for listening to others.

Fani said he had tried to talk Eygi out of going to the West Bank but that she told him “she needed to bear witness for the sake of her own humanity.”

Secretary of State Antony Blinken said the U.S. was “intensely focused” on determining what happened and that “we will draw the necessary conclusions and consequences from that.”

In a posting on X, the Turkish Foreign Ministry condemned “this murder carried out by” the Israeli government. Turkey will work “to ensure that those who killed our citizen is brought to justice,” ministry spokesman Oncu Keceli said.

Human rights groups say Israeli soldiers who kill Palestinians – or their foreign supporters – rarely are held to account. The Israeli military says it investigates such instances and takes action if there is criminal wrongdoing.

At least three activists from the International Solidarity Movement have been killed since 2000.

Two of them were killed in Gaza in 2003. American Rachel Corrie was crushed to death as she tried to block an Israeli military bulldozer from demolishing a Palestinian home. About a month later, British citizen Tom Hurndall was shot in the head by an Israeli soldier. ISM activists often place themselves between Israeli forces and Palestinians to try to stop the Israeli military from carrying out operations.

The Israeli military ruled Corrie’s death an accident, a conclusion widely rejected by rights groups. The soldier who killed Hurndall was sentenced to 11 and a half years in prison and was released after serving just over half of it.

Shireen Abu Akleh — a Palestinian-American journalist with the Al Jazeera news network – was shot to death covering an Israeli raid in the West Bank in 2022. The United States concluded an Israeli soldier likely killed her by mistake, and Israel acknowledged that was a “high probability” but not certain and ruled out a criminal investigation. Al Jazeera accuses troops of intentionally killing her.

A handful of Americans have been killed in the West Bank since the Israel-Hamas war began, apparently by Israeli fire. Two Palestinian-American teens, Mohammad Khdour and Tawfic Abdel Jabbar, were shot to death in the span of a month while driving close to their villages. The findings of U.S. and Israeli investigations into their deaths have not been released.

In a statement Thursday, U.S. Senator Chris Van Hollen of Maryland said the Biden administration has not done enough “to pursue justice and accountability” for Khdour and Abdel Jabbar. He said it must “use American influence to demand the prosecution of those responsible for harm against American citizens.”

 

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Posted
On 9/5/2024 at 7:04 AM, statsman said:

I think a bigger problem is the small Palestinian children being told, “Here where we live? This isn’t our home. That place 50 miles away? That’s our home. It was taken from your great grandparents by those bad people and you need to grow up and take it back”. 

GWz9-L1l-Xc-AA1nhu.jpg

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Posted
On 9/6/2024 at 6:56 PM, bolverk said:

Today, an American woman was murdered

 

Turkish woman with US citizenship.  Peaceful protestor.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

Quote

 

a Member of the International Solidarity Movement (ISM), a Palestinian-Led Movement focused on “Non-Violent Action”.

Richard David Hupper, a Member of the ISM, being sentenced to Three Years in a U.S. Federal Prison back in 2008, for funneling over $20,000 to. Hamas

 

 

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Posted
19 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

Terrorism, plain and simple


Exactly.  When the Palestinian people stop letting hamas occupy civilian areas, they won’t be treated like terrorists.  It’s their strategy to die for the cause.  
 

 

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Posted
On 9/6/2024 at 6:56 PM, bolverk said:

Today, an American woman was murdered

 

On 9/8/2024 at 4:21 AM, PRONG HORN said:

Turkish woman with US citizenship.  Peaceful protestor.  

 

 

Well whoever she is, I'm sure she would be happy to have had a military procession before her journey to Turkey.  Can anyone explain this one?  

 

 

 

 

 

 

  • Fuck You 1
Posted
7 hours ago, PRONG HORN said:


Exactly.  When the Palestinian people stop letting hamas occupy civilian areas, they won’t be treated like terrorists.  It’s their strategy to die for the cause.  
 

 

I hope hell is real so we can meet there.

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Posted (edited)

When Hamas puts its forces in civilian centers, they (Hamas) commit a war crime. When Israel bombs them, there, it is not committing a war crime. 
 
If Gaza has a NICU unit, and Sinwar puts his command post right next to it, it is not a war crime for Israel to bomb it. That’s an extreme example to illustrate a point. 
 
If you don’t like the formal rules of war, what is your proposal to change them to?

Is it your contention that the U.S. committed a war crime when it bombed Dresden? I know that’s what Nazi leaders proposed in the Nuremberg trials. 
 
Golda Meir said, “We can forgive them for killing our children. We can’t forgive them for making us kill theirs”. 

Edited by statsman
Posted
6 minutes ago, statsman said:

When Hamas puts its forces in civilian centers, they (Hamas) commit a war crime. When Israel bombs them, there, it is not committing a war crime. 
 
If Gaza has a NICU unit, and Sinwar puts his command post right next to it, it is not a war crime for Israel to bomb it. That’s an extreme example to illustrate a point. 
 
If you don’t like the formal rules of war, what is your proposal to change them to?

Is it your contention that the U.S. committed a war crime when it bombed Dresden? I know that’s what Nazi leaders proposed in the Nuremberg trials. 
 
Golda Meir said, “We can forgive them for killing our children. We can’t forgive them for making us kill theirs”. 

A makeshift refugee camp isn't a "civilian center" teeming with Hamas leadership.  Use your fucking brain. 

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Posted
17 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

A makeshift refugee camp isn't a "civilian center" teeming with Hamas leadership.  Use your fucking brain. 

What? Are you still thinking that Hamas is hanging out in the barracks at Fort Arafat? That’s not how this works. Hamas imbeds among civilians and limits the civilians’ egress. 
 
Please answer the question- what should the rule of war be about enemy troops/militants imbedded among civilians?

Posted
13 hours ago, Brian Fantana said:

Terrorism, plain and simple

My thought exactly. They want these people to move to Egypt. They will seemingly do anything to facilitate that.

Netanyahu is a war criminal and horrific perpetrator of crimes against humanity. We must deny that man access to any US arms. I'm for helping Israel against air attacks and that's about it. 

Pronghorn defines himself yet again with his nihilistic support of these actions. 

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Posted
56 minutes ago, statsman said:

When Israel bombs them, there, it is not committing a war crime. 

Yes it is. The crime is aggravated when Israel is responsible for making these concentration camps.

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