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22 hours ago, NoRagrets said:

He is not on a hot seat. He’s guaranteed through 2023. That’s an eternity for assistant coach hires.

CDC:  Tom, tell me how you are going to avoid the problems of this past year in the future.
TH:  Ok cool.  Hookem!

* uncomfortable silence *

CDC:  Well?
TH:  Ok cool.  Hookem!

Edited by Goredho
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5 hours ago, Kyrie Eleison said:

"caveman" all you want, but this wasn't the result of something not working...this was the plan all along.  it started with hiring Matt Canada his first full season, but Canada was an arrogant horse's ass and clashed with everyone, including Aranda.  gone.  he brought back Slinger last year as a stop-gap to hunt for the right guy who fit.  the plan was a promise to Burrow to have him in this system, which is why he transferred to LSU despite our history.  

he's not a dumbass by any means.  he had a plan...a good plan...and implemented it.  he's damn smart enough to listen to the right people and get out of his own way, and that's fucking smart.  he plays his persona for a reason, and that's to get the actual dumbasses who think he's a...well, caveman...to sell him and his team short.  don't believe it?  go back and look at the threads prior to the LSU-UT game and how many posters on this site ragged him for being out of his element, and how "Mensa" was going to run circles around him.

who's laughing now?

btw, he's also 8-0 vs. top 10 teams not named Alabama. 

fucker's a leader and can coach 'em up.

 

he very clearly learned from his time at Ole Miss, where he went 10-25 and 3-21 in the SEC and by all measures was a "caveman" who got in his own way at basically every single opportunity. 

he has learned from that, he is a leader and he is a good coach and recruiter - none of that has ever really been questioned since he left Ole Miss though? his plan of taking less money as head coach and plowing that money back into the assistant pool was a smart one and for sure had something to do with him getting the job. 

BUT he has also gone 0 for 2 on actual on OC hires (Canada, and Ensminger who actually had a worse offense using OFEI than Canada did) and very, very, very clearly got lucky with Joe Brady - who isn't the OC, makes "only" 400k and could leave after this offseason...i would be shocked if Ensminger is going to be happy to step back down to only coaching TEs? I know his history there and how happy he is, but that is a kick in the nuts.

again, say what you want about anything and everything else he has done but hiring Ensminger was anything but an overwhelmingly great hire. he has no history as an innovator, he has no history of being some insanely successful OC, he has no history of bringing in a new scheme to counter Saban. He was more of the same going back to when he joined the staff in 2010.

Do you think anyone, including Coach O, will be happy of Ensminger is the OC next year and Joe Brady is literally anywhere else? 

nick miller GIF

All of that said, I am glad he is doing well at LSU. It is his dream job and outside of beating Texas I generally want them to win whoever they play.

Edited by NoName
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17 hours ago, Kyrie Eleison said:

the fuck you say...we have an actual fighting chance this year and with the schematic and coaching changes, along with the way recruiting is going, we'll compete every year hereafter.

Saban owned Miles...and that carried over to O.  and O changed as a result.

 

You nearly lost to Texas. Your defense is trash. 
 

Bama wins by 17.

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17 hours ago, NoName said:

 

he very clearly learned from his time at Ole Miss, where he went 10-25 and 3-21 in the SEC and by all measures was a "caveman" who got in his own way at basically every single opportunity. 

he has learned from that, he is a leader and he is a good coach and recruiter - none of that has ever really been questioned since he left Ole Miss though? his plan of taking less money as head coach and plowing that money back into the assistant pool was a smart one and for sure had something to do with him getting the job. 

BUT he has also gone 0 for 2 on actual on OC hires (Canada, and Ensminger who actually had a worse offense using OFEI than Canada did) and very, very, very clearly got lucky with Joe Brady - who isn't the OC, makes "only" 400k and could leave after this offseason...i would be shocked if Ensminger is going to be happy to step back down to only coaching TEs? I know his history there and how happy he is, but that is a kick in the nuts.

again, say what you want about anything and everything else he has done but hiring Ensminger was anything but an overwhelmingly great hire. he has no history as an innovator, he has no history of being some insanely successful OC, he has no history of bringing in a new scheme to counter Saban. He was more of the same going back to when he joined the staff in 2010.

Do you think anyone, including Coach O, will be happy of Ensminger is the OC next year and Joe Brady is literally anywhere else? 

nick miller GIF

All of that said, I am glad he is doing well at LSU. It is his dream job and outside of beating Texas I generally want them to win whoever they play.

The Ogre ain't letting Brady go anywhere next year. 

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2 hours ago, Doc Sam Beckett said:

The Ogre ain't letting Brady go anywhere next year. 

We shall see. If he wins vs Bama there are going to be head coaching job offers in his future or opportunities to run his (own) offensive program. 

He is about to get a huge salary bump, only making $400k this year...

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6 hours ago, Junior Miller said:

To me until it actually happens it's 70%-30% odds on Bama winning. LSU is good enough to win but they have an uphill climb to prove it. 

Baker Mayfield beat a much better Bama team soundly.  Johnny 8Ball did too.

Fact is that Saban's Bama teams have big trouble with good dual threat qb's.

Guess what LSU has.

It's a toss up.

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13 minutes ago, Cajun said:

Baker Mayfield beat a much better Bama team soundly.  Johnny 8Ball did too.

Fact is that Saban's Bama teams have big trouble with good dual threat qb's.

Guess what LSU has.

It's a toss up.

Neither team had massive history of losing to them at that point. Until the streak is broken there's a big mental advantage on one side and LSU has to overcome that. 

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32 minutes ago, Junior Miller said:

Neither team had massive history of losing to them at that point. Until the streak is broken there's a big mental advantage on one side and LSU has to overcome that. 

Dude, if you don't think that aggy came in completely expecting to lose that game in Tuscaloosa then you don't understand aggy.

At all.

The term "mental disadvantage" was invented in College Station brah.

LSU vs Bama is a toss up this year.

Edited by Cajun
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52 minutes ago, Cajun said:

Baker Mayfield beat a much better Bama team soundly.  Johnny 8Ball did too.

Fact is that Saban's Bama teams have big trouble with good dual threat qb's.

Guess what LSU has.

It's a toss up.

Baker didn't, Trevor Knight did. Although he looked like Baker.

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1 hour ago, Cajun said:

Baker Mayfield beat a much better Bama team soundly.  Johnny 8Ball did too.

Fact is that Saban's Bama teams have big trouble with good dual threat qb's.

Guess what LSU has.

It's a toss up.

You think Joe Burrow is a "dual threat" quarterback? I mean, he isn't a statue, but he's closer to Jake Fromm than he is Manziel or Baker in my opinion.  

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2 hours ago, NoName said:

We shall see. If he wins vs Bama there are going to be head coaching job offers in his future or opportunities to run his (own) offensive program. 

He is about to get a huge salary bump, only making $400k this year...

Unless he goes somewhere else as a HC (extremely doubtful), he’s not leaving LSU. He already runs his own offensive system. Ensminger has pretty much nothing to do with this offensive scheme. 
They’ll give him a massive raise and make him the OC. Brady’s not going anywhere until someone hires him away as a HC.

Edited by Burt Macklin
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1 hour ago, Reynolds Woodcock said:

You think Joe Burrow is a "dual threat" quarterback? I mean, he isn't a statue, but he's closer to Jake Fromm than he is Manziel or Baker in my opinion.  

He's dual enough to beat this Bama team.

He just needs to be effective enough running to get a few first downs where Saban blankets the receivers.  That will happen.

Against the normal Bama D, maybe not, but this ain't the normal Bama D. Not even close.

Edited by Cajun
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Unless he goes somewhere else as a HC (extremely doubtful), he’s not leaving LSU. He already runs his own offensive system. Ensminger has pretty much nothing to do with this offensive scheme. 
They’ll give him a massive raise and make him the OC. Brady’s not going anywhere until someone hires him away as a HC.

Generally this, though I'd think an NFL coordinator job would be tempting too.

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On 10/19/2019 at 10:45 PM, campcrunk said:

Seriously. This is a probably a 3-4 team with Strong at them helm. Maybe even 2-5.

And? Fuck Charlie Strong. I don't want to judge Herman based on being better than Strong. That is nothing to pat yourself on the back about. The record doesn't mean shit right now. We haven't beat a team worth a damn.

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Just now, Vic Mackey said:

And? Fuck Charlie Strong. I don't want to judge Herman based on being better than Strong. That is nothing to pat yourself on the back about. The record doesn't mean shit right now. We haven't beat a team worth a damn.

No shit, don't try to make me feel better about herpes because I didn't test positive for AIDS.  Our standards are in the shitter these days.  

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good fucking god...this is his first real job in the football world.  the dude's a savant...i get it...but he just turned 30 in September and no one is taking a chance on him as a HC or full on NFL coordinator until he builds a body of work.  

we'll give him a significant raise, and he'll be with us for the next few years at least.

besides, he really does love working for CEO and LSU, and from every account everyone loves him.  it's a perfect environment for him to build a resume'.

 

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good fucking god...this is his first real job in the football world.  the dude's a savant...i get it...but he just turned 30 in September and no one is taking a chance on him as a HC or full on NFL coordinator until he builds a body of work.  
we'll give him a significant raise, and he'll be with us for the next few years at least.
besides, he really does love working for CEO and LSU, and from every account everyone loves him.  it's a perfect environment for him to build a resume'.
 

Kliff Kingsbury spun a losing record with Pat Mahomes as his starter and eventually getting fired at Tech (worth noting that Herman gave him an extra year by melting down at home) into a NFL head coaching position with no prior NFL coaching experience.

Never say never when it comes to NFL front offices doing dumb shit.

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1) I hope that Herman makes it. Going through another HC search and ramp is not what I would like to see

 

2) If point 1 doesn't happen and Texas has to bring in a new HC I truly hope this time they go to the market for the best possible DC/OC and spend the $ to get them vs saying "Well this guy was with me when I was at multi-directional state university so he must be ready for the UT job" and make a comfort hire.

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On 10/29/2019 at 2:56 PM, NoName said:

 

he very clearly learned from his time at Ole Miss, where he went 10-25 and 3-21 in the SEC and by all measures was a "caveman" who got in his own way at basically every single opportunity. 

he has learned from that, he is a leader and he is a good coach and recruiter - none of that has ever really been questioned since he left Ole Miss though? his plan of taking less money as head coach and plowing that money back into the assistant pool was a smart one and for sure had something to do with him getting the job. 

BUT he has also gone 0 for 2 on actual on OC hires (Canada, and Ensminger who actually had a worse offense using OFEI than Canada did) and very, very, very clearly got lucky with Joe Brady - who isn't the OC, makes "only" 400k and could leave after this offseason...i would be shocked if Ensminger is going to be happy to step back down to only coaching TEs? I know his history there and how happy he is, but that is a kick in the nuts.

again, say what you want about anything and everything else he has done but hiring Ensminger was anything but an overwhelmingly great hire. he has no history as an innovator, he has no history of being some insanely successful OC, he has no history of bringing in a new scheme to counter Saban. He was more of the same going back to when he joined the staff in 2010.

Do you think anyone, including Coach O, will be happy of Ensminger is the OC next year and Joe Brady is literally anywhere else? 

nick miller GIF

All of that said, I am glad he is doing well at LSU. It is his dream job and outside of beating Texas I generally want them to win whoever they play.

 

So basically you're saying that you can disprove the notion that Orgeron has learned to hand the reigns to great assistants because there's a good chance the coach he hired this year will end up performing so well that he gets poached for a promotion by another team?

I mean you're right. That's one problem Herman is never going to have.

Next level Mensa strategery.

Edited by BradInATX
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5 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

 

So basically you're saying that you can disprove the notion that Orgeron has learned to hire really good assistants and hand them the reigns because there's a good chance the coach he hired this year performed so well that he got poached for a promotion by another team?

I mean you're right. That's one problem Herman is never going to have.

Next level Mensa strategery.

His original username was "NoAristotle".

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14 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

 

So basically you're saying that you can disprove the notion that Orgeron has learned to hire really good assistants and hand them the reigns because there's a good chance the coach he hired this year performed so well that he got poached for a promotion by another team?

I mean you're right. That's one problem Herman is never going to have.

Next level Mensa strategery.

Job #1 for a head coach is do a good job hiring and managing your staff.   Hire good coaches, hire good recruiters, bonus if they do both.   Fire the ones who suck.

Job #2 is to do a good job hiring.  Because if you were good at job #1 you are pretty much always replacing guys who get lured away or you're cutting dead weight.  

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10 hours ago, BradInATX said:

 

So basically you're saying that you can disprove the notion that Orgeron has learned to hand the reigns to great assistants because there's a good chance the coach he hired this year will end up performing so well that he gets poached for a promotion by another team?

I mean you're right. That's one problem Herman is never going to have.

Next level Mensa strategery.

calling Matt Canada and Steve Ensminger"great assistants" is truly hilarious.

You mean Matt Canada, the guy who between the 2010 and 2018 seasons held 7 different jobs? (Indiana, Northern Ill, Wisc, NC State, Pitt, LSU, Maryland)

Matt Canada was a failure of a hire - the replacement (Ensminger) actually had a worse offense by OFEI the next year. 

Brady was a good hire - obviously - but Coach O has gone out of the way a number of times to make it clear who is calling the actual plays and who runs the offense, and it isn't Joe Brady even though he clearly has a ton of influence.

Coach O was clearly a great hire for them and has learned from his past mistakes but let's not make him some kind of fucking savant.

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38 minutes ago, NoName said:

calling Matt Canada and Steve Ensminger"great assistants" is truly hilarious.

You mean Matt Canada, the guy who between the 2010 and 2018 seasons held 7 different jobs? (Indiana, Northern Ill, Wisc, NC State, Pitt, LSU, Maryland)

Matt Canada was a failure of a hire - the replacement (Ensminger) actually had a worse offense by OFEI the next year. 

Brady was a good hire - obviously - but Coach O has gone out of the way a number of times to make it clear who is calling the actual plays and who runs the offense, and it isn't Joe Brady even though he clearly has a ton of influence.

Coach O was clearly a great hire for them and has learned from his past mistakes but let's not make him some kind of fucking savant.

I don't think anyone is trying to make him some kind of savant. The general point is that he's shown the ability to do a few things that Herman has not:

- Consistently improve year-over

- Suck up his ego and admit staff mistakes and correct them

- Bring his team back to national prominence

He's done a great job at LSU. Ball don't lie.

Edited by BradInATX
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calling Matt Canada and Steve Ensminger"great assistants" is truly hilarious.
You mean Matt Canada, the guy who between the 2010 and 2018 seasons held 7 different jobs? (Indiana, Northern Ill, Wisc, NC State, Pitt, LSU, Maryland)
Matt Canada was a failure of a hire - the replacement (Ensminger) actually had a worse offense by OFEI the next year. 
Brady was a good hire - obviously - but Coach O has gone out of the way a number of times to make it clear who is calling the actual plays and who runs the offense, and it isn't Joe Brady even though he clearly has a ton of influence.
Coach O was clearly a great hire for them and has learned from his past mistakes but let's not make him some kind of fucking savant.


when we fired Miles, O’s first change as interim was to fire Cam Cameron the very next day. Ensminger was already on staff and took over OC duties as a stop gap. he was demoted that next spring when O brought Canada in and once again took over last year with the full understanding that O was going to bring someone else end. that plan was slightly amended by bringing in Brady. but bet your ass he’s there with everyone in full understanding that he’ll be taking over OC duties from Slinger.

so to say that Slinger won’t take well to a “demotion” is hogwash...he’s already done it once and fully understands the plan and is onboard with it.

ain’t no ego there...
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On 10/31/2019 at 9:21 AM, BradInATX said:

I don't think anyone is trying to make him some kind of savant. The general point is that he's shown the ability to do a few things that Herman has not:

- Consistently improve year-over

- Suck up his ego and admit staff mistakes and correct them

- Bring his team back to national prominence

He's done a great job at LSU. Ball don't lie.

he has done a great job at LSU, 100% correct. but instead of just owning what he does and let his results speak for themselves, which are fine, people overblow it.

///

constantly improve? yes, he went from 9 wins to 10 and played in a ny6 after playing in the citrus 2x. yes, that is AN improvement.

LSU's final AP ranking in the last 5 years of Les Miles were 2, 13, 14, NR, 16. under Coach O it is 13, 18, 6. improvement, yes. but lets not act like you went from spending most of the last 10 years unranked or in the back half of the top 25, then jumped up to 6.

admitting staff mistakes and correcting them? not exactly. come on now. 

(not sure if this is going to upload right but here is the link:https://nq94.s-ul.eu/9aSPkpkR)

here is his staff continuity from 2017 to now. yellow = same guy on staff. Red and green are "new" hires.

spacer.png

admitting staff mistakes and correcting them?

  • Dennis Johnson moved from being a GA to the OLB coach to DL coach being an analyst there, he is quite young. only took a step back in 2019 because he tore both patella tendons in his knees and is in a wheelchair. he will be back next year. by all measures he was a great hire/replacement when Jenkins retired. 
  • 2 dudes retired because they are OAF.
  • one dude took an OC position at BYU (still there)

he hasn't really made staff changes/shook anything up from a coaching standpoint by choice outside of adding Jerry Sullivan to be the passing game coordinator, and replacing him with Brady (which is a good move) - in the last 2 years he has made basically one real change. 

Switching from a 74 year old passing coordinator to a 30 year old one 

Bill Johnson is on a 1 year deal and was a comfort hire because they have known each other as long as Joe Brady has been alive.

dude has objectively done an excellent job filling out his staff. but he isn't really making major changes here. 

as far as bringing LSU back to national prominence? come on dude. Les Miles took yall to two national championship games, won on, averaged 10 wins a year for 11 years, was ranked for 9 of his 11 full seasons, finished in the top 10 in almost in half of his years at LSU and was involved with some of the best games of the 10s. 

he has done a great job, and was a great hire. but don't make this out for more than it is. he is still 0-3 against Bama, never scored more than 10 points against Saban (10 2x and shut out), is 2-2 against Florida, has yet to win a division championship or a conf championship, has finished in the top 10 once and top 5 zero times, has zero playoff appearances, etc.

let him be a good coach, but don't make him out into more than he is - he is a good hire, who took a good program and didn't drop off, who hired a very good staff and kept it together, has made improvements in year 3 on the offensive side and who is having his best season yet with the potential to actually beat Bama. can't that be enough?

 

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1 minute ago, NoName said:

he has done a great job at LSU, 100% correct. but instead of just owning what he does and let his results speak for themselves, which are fine, people overblow it.

///

constantly improve? yes, he went from 9 wins to 10 and played in a ny6 after playing in the citrus 2x. yes, that is AN improvement.

LSU's final AP ranking in the last 5 years of Les Miles were 2, 13, 14, NR, 16. under Coach O it is 13, 18, 6. improvement, yes. but lets not act like you went from spending most of the last 10 years unranked or in the back half of the top 25, then jumped up to 6.

admitting staff mistakes and correcting them? not exactly. come on now. 

(not sure if this is going to upload right but here is the link:https://nq94.s-ul.eu/9aSPkpkR)

here is his staff continuity from 2017 to now. yellow = same guy on staff. Red and green are "new" hires.

spacer.png

admitting staff mistakes and correcting them?

  • Dennis Johnson moved from being a GA to the OLB coach to DL coach being an analyst there, he is quite young. only took a step back in 2019 because he tore both patella tendons in his knees and is in a wheelchair. he will be back next year. by all measures he was a great hire/replacement when Jenkins retired. 
  • 2 dudes retired because they are OAF.
  • one dude took an OC position at BYU (still there)

he hasn't really made staff changes/shook anything up from a coaching standpoint by choice outside of adding Jerry Sullivan to be the passing game coordinator, and replacing him with Brady (which is a good move) - in the last 2 years he has made basically one real change. 

Switching from a 74 year old passing coordinator to a 30 year old one 

Bill Johnson is on a 1 year deal and was a comfort hire because they have known each other as long as Joe Brady has been alive.

dude has objectively done an excellent job filling out his staff. but he isn't really making major changes here. 

as far as bringing LSU back to national prominence? come on dude. Les Miles took yall to two national championship games, won on, averaged 10 wins a year for 11 years, was ranked for 9 of his 11 full seasons, finished in the top 10 in almost in half of his years at LSU and was involved with some of the best games of the 10s. 

he has done a great job, and was a great hire. but don't make this out for more than it is. he is still 0-3 against Bama, never scored more than 10 points against Saban (10 2x and shut out), is 2-2 against Florida, has yet to win a division championship or a conf championship, has finished in the top 10 once and top 5 zero times, has zero playoff appearances, etc.

let him be a good coach, but don't make him out into more than he is - he is a good hire, who took a good program and didn't drop off, who hired a very good staff and kept it together, has made improvements in year 3 on the offensive side and who is having his best season yet with the potential to actually beat Bama. can't that be enough?

 

Who is ya'll? I'm not an LSU guy. 

Bottom line is he identified issues with scheme and staff and corrected them. The novel you wrote up there is parsing minutia to try to somehow undermine the over-arching point, that Orgeron has the humility and awareness to recognize issues with scheme and staff and fix them. So far, Herman has shown none of that.  

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2 minutes ago, BradInATX said:

Who is ya'll? I'm not an LSU guy. 

Bottom line is he identified issues with scheme and staff and corrected them. The novel you wrote up there is parsing minutia to try to somehow undermine the over-arching point, that Orgeron has the humility and awareness to recognize issues with scheme and staff and fix them. So far, Herman has shown none of that.  

let's just agree to disagree. 

he has been a great hire for LSU and has been successful. lets agree on that and leave it alone.

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3 minutes ago, HornsOverIthaca said:

I’m not saying Orgeron is a caveman, I’m just saying he is closer to being one than the rest of us.  That could be part of it.  There have been plenty of examples.  Most people don’t know this, but Oscar Hammerstein II was a caveman.

air caveman GIF

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On 10/27/2019 at 11:18 AM, BearSchlong said:
On 10/27/2019 at 10:19 AM, GreenspointTexas said:
Legit HC wish list, in no particular order:
(qualifiers of no-coordinator, no G5)
 
1) Fleck
2) Peterson (not coming here)
3) Stoops (done with college, not coming here lol)
4) Briles (lmao no way)
5) Meyer (see Stoops)
6) Cristobal?
7) Klieman (need a bigger sample size)
emoji41.png Rhule (lmao he makes 10 million a year, hes not leaving Baylor)
9) Patterson (see Rhule)
10) Dykes? 
 
 
 
Did i sum it up pretty well?

Read more  

You left out the real guy that should be your corch, Mike Leach.

Swing your sword!!!

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