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Immaculate Vibes

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totallynotabuttpirate
totallynotabuttpirate

Yea, that's what I'm focused on right now. Nothing better than both sides-ing it after watching what those terrorists did to innocent civilians.  Looking forward to your links of videos showing I

Superhero
Superhero

It’s been a serious, sometimes political debate whether a person from Taiwan should refer to themselves as Chinese from Taiwan, or Taiwanese. The current mood is to call our(?)selves Taiwanese. F

CHIEF
CHIEF

Good God. Don't you have have a Foie Gras in Tuscany waiting for you? Or a 25 year old Silver Oak Cabernet, in Sonoma? Stay in the CR, where you belong. I'm sorry, I don't usually lash out, but you ar

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ABSR

ABSR 5266

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7 hours ago, Brisketexan said:


The Hamas terrorists? They’re trying to seek revenge.
The actual nation states who put them up to it and helped them do it? Instability and chaos. And, riling up their own oppressed people to hate a made-up enemy to distract them from their own shitty regimes (seriously…there’s no real historical reason that Iran and Israel should be deadly enemies).
A lot of Palestinians will die so that Iran’s mullahs can distract their own oppressed people for a while longer.

And be clear that Iran and other “supportive” Muslim nations will send weapons, but won’t work to improve the lives and grow the economy of Palestinians.  But neither does Hamas.   They all want to have Israel as a boogeyman, but actually doing things like fixing infrastructure, creating business and opportunities is something Hamas can’t do and other Muslim countries won’t.   They will help them kill and be terrorists, but they won’t work to improve their lives.  It is why the two State solution is one they are not interested in.

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DalTxHornFan

DalTxHornFan 3066

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2 minutes ago, CycleTex87 said:

A buddy of mine flew on the Space Shuttle and said that the Israel border is the only national border visible from space.  Why?  Because it’s green in Israel and brown everywhere else. 

Wife said the same thing when flying into Israel a couple of years ago.

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Aqua Buddha

Aqua Buddha 13897

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40 minutes ago, CycleTex87 said:

A buddy of mine flew on the Space Shuttle and said that the Israel border is the only national border visible from space.  Why?  Because it’s green in Israel and brown everywhere else. 

Because they spent time and energy developing the land they had because they knew they needed an economy and had a country to run.  The rest of the region had other priorities, which is why I have a dim view of a Palestinian state.  They've not been interested in doing the non fun parts of running a country.

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Brian Fantana

Brian Fantana 6589

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28 minutes ago, totallynotabuttpirate said:

@Brian Fantana Can we get some links to videos of Israeli soldiers beheading Palestinians? 

You can literally find hundreds of images of dead Palestinian children from Israeli air strikes alone. Are those deaths any less horrific?

I'm literally just trying to understand why those deaths don't move the needle for you, but these do.

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totallynotabuttpirate

totallynotabuttpirate 5294

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1 minute ago, Brian Fantana said:

Are those deaths any less horrific?

Fuck yes, you stupid fuck. The deaths as a result of airstrikes on military targets that are concealed in civilian areas are a world away from beheading a defenseless person. 

You really need to gtfo your computer. So much dumb. 

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Brian Fantana

Brian Fantana 6589

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4 minutes ago, totallynotabuttpirate said:

Fuck yes, you stupid fuck. The deaths as a result of airstrikes on military targets that are concealed in civilian areas are a world away from beheading a defenseless person. 

You really need to gtfo your computer. So much dumb. 

Brady Bunch K GIF

You just gave the game away, thanks for playing!

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Schulz2.0

Schulz2.0 28616

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17 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

You can literally find hundreds of images of dead Palestinian children from Israeli air strikes alone. Are those deaths any less horrific?

I'm literally just trying to understand why those deaths don't move the needle for you, but these do.

You can believe that Israel has done some morally abhorrent things and also say this is a terrorist attack by Hamas. Hamas and Iran believe that Israel has no right to exist. It's an existential fight for Israel.

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Brian Fantana

Brian Fantana 6589

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Just now, Schulz2.0 said:

You can believe that Israel has done some morally abhorrent things and also say this is a terrorist attack by Hamas. Hamas and Iran also believe that Israel has no right to exist. It's an existential fight for Israel.

It absolutely is a terrorist attack, a disgusting and abhorrent one. I've said as much and that I don't condone these attacks like 50 times at this point.

It just doesn't surprise me, and the violence will continue until something big changes. You can't simply tell a group of demonstrably oppressed people to simply accept being oppressed and everything will be hunky dory, that isn't how humans work. The majority of Palestinians want peaceful coexistence with Israel, but someone has to extend the hand, and neither side trusts the other enough to do that.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 103143

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It absolutely is a terrorist attack, a disgusting and abhorrent one. I've said as much and that I don't condone these attacks like 50 times at this point.
It just doesn't surprise me, and the violence will continue until something big changes. You can't simply tell a group of demonstrably oppressed people to simply accept being oppressed and everything will be hunky dory, that isn't how humans work. The majority of Palestinians want peaceful coexistence with Israel, but someone has to extend the hand, and neither side trusts the other enough to do that.

Does the leadership of Israel call for the extermination of any possible Palestinian state AND all Palestinians, wherever they may live? Nope.

Does the leadership of the Palestinians in Gaza call for the extermination of any Jewish state AND all Jews, wherever they live? Yes.

That distinction is important. Israel can be negotiated with. Hamas cannot. How can you negotiate with that? “So…would you be okay if you only killed HALF the Jews on earth? Would that be satisfactory?”

Hamas has chosen very poorly. Don’t declare that you are waging a war of extermination against a better-armed opponent. You leave the opponent no choice. Israel has no choice at this point but to completely and totally annihilate the foe that has declared that it seeks to exterminate them, and is actively working to do so. To accomplish that task - which must be accomplished - there’s no way to get there without causing massive collateral damage and civilian suffering. Israel has only bad choices in front of it.

I’m betting it chooses the path that sees Palestinians die, rather than leave an enemy that seeks to exterminate Israel and all Jews standing.

That’s what any sane people would do. It’s fucking awful. But Hamas, and the people of Gaza who apparently clearly support Hamas, have declared that this is how it is going to be. So, that’s how it will be. Stupid, awful, and horrific. Lotta people making a lotta stupid choices these days.
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Brian Fantana

Brian Fantana 6589

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3 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:


Does the leadership of Israel call for the extermination of any possible Palestinian state AND all Palestinians, wherever they may live? Nope.

Does the leadership of the Palestinians in Gaza call for the extermination of any Jewish state AND all Jews, wherever they live? Yes.

That distinction is important. Israel can be negotiated with. Hamas cannot. How can you negotiate with that? “So…would you be okay if you only killed HALF the Jews on earth? Would that be satisfactory?”

Hamas has chosen very poorly. Don’t declare that you are waging a war of extermination against a better-armed opponent. You leave the opponent no choice. Israel has no choice at this point but to completely and totally annihilate the foe that has declared that it seeks to exterminate them, and is actively working to do so. To accomplish that task - which must be accomplished - there’s no way to get there without causing massive collateral damage and civilian suffering. Israel has only bad choices in front of it.

I’m betting it chooses the path that sees Palestinians die, rather than leave an enemy that seeks to exterminate Israel and all Jews standing.

That’s what any sane people would do. It’s fucking awful. But Hamas, and the people of Gaza who apparently clearly support Hamas, have declared that this is how it is going to be. So, that’s how it will be. Stupid, awful, and horrific. Lotta people making a lotta stupid choices these days.

I don't disagree, what I disagree with is conflating Hamas with all of the Palestinians living in Gaza, and the numerous calls to just wipe them all out and get it over with in this thread alone. It's like I said in the CR thread, the exit polling after Hamas was democratically elected to lead over there is pretty telling of what the people wanted.

I disagree that Israel has only bad choices in front of it. There's a lot of push and pull here and Israel has unnecessarily done more than it's fair share of both. I feel like you would have agreed to that statement a few days ago.

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 88750

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2 hours ago, CycleTex87 said:

Maybe, but it’s generally agreed that the Iranians are backing Hamas and Hezbollah.  One more step to include Putin in some big picture strategy with the Iranians (who are providing some support to Russia in Ukraine) is not out of the question. 

I'm sure it's right out of some KGB playbook, especially when you look at the Middle East of the 70s and 80s. Putin needs as many distractions as possible.  Without looking, I'm sure we've got some people in this country that are claiming we need to stop helping Ukraine because we might need those weapons to fight Hamas or something (note: much of the hardware we are giving the Ukrainians is not our top-tier stuff we'd be using against Hamas or Iran or whoever).

With that said, he's risking a lot with Iran - Israel and/or the US and/or even Turkey could decide some Iranian drone/missile factories need to go, and that would cripple Putin's efforts at destroying Ukrainian apartment buildings, hospitals, schools, and cafes.

 

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Boss Hogg

Boss Hogg 808

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49 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

You can literally find hundreds of images of dead Palestinian children from Israeli air strikes alone. Are those deaths any less horrific?

I'm literally just trying to understand why those deaths don't move the needle for you, but these do.

IMG-2450.gif

 

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atomheartbevo

atomheartbevo 88750

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2 hours ago, ABSR said:

And be clear that Iran and other “supportive” Muslim nations will send weapons, but won’t work to improve the lives and grow the economy of Palestinians.  But neither does Hamas.   They all want to have Israel as a boogeyman, but actually doing things like fixing infrastructure, creating business and opportunities is something Hamas can’t do and other Muslim countries won’t.   They will help them kill and be terrorists, but they won’t work to improve their lives.  It is why the two State solution is one they are not interested in.

Saudi Arabia claims to support the Palestinians.

The Saudis are spending $500 billion to kick-start a futuristic, green, 10,000+ square mile city along the Red Sea, and it's not far from the areas in question.  Houston, for reference, is around 650 square miles I believe.

Are the Saudis offering to import even tens of thousands of Palestinians (out of millions)?  What's the magic 8-ball say?

Ryan Newman No GIF by Alexander IRL

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atomheartbevo

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Also, between what Ukraine is doing to Russia with drones/UAVs, and with what we are seeing that Hamas did with drones, I'd imagine that anybody with a decent-sized military is concerned about drones going forward.  This is just reaffirming what we've seen in Ukraine.

US Army is going to need some new MOSes just for anti-drone personnel.

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Boss Hogg

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1 minute ago, atomheartbevo said:

Also, between what Ukraine is doing to Russia with drones/UAVs, and with what we are seeing that Hamas did with drones, I'd imagine that anybody with a decent-sized military is concerned about drones going forward.  This is just reaffirming what we've seen in Ukraine.

US Army is going to need some new MOSes just for anti-drone personnel.

 By the same token, could sending Israeli troops into Gaza devolve into a Bakhmut type of building to building hellscape? 

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Aqua Buddha

Aqua Buddha 13897

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2 minutes ago, atomheartbevo said:

Also, between what Ukraine is doing to Russia with drones/UAVs, and with what we are seeing that Hamas did with drones, I'd imagine that anybody with a decent-sized military is concerned about drones going forward.  This is just reaffirming what we've seen in Ukraine.

US Army is going to need some new MOSes just for anti-drone personnel.

The Azerbajan/Armenian war will go down in history as the end of tanks as we know it.  That's what makes the Russian incursion into Ukraine so stupid.  

Hamas is likely baiting the Israeli's into moving into the urban areas with thanks and APC's.  Israeli's should surprise them with going more Old School.  They should lay siege to the entire area.  Starve them out.  Deny them the glorious battle.  They'll get hungry enough and they'll come out.

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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 103143

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I don't disagree, what I disagree with is conflating Hamas with all of the Palestinians living in Gaza, and the numerous calls to just wipe them all out and get it over with in this thread alone. It's like I said in the CR thread, the exit polling after Hamas was democratically elected to lead over there is pretty telling of what the people wanted.
I disagree that Israel has only bad choices in front of it. There's a lot of push and pull here and Israel has unnecessarily done more than it's fair share of both. I feel like you would have agreed to that statement a few days ago.

I don’t disagree that calls to exterminate all Palestinians in Gaza in response are wrong, and I would oppose any action to do so.

But understand, the Palestinians there KNOWINGLY chose to throw in their lot with a movement that LITERALLY HAS GENOCIDE OF ALL JEWS AS ITS PLATFORM. You don’t get to just waltz past that and say “yeah, ok, I see that…but the real reason I voted for them was because they have good ideas about public sanitation and jobs programs.” The Palestinians in Gaza made a very poor choice. And they have been paying a price for it, and are about to pay a horrific additional price for it.

As for Israel’s choices…what GOOD choice does it have in front of us? Allowing Hamas or any militant in Hamas to survive is a non-starter. They have made it plain: us, or you. Israel would be stupid to choose anything other than “eliminate Hamas.”

Israel has been plenty piece of dick, including in the past couple of years. But by choosing to escalate the fight to the existential level, Hamas makes politics and everything below extermination/survival irrelevant. You sacrifice all high ground when you do that. You sacrifice your claim to continue to live when you do that. If I walk up to you and say “I will not stop until I kill you,” and then I attack you…you’d be an absolute moron not to kill me. Immediately.

Hamas has chosen a war of extermination. It will get what it has chosen. It will get a lot of Palestinians killed in the process. I’ll likewise suggest that maybe those people shouldn’t have happily supported a movement of genocide, even if it did promise a good street sweeping program.
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Brisketexan

Brisketexan 103143

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The Azerbajan/Armenian war will go down in history as the end of tanks as we know it.  That's what makes the Russian incursion into Ukraine so stupid.  
Hamas is likely baiting the Israeli's into moving into the urban areas with thanks and APC's.  Israeli's should surprise them with going more Old School.  They should lay siege to the entire area.  Starve them out.  Deny them the glorious battle.  They'll get hungry enough and they'll come out.

That’s horrific.
It’s also the smart play.

War is hell.
That’s why you really should avoid choosing that path if you at all can.
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Poe It Up

Poe It Up 126

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6 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

The Azerbajan/Armenian war will go down in history as the end of tanks as we know it.  That's what makes the Russian incursion into Ukraine so stupid.  

Hamas is likely baiting the Israeli's into moving into the urban areas with thanks and APC's.  Israeli's should surprise them with going more Old School.  They should lay siege to the entire area.  Starve them out.  Deny them the glorious battle.  They'll get hungry enough and they'll come out.

Just get ready for pictures of starving civilians. Then when the cameras turn off, Hamas will strap bombs to them in the name of Allah. Morons in the west will eat it up. 

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Parliament

Parliament 13979

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16 minutes ago, Boss Hogg said:

 By the same token, could sending Israeli troops into Gaza devolve into a Bakhmut type of building to building hellscape? 

 

14 minutes ago, Aqua Buddha said:

Hamas is likely baiting the Israeli's into moving into the urban areas with thanks and APC's.  Israeli's should surprise them with going more Old School.  They should lay siege to the entire area.  Starve them out.  Deny them the glorious battle.  They'll get hungry enough and they'll come out.

That hellscape was made possible by Russia's ability to rain artillery.  Does Israel have that?  Do they have enough rockets and bombs?  (I don't know.  Just wondering.)

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Frank Drebin

Frank Drebin 5359

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These are the same "civilians" that were dancing in the street and celebrating when 9/11 happened to us. I have no sympathy for them, their offspring, or any other civilian in Gaza. It's a long time coming. They brought these people into power and supported them. Time they reap the consequences.  
 

In my view, Palestinians would be better off if their Arab brothers would take them im.  Plenty of Jews have been  displaced from Arab countries in the Middle East and North Africa.  

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Aqua Buddha

Aqua Buddha 13897

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2 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

These are the same "civilians" that were dancing in the street and celebrating when 9/11 happened to us. I have no sympathy for them, their offspring, or any other civilian in Gaza. It's a long time coming. They brought these people into power and supported them. Time they reap the consequences.  
 

In my view, Palestinians would be better off if their Arab brothers would take them im.  Plenty of Jews have been  displaced from Arab countries in the Middle East and North Africa.  

This is like William Munny at the end of Unforgiven.  

1.  Yeah, he should have armed himself if he was going to decorate his bar with my friend

2.  You don't wan't to get killed, you'd better get on out of the bar.

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GabrielsHorn

GabrielsHorn 2142

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12 minutes ago, Poe It Up said:

Just get ready for pictures of starving civilians. Then when the cameras turn off, Hamas will strap bombs to them in the name of Allah. Morons in the west will eat it up. 

We already have multiple people in the west celebrating the capture, rape and execution of women; the capture and execution of children and the elderly; and beheading IDF soldiers in the name of de-colonization ala Fanon’s theory. 
 

Israel and the IDF have their own issues, but seeing people celebrate brazen terrorist is pretty shocking. 

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