Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Posted
2 hours ago, Anastasis said:

Normal epidemiology y'all. 

Rates of newly recorded transgender identity during 2000-18, by age group

Yes, clearly the trans epidemic is spreading like wildfire.

Maybe it has something to do with the fact that people have been increasingly more able to be who they want to be without being, ya know, killed for it?  I know, I know, y'all are gonna fix that trend for us, because you're so Christian and all.

  • Hook 'Em 1
Posted
22 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

Kindness is not found in standing by silently while we inappropriately medicate children with no sound medical evidence basis.

Correct.

See, kindness is found in deciding that addressing that issue....in which around 2,000 kids in the entire United States, with the consent of both their parents and treating physician, are receiving such medication for gender dysphoria....is SO important that you must, you simply MUST, support and elect a regime that will shut off food aid to the starving, cancel food trucks on their way to food banks and schools, stop AIDS, malaria, and tuberculosis treatment programs, deport US citizen children, etc. etc. etc.

Won't someone think of the children????

No, not THOSE children.  Not the hungry children. Not the children with or at risk of deadly illnesses.  Fuck THOSE kids.  And fucking THOSE kids is all worth it, if we can only tackle this, the most important issue that humanity has ever faced, which affects 0.0005% of the entire population.

  • Hook 'Em 1
  • Like 2
  • Haha 1
  • Rage+1 1
Posted
1 minute ago, Bojack said:

I think people are more often ignoring him and that's part of why he's become an even worse poster. He getting a bit less of the attention he craves, so he's increasingly embraced maga and more often flings personal insults among other things. 

100%. 

  • Like 1
Posted
6 minutes ago, Bojack said:

I think people are more often ignoring him and that's part of why he's become an even worse poster. He getting a bit less of the attention he craves, so he's increasingly embraced maga and more often flings personal insults among other things. 

You’ve actually been here for the full arc, and this is very lazy but unsurprising  take. 

  • Fuck You 1
Posted (edited)

None of you had a problem with the principles of evidence based medicine when it was directed at ivermectin and HCQ and clowns like triple horn. Sorry if you find yourself on the other end of that equation now and find it uncomfortable. 

Edited by Anastasis
  • Like 1
  • Fuck You 1
Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

None of you had a problem with the principles of evidence based medicine when it was directed at ivermectin and HCQ and clowns like triple horn. Sorry if you find yourself on the other end of that equation now and find it uncomfortable. 

Many of us think evidence-based examination of gender dysphoria and treatments should be a thing, and don't have a problem with an honest discussion of it.

What we see right through is making something that affects 0.0005% of the population a crisis issue that merits major attention.

In the US, 2,000 kids receive such treatment.  Again, all with the consent of their parents and under a doctor's care.  They're not being killed, they're just receiving treatment that is subject to medical debate.

190 kids died in car wrecks because they were unrestrained.

Nearly 4,000 people a year drown.

Nearly 7,000 people accidentally suffocate.

Globally, around 3 million children starve to death each year.

 

The degree of "concern" for an issue that is, statistically speaking, a non-issue, to the point that those who are so "concerned" about it will toss in their lot with the most openly cruel political movement since the 1940s....well, see, that's where the true colors come through.

It ain't about protecting kids at all.  If it WAS, the "concerned" people would be in favor of things that actually kept kids safe, and fed them, and shit like that.  They aren't.  They are willing to SACRIFICE all of those things, to make a stand on their pet issue.

Me?  I mostly think we should leave people the fuck alone, including families who are wrestling with a goddamned difficult thing involving their child, who they love and are trying to make the best decision for.  I agree that there are psychological and medical issues and concerns in play; I think those should be hashed out in, among, and by the medical community (which seems to be happening - it is a process, which is to be expected for a situation that has only in recent years even been accepted as something to be considered by medical practitioners).  Let it get sorted out, and know that inevitably, someone may end up hurt by the fact that the process takes time; if medical treatment of gender dysphoria turns out to be a bad thing, then some kids got a treatment that they shouldn't have.  Likewise, if medical treatment of gender dysphoria turns out to be a solid treatment...but we've banned it on the political level....then some kids who should have received a treatment that will help them were denied that treatment.  But of course, none of that matters.  That's not what this is about.  At all.  It's about item 7,547 in dividing society into "normal" people who get to shit all over "the other" -- we can't shit on those poor kids, of course....so we place our hatred on the evil parents of those dirty trans.  THEY are the ones turning people trans!  There wouldn't BE any trans people if those stupid evil parents didn't do their evil!

Add it to the pile.  It's not about caring for the ultimate outcome or kindness.  It's about carving out a group, aiming your ire at them, and feeling superior for doing so.  That's how we roll these days.

Edited by Brisketexan
  • Hook 'Em 5
  • Like 1
Posted
5 minutes ago, ChuckNorrisActionJeans said:

Leave the kids alone = Block access to gender-affirming care by law

Maybe read it this time.
 

 

 

I know yall will hate this one. I could post the euro reviews, and we'll hear about TERF island or other dumb shit, but here you go. Economist piece posted as well as AAP for full balance (still waiting on their systematic review, lol). 

https://opa.hhs.gov/sites/default/files/2025-05/gender-dysphoria-report.pdf

The economist treatment: https://www.economist.com/united-states/2025/05/05/where-the-trump-administration-has-science-on-its-side

And for good measure to get in front of it, the AAP response, which is lol: https://publications.aap.org/aapnews/news/32145/AAP-speaks-out-against-HHS-report-on-gender

1 minute ago, Brisketexan said:

Many of us think evidence-based examination of gender dysphoria and treatments should be a thing, and don't have a problem with an honest discussion of it.

Seems otherwise. 

  • Fuck You 1
Posted
1 minute ago, Anastasis said:

 

Maybe read it this time.
 

 

 

I know yall will hate this one. I could post the euro reviews, and we'll hear about TERF island or other dumb shit, but here you go. Economist piece posted as well as AAP for full balance (still waiting on their systematic review, lol). 

https://opa.hhs.gov/sites/default/files/2025-05/gender-dysphoria-report.pdf

The economist treatment: https://www.economist.com/united-states/2025/05/05/where-the-trump-administration-has-science-on-its-side

And for good measure to get in front of it, the AAP response, which is lol: https://publications.aap.org/aapnews/news/32145/AAP-speaks-out-against-HHS-report-on-gender

Seems otherwise. 

Naah.  We're just not biting on your logically fallacious distraction.

It's functionally a non-issue, and to the extent it's an issue, it's being played out in all the wrong places, in all the wrong ways.  And the fact that it aligns, as a "crisis issue," almost perfectly with the exact same people who want to erase trans people and gay people from society, is a pretty big fucking tell.

Leave them the fuck alone.  Quit picking on the weak and marginalized.  And yes, that includes picking on them by the proxy of "it's their evil libtard parents who are turning them queer."

Posted (edited)
40 minutes ago, Bojack said:

I think people are more often ignoring him and that's part of why he's become an even worse poster. He getting a bit less of the attention he craves, so he's increasingly embraced maga and more often flings personal insults among other things. 

Single payer health care. Slough off the dead, stupid, weight.

The evidence on  gender affirming care is in. Those folks denying it are liars acting from political bias. Institutions that support gender affirming care, here in the US: the American Medical Association, the American Psychiatric Association, the American Academy of Pediatrics, the Endocrine Society, and the Pediatric Endocrine Society.

 

Edited by Willfully Horn
Posted
14 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Many of us think evidence-based examination of gender dysphoria and treatments should be a thing, and don't have a problem with an honest discussion of it.

What we see right through is making something that affects 0.0005% of the population a crisis issue that merits major attention.

In the US, 2,000 kids receive such treatment.  Again, all with the consent of their parents and under a doctor's care.  They're not being killed, they're just receiving treatment that is subject to medical debate.

190 kids died in car wrecks because they were unrestrained.

Nearly 4,000 people a year drown.

Nearly 7,000 people accidentally suffocate.

Globally, around 3 million children starve to death each year.

 

The degree of "concern" for an issue that is, statistically speaking, a non-issue, to the point that those who are so "concerned" about it will toss in their lot with the most openly cruel political movement since the 1940s....well, see, that's where the true colors come through.

It ain't about protecting kids at all.  If it WAS, the "concerned" people would be in favor of things that actually kept kids safe, and fed them, and shit like that.  They aren't.  They are willing to SACRIFICE all of those things, to make a stand on their pet issue.

Me?  I mostly think we should leave people the fuck alone, including families who are wrestling with a goddamned difficult thing involving their child, who they love and are trying to make the best decision for.  I agree that there are psychological and medical issues and concerns in play; I think those should be hashed out in, among, and by the medical community (which seems to be happening - it is a process, which is to be expected for a situation that has only in recent years even been accepted as something to be considered by medical practitioners).  Let it get sorted out, and know that inevitably, someone may end up hurt by the fact that the process takes time; if medical treatment of gender dysphoria turns out to be a bad thing, then some kids got a treatment that they shouldn't have.  Likewise, if medical treatment of gender dysphoria turns out to be a solid treatment...but we've banned it on the political level....then some kids who should have received a treatment that will help them were denied that treatment.  But of course, none of that matters.  That's not what this is about.  At all.  It's about item 7,547 in dividing society into "normal" people who get to shit all over "the other" -- we can't shit on those poor kids, of course....so we place our hatred on the evil parents of those dirty trans.  THEY are the ones turning people trans!  There wouldn't BE any trans people if those stupid evil parents didn't do their evil!

Add it to the pile.  It's not about caring for the ultimate outcome or kindness.  It's about carving out a group, aiming your ire at them, and feeling superior for doing so.  That's how we roll these days.

While I agree with you, what’s the point of engaging with a troll and giving him what he wants? You’re spent infinitely more time engaging him than he deserves. His brain is broken.

  • Hook 'Em 2
  • Like 1
Posted
5 minutes ago, safe sex said:

Never mind completely ignoring the vast vast majority of lived trans experience

One step away from sucking paste out of a tube from tractor supply. 

  • Fuck You 1
Posted
24 minutes ago, safe sex said:

Never mind completely ignoring the vast vast majority of lived trans experience

And just being an unrepentant asshole to someone he once called a friend.

  • Like 1
Posted
1 hour ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

Against my better judgement I'm going to wade in for a hot second, then probably wade back out.  The subject of rapid onset gender dysphoria is hotly debated and depending on where you sit is where you wind up viewing things.  That said,  I hope none of you parents have to experience it.   Hate linking to amazon so here:

https://bookshop.org/p/books/is-my-child-trans-a-guide-for-parents-stella-o-malley/20225435?ean=9781634312486&next=t


I'm about as far left as it gets.  I'm the true whacko lefty in terms of the majority of my views.  But when my previously very feminine daughter who never exhibited one iota of having previous gender dysphoria decided she wanted a new name and new pronouns, I'm now somehow maga for not affirming that self diagnosis.  There is no other health issue where a child could tell you something and you would be forced to accept it.  If your child came up to you and said they thought they had breast cancer and wanted some chemo and a masectomy would you just affirm that? And very few people understand what you're going though.  And then yeah, you go too far into trying to find sympathetic ears and you wind up in maga land.  Because goddamned mental health and medical issues are politicized in this country. 

That book summarizes a lot of issues I can't fully debate or argue well here.  There are multiple reasons the NHS ended gender affirming care for youth.   As to my personal situation, my child found a group of friends that accepted her.  All of them young teen girls who are now  all 'boys' with new names and costumes. And binders.  And the leader of the group is on testosterone already.  There's also plenty of non-gender specific mental issues that were already in the mix with this crew.  Anorexia, cutting, suicidal ideation at times.  Most of which seems to be done for the 'look at me' affect but what parent can ignore any of this.  And mine was in therapy before she decided to 'come out.'  And sorry, but Ana is right about the social media aspect to it all as well.   And the high amount of this crew in such a small town that somehow all are gender dysphoric at the same time never previously showing symptoms sure seems strange.  I also think its connected to the fact that they are well middle to very upper middle class white kids who haven't had an real struggles in life.  So now they get to have one.  And they get to be celebrated.  And they get to support each other.  At the same time if their parent don't immediately affirm, then we're transphobic bigots.

We also have very first hand knowledge of a set of friends who had kids that actually exhibited trans signs at an early age.  we all thought "yeah that tracks."  That child went on the puberty blockers and grew breasts (male to female).  Now as a high school graduate regrets everything and wants to be male again, and is now sterile for life.  And that's a child we thought tracked as trans.  Our own child absolutely never exhibited anything like it. Was the pink, and barbie doll girl from an early age (at the time much to the chagrin of my wife).  Not one friend that we've told has come back with "yeah, that tracks."  Most have been befuddled and can't believe it.  Many have said "that's just a trendy phase now."

I'm not looking for nor do I deserve sympathy from anyone here.  But this has my wrecked my wife. She's lost her daughter, at least for the moment.  And lost her to something that feels absolutely fake.  Absolutely not who she is deep down.    It has thrown into a deep depression, and much anger.  It plays on my mental health now all the time as well.  We feel thoroughly helpless.  I have tried to be neutral about it.  I use the new name but not the new gender. But something we are aligned on is no hormones or surgeries until our child is a self supporting adult.  But I'm in Oregon where at the age of 14 she can go around us and get it done anyway.  Wonderful.  I have seen too much to think children should self diagnose, get immediate affirmation, and then get medical treatment.   Treatment that can cause real long term damage.  And the arrogance in folks who think they know the child you have spent their whole life with is astounding. 

So yeah, I'm against medical intervention for this with youth.  And I fucking hate MAGA.

MCFB, you seem to have your personal messages function turned off. Please consider changing that setting. 

Posted
8 minutes ago, safe sex said:

It's almost like the issue should be handled by the family and their medical provider(s) and everyone else should stay the fuck out of their business.

It's almost like any other psychiatric condition should be handled, informed by the principles of evidence based medicine. 

It's wilding that this is not obvious. 

  • Fuck You 1
Posted
29 minutes ago, Anastasis said:

It's almost like any other psychiatric condition should be handled, informed by the principles of evidence based medicine. 

It's wilding that this is not obvious. 

Just fuck off man. No one is enjoying the engagement you are driving here in this thread. Just move on. 

Posted
28 minutes ago, immamac said:

Just fuck off man. No one is enjoying the engagement you are driving here in this thread. Just move on. 

That you think "enjoyment" is the endpoint is pretty telling. Particularly in this thread, but more broadly. Fuck right off immamac. 

  • Fuck Around and Find Out 1
Posted
5 hours ago, Bojack said:

I think people are more often ignoring him and that's part of why he's become an even worse poster. He's getting a bit less of the attention he craves, so he's increasingly embraced maga and more often flings personal insults among other things. 

this is it 100%

 

  • Hook 'Em 2
Posted
9 hours ago, troph said:

I’m really sorry for your distress and the pain your family is going through. As the resident trans person, I can say I’ve never advocated for quick transition or irreversible treatment until to the best of everyone’s abilities it’s confirmed the trans identity is stable and not changing back. I’ve talked to dozens and dozens of parents and supported their cautious approach. In our kids school some have tried on trans identities, others gay identities only to change back pretty quickly. The thing about the old days is you knew to keep this shit hidden and deep, but in the end if we can’t transition early enough we have to destroy the lives of many people to transition later. That’s no good either for those of us who knew early. Now it’s more accepting so we have folks trying it on and it’s not permanent. I get it. Honestly I don’t think legal bans are good, but I don’t think quick transitions are good either. What I will say is this, after 38 years of knowing and dealing with this shit (since I was 11), suffering my own despair for years then turning my life and the lives of others upside down, I can tell you there is one universal truth about being trans or struggling with gender identity issues - pain and suffering - but there can be a beautiful ending.  In the end I think it’s an acute version of what it means to be human and a lot of the time it sucks donkey ass.  I’m sorry for the pain you’re going through. Love your kiddo, love your wife. No harsh words coming from me to another parent who is trying their best to love them, no way. 

Thank you for the kind reply.  And I appreciate your story.  I hope its obvious that I would never question other's trans identity or needs.  We are loving our child the best we can, and so far our connections still seem good.  We try to focus on that.  And we're also aware that the "loss of the child" is a grief we would face anyway, regardless of gender.  They have to leave the nest after all.

Quote

Honestly I don’t think legal bans are good, but I don’t think quick transitions are good either



Well that's our issue.  And I cannot claim  an answer obviously. I just personally feel parents should have a say in their child's medical care and decisions.  I don't know at what point that line gets crossed, but I know it scares us.

  • Hook 'Em 6
  • Like 1
Posted
16 hours ago, ChuckNorrisActionJeans said:

All of the trans adults I know (gen x basically) didn't "come out" as kids because there was no widespread knowledge of what being trans was, nor was there internet or any other realistic way for a kid then to figure out their situation/why they felt the way they did (and any attempt would have been/was met with 100% condemnation). I sure wish they had been able to do so because it would have headed off a whole myriad of life problems. But we can't have that... they must suffer for being different, I guess. And who gives a shit about people's lived experience, anyway. We must keep talking about "them" and regulating "them", instead of listening to "them" 

I will forever live with a heavy, heavy, heavy heart knowing how much pain my condition caused me and many others. I once thought I could out run it, I could distract myself from it or even earlier on, absolve myself completely of it. Now I know that constant pain and suffering is my lot in life, not so much in who I am, but in the circumstances that dictate how I dealt with it and how I show up in the world. Honestly, there is not a day that goes by that I am not acutely aware of my difference, as I hide in plain sight, knowing that I do not belong in this world and that my very existence has hurt so many I love and is despised by so many who have no interest in knowing me. There is another side to the experience, and people in my life have rebuilt and recovered, and for that I am happy and also full of grief. My ex seems really happy, her career has taken off. My kids are doing extremely well, beyond thriving they are at the top of their peer group just killing it. Their mental health is strong, their values in tact and their trajectory is full of blue skies and fair winds. My wife and I are stable, calm and easing through middle age. BUT, the past is still there and it is full of destruction. In the end, I think that's what "they" want - and for me, I just have to try my best to live in the moment where I'm not at risk for harming others due to a mismatch that either drives me to death or drives me to constant sorrow and a constant wake of pain for others, and enjoy the current state of recovery for everyone. It is, however, a daily challenge, and this pain is something I will carry until my natural life runs its course.

It doesn't have to be this way.

  • Hook 'Em 2
  • Like 5
Posted
44 minutes ago, troph said:

The fundamental issue is the god damn politicalization of trans-ness. You’ve got one side saying it’s “ideology” which leaves the other side entrenched. Kids want to rebel and want attention so they try things. In the end, if we could just stop with the politicalization, we could identify trans kids and folk, treat them and move on. 

I get the reason why people want to ban and the reason why people scream protect trans kids and don’t want to question those who identify as trans. The fundamental problem here, is the politicalization of the issue. 

stop that, a ton of the ancillary problems go away and all that’s left is treating those who really are trans. And that quite frankly should be the only goal, identity those who really are trans and get them help. Nothing more, nothing less. 

all this.  all of it.  making science and health issues political has been a problem in this country for some time.  and it only got worse with the current regime.

  • Hook 'Em 6
  • Like 1
Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

Thank you for the kind reply.  And I appreciate your story.  I hope its obvious that I would never question other's trans identity or needs.  We are loving our child the best we can, and so far our connections still seem good.  We try to focus on that.  And we're also aware that the "loss of the child" is a grief we would face anyway, regardless of gender.  They have to leave the nest after all.



Well that's our issue.  And I cannot claim  an answer obviously. I just personally feel parents should have a say in their child's medical care and decisions.  I don't know at what point that line gets crossed, but I know it scares us.

I have no question about your stance.  I also believe parents are a key stakeholder in the process and I do not support excluding them. I think the red states have messed this up, but I wouldn't be surprised if the blue states have too, the opposite direction.

when parents are a key stakeholder, it is true some kids will suffer, but if we take politics out of it, turn to science and trust experts who took an oath to do no harm, we can get through this. I think excluding parents is simply a mistake, really a grave one, but it does leave us vulnerable to those who are close minded and unable to deal. Unfortunately, the world is what it is, kids are raised by adults, you sometimes win that lottery, you sometimes lose. I fucking lost that lottery in a bigly way. but until evolution changes the way humans mature, there's really not much we can do about the parents that suck except hope the resiliency of humanity carries us through (as it did for me).

Edited by troph
  • Hook 'Em 3
  • Like 1
Posted (edited)

all of the shit that crosses into what evangelicals and catholics think are biblical issues are completely fucked up - abortion, gender affirming care, assisted suicide, right to die, death penalty, I'm sure there is more, but EVERY SINGLE ONE of these issues is FUBAR'd politically.  That is 100% the root cause of the problem here.  I have tremendous empathy for anyone ground up in these issues - in any way - because of this reality.

Edited by troph
  • Hook 'Em 2
Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, MC Fresh Breath said:

But I'm in Oregon where at the age of 14 she can go around us and get it done anyway.  Wonderful.  I have seen too much to think children should self diagnose, get immediate affirmation, and then get medical treatment.   Treatment that can cause real long term damage.  And the arrogance in folks who think they know the child you have spent their whole life with is astounding. 

Just to add context/information, as I understand it, the laws in the western states that created the ability for teens to get medical treatment without parental consent(and in many instances forbidding parental notification) were enacted with the intent of allowing underage girls to get an abortion in the 1980's.  

Edited by Incredulity
  • Hook 'Em 1
Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

Just to add context/information, as I understand it, the laws in the western states that created the ability for teens to get medical treatment without parental consent(and in many instances forbidding parental notification) were enacted with the intent of allowing underage girls to get an abortion in the 1980's.  

I have a hard time with that intent as well. having parents as gatekeepers is an imperfect construct, but its better than absolute bans and in many, many cases its better than kids having complete control over their lives at such a young age. maybe that's my historical conservative leanings, but if we could design an optimal scenario, it's no bans and parents, doctors, mental health professionals and the child (patient) making informed decisions about what's best for them in an intimate, careful, thoughtful and knowledgeable way. and of all the weak points we can uncover in all the various ways this can play out - red state bans, blue state exclusions of parents, or parents having a voice and say in the process, the inclusion of parents to the exclusion of the state in all respects is the closest to the ideal that I can come up with, so the risk of misinformed and bad parenting is a risk I think we have to accept.

Edited by troph
  • Hook 'Em 4
  • Like 1
Posted
9 minutes ago, troph said:

I have a hard time with that intent as well. having parents as gatekeepers is an imperfect construct, but its better than absolute bans and in many, many cases its better than kids having complete control over their lives at such a young age. maybe that's my historical conservative leanings, but if we could design an optimal scenario, it's no bans and parents, doctors, mental health professionals and the child (patient) making informed decisions about what's best for them in an intimate, careful, thoughtful and knowledgeable way. and of all the weak points we can uncover in all the various ways this can play out - red state bans, blue state exclusions of parents, or parents having a voice and say in the process, the inclusion of parents to the exclusion of the state in all respects is the closest to the ideal that I can come up with, so the risk of misinformed and bad parenting is a risk I think we have to accept.

totally agree.

  • Hook 'Em 1
Posted

Look at MC and Troph (and others) having a real, honest, thoughtful conversation about a genuinely tough issue.  Which can happen, in the absence of politicized trolling.  Truly, if you wanted a study in contrasts to perfectly illustrate how broken our society is, vs. how it SHOULD be, the contrast between today's post string and yesterday's (but for MC's initial post) captures it perfectly.

There's a rational, decent, medically and psychologically sound way to approach this particular issue.  No, it will never be perfect (in complex matters, you hardly ever hit the bullseye of "we got it exactly right"), but it will be a lot more so - and create a lot less collateral damage - if it is not politicized, but instead is based on a decent mix of humanity and reason.

MC and Troph are impressive, good, and kind people.  And it pains me to see them experiencing or even remembering the challenges and pain their experiences involve.  I can't want anything but the best for both of them and their families.  And . . . shouldn't that be the goal for ALL of us, for EVERYONE?  I don't want to be "right" - I don't give a shit, what I personally take from the "debate" doesn't make a shit, as I'm not personally affected by it.  I just want the folks who ARE in it to have a fair chance to get it "right" for them and theirs, and to be supported and not harassed/berated by society in doing so.  Seriously, what's so fucking wrong with us that we can't simply settle on that approach?

  • Hook 'Em 3
  • Like 4
Posted
1 minute ago, troph said:

thank you and I really want to underscore that what is truly non-negotiable here for anyone one close to this issue - not just me, not just a trans kid, not just a questioning kid who isn't trans, and not just the parents or ex-husbands, ex-wives, the parents of adult trans folk and the kiddos of trans folk - but all of us - is that empathy, compassion and open-mindedness, a willingness to listen and understand is deeply needed.

Agreed, and this should be the thought process for literally everything. In the end, our society might crumble anyways, but better to live this path than any other. 

 

  • Hook 'Em 2
  • Like 2
Posted
1 minute ago, Hank Kingsley said:

Agreed, and this should be the thought process for literally everything. In the end, our society might crumble anyways, but better to live this path than any other. 

Dead-on.  But, contrast that with the dominant political ethos of the moment:

Elon Musk: "the fundamental weakness of Western civilization is empathy." 

Two two competing approaches aren't "different paths to the same destination," they are polar opposites.  Metaphorically, we are arguing between "should we douse ourselves in gasoline and light ourselves on fire, bathing in the cleansing flames?  Or should we NOT light ourselves on fire?"  There's not really a middle ground.  And right now (see yesterday's post string), we are in full-on self-immolation, because when I light myself or others on fire, it makes stupid libs scream "NO!", and that means I'm winning.

The right approach doesn't mean that hard choices can't be made.  It doesn't mean that people won't end up being hurt, one way or the other; in imperfect systems (as all systems are), that's inevitable.

My bigger-picture fear -- and current conclusion -- is that we have to put empathy aside for the moment.  First, we have to fight back and defeat the monster that is hate and cruelty.  And that....requires dirtying our hands.  I sure as shit never wanted it to be this way, but here we are.

Posted

You don’t have to put aside empathy for those who are suffering to fight back, you fight back because of the empathy toward those who are suffering. 

 

  • Hook 'Em 2
  • Like 3


×
×
  • Create New...