Texas O-line talk

[Codaxx 5405]

1 minute ago, BurntOrange&White said:

Also Should mention that Jones was so late getting to his guy. 
 

 

Yes, he is slow and late. The issue is 6 blockers for 5 rushers. Majors and Kerstetter are blocking air. My point was I believe Okafor and Majors needed to pick up the interior DL twist. Instead Okafor picked up 1 and Majors blocks air. If they pass that off both interior DL are blocked. If Jones passes on the blitzer, he likely plants Casey earlier. 

[BurntOrange&White 38710]

4 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

Yes, he is slow and late. The issue is 6 blockers for 5 rushers. Majors and Kerstetter are blocking air. My point was I believe Okafor and Majors needed to pick up the interior DL twist. Instead Okafor picked up 1 and Majors blocks air. If they pass that off both interior DL are blocked. If Jones passes on the blitzer, he likely plants Casey earlier. 

None of that matters as the pressure came from where Jones got thrown off his space. And you know how I know you’re full of shit and not watching very closely? Because you said majors didn’t block anyone when in reality Majors and Okafor actually did well picking up the twist. But once again Jones getting pushed like he did allowed 9 to work all the way around and into the play again. 
 

the person you’re trying to blame here is Kerstetter but Kerstetter does well not vacating his space in case the linebacker on the strong side(his side) decided to blitz. 
 

 

Once again Jones completely fucked this play from the start 

Edited September 20, 2021 by BurntOrange&White

[Codaxx 5405]

1 minute ago, BurntOrange&White said:

None of that matters as the pressure came from where Jones got thrown off his space. And you know how I know you’re full of shit and not watching very closely? Because you said majors didn’t block anyone when in reality Majors and Okafor actually did well picking up the twist. But once again Jones getting pushed like he did allowed 9 to work all the way around and into the play again. 
 

the person you’re trying to blame here is Kerstetter but Kerstetter does well not vacating his space in case the linebacker on the strong side(his side) decided to blitz. 
 

 

Once again Jones completely fucked this play from the start 

They didn’t pick up the stunt and that is irrefutable, because the DT lined up on Majors right shoulder hit Casey. Nobody blamed Kerstetter, so maybe you need to go and read. 

[BurntOrange&White 38710]

7 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

They didn’t pick up the stunt and that is irrefutable, because the DT lined up on Majors right shoulder hit Casey. Nobody blamed Kerstetter, so maybe you need to go and read. 

I’m telling you that you completely didn’t view correctly and blamed someone that picked up the “stunt”

majors has hat on hat here his guy goes completely around once Jones gets forced so far inside  Okafor has a hat on a hat as well. Majors actually does a good job sliding over to get his hat on the guy 

Literally this play got fucked because Jones everyone else did their job. No reason for this specific play for our LT to have his back to the lane the defender came across. 

Edited September 20, 2021 by BurntOrange&White

[BurntOrange&White 38710]

Honestly I’m not even sure that was designed by rice that way. I just think the defender just made a play to go across 

[Codaxx 5405]

4 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

I’m telling you that you completely didn’t view correctly and blamed someone that picked up the “stunt”

majors has hat on hat here his guy goes completely around once Jones gets forced so far inside  Okafor has a hat on a hat as well. Majors actually does a good job sliding over to get his hat on the guy 

Literally this play got fucked because Jones everyone else did their job. No reason for this specific play for our LT to have his back to the lane the defender came across. 

Look at the bottom photo. Jones is on the blitzer. Brewer is engaged. Majors and Kerstetter have nobody to block. Majors is actually turned around and facing Thompson, as is Okafor. The DL lined up in A gap is now running free toward Casey through the opposite A gap

[BurntOrange&White 38710]

4 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

Look at the bottom photo. Jones is on the blitzer. Brewer is engaged. Majors and Kerstetter have nobody to block. Majors is actually turned around and facing Thompson, as is Okafor. The DL lined up in A gap is now running free toward Casey through the opposite A gap

Jones was late to the blitzer the DE was holding contain shoved him in and it collapsed the left side of the line.  That’s why the play failed. Not because of any of the ancillary stuff you’re trying to point out. 
 

Majors put his hat on the guy and did a good job shuffling to get there. His guy then makes a choice to go all the way around to the spot vacated by Jones. 

Edited September 20, 2021 by BurntOrange&White

[Codaxx 5405]

15 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

Jones was late to the blitzer the DE was holding contain shoved him in and it collapsed the left side of the line.  That’s why the play failed. Not because of any of the ancillary stuff you’re trying to point out. 
 

Majors put his hat on the guy and did a good job shuffling to get there. His guy then makes a choice to go all the way around to the spot vacated by Jones. 

We can agree to disagree. I am positive that was a twist between the interior DL and you think the guy just looped around on his own. We aren’t going to come to an agreement 

[BurntOrange&White 38710]

Just now, Codaxx said:

We can agree to disagree. I am positive that was a twist between the interior DL and you think the guy just looped around on his own. We aren’t going to come to an agreement 

No we can’t because you’re flat out wrong and grasping at straws to prove an incorrect point. 

[Codaxx 5405]

6 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

No we can’t because you’re flat out wrong and grasping at straws to prove an incorrect point. 

Damn, you are sensitive little man 

[GringoSalado 1639]

At least they didn't block each other.

[Vertigo 20203]

[LTtxfan 48688]

9 hours ago, HenryJames said:

Is that Worthy blocking at the top of the screen??

Whoever that WR is did a good job walling off that DB...

[westexhorn 1994]

1 minute ago, LTtxfan said:

Is that Worthy blocking at the top of the screen??

Whoever that WR is did a good job walling off that DB...

Yes that's Worthy

[BurntOrange&White 38710]

6 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

Is that Worthy blocking at the top of the screen??

Whoever that WR is did a good job walling off that DB...

On Johnathan Brooks touchdown run there was a good block by the WR as well. I belive it's Dixon....but it's a great block that I don't think any of our WR's make the prior 8 years.

 

 

[LTtxfan 48688]

Thx for this @satyanash 

Scipio Tex -- 2021 Texas-Rice Postmortem: Offense

While the players certainly demonstrated effort and some athletic pride after last week's loss, the Texas coaches also showed a bit of introspection with a game plan that featured outside zone in the running game and Xavier Worthy in the passing game. The Slippery Splinter Sprinter from Fresno caught 7 balls for 88 yards and a touchdown in the first half and demonstrated some of the edge and heart that Texas needs. I saw you put that shoulder into a dude on the punt return, Xavier.

Texas also made a point of attacking the Owl size deficiencies in the back 7. Early and often.

That was mean. That play is truncated, but it's actually outsize zone going the other way. Bijan sees the overplay and offers a vicious cutback to punish the over pursuit. This is one of 100 reasons that OZ is awesome with a running back like Bijan and a fairly athletic Texas OL that benefits from certainty, but at this point, how much I sell you on outside zone doesn't matter, does it?

OL

They struggled a little early in protection (it's almost always on play action or when we are pulling linemen in pass protection - OL with unclear assignments often block air - especially ours) and passing off defenders in the run game, but when they were good, they were great. Rice's front is the strength of their entire program and they have a couple of legitimate dudes, so don't totally dismiss the improvement in the running game with "It's Rice." Just partially dismiss it. The Horn offensive line overcame some early rocky moments to eventually find their legs, get hat and hat, and then pile drive Rice defenders into the dirt. The holes were cavernous at times.

While much is made of the rhythms of the passing game, running games have a rhythm and timing element as well. Sometimes uncorking on a bad defense can help to get it down and clarify for a staff what the team is good at.

Christian Jones had a hold and gave up a free rusher once. He's also very inconsistent in his pass sets. At this stage, every one of them should look the same. They're not. He needs some individual attention and to get out of his own head. He is athletic though and really thrives when he can use it in the running game. I need him meaner. When Okafor was good, he crushed people. Had a mental hiccup or two. Majors was very solid against a legit dude at NT. Kerstetter was effective and had a crushing drive block on a 3rd and 6 running play with Roschon where he sprang him for 14 yards over right tackle. This was Angilau's best run blocking game since Utah- on Bijan's long touchdown run, he caved an entire side of the Rice defensive line, effectively sealing the entire backside of the defense singlehandedly. 

Bijan gets the praise there, but let's be clear about who wore the cape on that highlight.

Observation: our 2nd team OL has a nastier disposition than our 1st team. A lot of of that is because of Andrej Karic. He had six pancakes and Karic repeatedly made a point of punishing Rice defenders with finishing blocks at a juncture in the game where most guys are striking deals to let up. Karic is very chippy. I have to accept that I simply have a different view of football than Flood. I want edge, motor, and cruelty in my starting lineup. Even at a tiny 6-4, 290.

I dig Logan Parr in limited viewing and Hookfin is an easy mover at 300+. I can't believe how wide and thick Hayden Conner is. His natural base is so strong that if he develops even decent feet and technique, it's going to very difficult for any college pass rusher that isn't a high NFL draft pick to do much with him.

Edited September 21, 2021 by LTtxfan

[Hiphopopotamos 20850]

Ian Boyd's latest on why it might not be as easy as just inserting Karic into the starting lineup:

Quote

 

The second-team offensive line looked good against Rice. The first team looked pretty good as well, and the second team didn’t have to try to execute any protections for double move play-action shots. They just got to line up and mash a worn down unit who wanted to get back to Houston.

Still, we could see a few things we’ve consistently seen. Hayden Conner is hard to get around, he’s an even bigger and stronger version of Junior Angilau and an obvious fit for this scheme. Andrej Karic continues to be athletic and tough in every instance where we see him get snaps for the Longhorns. Tope Imade was also powerful and solid in his opportunities.

So what do we make of this? Should there be a lineup change?

Maybe, but also maybe not. What exactly would the change be to raise the caliber of this unit?

Hayden Conner may be better than Junior Angilau and/or Denzel Okafor, but is he better right now? Consider that pass protection and assignment errors have been the main issue for Texas and Conner is a true freshman who’s been cross-training at two positions. Is he ready to offer consistently clean play? I have no idea.

The more popular change I think most would like to see is inserting Karic into the starting lineup. The only question, where?

He might be a better left tackle than Christian Jones, but then Jones was said to have had a better camp and continues to be one of the more promising athletes on the entire unit who just needs more consistency. Perhaps Texas could put Karic in and either slide Jones over to right tackle or put Karic at right tackle, but does this line really get better without Derek Kerstetter? The super senior had a bad outing against Arkansas but then was good against Rice and is steady in pass protection and a leader in the locker room. It may be Karic needs to replace one of these guys but it’s not as cut and dry a situation as it appears when he’s pancaking people in garbage time.

The other popular solution is to continue to play both Kerstetter and Jones while adding Karic but to slide someone inside to guard, ideally to Denzel Okafor’s place at left guard. There’s more problems here though.

Okafor is a great run blocker in zone and while his pass protection has been shoddy it’s not obvious to me moving a tackle inside will make the situation better. Can any of these three tackles anchor against a defensive tackle coming downhill on them? Would they be strong enough to get push? Do any of them have any real experience or knowhow for playing guard in the new system or will they also be prone to mental breakdowns which lead to inside pressure?

I see what everyone else sees, it seems Andrej Karic is one of the five best offensive linemen on the team and maybe THE best. However, fitting him into the starting lineup isn’t quite the slam dunk you’d think. Maybe the best solution would be sliding the versatile Kerstetter inside to guard and playing Karic at right tackle. Since fall camp I’ve suspected the most likely solution would be for Karic to get the start if there’s an injury (anywhere on the line, really) and then to Wally Pipp someone and refuse to relinquish the gig.

We’ll get to Texas Tech later in the week, but I suspect the Red Raiders will offer the current offensive line and quarterback another chance to build confidence and cohesion before the real test on the road to Gary Patterson’s Fort.

 

 

[LTtxfan 48688]

Scipio Tex -- Everyone Gets A Trophy Podcast (Sept 20)  "Filling Up On Rice"

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/filling-up-on-rice/id1479624200?i=1000536078923

 21 minute mark -- Discuses O-line. 

 

I just came up with the new SURLY OL Slogan:

 "NEED MORE KARIC" 

  

 

Edited September 21, 2021 by LTtxfan

[gmr548 16251]

The more popular change I think most would like to see is inserting Karic into the starting lineup. The only question, where?

He might be a better left tackle than Christian Jones, but then Jones was said to have had a better camp and continues to be one of the more promising athletes on the entire unit who just needs more consistency. 
 

LOTS MORE WORDS

Taking “Karic is better than Christian Jones at LT” and then somehow turning that into a dozen more paragraphs to say “But how could we find a way to get Karic into the lineup?” is the most Ian Boyd thing ever.

lol yeah

The fact that it’s an issue to insert Karic at LT because of Jones’s potential at the position is also stupid, because we’re not talking about a RS FR or something. He’s a fourth year junior that started all last year. You know what you’ve got at this point.

The issue with Jones sliding down to guard bring an unknown is also on bad coaching decisions - they didn’t rotate him in when they had a chance in the spring and fall camp. I agree it’s probably untenable at this point but that’s on the coaches for not looking at it earlier when there’s little doubt Karic was better at OT and Okafor was whiffing in pass pro, just like they always have been.

Ultimately it comes down to two coaching staffs looking at Christian Jones and thinking they can unlock some theoretical high ceiling for him at tackle.

[Codaxx 5405]

21 minutes ago, gmr548 said:

Taking “Karic is better than Christian Jones at LT” and then somehow turning that into a dozen more paragraphs to say “But how could we find a way to get Karic into the lineup?” is the most Ian Boyd thing ever.

lol yeah

The fact that it’s an issue to insert Karic at LT because of Jones’s potential at the position is also stupid, because we’re not talking about a RS FR or something. He’s a fourth year junior that started all last year. You know what you’ve got at this point.

The issue with Jones sliding down to guard bring an unknown is also on bad coaching decisions - they didn’t rotate him in when they had a chance in the spring and fall camp. I agree it’s probably untenable at this point but that’s on the coaches for not looking at it earlier when there’s little doubt Karic was better at OT and Okafor was whiffing in pass pro, just like they always have been.

Ultimately it comes down to two coaching staffs looking at Christian Jones and thinking they can unlock some theoretical high ceiling for him at tackle.

I listened to Scip talking about Karic. He is an unabashed fan. One thing that caught my attention was him saying the OL could use Karic’s attitude. Forgot the player he heard it from by the guy told him “it’s great to have an asshole line up next you. He is getting in fights. Riling up the other team. You get riled up defending him”.  Maybe it’s the post Arkansas blues, but I agree it would be nice to see some nasty injected into the OL. 

[Vertigo 20203]

On 9/20/2021 at 4:39 PM, Duane Moore said:

I’m really enjoying this back and forth on offensive philosophy. Both sides are making good cases by people who know their X’s and O’s very well. This is high level discussion for a message board. 

 

Edited October 4, 2021 by Vertigo

[LTtxfan 48688]

18 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

I listened to Scip talking about Karic. He is an unabashed fan. One thing that caught my attention was him saying the OL could use Karic’s attitude. Forgot the player he heard it from by the guy told him “it’s great to have an asshole line up next you. He is getting in fights. Riling up the other team. You get riled up defending him”.  Maybe it’s the post Arkansas blues, but I agree it would be nice to see some nasty injected into the OL. 

It was Drew Kelson that Scipio was referring to...

 

Start around 23 minute mark

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/filling-up-on-rice/id1479624200?i=1000536078923

 

Edited September 22, 2021 by LTtxfan

[Red Five 40108]

Holy shit that Ian Boyd piece. Summed up, "Karic may be the best OL on the team, but he may not be able to start because stuff". I think this was my favorite part:

"Perhaps Texas could put Karic in and either slide Jones over to right tackle or put Karic at right tackle, but does this line really get better without Derek Kerstetter?"

[westexhorn 1994]

I just watched Texas vs Rice first half again.  Our pass protection is definitely shaky...  both times Casey tried to take a shot on 1st down he got hit pretty hard before being able to let the ball fly.  

[futureman 22324]

On 9/20/2021 at 6:38 PM, Codaxx said:

Damn, you are sensitive little man 

he is! dumb, too. 

[LTtxfan 48688]

 

[Gucci_Suit 2568]

4 hours ago, LTtxfan said:

 

Pfff. We’d need line help if we were joining 26-6A. 

[Texasrocks 2110]

I rewatched the first half and tried to pay more attention to the o-line. I know almost nothing about o-line play, but I don't get why Jones is being singled out for poor play. There were some hilarious break-downs with other guys. For example, take Bijan's first TD. A couple of things stood out. First, Bijan is really good. This should have been a stop for no gain, but the defender ended up on his butt while Bijan was celebrating in the endzone. Second, Kerstetter went right by the defender and didn't even look to his right. Fortunately, Bijan is a stud so it didn't matter.

[6th Street 6245]

7 minutes ago, Texasrocks said:

I rewatched the first half and tried to pay more attention to the o-line. I know almost nothing about o-line play, but I don't get why Jones is being singled out for poor play. There were some hilarious break-downs with other guys. For example, take Bijan's first TD. A couple of things stood out. First, Bijan is really good. This should have been a stop for no gain, but the defender ended up on his butt while Bijan was celebrating in the endzone. Second, Kerstetter went right by the defender and didn't even look to his right. Fortunately, Bijan is a stud so it didn't matter.

Nice effort by Jones there - almost got a hand on his guy 

[westexhorn 1994]

6 minutes ago, Texasrocks said:

I rewatched the first half and tried to pay more attention to the o-line. I know almost nothing about o-line play, but I don't get why Jones is being singled out for poor play. There were some hilarious break-downs with other guys. For example, take Bijan's first TD. A couple of things stood out. First, Bijan is really good. This should have been a stop for no gain, but the defender ended up on his butt while Bijan was celebrating in the endzone. Second, Kerstetter went right by the defender and didn't even look to his right. Fortunately, Bijan is a stud so it didn't matter.

I dont know much either but i think that has to do with us running outside zone.  The Tackle ignores the Edge guy that is away from the direction of the play.  

[westexhorn 1994]

3 minutes ago, 6th Street said:

Nice effort by Jones there - almost got a hand on his guy 

Christian Jones is so damn slow... OU fast edges are gonna make him spin over and over all game.  Hell if i am Tech's DC i would just attack the shit out of our left side of the line.

Edited September 23, 2021 by westexhorn

[Texasrocks 2110]

Here's another one. This is from the first drive. A blitzer lines up right in the middle. At the snap, neither Majors nor Okafor pick him up. I think this is on Okafor - he goes for the double team and ignores a guy right in front of him.

[westexhorn 1994]

1 minute ago, Texasrocks said:

Here's another one. This is from the first drive. A blitzer lines up right in the middle. At the snap, neither Majors nor Okafor pick him up. I think this is on Okafor - he goes for the double team and ignores a guy right in front of him.

Yup i just thought of that play too.  Just send someone straight through the middle on first down.  Bijan did whiff that block though.

[Texasrocks 2110]

5 minutes ago, westexhorn said:

I dont know much either but i think that has to do with us running outside zone.  The Tackle ignores the Edge guy that is away from the direction of the play.  

But that isn't the edge defender. I can't tell if it's the linebacker or the safety, but he came inside the end. I assume Kerstetter was supposed to help with the tackle and then get to the second level. But he ignores the LB/safety coming right through the gap he just vacated.

[Atticus 3892]

18 minutes ago, Texasrocks said:

I rewatched the first half and tried to pay more attention to the o-line. I know almost nothing about o-line play, but I don't get why Jones is being singled out for poor play. There were some hilarious break-downs with other guys. For example, take Bijan's first TD. A couple of things stood out. First, Bijan is really good. This should have been a stop for no gain, but the defender ended up on his butt while Bijan was celebrating in the endzone. Second, Kerstetter went right by the defender and didn't even look to his right. Fortunately, Bijan is a stud so it didn't matter.

QB blocks the edge guy with the read

[Burt Macklin 18960]

24 minutes ago, Texasrocks said:

I rewatched the first half and tried to pay more attention to the o-line. I know almost nothing about o-line play, but I don't get why Jones is being singled out for poor play. There were some hilarious break-downs with other guys. For example, take Bijan's first TD. A couple of things stood out. First, Bijan is really good. This should have been a stop for no gain, but the defender ended up on his butt while Bijan was celebrating in the endzone. Second, Kerstetter went right by the defender and didn't even look to his right. Fortunately, Bijan is a stud so it didn't matter.

I find it funny you ask why Jones gets so much shit and then post a play where he completely whiffs on his man. 

[Texasrocks 2110]

18 minutes ago, Atticus said:

QB blocks the edge guy with the read

The edge guy is 33, he doesn't matter. Watch the guy in the middle who whiffs on the tackle. He's not being read - he passes within a foot of Kerstetter.

[Texasrocks 2110]

13 minutes ago, Burt Macklin said:

I find it funny you ask why Jones gets so much shit and then post a play where he completely whiffs on his man. 

I didn't say Jones played well. I said he was singled out when other guys screwed up too. Jones whiffed on his man, but Kerstetter didn't even look at the guy who came through his gap.

[LTtxfan 48688]

7 minutes ago, Texasrocks said:

I didn't say Jones played well. I said he was singled out when other guys screwed up too. Jones whiffed on his man, but Kerstetter didn't even look at the guy who came through his gap.

 

                  "NEED MORE KARIC" 

  

[Had Enough 2021]

On this play, they have 9 defenders within 6 yards of the LOS. We have 7 to block them. Rice was trying to force us to pass. They couldn’t. Not only that but they had limited second level defenders. On occasion the unblocked dude was one we couldn’t account for.

What we want with this group of RBs is lots of hats on hats so that our RBs are 1 v 1 cause we’ll win many of those. Bijan won those versus ArKansas, but he was smothered by the 2nd and 3rd tacklers.

Even on pass plays, it was one defender getting free. That can be cleaned up. Whether that will happen is tbd.

Some of the consternation is repeated trauma. Part is unrealistic expectations. And some is just flat out wrong.

[6th Street 6245]

1 hour ago, westexhorn said:

Christian Jones is so damn slow... OU fast edges are gonna make him spin over and over all game.  Hell if i am Tech's DC i would just attack the shit out of our left side of the line.

I think we ourselves a new Camrhon Hughes "no contact at all" aka NCAA

[Burt Macklin 18960]

1 hour ago, Texasrocks said:

I didn't say Jones played well. I said he was singled out when other guys screwed up too. Jones whiffed on his man, but Kerstetter didn't even look at the guy who came through his gap.

It’s because he’s by far our worst OL over the first 3 games and there’s a guy sitting on the bench who’s better than him. 
 

 

[gmr548 16251]

It’s because he’s by far our worst OL over the first 3 games and there’s a guy sitting on the bench who’s better than him. 
 
 

Jake Majors was so bad against Arkansas that it’s almost impossible not to bestow that honor upon him simply because of that performance. That’s the worst game I’ve seen out of an individual OL since Tristan Nicholson was here, at least.

But yes, Karic should starts.

[Burt Macklin 18960]

1 hour ago, gmr548 said:

Jake Majors was so bad against Arkansas that it’s almost impossible not to bestow that honor upon him simply because of that performance. That’s the worst game I’ve seen out of an individual OL since Tristan Nicholson was here, at least.

But yes, Karic should starts.

Majors’ Arkansas game was the single worst performance of any OL so far, but Jones has been consistently awful all three games and he shows no signs of putting it together or improving. With Majors, he at least has some good mixed in with the bad and you can see some potential there. 

[Longhornlove 4719]

Re-watched the Rice game, Karic was mauling people, never missed a block but didn't get to see him much in Pass pro. On one running play did see Juan Davis destroy a guy. 

[LTtxfan 48688]

For Game #4    Texas Tech

• Conner ahead of Hookfin at RT
• Parr ahead of Ghirmai at Center

 

[BurntOrange&White 38710]

10 hours ago, Texasrocks said:

Here's another one. This is from the first drive. A blitzer lines up right in the middle. At the snap, neither Majors nor Okafor pick him up. I think this is on Okafor - he goes for the double team and ignores a guy right in front of him.

I'm pretty sure that free runner is 100% on okafor...

[BurntOrange&White 38710]

8 hours ago, gmr548 said:

Jake Majors was so bad against Arkansas that it’s almost impossible not to bestow that honor upon him simply because of that performance. That’s the worst game I’ve seen out of an individual OL since Tristan Nicholson was here, at least.

But yes, Karic should starts.

1 bad game isn't worse than 3 bad games, no matter how bad that 1 game because said player with 3 bad games was equally as bad as said player with the 1 bad game.

Edited September 23, 2021 by BurntOrange&White

[gmr548 16251]

1 bad game isn't worse than 3 bad games, no matter how bad that 1 game because said player with 3 bad games was equally as bad as said player with the 1 bad game.

[LTtxfan 48688]

2 hours ago, BurntOrange&White said:

1 bad game isn't worse than 3 bad games, no matter how bad that 1 game because said player with 3 bad games was equally as bad as said player with the 1 bad game.