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10 hours ago, Gil Bang said:

So my kid worked through Xmas, so he’s out here now. He knows that I fucking love .22s so, here’s what he brought me for a present. b8b99f366bbcb75b1ef9707b25313352.jpg

Ruger Wrangler.

Those are solid budget wheelguns that get very good reviews by owners on the Ruger forums. About the only criticism is for the plastic grip panels, but a lot of the owners are replacing them with wood ones from Altamont. One of those is on my want list. 

It is Ruger’s direct marketing challenge to the Heritage Rough Rider line, and it looks like it is very successful. Great plinkers they say. Aluminum frame, zanak trigger guard & backstrap, steel cylinder & barrel. Some parts interchange with the expensive Single Six. 
 

+rep for your son.

Edited by Armybrat

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2 hours ago, Armybrat said:

Those are solid budget wheelguns that get very good reviews by owners on the Ruger forums. About the only criticism is for the plastic grip panels, but a lot of the owners are replacing them with wood ones from Altamont. One of those is on my want list. 

It is Ruger’s direct marketing challenge to the Heritage Rough Rider line, and it looks like it is very successful. Great plinkers they say. Aluminum frame, zanak trigger guard & backstrap, steel cylinder & barrel. Some parts interchange with the expensive Single Six. 
 

+rep for your son.

Yep, the heritage is a pretty nice looking gun for the price. I fondled the Ruger and the Heritage and the fit and finish is, not surprisingly, a step up on the Ruger. So is the price. Ruger and Smith are the only wheel guns I own, and the CS from both are too notch so I'd go with the Ruger.

It's on the list after I get my new optic and can for the 300 BLK and the other work I've done complete.

I really "need" another 22 lr pistol beyond my Mk II.

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Heritage does offer several variations of their budget .22 revolvers, including different barrel lengths, a .22 magnum option, and even a birdshead grip. I don’t think Ruger will offer the Wrangler in .22 magnum, however.

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21 minutes ago, Armybrat said:

Heritage does offer several variations of their budget .22 revolvers, including different barrel lengths, a .22 magnum option, and even a birdshead grip. I don’t think Ruger will offer the Wrangler in .22 magnum, however.

Yeah, the Heritage really isn't a bad option.

I've zero need or desire for 22 mag. I suspect the market for that is very niche and Ruger has options in their non-budget revolver offerings. As such, no real need to compete against Heritage for that specific market.

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I wouldn’t own one that you have to press a trigger guard release on.

I’ve got a single 6 and never shoot the .22 mag cylinder.

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7 hours ago, Jkwellborn said:

I wouldn’t own one that you have to press a trigger guard release on.

I’ve got a single 6 and never shoot the .22 mag cylinder.

This. They have two issues. Not sure if one has been fixed or not, but they used to have locking issues if debris got into the mechanism. Might be fixed but still..

A smaller but not inconsequential issue is it actually puts an extra .5 step in your draw stroke. I run a 4 count and using one who completely fuck up my draw stroke.

(Edit - fixed as I forgot they modified it to a thumb release)

Given that, and the reality that there are a bevy of quality holsters that have plenty of retention for 99.99% of activities you might do while carrying a gun, I think they are worthless.

Only if you do something like off roading and getting huge air while doing some xGames flips do you need such a holster, imo.

But to each their own.

Edited by BurntEyes

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I’ve also read where instructors aren’t letting guys use them in classes because of people sticking their fingers in the trigger guard on accident.

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19 minutes ago, Jkwellborn said:

I’ve also read where instructors aren’t letting guys use them in classes because of people sticking their fingers in the trigger guard on accident.

Most serious tactical trainers I know would tell you to throw it in the trash and would give you something out of the "Holster Box" to use instead.

I have never, ever seen a single person in any shooting comp use one.

There might be, but I sure have not seen it.

Edit - I was walking through my stroke figuring out how it would effect my draw stroke and it is even worse than I noted above.

In position 1 you get your left hand on your chest (sweeping cover if needed) and with your right you are looking to confirm your grip (sweeping if required) on the pistol and getting your thump on TOP of the safety (if required) prior to step two.

Having to press the release, partially pull pistol out, THEN confirm grip completely fucks up the stroke and leaves a shit ton of room for fuck ups.

Edited by BurntEyes

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hey gun nuts, tell me about dry firing.  

I was told as a kid that dry firing was bad.  But, the book for this sweet little ruger says it can be dry fired without damaging the gun.  What's the deal?

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8 hours ago, Gil Bang said:

hey gun nuts, tell me about dry firing.  

I was told as a kid that dry firing was bad.  But, the book for this sweet little ruger says it can be dry fired without damaging the gun.  What's the deal?

Not to challenge Parliament, but very few guns have any issue being dry fired. Largely, it's an old, perpetuated myth that seems to stick around.

Shame, because consistent, dedicated dry firing taken seriously can really help you on your grip and trigger control. Going a step beyond the laser systems such as LaserLyte (I'm not specifically recommending that one it was just top of mind) offer trigger/grip/draw work, potentially in the home or in the back yard. If you don't have a range where you can work your draw stroke or get to the range frequently, these are both excellent substitutes, and frankly should be combined in even if you do.

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Seriously, the only gun manual I’ve read that said dry firing is not advised is for the Ruger SR semiauto series - and that was only without an empty magazine inserted.

Others are hesitant to dry fire revolvers like the SAA that have the firing pin on the hammer. But no matter, if you are uncomfortable doing it, just buy some snap caps for your gun.

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Snap caps a pretty cheap, but I can’t imagine how dry firing would actually hurt anything. Some people have complained about the spring or firing pin breaking since there’s nothing for it to hit. Who knows.

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17 minutes ago, Jkwellborn said:

Snap caps a pretty cheap, but I can’t imagine how dry firing would actually hurt anything. Some people have complained about the spring or firing pin breaking since there’s nothing for it to hit. Who knows.

True on snap caps.

The firing pin/spring thing is a silly urban myth that continues to be perpetuated based on zero facts. It's been around forever and it appears always will be. Maybe it started way back with the percussion issue above, but um, I don't shoot those. And worse comes to worst, snaps are cheap as you said.

Use of dry fire is the most underutilized, high value, low cost and time investment one can do to improve their shooting.

Then again, most people "don't need to" improve their shooting according to the legends/myths about themselves in their own mind.

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2 hours ago, BurntEyes said:

Use of dry fire is the most underutilized, high value, low cost and time investment one can do to improve their shooting.

Then again, most people "don't need to" improve their shooting according to the legends/myths about themselves in their own mind.

This.  Pistols are among the most prevalent of all firearms, as well as being the most difficult to fire well.  There's a reason Tier I &II military units train with them so much that they are quickly retired when the slides get micro-fractures.

Under optimum situations that are hard to hit objects with.  Under duress, it becomes almost impossible.  Your heart beat spikes, you get an adrenaline dump, and your fine motor skills go to shit.  Skill with a pistol and it's small sight radius is perishable as well.  Like a refined golf swing, you take time off and it diminishes quickly.  

Drills such as those mentioned above are a great way to stay refined.  

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They need to come out with a carbine like the PC-9 in 5.75x28 that uses these same mags.

Would be a hellacious truck gun for the farm or ranch topped with a 1x6 or even a red dot.

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Just now, Reagan1k said:

They need to come out with a carbine like the PC-9 in 5.75x28 that uses these same mags.

Would be a hellacious truck gun for the farm or ranch topped with a 1x6 or even a red dot.

Yep.  Thats what everyone else is telling them on all the Youtube reviews/social media posts.  Only problem with 5.7 is how expensive it is per 50.  Hopefully this gun might help bring the price down some.

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Yeah - FN's original offering's cost has hampered adoption by the average shooter - thus limiting the demand for the pills.

Get a bunch of these ruger's in the hands of the weekend shooter and the ppr will start to come down quickly.

Just like the .224 Valk., and 6.5GR / CM - Get some reasonably priced shooters out there and the ammo prices will plummet.

That sucker would be hell on hogs and coyotes. 

I'd even buy a hi-point carbine in 5.75x28 if it ran as well as my 10mm.  All the hi-point jokes aside......they make a pretty good little carbine that goes bang out the barrel and not in your wallet.

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15 hours ago, Reagan1k said:

They need to come out with a carbine like the PC-9 in 5.75x28 that uses these same mags.

Would be a hellacious truck gun for the farm or ranch topped with a 1x6 or even a red dot.

Looks suspiciously like my Kel-Tec PMR 30.  The carbine accompaniment is just that.  One hell of a fun truck gun (I have the pistol, friend has both).  You can fit it in a small day pack, and carry hundreds of rounds of ammo.  Which isn't cheap, but cheaper than 5.7.

22 Mag doesn't quite match the ballistics of the 5.7, but I've seen the damage it does to varmints and pigs.  With zero recoil, your follow up shots are easy to control.  

8sn5dkwelps01.jpg

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5 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

Looks suspiciously like my Kel-Tec PMR 30.  The carbine accompaniment is just that.  One hell of a fun truck gun (I have the pistol, friend has both).  You can fit it in a small day pack, and carry hundreds of rounds of ammo.  Which isn't cheap, but cheaper than 5.7.

22 Mag doesn't quite match the ballistics of the 5.7, but I've seen the damage it does to varmints and pigs.  With zero recoil, your follow up shots are easy to control.  

8sn5dkwelps01.jpg

Looks like a Mattel Christmas set.

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1 hour ago, BabaYaga said:

Looks suspiciously like my Kel-Tec PMR 30.

8sn5dkwelps01.jpg

What do you think about that Burris fast fire? 

And while I think 5.7 is a good round I'm of the mindset it's a little like Sig 357/40. A round that is a little bit of a solution looking for a problem. If I am going to pick up a new pistol round it will be 10 mm. If a new varmint round probably 17 or 22 mag, but most of my varmint issues are solved by 22/410.

Edited by BurntEyes

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1 hour ago, BabaYaga said:

Looks suspiciously like my Kel-Tec PMR 30.  The carbine accompaniment is just that.  One hell of a fun truck gun (I have the pistol, friend has both).  You can fit it in a small day pack, and carry hundreds of rounds of ammo.  Which isn't cheap, but cheaper than 5.7.

22 Mag doesn't quite match the ballistics of the 5.7, but I've seen the damage it does to varmints and pigs.  With zero recoil, your follow up shots are easy to control.  

8sn5dkwelps01.jpg

Agreed - hybrid of a 22 mag and hornet.  

Probably a solution looking for a problem but hey.... I have lots of those. 

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I owned one of the first PMR30s that Keltec produced and I'll never buy another Keltec product again.   They are really a terrible company overall regardless of the cool shit they dream up.

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1 minute ago, BurntEyes said:

What do you think about that Burris fast fire? 

Those aren't mine - just a internet pic of both together.  I have the pistol, buddy of mine has both, so to save time I just grabbed a pic online as reference.  His carbine doesn't have a muzzle break or scope.  Just a red dot - which is all you need with these.  

Pistol, in my estimation, is the perfect ranch gun.  Insanely light.  Carries 30 in the mag.  Offers good penetration on varmints and small game.  I spooked a mid-size pig once farting around in some dense brush.  100+ lbs +/-.  20 yards maybe?  I was able to hold on this stinky monster on the run, rolled her easily, and counted 9 hits out of 12 shots fired.  All of which penetrated and turned her innards into jelly.  It's not my primary HD gun, but in a pinch, I'd trust it to do the job.  

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8 minutes ago, Reagan1k said:

Agreed - hybrid of a 22 mag and hornet.  

Probably a solution looking for a problem but hey.... I have lots of those. 

Hmmm.. all of my firearms and calibers are 100% functional and practical including the very cherry stupid clean chrome Raven 25. I still don't think I have purchased 25 ammo though. I should, it is the PERFECT self defense gun.

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17 minutes ago, Reagan1k said:

Agreed - hybrid of a 22 mag and hornet.  

Probably a solution looking for a problem but hey.... I have lots of those. 

Wasn't it designed as a solution to the NATO request for a small, fast round to replace the 9mm?  Something that could defeat most battlefield body armor.  Both NATO, and later the FBI did a considerable number of tests on the efficacy of modern rounds.  The conclusion was centered around penetration.  It was the singular trait that was concluded to be the most "effective".  Penetration and cavitation.  

We're seeing a trend in that direction.  I know many SF teams the world over have fallen in love with the H&K MP7 and it's tiny, but lethal 4.6mm cartridge.  These small, hyper-fast rounds zip through most conventional body armor and turn what's behind it into grape jelly.  

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58 minutes ago, krevo said:

I owned one of the first PMR30s that Keltec produced and I'll never buy another Keltec product again.   They are really a terrible company overall regardless of the cool shit they dream up.

I loved mine so much I bought another one. The CMR is next on my list of gun purchases.

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1 hour ago, Reagan1k said:

Yep- for backline troops in lieu of the 9 for penetration and high capacity / low recoil.

 

Troops and others in places like embassies and security details in not nice places. At least that is what I've gathered. It's not as "intimidating" as a 5.56 or other full sized carbines, more portable and semi-concealable.

Please note,  I may have completely fabricated this as I honestly can recall where I was reading about this aspect.

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38 cents isn't SO bad. I have an FN57 that I bought because...reasons. It has an unusual operating system and a TERRIBLE trigger. It was also like $1300 new.

Ruger was brilliant with this pistol. And a carbine that uses the same mags would print money.

Ruger has some good things going right now. They literally invented a new platform with their PRC, and they have some new Peacemaker replica in .22. Brilliant.afcdf6b25d159f70d743f3a08f2adf47.jpg

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A shortened .30 carbine necked down to .25 caliber could have the same overall length and possibly similar ballistics to the 5.7x28 with slightly reduced magazine capacity and probably similar recoil. .256 Win Mag bullets would fit. Then you could make a pistol and carbine that use the same magazines and have slightly greater knockdown power over the 5.7.

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@NotActuallyALonghorn

Interesting that you brought that up because the 5.7x28 PDW is basically this century's version of a primary role the M1 Carbine played from the 40's to the 70's.

@BurntEyes     You didn't make it up.  That's what I've read as well.  It was envisioned as and designed to be a bridge between the 5.56 and the 9mm - where threat levels were escalated and defeating body armor might be necessary in an otherwise non-battlefield environment.

Similar mental exercise to the FBI's trials with the 10mm and then 40s&w following the '86 Miami shootout. 

 

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Look for Ruger to add the 5.7 round to its PC Carbine offerings - it already comes in 9mm & .40, plus they include mag well adapters to accept both Ruger & Glock magazines. And it has the takedown takedown feature too.

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I loved mine so much I bought another one. The CMR is next on my list of gun purchases.
To be clear KT has re worked the PMR30 several times. Kervo says he got an early one. They received a lot of criticism.

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1 minute ago, bigshark88 said:
On 1/14/2020 at 10:27 AM, immortal13 said:
I loved mine so much I bought another one. The CMR is next on my list of gun purchases.

To be clear KT has re worked the PMR30 several times. Kervo says he got an early one. They received a lot of criticism.

Oh ok...thanks 

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38 minutes ago, Lat22 said:

I've got the reloading bug bad right now.  Somebody talk me out of it.

My two favorite types of friends:  those with boats, and that went hard in the reloading paint and need to make space for the next batch....

DO IT!

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10 hours ago, BabaYaga said:

My two favorite types of friends:  those with boats, and that went hard in the reloading paint and need to make space for the next batch....

DO IT!

Yeah, I have, very purposefully always avoided going down the reloading path.

I shoot enough to "justify" the initial equipment investment, but ultimately, my OCD will kick in and I'll keep upping the ante until my ROI will extend past my own good bye date.

I would end up buy guns for the new caliber ammo I wanted to try and make.

Edited by BurntEyes

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My brother did it for years when he was wearing a badge and shooting constantly.   The $$$ works, especially if you are super smart like me and but tons of Wby mags. 
 

My advice would be do it IF you think it’ll be a small hobby where you view it as getting away for a bit. 

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