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Lobwedgephil

5 HPD Officers Shot

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11 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I would think that some are disappointed that the dead suspects weren't illegal immigrants (from Mexico)

 

You damn well know Greg Abbott would have something to say about it.

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This whole thing isn’t adding up to me. We’ll see how this plays out but you don’t go from having no record to blazing it out with the cops. 

 

My guess is going to be that they didn’t know it was the police.  In his first press appearance yesterday, Acevedo immediately started  laying out the details about “marked cars” and “uniformed officers”  backing up the plainclothes narcs.  He wasn’t asked about it. 

Edited by Lat22

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9 minutes ago, Lat22 said:

This whole thing isn’t adding up to me. We’ll see how this plays out but you don’t go from having no record to blazing it out with the cops. 

 

My guess is going to be that they didn’t know it was the police.  In his first press appearance yesterday, Acevedo immediately started  laying out the details about “marked cars” and “uniformed officers”  backing up the plainclothes narcs.  He wasn’t asked about it. 

This is where I'm....well, not LEANING there yet....but it's my basis for concern.

 

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I finally just saw the video of The Little Nerd and the glasses making veiled threats towards the public. If HPD or Acevedo have any sense they will get rid of that little Cretin in a hurry. He's obviously unstable and has no business in an official capacity in front of a camera

Of course we're talkin about Acevedo here so the guy will probably be promoted.

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The more I read, the more I am convinced that this is not going to end well for the police. Well, unless they cover it up......

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So after all that they didn’t even find any black tar on location. Wonder if they no knocked the wrong house.  One of the neighbors being interviewed mentioned that the home owners were good, friendly people. 

 

This might really come back to fuck hpd. Notice how art is trying to sway the narrative from the start 

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11 minutes ago, Lat22 said:

The more I read, the more I am convinced that this is not going to end well for the police. Well, unless they cover it up......

i simply do not understand why it would be a policy to NOT have body cams for warrant runs. it would not be difficult to implement, and it's EXACTLY that kind of situation the police should want cams running to document that they did everything by the book.

i'm with lat and brisket with the misgivings on this one. of course, i think no-knock raids should be outlawed.

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14 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

i simply do not understand why it would be a policy to NOT have body cams for warrant runs. it would not be difficult to implement, and it's EXACTLY that kind of situation the police should want cams running to document that they did everything by the book.

Unless they didn't 

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46 minutes ago, hayden_horn said:

i simply do not understand why it would be a policy to NOT have body cams for warrant runs. it would not be difficult to implement, and it's EXACTLY that kind of situation the police should want cams running to document that they did everything by the book.

i'm with lat and brisket with the misgivings on this one. of course, i think no-knock raids should be outlawed.

You’re thinking about it backwards. I’m not a cop hater like many on this site, but in situations where there are only eye witnesses, the cop’s word will virtually always be taken as true. Essentially, there is no upside from a police department’s perspective to implement body cameras. Only the bad press and turmoil that comes along with any potentially damning videos.

 

Edited by housious

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^

And that is how they get in situations like yesterday’s, and tax payers questioning the situation.

 

Today they could have reviewed footage with internal investigations, union, and legal and released it.

 

Instead they’re serving warrants to gain information for prosecuting criminals without easily captured video evidence. People question. A narrative develops and you have the union president saying he’s going to hold citizens, activists, and reporters accountable.

 

ETA: the upside is for everyone. The lawyers, the tax payers, the city, and CYA for the department.

 

 

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So a guy with zero arrests ever and a navy vet just goes out guns blazing against the cops? That doesn't really make sense to me. I support the police, but something isn't right here. 

 

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4 hours ago, the said:

I dont have kids. That was just an example, and accountability is exactly what I'm arguing. Its for everyone to see in black and white, sell crack cocaine, go to jail. And yet we scream about mass incarcerations. We have record low unemployment and yet these dealers going to jail is yet a failure of society? 

No, its them. 

I bet you shit bricks when the health department comes by. 

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Acevedo really bothers me (and I’m mostly pro-cop). As some have said, he’s very quick to blame the majority when we’re on his side. He seems stupid, lazy, and short tempered (just like the stereotype). I feel like I’m being lectured when he speaks - fuck that.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

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1 hour ago, Lobwedgephil said:

So a guy with zero arrests ever and a navy vet just goes out guns blazing against the cops? That doesn't really make sense to me. I support the police, but something isn't right here. 

 

Agreed.  There may be more to this story.

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5 hours ago, Celery Man said:

So they broke into the house and shot the dog?

Somebody shoots my dog, they're getting shot, too.  We may all die, but they aren't getting out unscathed unless they kill me first.

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11 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Those that make the rules get preference.  But it's normal.   If a football player at a UT game has a seizure, they will get him to clinical care within minutes.  Happens to a fan in the stands, its going to take a while to get you to the hospital.

If the football player needs to go to a hospital in an ambulance, EMS isn't going to get them from the stadium to the hospital any quicker than they'd transport the fan in the stands. Of course it will take longer to get the fan to the ambulance since they're in the stands. Now, if the football player can get sufficient clinical care in the stadium, then yeah, they're going to get treatment the fan won't get.That's not a matter of the public's emergency response favoring the football player though.

As for the cop getting a medevac on standby as someone mentioned above, I doubt that's what Houston EMS had in mind when they sent the 3rd chopper. Early in incidents, info is often all over the place and sketchy, even in typical incidents like vehicle collisions etc. In a developing potential mass-casualty incident like this one, with 5 cops already shot, I'm sure the reports were numerous and likely wildly inconsistent. The info the 911 dispatch center has is only as good as the caller giving it to them. Inaccurate as the info may be, we have to make decisions based on that info, and we typically err on the side of caution. They probably were receiving exaggerated reports of more than 5 officers down, or an unknown number down with lots of shots fired, or who knows what, so they escalated their response. It happens all the time,  multiple times a day even here in Austin, at different levels of response to different types of incidents, whether emergency workers are involved as victims or not. 

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Story on Ch.2 included an interview with a neighbor who lives across the street who knew the suspects for 30 years. In addition to vouching for their character and respect for the law, he said the husband was out walking the dog 30 minutes before the shooting started.

Why not just serve the warrant while he’s out walking the dog? Or at some other time/method than kicking in the door?

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46 minutes ago, Player said:

Story on Ch.2 included an interview with a neighbor who lives across the street who knew the suspects for 30 years. In addition to vouching for their character and respect for the law, he said the husband was out walking the dog 30 minutes before the shooting started.

Why not just serve the warrant while he’s out walking the dog? Or at some other time/method than kicking in the door?

It wasn’t an arrest warrant for a specific individual. It was a search warrant on that residence-most likely based on multiple sales of narcotics out of that residence. 

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Acevedo really bothers me (and I’m mostly pro-cop). As some have said, he’s very quick to blame the majority when we’re on his side. He seems stupid, lazy, and short tempered (just like the stereotype). I feel like I’m being lectured when he speaks - fuck that.
 
 
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

No shit...this whole thing has “clusterfuck” written all over it, so he starts spouting off about lawmakers and gun control. Fuck him.

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I realize that it was a search warrant rather than an arrest warrant. From a tactical standpoint I don’t think there’s anything that would have prevented HPD from simply waiting until Mr. Tuttle came outside to approach him, explain that a search warrant had been issued, and then completing the search.

We’re talking about a couple who had lived in their house for 30+ years. The only criminal history for either of them was a hot check written several years ago by the wife.

Just because Art claims in a press conference that someone in the neighborhood alleges that drugs were being dealt from the house, it’s not necessarily true. Setting aside for a moment that no black tar heroin was found, what exactly did HPD do to try to corroborate the “drug house” allegation before kicking in the door and jeopardizing the lives of the homeowners, neighbors, and the officers themselves?

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2 hours ago, Player said:

I realize that it was a search warrant rather than an arrest warrant. From a tactical standpoint I don’t think there’s anything that would have prevented HPD from simply waiting until Mr. Tuttle came outside to approach him, explain that a search warrant had been issued, and then completing the search.

We’re talking about a couple who had lived in their house for 30+ years. The only criminal history for either of them was a hot check written several years ago by the wife.

Just because Art claims in a press conference that someone in the neighborhood alleges that drugs were being dealt from the house, it’s not necessarily true. Setting aside for a moment that no black tar heroin was found, what exactly did HPD do to try to corroborate the “drug house” allegation before kicking in the door and jeopardizing the lives of the homeowners, neighbors, and the officers themselves?
 

You aren’t given a narcotic search warrant based on a whim. You’re looking at atleast one UC buy from the location, multiple informant buys from the location, and surveillance of foot and motor vehicle traffic. A citizen narcotic complaint gets that ball rolling and thats it.

Heroin was listed on the warrant because it’s been purchased from that location before. You can’t control the supply at the time they chose to serve the warrant. 

Edited by Constant

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14 hours ago, housious said:

You’re thinking about it backwards. I’m not a cop hater like many on this site, but in situations where there are only eye witnesses, the cop’s word will virtually always be taken as true. Essentially, there is no upside from a police department’s perspective to implement body cameras. Only the bad press and turmoil that comes along with any potentially damning videos.

 

So the only downside is accountability?

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39 minutes ago, Constant said:

You aren’t given a narcotic search warrant based on a whim. You’re looking at atleast one UC buy from the location, multiple informant buys from the location, and surveillance of foot and motor vehicle traffic. A citizen narcotic complaint gets that ball rolling and thats it.

Heroin was listed on the warrant because it’s been purchased from that location before. You can’t control the supply at the time they chose to serve the warrant. 

Objection, non-responsive. (Also, assumes a shitload of [alleged] facts that are not in evidence.) 

But for the sake of argument, let's go ahead and assume that there was "at least one UC buy from the location, multiple informant buys from the location, and surveillance of foot and motor vehicle traffic." That's a considerable expenditure of department resources, and would provide probable cause for not only a search warrant, but also an arrest warrant. 

Why wouldn't HPD simply wait for Tuttle to go to HEB, or to take his wife to the doctor for cancer treatment, or to walk his dog, etc. to place him under arrest, and then search the house? 

Your alleged facts, even if they are all true, do not constitute exigent circumstances or provide a reasonable justification for busting down the front door. 

It sounds like it could have been handled differently and in a much safer manner that wouldn't have unnecessarily put lives at risk. 

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54 minutes ago, Constant said:

You aren’t given a narcotic search warrant based on a whim. You’re looking at atleast one UC buy from the location, multiple informant buys from the location, and surveillance of foot and motor vehicle traffic. A citizen narcotic complaint gets that ball rolling and thats it.

Heroin was listed on the warrant because it’s been purchased from that location before. You can’t control the supply at the time they chose to serve the warrant. 

The local news say that "dozens" of neighbors vouched for the couple.  Said they were law abiding citizens and normal.  The local reporters apparently found no one who could say anything bad about the couple. I wonder how they got the warrant?   Could the police have gotten the wrong house?  How much of the warrant information will be made public?

Also, the weapons found in the house do not suggest they were connected to some drug ring.  I have more firepower in my bedside chest of drawers.  There has to be much more to this story.

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9 minutes ago, Player said:

Objection, non-responsive. (Also, assumes a shitload of [alleged] facts that are not in evidence.) 

But for the sake of argument, let's go ahead and assume that there was "at least one UC buy from the location, multiple informant buys from the location, and surveillance of foot and motor vehicle traffic." That's a considerable expenditure of department resources, and would provide probable cause for not only a search warrant, but also an arrest warrant. 

Why wouldn't HPD simply wait for Tuttle to go to HEB, or to take his wife to the doctor for cancer treatment, or to walk his dog, etc. to place him under arrest, and then search the house? 

Your alleged facts, even if they are all true, do not constitute exigent circumstances or provide a reasonable justification for busting down the front door. 

It sounds like it could have been handled differently and in a much safer manner that wouldn't have unnecessarily put lives at risk. 

Totally agree with this.  Instead of loading up the MRAP and the SWAT unit, why not expend some of that energy on a creative way to execute the warrant to minimize danger to the search team, the target, and bystanders.

And despite all the protections surrounding the issuance of search warrants, LEO/A still seem to get it dramatically wrong entirely too often.  Everyone clucks and shakes their head when a warrant goes awry, but we rarely step back to consider how much went really badly wrong in the whole process of obtaining that warrant, which would include grievous mistakes in the supporting affidavit (that could probably easily be characterized as lies), lax review of the application, etc.

Edited by TwiceHorn

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The story seems odd, but I don't know if HPD can put the resources into staking out every warrant location to find the absolute best opportunity to serve the warrant.   Should they watch for several days waiting for a pattern of walking the dog in the afternoon?    And outside of going to a job or dealing with your kids, which this couple didn't seem to have either, most people don't have set routines.  You can ask my dog, there isn't a normal dog walking schedule at my house. 

My guess is that HPD runs some type of risk assessment but mistakes can be made.   These were middle-aged, ex-Navy disability, with zero history of violence.  The risk was probably assessed as low as it gets.  Now I did read that the cops had a strong reason to believe weapons were there but that wouldn't seem to be uncommon for drug dealers.

I'm not a cop apologist but when criminals start to shoot at cops, how the encounter started means very little.  This also doesn't sound like the cops invaded the wrong house and the law-abiding, gun owning homeowner thought they were being invaded by criminals.   Perhaps this couple were small time dealers but then they shouldn't have opened fire on the cops.

 

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Why would police ever use undercover officers to serve a search warrant? That doesn’t make any sense like not wearing cameras makes no sense. If they broke the door down while saying police there’s a chance the people inside only hear the door being smashed. 

I hope they were actually dealing and it wasn’t a nextdoor poster annoyed the dog barked while it was outside that called in the “tip”.

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23 minutes ago, McFly said:

Why would police ever use undercover officers to serve a search warrant? That doesn’t make any sense like not wearing cameras makes no sense. If they broke the door down while saying police there’s a chance the people inside only hear the door being smashed. 

I hope they were actually dealing and it wasn’t a nextdoor poster annoyed the dog barked while it was outside that called in the “tip”.

The police are saying that undercover cops had previously bought heroin at the house.  Perhaps they are lying but that seems pretty cut and dry that someone was dealing at the house.

And if the cops didn't follow protocol, they should be called out for it.

 

 

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Quote

Acevedo said the drug raid on the southeast Houston home stemmed from numerous complaints from neighbors. He said undercover officers had previously made two purchases of black tar heroin from drug dealers at the house.

Armed with a search warrant, nine narcotics detectives backed up by at least six patrol officers surrounded the home on Harding Street just before 5 p.m. on Monday.

After a 54-year-old officer, the lead investigator on the case, broke open the front door, a 33-year-old officer armed with a shotgun entered the residence and was immediately attacked by a pit bull, Acevedo said.

He said that the officer being attacked shot and killed the dog.

One of the suspects, Tuttle, charged from the back of the house firing a .357-caliber Magnum revolver at the officer, hitting him in the shoulder.

"He went down and fell on the sofa in the living room," Acevedo said of the wounded officer. "A female suspect went towards that officer, reached over the officer and started making a move for his shotgun."

Another officer who entered the house was allegedly shot by Tuttle.

Acevedo said officers opened fire killing Nicholas and engaged in a gun battle with Tuttle.

He said the lead investigator who breached the door, entered the house and was also shot.

"After we had two officers down and another shot, the remaining officers ... started laying down cover fire, left positions of cover themselves and, I believe, they heroically pulled their fellow officers out of harm's way," Acevedo said.

He said Tuttle followed the retreating officers to the front door and continued to fire at them before he was shot and killed.

Police recovered two shotguns and three rifles from the residence and seized marijuana and a white powder they believe to be either cocaine or the powerful synthetic opioid fentanyl, Acevedo said.

https://abc13.com/2-suspects-identified-in-drug-house-shootout-that-left-5-officers-injured-/5111659/

look, if they've evidence that these folks were drug dealers, fair play to the police. 

however, someone kicks in my door, shoots my dog, i'm not sure i'm stopping to ask for their badge number and to see their paperwork, and settle in for a worthy exchange of ideas.

and that is the inherent danger that these raids produce, imo. if every one of those officers shot were in plainclothes, that signifies a major problem in procedure. 

even IF the police self-identified, the rushed nature of these types of raids requires the suspects to process that information. these raids are not designed for that. they are a show of force, and a charge into a house to stun the suspects into acquiescence. 

i think it's a bad policy. if you've got the resources to devote however many officers to this no-knock raid, then you can stick a plainclothes detective in a non-marked car for a day or two down the street and identify the habits of the house.

there is too much "cowboy up!" attitude on the part of the cops. it's worth noting that when acevedo was chief of APD here, we had several bad shoot situations. we haven't seen that pattern continue under manley. that could be a matter of luck. or not. i guess houston will see.

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It's definitely a good point that no knock raids can easily turn the situation much worse as the cops are escalating the situation.    You got the bad guys, probably with weapons on the other side, and even if they would peacefully surrender to the police, they may not fully believe its the police.  If I was a rival gang that wanted to attack them, calling myself the police sounds like a good plan.

Perhaps police should re-evaluate the effectiveness of no-knock warrants just as many depts have stopped high speed chases as they lead to so many bad outcomes.

The real tragedy starts when an innocent bystander walking down the street gets caught in the cross fire.

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1 hour ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

I'm not a cop apologist but when criminals start to shoot at cops, how the encounter started means very little.  This also doesn't sound like the cops invaded the wrong house and the law-abiding, gun owning homeowner thought they were being invaded by criminals.   Perhaps this couple were small time dealers but then they shouldn't have opened fire on the cops.

 

That would be terrific if

1) cops knew they were criminals (they did not)

2) residents knew invaders were cops (seems extremely likely they did not)

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I figured this thread would be blowing up today.

The local radio news reports today said they found some pot( who cares?,) 3 or 4 guns( average as fuck for Texas,) and a white powder, possibly fentanyl.

You mean that's it?  That's why you're breaking down doors?   Of all the fucking opportunity in H-town, this is your badass bust?

I understood the warrant to be as the result of neighborhood complaints of known heroin deals, as in, a massive clearing house for smack.

 

Cops got fucked up and two people lost their lives for this bullshit?

 

 

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1 minute ago, slorch said:

I figured this thread would be blowing up today.

The local radio news reports today said they found some pot( who cares?,) 3 or 4 guns( average as fuck for Texas,) and a white powder, possibly fentanyl.

You mean that's it?  That's why you're breaking down doors?   Of all the fucking opportunity in H-town, this is your badass bust?

I understood the warrant to be as the result of neighborhood complaints of known heroin deals, as in, a massive clearing house for smack.

 

Cops got fucked up and two people lost their lives for this bullshit?

 

 

A mysterious and possibly deadly white powder.... Talcum powder Maybe? Heard it causes cancer and that can be deadly. Freaking cops.

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They released the warrant a few minutes ago. It was a no knock warrant, so they went in unidentified, because a confidential informant supposedly bought heroin there once. 

 

 

 

Edited by Lobwedgephil

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2 minutes ago, Lobwedgephil said:

They released the warrant a few minutes ago. It was a no knock warrant, so they went in unidentified, because a confidential informant supposedly bought heroin there once. 

 

 

 

That seems ; . . . flimsy.

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1 minute ago, TwiceHorn said:

That seems ; . . . flimsy.

I despise the war on drugs and the no knock warrants it produced. It gets everything backwards. 

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this discussion reminds me of a similar event that happened to a family we are best friends with here in Austin.

and yes, it was when Acevedo was still here. 

no-knock warrant served pre-dawn...dad was working, mom and son were home alone. he did have some sketchy friends and was running with a questionable crowd. an 'anonymous' tip said he was a cartel-level drug dealer. 

anyway, when door was busted in and flash bangsthrown, they both wake from dead sleep, mom screaming, kid grabs gun (because Texas, hunters, big 2nd amend supporters, etc) and proceeds to fire. shot one cop in the knee. mom realizes it's police, yells at him to stop, he does immediately, they lay on floor and he's taken into custody. 

2 years later, he's found not guilty of attempted murder of a peace officer, but guilty of agg assault. 

oh, and their dog was also killed.  blown up with a flash bang in their kitchen. 

that officer,  ANY of those officers could have been killed. our friends could have been killed. the dog WAS killed.

for an ounce of pot and some xanax. and several legal firearms, which were returned to the family. 

i was in the courtroom for much of the trial.  neighbors testified they hid in the closet bc they did not hear it was APD. APD surveilled the house for a week and admitted in court that they observed no suspicious activity. they did trash raids and found baggies and a container from a dispensary in CO. and empty ammunition cartridges...which came from the dad going to shooting range. that and the tip is what they based the no-knock warrant on. kid did not have a record.

kid went to school every day at 730. why the couldn't have waited,  just stopped him on the street, i will never understand. they didn't even charge him for the drugs, just the shooting.

which, in my not so humble opinion, THEY instigated. 

he got 13 years. completely illogical to me.

 

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12 minutes ago, mchookem said:

this discussion reminds me of a similar event that happened to a family we are best friends with here in Austin.

and yes, it was when Acevedo was still here. 

no-knock warrant served pre-dawn...dad was working, mom and son were home alone. he did have some sketchy friends and was running with a questionable crowd. an 'anonymous' tip said he was a cartel-level drug dealer. 

anyway, when door was busted in and flash bangsthrown, they both wake from dead sleep, mom screaming, kid grabs gun (because Texas, hunters, big 2nd amend supporters, etc) and proceeds to fire. shot one cop in the knee. mom realizes it's police, yells at him to stop, he does immediately, they lay on floor and he's taken into custody. 

2 years later, he's found not guilty of attempted murder of a peace officer, but guilty of agg assault. 

oh, and their dog was also killed.  blown up with a flash bang in their kitchen. 

that officer,  ANY of those officers could have been killed. our friends could have been killed. the dog WAS killed.

for an ounce of pot and some xanax. and several legal firearms, which were returned to the family. 

i was in the courtroom for much of the trial.  neighbors testified they hid in the closet bc they did not hear it was APD. APD surveilled the house for a week and admitted in court that they observed no suspicious activity. they did trash raids and found baggies and a container from a dispensary in CO. and empty ammunition cartridges...which came from the dad going to shooting range. that and the tip is what they based the no-knock warrant on. kid did not have a record.

kid went to school every day at 730. why the couldn't have waited,  just stopped him on the street, i will never understand. they didn't even charge him for the drugs, just the shooting.

which, in my not so humble opinion, THEY instigated. 

he got 13 years. completely illogical to me.

 

God dammit....that makes me rage as hell.

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They released the warrant a few minutes ago. It was a no knock warrant, so they went in unidentified, because a confidential informant supposedly bought heroin there once. 
 
 
 

I'm probably the most law and order guy on this forum but if you can get a no knock warrant based on one confidential informant with no additional cooberation then that is bullshit.

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Miya Shay went to the courthouse to get the warrant. They refused to give it to her at first, but they finally gave it to her after she showed them they have no legal reason to hold it. HPD released it soon afterwards.

The confidential informant was an undercover agent who bought meth the day before. I'm also aware an officer can lie just to get a warrant.

Edited by mycox

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kid went to school every day at 730. why the couldn't have waited,  just stopped him on the street, i will never understand. they didn't even charge him for the drugs, just the shooting.
which, in my not so humble opinion, THEY instigated. 
he got 13 years. completely illogical to me.
 
those mraps are not going to drive themselves.

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32 minutes ago, mchookem said:

this discussion reminds me of a similar event that happened to a family we are best friends with here in Austin.

and yes, it was when Acevedo was still here. 

no-knock warrant served pre-dawn...dad was working, mom and son were home alone. he did have some sketchy friends and was running with a questionable crowd. an 'anonymous' tip said he was a cartel-level drug dealer. 

anyway, when door was busted in and flash bangsthrown, they both wake from dead sleep, mom screaming, kid grabs gun (because Texas, hunters, big 2nd amend supporters, etc) and proceeds to fire. shot one cop in the knee. mom realizes it's police, yells at him to stop, he does immediately, they lay on floor and he's taken into custody. 

2 years later, he's found not guilty of attempted murder of a peace officer, but guilty of agg assault. 

oh, and their dog was also killed.  blown up with a flash bang in their kitchen. 

that officer,  ANY of those officers could have been killed. our friends could have been killed. the dog WAS killed.

for an ounce of pot and some xanax. and several legal firearms, which were returned to the family. 

i was in the courtroom for much of the trial.  neighbors testified they hid in the closet bc they did not hear it was APD. APD surveilled the house for a week and admitted in court that they observed no suspicious activity. they did trash raids and found baggies and a container from a dispensary in CO. and empty ammunition cartridges...which came from the dad going to shooting range. that and the tip is what they based the no-knock warrant on. kid did not have a record.

kid went to school every day at 730. why the couldn't have waited,  just stopped him on the street, i will never understand. they didn't even charge him for the drugs, just the shooting.

which, in my not so humble opinion, THEY instigated. 

he got 13 years. completely illogical to me.

 

I mean why couldn't they have nabbed the kid at 7:31, said "we have a search warrant, is your Mom or anyone else home?" and gone from there.  It really seems like they enjoy creating "tactical" situations, which they repeatedly prove they can't handle safely.

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They released the warrant a few minutes ago. It was a no knock warrant, so they went in unidentified, because a confidential informant supposedly bought heroin there once. 
 
 
 

That seems ; . . . flimsy.

Like fucking crepe paper flimsy. Jesus.
this discussion reminds me of a similar event that happened to a family we are best friends with here in Austin.
and yes, it was when Acevedo was still here. 
no-knock warrant served pre-dawn...dad was working, mom and son were home alone. he did have some sketchy friends and was running with a questionable crowd. an 'anonymous' tip said he was a cartel-level drug dealer. 
anyway, when door was busted in and flash bangsthrown, they both wake from dead sleep, mom screaming, kid grabs gun (because Texas, hunters, big 2nd amend supporters, etc) and proceeds to fire. shot one cop in the knee. mom realizes it's police, yells at him to stop, he does immediately, they lay on floor and he's taken into custody. 
2 years later, he's found not guilty of attempted murder of a peace officer, but guilty of agg assault. 
oh, and their dog was also killed.  blown up with a flash bang in their kitchen. 
that officer,  ANY of those officers could have been killed. our friends could have been killed. the dog WAS killed.
for an ounce of pot and some xanax. and several legal firearms, which were returned to the family. 
i was in the courtroom for much of the trial.  neighbors testified they hid in the closet bc they did not hear it was APD. APD surveilled the house for a week and admitted in court that they observed no suspicious activity. they did trash raids and found baggies and a container from a dispensary in CO. and empty ammunition cartridges...which came from the dad going to shooting range. that and the tip is what they based the no-knock warrant on. kid did not have a record.
kid went to school every day at 730. why the couldn't have waited,  just stopped him on the street, i will never understand. they didn't even charge him for the drugs, just the shooting.
which, in my not so humble opinion, THEY instigated. 
he got 13 years. completely illogical to me.
 

Look up the case of the guy in Killeen who killed a cop coming through his window in the middle of the night. He had no idea it was a cop. It was the middle of the night. He did what any Texan would do (if the cop had been a bad guy, Abbott and Patrick would be giving him medals for the exact same act). And he’s heading to trial.
Oh, and a cop is dead. For no good reason. What a damned waste.

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