Afghan War ending, foretold by The Onion 10 years Ago [DT thread ruined by politics]

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12301]

16 minutes ago, sidis said:

not going to come back through with any contrition on this at all and acknowledge your role in spreading misinformation?

[JimmyJames 12267]

He’s checking the database for the proper response in that situation. Will report back soon. 

[DonkeyCigars 144]

32 minutes ago, DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt said:

i would have responded by getting our troops out faster.

Are you intentionally not directly answering or stating that you would have not responded militarily or tactically to the 13 deaths? That IS what you are saying right?

You would have responded to the deaths of the 13 Americans by putting in the order to go faster and get the military to march in double-time? 

Beyond the moral hazard that not responding presents (IMO) with simply trying to get our troops out faster, I don't see why you can't do both? Retaliate (as we did, with unmanned drone strikes) and put in the order for double-time.

I don't mean for you to feel like I'm picking on you here, I'm just trying to suss out your thinking and motivations because you aren't making much sense or giving much to work with. Is it because you haven't really truly put much thought into at all, so you can't articulate your point of view because there really isn't much of one, except to be sort of blindly in opposition of what happened?

Do you have critical and/or independent thoughts here? It's okay if you haven't really thought about all this and are just messing around here with one-liners and half-thoughts, but it would be nice to know that after 4 or 5 attempts to wrench out of you what you are thinking and get some supporting and contextual thoughts to what informs your thinking.

Edited August 30, 2021 by DonkeyCigars

[Bullneck 18617]

26 minutes ago, sidis said:

at least you have immortal13 laughing at your post.  i mean, after all, it was hilarious.

I saw that, too.  I wonder what the funny part is. 

[mchookem 15429]

2 minutes ago, Bullneck said:

I saw that, too.  I wonder what the funny part is. 

i feel sorry for that dude 😕

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12301]

1 minute ago, DonkeyCigars said:

Are you intentionally not directly answering or stating that you would have not responded militarily or tactically to the 13 deaths? That IS what you are saying right?

You would have responded to the deaths of the 13 Americans by putting in the order to go faster and get the military to march in double-time? 

that is correct.

Quote

Beyond the moral hazard that not responding presents (IMO) with simply trying to get our troops out faster, I don't see why you can't do both? Retaliate (as we did, with unmanned drone strikes) and put in the order for double-time.

is there any moral hazard in killing a bunch of innocent kids? with the benefit of hindsight, was the retaliation the right call?

[Bullneck 18617]

2 minutes ago, DonkeyCigars said:

Are you intentionally not directly answering or stating that you would have not responded militarily or tactically to the 13 deaths? That IS what you are saying right?

You would have responded to the deaths of the 13 Americans by putting in the order to go faster and get the military to march in double-time? 

Beyond the moral hazard that not responding presents (IMO) with simply trying to get our troops out faster, I don't see why you can't do both? Retaliate (as we did, with unmanned drone strikes) and put in the order for double-time.

Apparently you haven't paid any attention to anything. 

Quote

As of July 27, 2018, there have been 2,372 U.S. military deaths and 4 Department of Defense civilian deaths in the War in Afghanistan. 1,856 of these deaths have been the result of hostile action. 

Do you not give a shit about anything except the 13 people who died last week and retaliating?

[RomaVicta 29472]

15 hours ago, Trey3216 said:

I clicked it, still doesn’t dispute that the motherfucker fell asleep for about 45 seconds there.   

Do you similarly trust your own eyes when watching video from Jan. 6? Just looking for a point of reference here.

BTW, Biden appears to be nodding not nodding off.

[Bullneck 18617]

47 minutes ago, PassiveAggressiveCoach said:

My excursion to the shitty side of town is over. I'll let you guys get back to slapping each other on the back for how Biden handled the withdrawal because he got us out and that's really what matters. After all, he did get 100K out in 2 weeks so that's great! Doesn't matter how it was done because there was just no way it could've gone better or how we broke our promise to countless 1000s of afghans and stranded US citizens. I can't even debate with that mindset. 

Why not head over the to Covid thread and let us know your thoughts about vaccines.

[Muy Frio 182]

36 minutes ago, sidis said:

not going to come back through with any contrition on this at all and acknowledge your role in spreading misinformation?  i suspect you are just going to complain to other boards about how mean everyone is in cr and how they neg repped you for "having a different point of view?"

at least you have immortal13 laughing at your post.  i mean, after all, it was hilarious.

genuinely wonder what it is like to look at yourself in the mirror and see what you see.

 

It was wrong. The left pic was from another ceremony.
 

The right pic was from the ceremony. Not the best look in any case. 

[The Ace of Aces 4946]

The Atlantic off the top rope with a truth bomb  

Quote

America’s longest war has been by any measure a costly failure, and the errors in managing the conflict deserve scrutiny in the years to come. But Joe Biden doesn’t “own” the mayhem on the ground right now. What we’re seeing is the culmination of 20 years of bad decisions by U.S. political and military leaders. If anything, Americans should feel proud of what the U.S. government and military have accomplished in these past two weeks. President Biden deserves credit, not blame.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/08/biden-deserves-credit-not-blame-for-afghanistan/619925/

[Longhorn_Fan68 33694]

so shitty, easily debunked memes is all they have left? a bumbled yet still successful evacuation of 125k people in a month, and all they can posts are falsified memes. what shitty people.

[Muy Frio 182]

28 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

Well a right wing guy is king of late night currently and on a cable channel. 

[Bullneck 18617]

1 minute ago, Muy Frio said:

It was wrong. The left pic was from another ceremony.
 

The right pic was from the ceremony. Not the best look in any case. 

Always the "best look" or "not the best look."  

Did you not learn more words wherever you actually went to college?

[Muy Frio 182]

1 minute ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

so shitty, easily debunked memes is all they have left? a bumbled yet still successful evacuation of 125k people in a month, and all they can posts are falsified memes. what shitty people.

Yes, keep telling people how great this all went.

[Longhorn_Fan68 33694]

Just now, Bullneck said:

Always the "best look" or "not the best look."  

Did you not learn more words wherever you actually went to college?

that's as far as he's gotten in his Russian-English phraseology course

[DDD Dad 14060]

2 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

Yes, keep telling people how great this all went.

How are you able to post in here?  Aren't you back in Purgatory?

Quote

There are 2 phases to being crowd source banned at Surly Horns now.

Step 1: you get to purgatory at -100 rep. You lose all posting privileges everywhere else

Step 2: permanent banination at -200 rep.

Once you are in purgatory you cannot see rep you receive and from whom, you also cannot give rep. If you start a topic that gets you the good will of community saving you then you can rejoin. If you are still a piece of shit you can get fucked and be gone.

 

Edited August 30, 2021 by DDD Dad

[DonkeyCigars 144]

Just now, DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt said:

that is correct.

is there any moral hazard in killing a bunch of innocent kids? with the benefit of hindsight, was the retaliation the right call?

Unfortunately innocent kids died. I wouldn't call that a moral hazard as much as...maybe adverse selection? It's a tough thing, war. It's especially tougher when you are fighting a rogue, guerilla enemy without institution and fuzzy boundaries. 

IMO Biden has been a true leader and showed some true grit the last week. I get that it's easy to bag on him and the intel and whatever, but when people he is charged to lead died, he took it personal and owned their deaths and a response. And he did it in a way that neither jeopardized the retreat (unman drone strikes) and didn't present horrible optics and moral hazards (In my opinion) by not responding and signaling that the deaths were an acceptable outcome in the calculus of war (and thus giving ISIS-K a moral victory with a multiplier effect on morale, recruitment, and emotional buy-in to the terrorist movement and the underdog sensibilities of being a David to Goliath).

With the benefit of hindsight, I would not have retaliated in this way because innocent people died. I would have sought another way to retaliate or tried another day or location to try and have 0 innocent deaths. But, I resolve that retaliation was and is still the right call. 

You still must retaliate. If you don't, in this instance, with this context (in retreat and against this enemy and with the deaths of our own), then my opinion is Biden would have failed as a leader. I'm glad for American's that he responded; I'm sad for the innocent families.

[RomaVicta 29472]

14 hours ago, Muy Frio said:

 

Negged for repeated distortions: lying. Biden was at FEMA regarding the hurricane. 

Also negged for second-rate, old-school right-wing hysteria at anything any person who shares your mania whispers or tweets to you.

Your attacks have no substance. Your motives seemingly lack even a scintilla of personal integrity.

[JimmyJames 12267]

4 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

It was wrong. The left pic was from another ceremony.
 

The right pic was from the ceremony. Not the best look in any case. 

Ah. Going with the ole “I was wrong and looked dumb but it’s a bad look for Biden anyway.”  I really should have predicted that in advance. 

[Bullneck 18617]

1 minute ago, DonkeyCigars said:

Unfortunately innocent kids died. I wouldn't call that a moral hazard as much as...maybe adverse selection? It's a tough thing, war. It's especially tougher when you are fighting a rogue, guerilla enemy without institution and fuzzy boundaries. 

IMO Biden has been a true leader and showed some true grit the last week. I get that it's easy to bag on him and the intel and whatever, but when people he is charged to lead died, he took it personal and owned their deaths and a response. And he did it in a way that neither jeopardized the retreat (unman drone strikes) and didn't present horrible optics and moral hazards (In my opinion) by not responding and signaling that the deaths were an acceptable outcome in the calculus of war (and thus giving ISIS-K a moral victory with a multiplier effect on morale, recruitment, and emotional buy-in to the terrorist movement and the underdog sensibilities of being a David to Goliath).

With the benefit of hindsight, I would not have retaliated in this way because innocent people died. I would have sought another way to retaliate or tried another day or location to try and have 0 innocent deaths. But, I resolve that retaliation was and is still the right call. 

You still must retaliate. If you don't, in this instance, with this context (in retreat and against this enemy and with the deaths of our own), then my opinion is Biden would have failed as a leader. I'm glad for American's that he responded; I'm sad for the innocent families.

I thought you were Anastasis but you're actually Zork, right?

[Bullneck 18617]

2 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

How are you able to post in here?  Aren't you back in Purgatory?

He will be soon.

[DonkeyCigars 144]

11 minutes ago, Bullneck said:

Apparently you haven't paid any attention to anything. 

Do you not give a shit about anything except the 13 people who died last week and retaliating?

We were actively retreating with an agreement and date to get out. That is different. I equated it above to being sucker punched or being shot in the back as you are trying to leave. You absolutely must respond to that as it is materially different, in my opinion, than being engaged in a mutual and offensive conflict and those deaths being a sad, tragic outcome of war.

Do you get that difference?

[JimmyJames 12267]

6 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

Well a right wing guy is king of late night currently and on a cable channel. 

And who exactly is that? 

[Muy Frio 182]

4 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

so shitty, easily debunked memes is all they have left? a bumbled yet still successful evacuation of 125k people in a month, and all they can posts are falsified memes. what shitty people.

It went so well that the private sector had to mobilize to help our military evacuate people. Flawless execution.  
 

It went so well that we’re having to trust the Taliban with securing our targets and securing the airport. You know the people our President rightfully said he would never trust when asked. I’m guessing we’ll never know what role having the Taliban as partners played in deaths of our soldiers or drone misfires or other people not getting out. 

[Muy Frio 182]

4 minutes ago, RomaVicta said:

Negged for repeated distortions: lying. Biden was at FEMA regarding the hurricane. 

Also negged for second-rate, old-school right-wing hysteria at anything any person who shares your mania whispers or tweets to you.

Your attacks have no substance. Your motives seemingly lack even a scintilla of personal integrity.

Lol. He asked if anyone had any questions. Then acted annoyed when he got a question he didn’t want. I guess that’s what he gets when he takes them when he’s told not to. He should listen better to his handlers. 

[elfenix 34000]

GRhorn wants to pretend that we could have evac'd everyone last month without immediately collapsing the afghan government and having to rely on the taliban anyway. 

[RomaVicta 29472]

13 hours ago, HenryJames said:

Guess we should stick around to dig graves.

Stupid and brutal is kind of our thing. It probably actually does scare our real enemies when we have real enemies. Otherwise, we're just dealing death, misery, and red-hot resentment.

Why no flowers and chocolates raining down on our boys? Why no statues of American drones in the places we so bravely and wisely liberated?

But we don't mean to kill civilians! Oh, in that case, yay America!

Bombs away!

 

Ah,  shit! The satellite image showed that the car had just left a wedding. Well, they were probably within a half mile of terrorist. We'll call it a clean kill. Who's gonna argue?

[Muy Frio 182]

7 minutes ago, JimmyJames said:

And who exactly is that? 

Greg Gutfeld

[David Dennison 17660]

1 hour ago, PassiveAggressiveCoach said:

Oh, the doha agreement the Taliban violated? Once again though regardless of the doha agreement doesn't mean the withdrawal had to be a complete shitshow like it was. You're confusing issues. The planning and execution of the withdrawal is independent of the doha agreement. 

It might have been a shitshow, but it was a highly successful shitshow. 

[Muy Frio 182]

2 minutes ago, elfenix said:

GRhorn wants to pretend that we could have evac'd everyone last month without immediately collapsing the afghan government and having to rely on the taliban anyway. 

For explanations we’ve gone from nobody could’ve predicted this would happen, to it was always going to be this way. It’s a fluid situation.  

[wildcat09 28387]

16 hours ago, Trey3216 said:

As doctored as “good people on both sides”.   That dopey motherfucker is asleep.    And you know it.  And you can’t defend it.    “But blah blah blah!!!!”   
 

 

 

they all suck shit through a straw.  None are better than the others.   

Watch this:

The people you buy comforting lies from have so much more contempt for your intelligence than any of us Cloak Room libs ever will.

[JimmyJames 12267]

3 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

Greg Gutfeld

You think that guy is actually funny? 

[David Dennison 17660]

10 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

It went so well that the private sector had to mobilize to help our military evacuate people. Flawless execution.  

It went so well that we’re having to trust the Taliban with securing our targets and securing the airport. You know the people our President rightfully said he would never trust when asked. I’m guessing we’ll never know what role having the Taliban as partners played in deaths of our soldiers or drone misfires or other people not getting out. 

And yet, it was a success. Over 100,000 people evacuated to safety.

That's quite an accomplishment.

[DonkeyCigars 144]

13 minutes ago, DonkeyCigars said:

We were actively retreating with an agreement and date to get out. That is different. I equated it above to being sucker punched or being shot in the back as you are trying to leave. You absolutely must respond to that as it is materially different, in my opinion, than being engaged in a mutual and offensive conflict and those deaths being a sad, tragic outcome of war.

Do you get that difference?

@Bullneck why are you trolling and/or not understanding things, and then going back and negging the last dozen posts out of emotional irrationality? Are you sick?

[Longhorn_Fan68 33694]

9 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

It might have been a shitshow, but it was a highly successful shitshow. 

Exactly. Anyone expecting us to have gotten out cleanly and without casualties is either intellectually dishonest, stupid, or both.

[JimmyJames 12267]

8 minutes ago, Muy Frio said:

Greg Gutfeld

His show airs at 10:00 CST/11:00 EST while meanwhile normal non idiots who don’t watch Fox News are in their homes watching their local news. 
 

Just another example of how pathetic the right wing hate machine is. Put on an unfunny “comic” then brag about ratings because your lunatic watchers are abnormal and watch an unfunny show instead of what is actually happening around them on the local news. 
 

Simply pathetic. 

[DonkeyCigars 144]

10 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

And yet, it was a success. Over 100,000 people evacuated to safety.

That's quite an accomplishment.

Agreed.

[RomaVicta 29472]

13 hours ago, Muy Frio said:

This would go on DT thread if there was an open one. These are a couple independent reporters. Horrifying if true. Surely not. 
 

 

Negged again you disingenuous piece of excrement. "If it's true?" Fuck you. There is no substantiation. It even looks like some Trumpers on thread are calling bullshit. 

The credibility of your "independent" reporter? Wikepedia

Quote

Emily Miller is an American political communications strategist,^[3][4] journalist and author. She has worked as the senior political correspondent at One America News Network, and before that as chief investigative reporter for WTTG, the local Fox affiliate in Washington, D.C., and was senior editor of The Washington Times' opinion pages. 

She quotes Yon, a more credible military reporter who leans conservative but mainly writes about the military. But why isn't what Yon allegedly said sourced directly to him?

You can use this post as an example of how to spend ten minutes looking into a story about an alleged abduction and murder of 7 busloads of US women.

"Horrifying if true."

For most people with humanity, yes. For base, vile amateur political operatives like yourself, it's a gleeful prospect lest you would have looked into it instead of ballyhooing for political reasons.

 

[Trey3216 15298]

12 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Watch this:

The people you buy comforting lies from have so much more contempt for your intelligence than any of us Cloak Room libs ever will.

I don’t buy comforting lies from anyone.   

[PassiveAggressiveCoach 118]

35 minutes ago, Bullneck said:

Why not head over the to Covid thread and let us know your thoughts about vaccines.

OK, you may be shocked. It's measured. 

[David Dennison 17660]

6 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

Exactly. Anyone expecting us to have gotten out cleanly and without casualties is either intellectually dishonest, stupid, or both.

It could have gone perfectly and politics would dictate that Joe Biden fucked it all up.

It is what it is. That's where we are in 2021.

 

[DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt 12301]

34 minutes ago, DonkeyCigars said:

Unfortunately innocent kids died. I wouldn't call that a moral hazard as much as...maybe adverse selection? It's a tough thing, war. It's especially tougher when you are fighting a rogue, guerilla enemy without institution and fuzzy boundaries. 

IMO Biden has been a true leader and showed some true grit the last week. I get that it's easy to bag on him and the intel and whatever, but when people he is charged to lead died, he took it personal and owned their deaths and a response. And he did it in a way that neither jeopardized the retreat (unman drone strikes) and didn't present horrible optics and moral hazards (In my opinion) by not responding and signaling that the deaths were an acceptable outcome in the calculus of war (and thus giving ISIS-K a moral victory with a multiplier effect on morale, recruitment, and emotional buy-in to the terrorist movement and the underdog sensibilities of being a David to Goliath).

With the benefit of hindsight, I would not have retaliated in this way because innocent people died. I would have sought another way to retaliate or tried another day or location to try and have 0 innocent deaths. But, I resolve that retaliation was and is still the right call. 

You still must retaliate. If you don't, in this instance, with this context (in retreat and against this enemy and with the deaths of our own), then my opinion is Biden would have failed as a leader. I'm glad for American's that he responded; I'm sad for the innocent families.

you know what tends to have the biggest impact on recruitment/emotional buy-in for these terrorist movements, right? 

[David Dennison 17660]

3 minutes ago, DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt said:

you know what tends to have the biggest impact on recruitment/emotional buy-in for these terrorist movements, right? 

Imperialism?

 

[DonkeyCigars 144]

6 minutes ago, DefinitelyNotHollywoodColt said:

you know what tends to have the biggest impact on recruitment/emotional buy-in for these terrorist movements, right? 

Being under the thumb of a foreign army who is rendering you powerless. And what Double D said.

[RomaVicta 29472]

1 hour ago, PassiveAggressiveCoach said:

My excursion to the shitty side of town is over. I'll let you guys get back to slapping each other on the back for how Biden handled the withdrawal because he got us out and that's really what matters. After all, he did get 100K out in 2 weeks so that's great! Doesn't matter how it was done because there was just no way it could've gone better or how we broke our promise to countless 1000s of afghans and stranded US citizens. I can't even debate with that mindset. 

So long!

[RomaVicta 29472]

1 hour ago, Incredulity said:

 

Is that one of them fancy dingleberry tastin' outfits?

[Incredulity 11141]

Just now, RomaVicta said:

Is that one of them fancy dingleberry tastin' outfits?

Ask your mother.  She's the expert in dingleberry tastin.

[956 Worldwide 33957]

To come back to the topic instead of shitty right wing Twitter disinfo, here’s the infographic of what the Taliban captured. You can’t say that a lot of this stuff is captured U.S. equipment. Most of the fixed and rotary wing aircraft were not ours— they belonged to the ANA and we hoped they’d use it to fight the Taliban. So it wasn’t ours to remove or destroy. 
 

The equipment that by far is most immediately dangerous in the hands of the Taliban and useful is the light arms, vehicles, and communications equipment. That’s the real treasure trove for their own use. Depending on the condition and availability of munitions, the artillery could be real shitty for them to have if some urban areas in the north decide to start fighting. 

 

[DDD Dad 14060]

3 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

Ask your mother.  She's the expert in dingleberry tastin.

You're not very good at this.