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Ronald Reagan... My God


vin2basketball

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Newly released tape from the Nixon Presidential Library shows Ronald Reagan making racist or at least racially tinged comments to Richard Nixon about African delegates to the UN in 1971.

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The day after the United Nations voted to recognize the People’s Republic of China, then–California Governor Ronald Reagan phoned President Richard Nixon at the White House and vented his frustration at the delegates who had sided against the United States. “Last night, I tell you, to watch that thing on television as I did,” Reagan said. “Yeah,” Nixon interjected. Reagan forged ahead with his complaint: “To see those, those monkeys from those African countries—damn them, they’re still uncomfortable wearing shoes!” Nixon gave a huge laugh.

So that's pretty bad. The other part of the story that I found interesting is:

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The exchange was taped by Nixon, and then later became the responsibility of the Nixon Presidential Library, which I directed from 2007 to 2011. When the National Archives originally released the tape of this conversation, in 2000, the racist portion was apparently withheld to protect Reagan’s privacy. A court order stipulated that the tapes be reviewed chronologically; the chronological review was completed in 2013. Not until 2017 or 2018 did the National Archives begin a general rereview of the earliest Nixon tapes. Reagan’s death, in 2004, eliminated the privacy concerns. Last year, as a researcher, I requested that the conversations involving Ronald Reagan be rereviewed, and two weeks ago, the National Archives released complete versions of the October 1971 conversations involving Reagan online.

The thing that I don't understand is why there was a differential application of privacy just to this portion of the tape. Like I understand the argument that this is private communication, so you can't release all of the tapes. But why would you only apply that privacy standard to a small portion of the tape?

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1 minute ago, F250 said:

A 60 year old white guy making racist comments in 1971 doesn't seem very surprising. Shit, it was probably more uncommon for whites to be offended by that kind of language in '71.

And that's just one of many reasons why the notion American exceptionalism is a load of horse shit.

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26 minutes ago, vin2basketball said:

Newly released tape from the Nixon Presidential Library shows Ronald Reagan making racist or at least racially tinged comments to Richard Nixon about African delegates to the UN in 1971.

So that's pretty bad. The other part of the story that I found interesting is:

The thing that I don't understand is why there was a differential application of privacy just to this portion of the tape. Like I understand the argument that this is private communication, so you can't release all of the tapes. But why would you only apply that privacy standard to a small portion of the tape?

Not to nitpick, but calling black UN delegates "monkeys" is unquestionably racist, not just racially tinged.   It's as racist a comment as it gets. 

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7 minutes ago, F250 said:

A 60 year old white guy making racist comments in 1971 doesn't seem very surprising. Shit, it was probably more uncommon for whites to be offended by that kind of language in '71.

No shit.

Look at LBJ.

Stop applying current day codes of morality to the past. We get it. It's wrong. 

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Have you heard his press secretary joking about AIDS as the epidemic was ramping up, killing Americans. Not a private conversation; it was in multiple press conferences, teasing reporters on why they would be concerned about a disease predominantly killing gay men.

As bad as Trump is and as bad as Trumpkins are, we do need to step back, review recent history, and acknowledge progress.

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8 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

And it needs to be pointed out for posterity so we know just how shitty these men were.

This kind of sums up my point quite well.

LBJ, who had his faults, but who also ushered in civil/voting rights the likes of which had never been seen before, is labeled "shitty" because he held un-enlightened views as defined by our time. His racist views trump everything else, to some.

Imo, this mentality is a problem. It's corrosive. 

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1 minute ago, Asithappens said:

This kind of sums up my point quite well.

LBJ, who had his faults, but who also ushered in civil/voting rights the likes of which had never been seen before, is labeled "shitty" because he held un-enlightened views as defined by our time. His racist views trump everything else, to some.

Imo, this mentality is a problem. It's corrosive. 

The opposite is apologia.

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35 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Ronald Reagan's legacy is only going to diminish with time. He was a terrible president and not a very good person, it seems.

Maybe.  Most on the Right already put ideals on him that he didn't even believe in.  It's the speakers ideal but they want to use Ronnie to validate it.  "Ronald Reagan was 100% behind supporting Crown Prince MBS and his war in Yemen."

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I’ll catch some shit for this, but as despicable as he was, he was perfect for that brief period where the Cold War ramps up and then wound down and the Soviet Union fell soon after.    Doesn’t excuse his personal views, but how do things play out if Carter wins a second term, and say George H. W.or Bob Dole win in ‘84?

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To add something, look at Coke Stevenson. An honorable man, no doubt, who held (at the time widely accepted) very racist views.

Are his views justified/condoned simply b/c they were accepted more then than now? Of course not. But it sure as hell doesn't make him a shitty person.

 

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Just now, Asithappens said:

To add something, look at Coke Stevenson. An honorable man, no doubt, who held (at the time widely accepted) very racist views.

Are his views justified/condoned simply b/c they were accepted more then than now? Of course not. But it sure as hell doesn't make him a shitty person.

Yes, it does. 

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4 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Maybe.  Most on the Right already put ideals on him that he didn't even believe in.  It's the speakers ideal but they want to use Ronnie to validate it.  "Ronald Reagan was 100% behind supporting Crown Prince MBS and his war in Yemen."

Ronald Reagan in 2019 would be a Mexican-loving libtard RINO. 

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Curious to find out who released this and what the motivation was.  To further drive in a racial wedge?   To normalize Trump's shittiness?  To point out the GOP has always been racist? 

Whatever the reason it doesn't surprise me.  Reagan was a shitty person, from all I know.

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33 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

And that's just one of many reasons why the notion American exceptionalism is a load of horse shit.

I don’t disagree about American exceptionalism. But this isn’t an American problem - it’s common to all humanity.

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a dude one time said something racist half a century ago in the middle of the civil rights era.  it ended up on tape.  on things i evaluate reagan's role in our country, i'd place something he said to one person 9 years before he was president pretty far behind probably everything else that appears on his wikipedia page right now.

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It’s also worth noting that he supported South African apartheid much longer than the rest of the country. His veto of sanctions was overridden by Congress. His reasoning was that they were our ally against Communism. But, when looking at balancing different concerns, this quote does provide context to how much apartheid concerned him.

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1 hour ago, David Dennison said:

And it needs to be pointed out for posterity so we know just how shitty these men were.

Yes we know, everyone is shitty, everyone has always been shitty. I'd say it's probably time for you to set sail for Utopia island where no one has ever been racist.  

PRO TIP:  Yer gonna need a ship as powerful as a Saturn 5 to get the journey started.

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2 hours ago, vin2basketball said:

Newly released tape from the Nixon Presidential Library shows Ronald Reagan making racist or at least racially tinged comments to Richard Nixon about African delegates to the UN in 1971.

So that's pretty bad. The other part of the story that I found interesting is:

The thing that I don't understand is why there was a differential application of privacy just to this portion of the tape. Like I understand the argument that this is private communication, so you can't release all of the tapes. But why would you only apply that privacy standard to a small portion of the tape?

Fuck privacy for Presidents.  If you want to be President, you should have to waive your right to privacy.

And this shouldn't even be a private communication in the first place.  It is a sitting President speaking with a state governor about state affairs.  If you want to have a private conversation, don't record it.

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Just now, FondrenRoad said:

  If you want to have a private conversation, don't record it.

I don't think the people talking to Nixon were aware of the fact they were being recorded. The Nixon Tapes are the gift that keeps on giving.

 

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1 hour ago, David Dennison said:

And it needs to be pointed out for posterity so we know just how shitty these men were.

But I’m told that the viewpoints and motivations  of a bunch of slave owners in the 1780’s is the only thing that should matter when deciding government policy in 2019.

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1 minute ago, Asithappens said:

Everybody, even Presidents, have a right to privacy.

 

But they shouldn't.  We all have a choice to run for President or not.  If you want to be President, it should be required that you be an open book.  The people should get to know every thing about you.  If you have something to hide, you shouldn't get to hide it and be President.

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1 hour ago, atomheartbevo said:

I’ll catch some shit for this, but as despicable as he was, he was perfect for that brief period where the Cold War ramps up and then wound down and the Soviet Union fell soon after.    Doesn’t excuse his personal views, but how do things play out if Carter wins a second term, and say George H. W.or Bob Dole win in ‘84?

Carter lost Iran to the mullahs and humiliated us by allowing them to keep our embassy personnel hostage for over 444 days instead of invading Iran like any other President would have. Another term and he would have allowed another calamity to happen, most likely Soviet Union aggression or leaving Israel out to dry.

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1 hour ago, Mojo Hand said:

Why is it that Republicans decry moral relativism applied to the present, but consistently use it to excuse abhorrent behavior in the past?   

If the R party embraced minorities and immigrants in 2019, then their apologists might be able to say that the Rs have at least evolved in a good way. They can't say that.

Shitholes countries, infested cities, concentration camps, go back where you came from, etc.

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1 minute ago, retread said:

If the R party embraced minorities and immigrants in 2019, then their apologists might be able to say that the Rs have at least evolved in a good way. They can't say that.

Shitholes countries, infested cities, concentration camps, go back where you came from, etc.

The most successful immigrant communities in this country - Cuban and Iranian Americans, have been solidly GOP for years. Our interests are aligned with the wealthy

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2 minutes ago, Iconoclast Texan said:

The most successful immigrant communities in this country - Cuban and Iranian Americans, have been solidly GOP for years. Our interests are aligned with the wealthy

Those aren't the most successful immigrant communities in this country

 

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4 minutes ago, Iconoclast Texan said:

The most successful immigrant communities in this country - Cuban and Iranian Americans, have been solidly GOP for years. Our interests are aligned with the wealthy

It's hilarious how proud you are of being a racist political party's pet.

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4 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Those aren't the most successful immigrant communities in this country

 

Jeez, those poor Asian immigrants. And the Jews. I hear they run everything. 

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16 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Those aren't the most successful immigrant communities in this country

 

Wrong as usual. From a source you’d trust. HuffPost 

A report by the Iranian Studies Group at MIT reveals that per capita average income for Iranian-Americans is 50% higher than that of the rest of the nation. Iranian-Americans living in homes valued at over $1 Million exceeds the national average by ten times

Edited by Iconoclast Texan
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6 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

It's hilarious how proud you are of being a racist political party's pet.

I support a party that allows me to keep as much of my wealth as possible and whose policies have allowed my commercial real estate investments to do exceptionally well. My interests don’t lie with a party that panders to the needs of poor minorities. 

Edited by Iconoclast Texan
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1 hour ago, atomheartbevo said:

I’ll catch some shit for this, but as despicable as he was, he was perfect for that brief period where the Cold War ramps up and then wound down and the Soviet Union fell soon after.    Doesn’t excuse his personal views, but how do things play out if Carter wins a second term, and say George H. W.or Bob Dole win in ‘84?

Stanford wins the 1982 Big Game, and then goes on to win the Peach Bowl?

jpeg

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Just now, Iconoclast Texan said:

I support a party that allows me to keep as much as my wealth as possible and have seen my commercial real estate investments do exceptionally well. My interests don’t lie with the needs of poor minorities 

If your party isn't defeated they will seize your property and throw you in a camp as a suspected Muslim.  You will never be white to them.

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