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Posted
17 minutes ago, Pam Cummings said:

Who gives a fuck if they did? Ohhh we all rallied to get paid but really it's for charity! Give me a fucking break.

I'm sure the charities that got the donations gave a fuck but maybe they didn't care.

Posted
both teams play the same course 

You keep saying this and it’s obviously true but different set ups benefit different teams/players.

I’m not going to pretend I understand all of the nuances, but the No Laying Up guys have been very critical of the set up and Keegan even said it didn’t work to their advantage. It’s a mistake at a home Ryder Cup.
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Posted

beth page was a bad choice because it's 'teeth' is being in us open mode, great for a us open. a ryder cup shouldn't be played under us open conditions.

you can't play 36 / 36 / 18 on that kind of course 

why do you think sundays at the masters are amazing ? the course is set up for scoring,  they want someone to make a charge. thats a ryder cup set up. imo

 

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Posted
1 hour ago, Hank Kingsley said:

There were no hazards on the course. The only water in play is on the 8th hole. The first cut of rough was a pristine lie. Even the second cut was never an issue. 

It's malpractice not to try and create some sort of advantage for your squad through research/analytics. 

That's my argument - this course WAS setup to be advantageous to the US. No penalities off the tee, soft attackable greens, wide enough fairways. Euro favored courses are tight, penal, brutal rough, rock greens. Minus the rock greens, that's exactly what Paris and Rome were. 

And again, didn't matter. Euros trashed us anyways. Keegan saying they could have set the course up different is a bullshit distraction from the reality that he fucked up pairings and the players were totally outclassed. 

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Posted
3 hours ago, crash_davis said:

IMO: Shitty play, Poor pairings, dudes who had no business playing at all, course set up

 

Disagree. The Euros played out of their minds, period. The Bradley criticism is unwarranted. 

Posted
10 minutes ago, dieucla98 said:

That's my argument - this course WAS setup to be advantageous to the US. No penalities off the tee, soft attackable greens, wide enough fairways. Euro favored courses are tight, penal, brutal rough, rock greens. Minus the rock greens, that's exactly what Paris and Rome were. 

And again, didn't matter. Euros trashed us anyways. Keegan saying they could have set the course up different is a bullshit distraction from the reality that he fucked up pairings and the players were totally outclassed. 

I'd argue the course setup was advantageous to both teams. What Euro player - let alone weekend hacker - wouldn't love a penalty free setup, soft greens, and wide fairways? 

Posted
19 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

I'd argue the course setup was advantageous to both teams. What Euro player - let alone weekend hacker - wouldn't love a penalty free setup, soft greens, and wide fairways? 

That's fair, and I agree to an extent. I still think it was more advantageous to the US but perhaps not advantageous enough (well, clearly not advantageous enough). 

Another school of thought I'm starting to come around to is the typical American bomb and gouge advantage just isn't an advantage anymore like it used to be when we had DJ, Brooks, and Tiger. There are enough Euros that thrive in the current bomb and gouge setting but can still succeed in the "must hit fairways and putts" setting and outside a few Americans, we struggle with that. 

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Posted

Examples of the details Luke Donald went to...

▫️ Told the team to arrive a week early and stay on Eastern Time in the week prior to the Ryder Cup.

▫️ Changed the bedding at the team hotel as he didn't think it was sufficient. Knew how important rest and recovery would be.

▫️ Swapped out the shampoo in the hotel room showers to a better quality and fragrance.

▫️ Noticed the doors in the hotel rooms had cracks that let in light so had each player's door fixed.

▫️ Each of the practice round uniforms was inspired by prior away victories for Team Europe.

▫️ Even today, not sure anyone knows this, but the four stripes on the European shirts represented the four away victories Team Europe have had.

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Posted
2 hours ago, dieucla98 said:

That's fair, and I agree to an extent. I still think it was more advantageous to the US but perhaps not advantageous enough (well, clearly not advantageous enough). 

Another school of thought I'm starting to come around to is the typical American bomb and gouge advantage just isn't an advantage anymore like it used to be when we had DJ, Brooks, and Tiger. There are enough Euros that thrive in the current bomb and gouge setting but can still succeed in the "must hit fairways and putts" setting and outside a few Americans, we struggle with that. 

the soft and slowerish greens after the rain were an advantage to the Euros. it helped them but the real issue is our guys choke putting A LOT for many years now.  when the greens are faster the putting advantage to the Euros is minimized a bit, IMO.

I also think we did not adjust, especially the first day, our scoring irons/wedges to the softness of the green.  we were spinning shit off the green or too much spin a lot.  The Euros did a better job adjusting, IMO.

I'd like to see the proximity stats but I'm not sure where to get them.

 

Posted (edited)

It's funny to see so many people say things like "Team USA just didn't make putts" and ignore the psychology of the Ryder Cup. Golf is the most mental game in the world. It's so quintessentially American to downplay emotions and the love needed to compete in this match play event. 

Team Europe doesn't play for "Europe". They play for each other. They play for Seve and Tony Jacklin. They revere the history and  the guys who paved the way before them. Shane Lowry said the Ryder Cup means more to him than his 2019 Open Championship win. 

Not trying to pick on Bryson, but he was asked why he was so emotional after losing. His answer was "I love my country."  That's great and all, but this tournament isn't about patriotism anymore, or at least shouldn't be the #1 factor. The game has gone global, the Europeans play in the US all year, the massive talent advantage America used to have is gone and not coming back. 

You have to find an edge. The Europeans have had a consistent plan for decades. Their attention to detail blows away Team USA, who just throws shit at the wall every 2 years. This is fixable, just need someone in charge who gets it. 

 

Edited by Hank Kingsley
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Posted
9 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

It's funny to see so many people say things like "Team USA just didn't make putts" and ignore the psychology of the Ryder Cup. Golf is the most mental game in the world. It's so quintessentially American to downplay emotions and the love needed to compete in this match play event. 

Team Europe doesn't play for "Europe". They play for each other. They play for Seve and Tony Jacklin. They revere the history and  the guys who paved the way before them. Shane Lowry said the Ryder Cup means more to him than his 2019 Open Championship win. 

Not trying to pick on Bryson, but he was asked why he was so emotional after losing. His answer was "I love my country."  That's great and all, but this tournament isn't about patriotism anymore, or at least shouldn't be the #1 factor. The game has gone global, the Europeans play in the US all year, the massive talent advantage America used to have is gone and not coming back. 

You have to find an edge. The Europeans have had a consistent plan for decades. Their attention to detail blows away Team USA, who just throws shit at the wall every 2 years. This is fixable, just need someone in charge who gets it. 

 

If playing for the USA doesn’t fire you up, you shouldn’t be out there. Especially if you get more excited to play for Morikowa or Cantlay than the RWB.

Posted

You singled out BDC. He showed the most emotion of anyone. He was down 5 and came back to tie. It was one of the best comebacks ever in Ryder Cup play. And Fitzpatrick didn’t make that easy.

I don’t think it was BDC fear of letting Ben Griffin down that motivated him for that comeback. 

Posted
4 minutes ago, Lamar said:

You singled out BDC. He showed the most emotion of anyone. He was down 5 and came back to tie. It was one of the best comebacks ever in Ryder Cup play. And Fitzpatrick didn’t make that easy.

I don’t think it was BDC fear of letting Ben Griffin down that motivated him for that comeback. 

Yes, that was a SINGLES match. I'm talking about the team aspect, where the US got pistol whipped by European pairings. 

I'm sure Team Europe will be very happy if Team USA continues to think it's just bad luck that they've lost 11 of the last 15 Ryder Cups. 

Last night Paul McGinley mentioned that top Euro players were mentally exhausted after first 2 days, and that the European committee needs to review and possibly adapt some strategies. Even though they won, they acknowledge a weakness and are already working on fixing it. Just a different level of care and detail from their side. 

 

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Posted
55 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

It's funny to see so many people say things like "Team USA just didn't make putts" and ignore the psychology of the Ryder Cup. Golf is the most mental game in the world. It's so quintessentially American to downplay emotions and the love needed to compete in this match play event. 

Team Europe doesn't play for "Europe". They play for each other. They play for Seve and Tony Jacklin. They revere the history and  the guys who paved the way before them. Shane Lowry said the Ryder Cup means more to him than his 2019 Open Championship win. 

Not trying to pick on Bryson, but he was asked why he was so emotional after losing. His answer was "I love my country."  That's great and all, but this tournament isn't about patriotism anymore, or at least shouldn't be the #1 factor. The game has gone global, the Europeans play in the US all year, the massive talent advantage America used to have is gone and not coming back. 

You have to find an edge. The Europeans have had a consistent plan for decades. Their attention to detail blows away Team USA, who just throws shit at the wall every 2 years. This is fixable, just need someone in charge who gets it. 

 

Clearly you are just talking about the foursome and four ball portion of the Ryder Cup. Thank you for capitalizing SINGLES in your other post so it’s clear for us.

Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, Revolution512 said:

Why was Keegan a captain again? Because he was snubbed from the team on a Netflix doc? Because he’s from the area? The guy has won 8 tournaments in his career.

Easy to say now, but I have been wondering the same thing.  I'll admit I'm not the biggest student of his career.  I know there are some others who either declined (Tiger) or weren't considered (Phil) for other reasons.  Seems like Justin Leonard would be high on the list of people getting consideration.  Heck, bring back Stricker or Davis Love.  

Edited by orange dream
Posted (edited)

Furyk was an assistant. Why not the captain?  
 

since hicks kept hammering him how much work the captain does, and we know how much work a full time pga pro puts in- what are we to assume when his golf game is going great but his Ryder cup team failed?  I know where I assume he spent his time. 
 

Hell I’d want azinger or couples over Bradley. 

Edited by Pato del Muerto
Posted
33 minutes ago, Surly Bevo said:

Dogshit Ryder Cup player (10-20). Dogshit Ryder Cup Captain (2018 7 point loss)

Keegan has played in 2 Ryder Cups and is 4-3. I don’t think he has ever been a Vice Captain.  Really green for being the captain. Especially considering the other options that are out there.

Posted

Great player doesn’t equal great captain, I just didn’t understand the choice from any level. 
 

Leonard would be a good choice. Duval would be another in my mind. Guys who are no longer playing (Leonard is back more now) and watch a ton of golf. Not just the Americans. 

Posted (edited)

When Keegan didn't make the '23 team, he was devastated and everyone saw it while being filmed for the Netflix doc Full Swing.  In golf circles, they said it was the impetus to quickly name KB '25 Captain as a mea culpa. A quick and irrational decision. 

Behind closed doors, a lot of people were annoyed by this decision. Azinger in an interview a while back said it was completely unfair to pass up older, retired American players as Captain. He likes Keegan but didn't agree with the way he was handed the job. 

From all reports, the US Ryder Cup "committee" is a total fucking joke. There is no strategy, there is no long term plan, there is no cohesiveness. Which is pathetic since so much money and resources are available to organize properly. 

 

EDIT: Reposting Alan Shipnuck's excellent Team USA criticism with historical context : https://www.skratch.golf/news/pro-golf/us-ryder-cup-loss-future-pgaa-ryder-cup-strategy-bethpage-2025

 

Edited by Hank Kingsley
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Posted

Great course. European fans were great and had shit eating grins essentially the entirety of play (save the bit of Sunday drama). US fans were on the whole ok but I witnessed plenty of shitbag and attention seeking behavior during play. 

The MC at the First Tee was terrible and I’m glad she fucked up so bad she had to quit.

winding down Sunday night there were a few arguments between fans, but mostly the Euros did their awesome chants and had a blast while US fans wallowed in their own crapulence. 

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