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Rougarou

Prove Me Wrong: American Airlines is the worst domestic airline

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On 5/1/2020 at 1:37 PM, Your Mom said:

I think Delta has already stopped selling middle seats. SWA is limiting seats sold, so as to not have anyone need to sit in a middle seat. Not sure who else has followed suit on that. I can tell you that its a moot point right now. Average load factor is below 20% right now. 

You were saying?

1 hour ago, TonyTexas said:

United doing its part to prolong the pandemic 

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16 minutes ago, RPM said:

You were saying?

 

I was saying Delta and SWA are underselling to avoid filling middle seats and that I didn’t know who else was following suit.  

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3 hours ago, TonyTexas said:

United doing its part to prolong the pandemic 

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Isn't the air being circulated in the cabin anyway? What good does it do if there's no middle seat while the entire plane shares the same air?

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21 minutes ago, HRSchenker said:

Isn't the air being circulated in the cabin anyway? What good does it do if there's no middle seat while the entire plane shares the same air?

Air conditioning systems in airplanes don’t recirculate air.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, XYZ said:

Air conditioning systems in airplanes don’t recirculate air.

They do, but the entire cabin is exchanged every 2-3 minutes, and the recirculated air helps with keeping enough humidity in the cabin. The HEPA filters installed supposedly kill 99.9% of everything that passes through them. 

Honestly, it’s likely the cleanest air you’ll breathe in your lifetime when you consider that most of it comes from the upper atmosphere above most pollution.

My question is what is the point of empty middle seats when someone  is sitting 20 some odd inches in front of and behind you?  

 

Edited by Bobby_Batronic

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I only sit outboard during pandemics so I can roll the window down and get fresh air after removing my mask at cruising altitude.  

Seriously though, i cannot fucking believe how many people are still flying like that.  I largely trust the air/hepa system, it's the rest of the filth involved with flying I do not understand right now.  God bless y'all while you do it.  I'm sure I'll have to get back to my rigorous schedule of 100,000 mile/year, but I haven't gotten within a mile of an airport in 3 months and haven't missed it at all.  I've already lose several tens of thousands of miles in rewards and couldn't give a flying fuck. 

 

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(Reuters) - The top three U.S. airlines have told their flight attendants not to force passengers to comply with their new policy requiring face coverings, just encourage them to do so, according to employee policies reviewed by Reuters.

American Airlines Group Inc (AAL.O), Delta Air Lines Inc (DAL.N) and United Airlines Holdings Inc (UAL.O) have told employees that they may deny boarding at the gate to anyone not wearing a face covering, and are providing masks to passengers who do not have them, the three carriers told Reuters.

Inside the plane, enforcement becomes more difficult.

Once on board and off the gate, the face covering policy becomes more lenient. The flight attendant's role is informational, not enforcement, with respect to the face covering policy," American told its pilots in a message seen by Reuters explaining its policy, which went into effect on Monday.

"Bottom line to the pilots: a passenger on board your aircraft who is being compliant with the exception of wearing a face covering is NOT considered disruptive enough to trigger a Threat Level 1 response," referring to some kind of intentional disruption by a passenger that could cause the captain to divert the flight.

American spokesman Joshua Freed said: "American, like other U.S. airlines, requires customers to wear a face covering while on board, and this requirement is enforced at the gate while boarding. We also remind customers with announcements both during boarding and at departure."

A United spokeswoman also said that any non-compliance by travelers would be addressed at the gate and that flight attendants had been counseled to use their "de-escalation skills" on the aircraft and to reseat any passengers as needed.

Delta said it had a similar policy.

All three airlines offer certain exemptions for young children or people with medical conditions or disabilities, and when people are eating or drinking.

"If the customer chooses not to comply for other reasons, please encourage them to comply, but do not escalate further," American told flight attendants in a message on Friday that it provided to Reuters.

"Likewise, if a customer is frustrated by another customer’s lack of face covering, please use situational awareness to de-escalate the situation," it said.

U.S. travel demand has fallen by about 94% in the midst of the coronavirus pandemic, prompting carriers to slash their flying schedules to roughly 30% of normal this month. With fewer planes in the skies, some are flying near capacity.

Global airlines body IATA came out last week in favor of passengers wearing masks onboard, as debate intensifies in the United States on the role that government agencies should play in mandating new safety measures for flying before a vaccine is developed.

While major U.S. airlines have individually mandated facial coverings, the Federal Aviation Administration has declined to implement the requirement, and it is not clear if the agency has the authority to compel passengers to wear face masks.

In a statement on Tuesday, the FAA said it would continue to engage in discussions about protecting the health and safety of flight crews and the traveling public and was "lending aviation expertise to federal public health agencies and airlines as they issue guidance for crew members, including health monitoring, screening protocols and aircraft cleaning."

Several airline union groups have called for a federal mandate on measures including masks, social distancing and cleaning.

"Airlines are implementing policies on the fly with essentially no coordination or direction from the federal government," said Sara Nelson, president of the Association of Flight Attendants-CWA, representing nearly 50,000 flight attendants at 19 airlines.

"We need federal requirements that mitigate risk during this pandemic and put the safety of crews and the traveling public first."

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I just assumed the United Cunts just want their passengers to die hoping they won’t have to deal with them. It’s pretty much how they operate in non pandemic times

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It's impossible to enforce since some people are exempt from it for certain medical reasons like asthma or some other ailment that makes it hard to breathe.  You can't make people prove they have those ailments, so you can't enforce the masks. 

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Posted (edited)

I'll put my vote in for United. Had a flight booked for June and UAL cancelled it.  I tried to file for a refund through their site, and the site would only let me request a refund for my seat upgrades.  I manually added my base ticket to the request, only for UAL to reject all three claims about 9 days later, saying I purchased a non-refundable fare.  Eventually got my money back after disputing the charge, with a screenshot of the DOT rules, stating that a refund has to be given when the airline cancels the flight, including non-refundable fares.  They've done it to lots of people...basically telling lies and basically hoping for people to give up and take the credit.

Edited by OU Sucks

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Friend of mine flew from DFW to CLT and back last week on AA. He said there were at least 100 people on both flights. People in middle seats, about 40% mask usage,  half the plane hacking and sneezing. He says he's 99% sure he's going to get the Covid after that. 

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Damn straight, masks is for queers!  Dallas was a beacon of manners and etiquette once upon a time, now it's the home of "take your middle seat, take off your mask, and shut the hell up!"  What a glorious chapter in Texas air travel.  

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I was curious to get opinions from the Surl on my situation with American Airlines.  I had a business trip scheduled for Prague in April.  I decided to take my wife (I know first mistake) so I bought her a ticket for about $4K.   In March the conference was canceled due to Covid 19 so I called back in March and American said they wouldn't refund the money but instead gave me a voucher that had to be used by the end of the year and all the money could only be used on my wife in the future. Now in May I realize travel may not be possible for the rest of the year so last week I emailed American asking for a refund and they just responded that the flight was non refundable and you have a voucher.   My question is would it be wrong to call my credit card company and explain the situation and see if they will reverse the charges?  Not sure the credit card company would even do this.  I am so glad American took all that bail out money yet won't refund money to customers like me even though I am a million miler with them and Executive Platinum every year for a decade or more now.  

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Beantown, I'd call the exec platinum line and speak with a rep.  I assume you can get through more easily than the poors.  I'd expect you won't be successful but you could then ask who you should speak to to escalate your request.  I've had success with this strategy in the past (not with AA but just in general).  Keep asking to speak to the next level of authority up from the person who couldn't help you.  I never get mad, I just keep escalating.  Maybe at a minimum you can at least get a more general voucher, not in your wife's name.

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Some of the airlines have extended the deadline for using the vouchers through 2021 or even 2022.  That is probably your best bet with American.  They straight up don't give a fuck.

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58 minutes ago, gecko said:

Beantown, I'd call the exec platinum line and speak with a rep.  I assume you can get through more easily than the poors.  I'd expect you won't be successful but you could then ask who you should speak to to escalate your request.  I've had success with this strategy in the past (not with AA but just in general).  Keep asking to speak to the next level of authority up from the person who couldn't help you.  I never get mad, I just keep escalating.  Maybe at a minimum you can at least get a more general voucher, not in your wife's name.

I started with the Exec Platinum desk and they told me to fill out the form online and submit it.  I am still tempted to just call my credit card company and tell them to reverse the charges and see if that works.

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15 minutes ago, kevwun said:

Some of the airlines have extended the deadline for using the vouchers through 2021 or even 2022.  That is probably your best bet with American.  They straight up don't give a fuck.

You got the "don't give a fuck" part right.  Can't speak for all airlines but the customer service side of American Airlines and their overall attitude towards their customers would cause them to fail if they were a restaurant or any other business in the service industry.  As an airline they have a monopoly at least on the Dallas market so they treat their customers like shit and no they can get away with it.  

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Boeing CEO seems to think one major airline is going out of business in the fall. The most likely airline, if this prediction holds true, would be AA. I'd work to get that refund. Voucher may not be worth anything soon enough. 

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Posted (edited)
On 5/13/2020 at 7:21 AM, Beantown Express 2.0 said:

I was curious to get opinions from the Surl on my situation with American Airlines.  I had a business trip scheduled for Prague in April.  I decided to take my wife (I know first mistake) so I bought her a ticket for about $4K.   In March the conference was canceled due to Covid 19 so I called back in March and American said they wouldn't refund the money but instead gave me a voucher that had to be used by the end of the year and all the money could only be used on my wife in the future. Now in May I realize travel may not be possible for the rest of the year so last week I emailed American asking for a refund and they just responded that the flight was non refundable and you have a voucher.   My question is would it be wrong to call my credit card company and explain the situation and see if they will reverse the charges?  Not sure the credit card company would even do this.  I am so glad American took all that bail out money yet won't refund money to customers like me even though I am a million miler with them and Executive Platinum every year for a decade or more now.  

Dude. 
 

Cautionary tale for all of you. 
DO NOT cancel flight on your own. Wait till 24 hrs before it is scheduled. If your airline cancels it they have no recourse but to refund. In other words don’t panic.  
Beantown, you might check the quarantine laws in Chek now and that “might” give you a little more ammo if they aren’t allowing visitors.  

Edited by Shaddie

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I started with the Exec Platinum desk and they told me to fill out the form online and submit it.  I am still tempted to just call my credit card company and tell them to reverse the charges and see if that works.

We did the online form and it took 2 weeks, but they eventually refunded us.

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Anyone wanna take bets on who it is?

 

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Boeing CEO seems to think one major airline is going out of business in the fall. The most likely airline, if this prediction holds true, would be AA. I'd work to get that refund. Voucher may not be worth anything soon enough. 

My thinking is that Boeing may be in more trouble than any of the big 4.

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My thinking is that Boeing may be in more trouble than any of the big 4.

I doubt it.

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Largest exporter in the nation with massive ties to the military and essential economy driving infrastructure?

Boeing’s not going anywhere. 

The interesting thing to see is who declares BK, likely AAL, and if the others follow shortly to prevent a massive competitive advantage like DAL enjoyed. 

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Not A/A and not domestic, but dayum.

Pakistan Jet Crashed Shortly After Bizarre Landing Attempt At 327 KPH

A deadly plane crash in Pakistan is prompting questions about how the crew could touch down without landing gear when their sophisticated jetliner was bristling with equipment to prevent pilots from doing just that.
After an abrupt descent that had unnerved air-traffic controllers, the pilots of the Pakistan International Airlines jet on Friday briefly put the aircraft on the runway without the landing gear, grinding along on its two engines at a speed of more than 327 kilometers (203 miles per hour), according to preliminary data.

The pilots aborted the landing attempt, climbing back into the sky, but reported shortly afterward they'd lost power. The Airbus SE A320 apparently glided into a neighborhood as pilots were attempting to return to the same runway, killing 97 of 99 people aboard.

"It is unbelievable to me that an airline crew on a jet like an Airbus, with all the warning systems, would attempt to land the plane without the gear extended," said John Cox, an aviation safety consultant who formerly flew the A320 as a U.S. airline pilot.

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5 minutes ago, RPM said:

Not A/A and not domestic, but dayum.

Pakistan Jet Crashed Shortly After Bizarre Landing Attempt At 327 KPH

A deadly plane crash in Pakistan is prompting questions about how the crew could touch down without landing gear when their sophisticated jetliner was bristling with equipment to prevent pilots from doing just that.
After an abrupt descent that had unnerved air-traffic controllers, the pilots of the Pakistan International Airlines jet on Friday briefly put the aircraft on the runway without the landing gear, grinding along on its two engines at a speed of more than 327 kilometers (203 miles per hour), according to preliminary data.

The pilots aborted the landing attempt, climbing back into the sky, but reported shortly afterward they'd lost power. The Airbus SE A320 apparently glided into a neighborhood as pilots were attempting to return to the same runway, killing 97 of 99 people aboard.

"It is unbelievable to me that an airline crew on a jet like an Airbus, with all the warning systems, would attempt to land the plane without the gear extended," said John Cox, an aviation safety consultant who formerly flew the A320 as a U.S. airline pilot.

No, it crashed. 

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Never flown a 320 but landing at 203kts seems a bit much. Maybe they forgot the flaps as well. Regardless, hope there were aircraft problems that we don’t know about or there is going to be some shoe throwing at the pilots graves.

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24 minutes ago, DallasGatr said:

Never flown a 320 but landing at 203kts seems a bit much. Maybe they forgot the flaps as well. Regardless, hope there were aircraft problems that we don’t know about or there is going to be some shoe throwing at the pilots graves.

For reference I had a partial flap landing (no slats) with a full boat at a high elevation airport and our Vapp was 163. 

You cant extend flaps beyond the second notch until 185 knots, but the gear can be lowered at 250 knots. The wheels won’t come down above 260 regardless of handle position. 

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