All Encompassing Investment and Financial Planning Thread for the Surly 99.5%

[Redneck Mutha 7832]

1 hour ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

My plan for the annual bonus to build a pool but I worry about my cheap boss not coming through on the promised bonus. But first I have to worry about my rural cousin and his family coming for a stay. At least they’re staying in the RV out front instead of taking up a bedroom.

[B00M 5999]

[StassneyHorn 6407]

I-Bonds down to 4.3% but have 0.9% fixed rate. That is all

[Nice Guy Eddie 13267]

Not in the category of getting rich but Apple is now offering a 4.15% savings account for their Apple Card holders.  Administered by Goldman Sachs. I haven't tested a withdrawal yet but I imagine it's fairly quick like GS' Marcus product.

Apple also starts accruing your interest on the day you initiate the deposit. Many other banks start the interest only once the funds have cleared. While this means little in the long run, I appreciate they're giving you a couple of days of interest even when they don't have fully have the funds yet.

As I mentioned the Apple Card, looks to be a requirement. It's basically a normal credit card with the main features that it gives you 3% cash back on Apple products/services and they give you the cash back immediately, including an option to deposit it in your Apple savings account. You don't have to wait for the month close date. Once again, not a huge deal but better than most.

[Guest]

Yeah, savings account rates are finally getting nice. Getting paid 4.25% with PNC. Marcus (Goldman Sachs) has a 5.05% 10-month CD.

[fluff 87]

Bask bank is a division of Texas Capital Bank, currently getting 4.64% FYI.

 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13267]

Decent interest rates make me want to keep as little as possible in checking accounts. Drop 5K in a 4% account, and it's like a free monthly lunch for you. (As I get older, I think of savings and other passive income in terms of purchasing power.)   Put 150-200K in a savings account, and you've just earned a lifetime car payment. Or something like that with the obvious realization that rates change and cars will get more expensive.

[StassneyHorn 6407]

Checked on the 10k I bond I bought when the rate went to 9.68% today and had $480 earned on it. Nice way to wake up to 500 dollars. Pretty sure the amount included the 3 month penalty baked in.

[Parliament 13979]

So Fidelity has some zero expense index funds.  What's the catch?  How do they make money?  They aren't working for free.  

[gmr548 16252]

3 hours ago, Parliament said:

So Fidelity has some zero expense index funds.  What's the catch?  How do they make money?  They aren't working for free.  

I mean it's just a loss leader. Fidelity offers a few zero fee index funds - ones that don't add significantly to their overhead to run given they already run basically identical index funds - to attract individuals shopping on price in hopes that they'll come out ahead with those new investors putting money into their products that do make them money. For example, ~85% of my portfolio is in zero fee but I do have a bit in a couple of funds that do have fees.

They're basically betting that fees lost from existing customers switching to zero fee funds will be less than fees gained from new investors bringing money in. As they're a few years old at this point it seems like it probably worked.

[Tailgate 2972]

What’s the surly thoughts on high-yield savings accounts? Kids are graduating college with jobs (yay!) and are thinking of using one for now.

Appreciate thoughts. Doing some online research as well.

[Texas Jeff 1908]

22 hours ago, Tailgate said:

What’s the surly thoughts on high-yield savings accounts? Kids are graduating college with jobs (yay!) and are thinking of using one for now.

Appreciate thoughts. Doing some online research as well.

IMHO, for those just starting out:

1. Build savings up to the point where you would not panic if you lost your job.  Something like 3-6 months of income with easy access if needed. 
2. Fund a 401(k) if you can, especially get the employer match if offered.
3. Invest any excess in low-cost indexed mutual funds.
4. Wait.

If you are in a low marginal tax bracket and have access to a Roth 401(k), consider the Roth 401(k).

[Nice Guy Eddie 13267]

HYSAs are great for emergency funds and short terms savings. I also want to work my savings balance up to ~3 years of expenses in the run up to my retirement.  This allows you to 1) earn a decent amount in annual interest, 2) prevent any retirement plan withdrawals in down years especially in the extremely important initial years.

[Dbeasy 14733]

Does anyone use a financial advisor that charges by the hour, rather than by percentage of assets? 

I’m doing some estate planning and am thinking about scenarios where I’m not around to manage the household finances and I want to explore that scenario.

I already have a financial advisor identified that charges by percent of assets. I don’t use them much today because I’ve got pretty good financial planning knowledge, but my wife would struggle mightily. 

[Incredulity 11141]

18 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

Does anyone use a financial advisor that charges by the hour, rather than by percentage of assets? 

I’m doing some estate planning and am thinking about scenarios where I’m not around to manage the household finances and I want to explore that scenario.

I already have a financial advisor identified that charges by percent of assets. I don’t use them much today because I’ve got pretty good financial planning knowledge, but my wife would struggle mightily. 

A good tax attorney or CPA

[Trey3216 15298]

4 hours ago, Dbeasy said:

Does anyone use a financial advisor that charges by the hour, rather than by percentage of assets? 

I’m doing some estate planning and am thinking about scenarios where I’m not around to manage the household finances and I want to explore that scenario.

I already have a financial advisor identified that charges by percent of assets. I don’t use them much today because I’ve got pretty good financial planning knowledge, but my wife would struggle mightily. 

There are quite a few that do both (flat fee, asset based fee, hybrid of the two).  

[Wally Fairway 5465]

4 hours ago, Dbeasy said:

Does anyone use a financial advisor that charges by the hour, rather than by percentage of assets? 

I’m doing some estate planning and am thinking about scenarios where I’m not around to manage the household finances and I want to explore that scenario.

I already have a financial advisor identified that charges by percent of assets. I don’t use them much today because I’ve got pretty good financial planning knowledge, but my wife would struggle mightily. 

Pics of the wife would help, but I'm sure someone from Surly would be around to help her.
Know what I mean, know what I mean, nudge nudge? 

 

[Dbeasy 14733]

1 hour ago, Trey3216 said:

There are quite a few that do both (flat fee, asset based fee, hybrid of the two).  

I’m looking for per hour, not flat fee. 

[Trey3216 15298]

1 hour ago, Dbeasy said:

I’m looking for per hour, not flat fee. 

Flat fee is either comprehensive or per hour.  That can be made as an arrangement with the advisor. 

[StassneyHorn 6407]

On 10/12/2023 at 11:43 AM, Dbeasy said:

I’m looking for per hour, not flat fee. 

No

[Nice Guy Eddie 13267]

While too long, but I found this to be an interesting discussion about retirement planning and traditional vs. Roth options. I've found it easy to fall into a trap that this way or that way is the best method to save. As your balances grow and time to retire become shorter, it's worth thinking about where you're going.  I also need to think more about what is said in this video. You can find some really bad advice in youtube videos as well as hidden gems.

 

Edited October 25, 2023 by Nice Guy Eddie

[Dbeasy 14733]

On 10/14/2023 at 11:48 AM, StassneyHorn said:

No

No, what?

[StassneyHorn 6407]

No to the question of financial advisors taking on ad-hoc work if you aren’t an existing client.

Most financial advisors have billing tiers that charge a quarterly flat fee by AUM amount, and then any operational fees detailed in the fee schedule. These people aren’t going to take on ad-hoc work for people that aren’t greasing the wheel for them. You would probably be better served by a CPA, or a lawyer you trust with discretionary trading rights on your account.

Unless something has changed in the industry, this was how it worked at every broker-dealer I worked for in the 2010s.

 

[Sgt Hulk 13484]

Reaching out to the surly elite. 
 

my time with Big blue is coming to an end and retiring soon.  Pension and disability will be starting in first of year.  Additionally I have secured a fairly robust industry job in the space world. 
 

so questions is outside or company 401K.  Is it worth getting a financial advisor like the JPM wealth manager folks offering me 6 months of free advising.   I’m fairly savvy however I don’t know all the vehicles out there to stash money to grow.  Stick to self managing or find a low fee pro?

[StassneyHorn 6407]

If you can afford it, no reason to sweat this stuff, you already accomplished what you needed to make it to retirement age. Don’t give yourself the extra job of financial advisor/tax expert.

Probably overstated, but I’d go with an advisor at a RIA rather than a wirehouse firm. The fact some wire houses even had to have some cute, opposing opinions about fiduciary rule changes was obnoxious.

 

Edited October 26, 2023 by StassneyHorn

[StassneyHorn 6407]

New I Bond rates looks attractive at 5.27%.

Important detail is it had a fixed rate of 1.3% attached to it for new buyers through November. Will be there the whole life of the bond

[Mr. White 4]

Is there any advantage to contribute to a 401K in which the employer doesn't match funds?

[blacklab 11807]

Yes, you get to put off paying income tax on it till later and you'll have more money to grow before you withdraw.

If you're making $120k now that money is in the $100k-$120k tax rate.

If you withdraw $20k after you retire and live off it for a year you're in the $0k-$20k tax rate which is much lower

 

[Dbeasy 14733]

On 10/25/2023 at 10:39 AM, StassneyHorn said:

No to the question of financial advisors taking on ad-hoc work if you aren’t an existing client.

Most financial advisors have billing tiers that charge a quarterly flat fee by AUM amount, and then any operational fees detailed in the fee schedule. These people aren’t going to take on ad-hoc work for people that aren’t greasing the wheel for them. You would probably be better served by a CPA, or a lawyer you trust with discretionary trading rights on your account.

Unless something has changed in the industry, this was how it worked at every broker-dealer I worked for in the 2010s.

 

Thank you for the response. You sound like you work in the business. Just to be clear there are advisors out there who charge per hour. I’m just looking for specific  recommendations. if no one on here uses per hour advisors, I’ll just select via my own research. 

[blacklab 11807]

I have a guy here in Austin I hit up on an hourly after a big change. Let me know if you want his contact info

[Nice Guy Eddie 13267]

21 hours ago, Mr. White said:

Is there any advantage to contribute to a 401K in which the employer doesn't match funds?

 

16 hours ago, blacklab said:

Yes, you get to put off paying income tax on it till later and you'll have more money to grow before you withdraw.

If you're making $120k now that money is in the $100k-$120k tax rate.

If you withdraw $20k after you retire and live off it for a year you're in the $0k-$20k tax rate which is much lower

 

Also can be worthwhile contributing to a Roth 401k with some of your contributions. Then those funds will be in the 0% tax rate later on. This allows you to manipulate and plan your tax brackets after you retire. In my opinion it’s good to have money in Roth, traditional and brokerage accounts outside of retirement. Gives you flexibility.

as an aside that sucks you get 0 match. Is this a contracting firm, or is your boss cheap?

[StassneyHorn 6407]

0 match sucks, tell HR to get it together

i think most people recommend max 401k traditional, then contribute max to a Roth IRA, then max an HSA if you got it/can live comfortably

[Nice Guy Eddie 13267]

On 11/4/2023 at 3:18 PM, StassneyHorn said:

0 match sucks, tell HR to get it together

i think most people recommend max 401k traditional, then contribute max to a Roth IRA, then max an HSA if you got it/can live comfortably

What are the limitations or rules regarding maxing out a Roth IRA if you contribute fully to a 401k including the post 50 catch-up?

[Redneck Mutha 7832]

9 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

What are the limitations or rules regarding maxing out a Roth IRA if you contribute fully to a 401k including the post 50 catch-up?

https://www.irs.gov/retirement-plans/amount-of-roth-ira-contributions-that-you-can-make-for-2023

[davidg 4015]

0 match sucks, tell HR to get it together
i think most people recommend max 401k traditional, then contribute max to a Roth IRA, then max an HSA if you got it/can live comfortably

We always did:
- 401k up to company match
- Roth IRA until income limits kicked in
- 401k max contribution
- 401k catch up after 50
- Brokerage account

Probably left some on the table regarding the HSA accounts but Oh well.

[Nice Guy Eddie 13267]

A caller made Dave Ramsey go into a rage the other day because the caller mentioned that someone should plan to withdraw 4% from their retirement account. Dave thinks that number should be 8% which is much higher than everyone else in the known universe thinks.

The 4% rule is there because you want to be conservative so that you have almost no chance of running out of money. Dave doesn’t think that is possible at 8%. Dave is wrong. Where Dave is right is that it can be disheartening to think that if you save $1m, you might need to only take out 40k at least in the first couple of years.

The caller created a video about it, and it’s possible that he intentionally set off Dave.

 

[Trey3216 15298]

2 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

A caller made Dave Ramsey go into a rage the other day because the caller mentioned that someone should plan to withdraw 4% from their retirement account. Dave thinks that number should be 8% which is much higher than everyone else in the known universe thinks.

The 4% rule is there because you want to be conservative so that you have almost no chance of running out of money. Dave doesn’t think that is possible at 8%. Dave is wrong. Where Dave is right is that it can be disheartening to think that if you save $1m, you might need to only take out 40k at least in the first couple of years.

The caller created a video about it, and it’s possible that he intentionally set off Dave.

 

The 4% rule doesn't even work anymore, unless you have "non-market buffer assets" equivalent to 2-3 years worth of withdrawals.  The going recommended withdrawal rate to not run out of money is about 2.8%.   

[Nice Guy Eddie 13267]

3 hours ago, Trey3216 said:

The 4% rule doesn't even work anymore, unless you have "non-market buffer assets" equivalent to 2-3 years worth of withdrawals.  The going recommended withdrawal rate to not run out of money is about 2.8%.   

Yep. The problem with some of these scenarios is other factors come into play. Age, SS benefits, other expected income, cash funds, etc. If you're retiring at 45, you need a fund that will confidently last 40 years. Even if the withdrawal rate has a 10% chance of failure, that could be devastating if you find yourself poor at 70.

As you write, my plan is to save up 3 years of expenses saved up in cash by my early 60s. Uncertain whether I would consider non-essential items like travel in that. This cash would remain untouched except in market downturns. Then when the market eventually returns, replenish the cash savings. Hopefully I never sell investments at the bottom. This is the idea on paper but I actually don't know exactly how I would implement it.

As for my withdrawal rate, I'm targeting 3-4%. If anything I worry more about switching from a saver to a spender. I could see myself withdrawing 4% and starting a new investment account.

[Trey3216 15298]

21 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Yep. The problem with some of these scenarios is other factors come into play. Age, SS benefits, other expected income, cash funds, etc. If you're retiring at 45, you need a fund that will confidently last 40 years. Even if the withdrawal rate has a 10% chance of failure, that could be devastating if you find yourself poor at 70.

As you write, my plan is to save up 3 years of expenses saved up in cash by my early 60s. Uncertain whether I would consider non-essential items like travel in that. This cash would remain untouched except in market downturns. Then when the market eventually returns, replenish the cash savings. Hopefully I never sell investments at the bottom. This is the idea on paper but I actually don't know exactly how I would implement it.

As for my withdrawal rate, I'm targeting 3-4%. If anything I worry more about switching from a saver to a spender. I could see myself withdrawing 4% and starting a new investment account.

Good post! 

[midtown 3334]

On 11/13/2023 at 7:27 AM, Nice Guy Eddie said:

A caller made Dave Ramsey go into a rage the other day because the caller mentioned that someone should plan to withdraw 4% from their retirement account. Dave thinks that number should be 8% which is much higher than everyone else in the known universe thinks.

Dave Ramsey is a used car salesman that took a well known debt reduction strategy and attached religion to it and got rich.  He has no business giving financial advice what so ever.  This is like taking compassion advice from  Joel Olsteen

Edited November 14, 2023 by midtown

[Dbeasy 14733]

So, I noticed a trend to watch that is very worrisome. Big corporate is getting more and more powerful every day.  Apple, Google, AT&T, etc have enormous power to dominate markets and set prices. I noticed recently that the big financial firms like Blackstone are starting to exert their own power over consumers.  For example, they have a set of bond funds called iShares iBonds that are useful for building bond ladders.  They had a tool on their website that made it easy to evaluate the different funds and build a ladder. It isn't a complicated tool, but they've now locked it away from consumers and force you to use advisors to get access to that "expertise".

I can see a near-term future where these mega firms like Fidelity, Blackstone, Vanguard, etc. start pulling information away from the consumer to force you to work with financial advisors.  That is not good. Hopefully financial start-ups can fill any informational void these companies try to create.

More broadly, be prepared for continued excessive price hikes every year from these companies that operate in monopoly and oligopoly markets, because our government isn't doing anything to stop them. They are all on the payrolls of Big Corp.

[Parliament 13979]

Vanguard tried charging me quarterly “account fees” for my low-mid 6 figure holdings 18 months ago.  Must not have gone over well as they haven’t tried it since.

[kmac30 416]

So, I noticed a trend to watch that is very worrisome. Big corporate is getting more and more powerful every day.  Apple, Google, AT&T, etc have enormous power to dominate markets and set prices. I noticed recently that the big financial firms like Blackstone are starting to exert their own power over consumers.  For example, they have a set of bond funds called iShares iBonds that are useful for building bond ladders.  They had a tool on their website that made it easy to evaluate the different funds and build a ladder. It isn't a complicated tool, but they've now locked it away from consumers and force you to use advisors to get access to that "expertise".
I can see a near-term future where these mega firms like Fidelity, Blackstone, Vanguard, etc. start pulling information away from the consumer to force you to work with financial advisors.  That is not good. Hopefully financial start-ups can fill any informational void these companies try to create.
More broadly, be prepared for continued excessive price hikes every year from these companies that operate in monopoly and oligopoly markets, because our government isn't doing anything to stop them. They are all on the payrolls of Big Corp.

Not to nitpick, but you’re talking about BlackRock. And what they are doing is a problem. They are using their size and ownership to dictate policy within companies that might not be in everyone’s best interest.

[Parliament 13979]

Every year at this time, I run a report of all my CC transactions and scrub for recurring charges I no longer need.  There's always something to cancel.

[Parliament 13979]

Call those aholes and tell them to refund.  If they don't, report it to your cc as a fraudulent charge.  I got my $5 Weather Channel refunded last year that way.

[Dbeasy 14733]

3 hours ago, kmac30 said:

Not to nitpick, but you’re talking about BlackRock. And what they are doing is a problem. They are using their size and ownership to dictate policy within companies that might not be in everyone’s best interest.

yes, BlackRock.  typo.

[Parliament 13979]

The iBond 5.27% atm.  My MMA is about the same.  That means I shouldn't put my yearly $10k in just yet, right?

[Larry T. Spider 1740]

Recently got a higher paying job so I have a good challenge on my hands. I can save about 4k or 5k per month plus commissions. Not counting commissions for now but it would be safe to expect another 50k or so. Could be much higher with accelerators.

This money is based on take home with my 401k getting maxed at 23k. Already maxed my Roth and my wife’s traditional IRA for 2024.

So the question is what’s next? Can’t do a HSA. Owe 135k on a house worth 600ish at a 3.25 rate. No debt other than the mortgage.

No kids. 12 month emergency fund is done. Need a new car soon and saved enough cash for that. Want to buy a couple of rental properties and also have enough for 25% down on those.

Im 40 and don’t have a ton of retirement savings because I wasn’t making a ton for a lot of my career. Paid into TRS for 15 years.

Is a taxable brokerage account the only real option here? Can’t imagine throwing a bunch at the mortgage would be smart with the low rate. I can buy more rentals if I end up liking it, but that won’t be for a while.

[Parliament 13979]

People worry about taxable accounts way more than they need to.  Put it in a taxable index fund (S&P 500, Wilshire 5000, etc.) and call it good.

[UTPhil2006 3753]

I vote the rental home route