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The Surly Official 2020 Corching Search Thread of DOOM and DESPAIR


If it ain't Urban, who do you want?  

283 members have voted

  1. 1. Speaking of polls, I had sex with South_Austin's mom

    • Fickell
      84
    • Fleck
      12
    • Franklin
      8
    • Fuente
      5
    • Cristobal
      29
    • Allen
      19
    • Some NFL assistant ....name him
      10
    • Some college assistant.....name him
      3
    • Harbaugh
      11
    • Other....name him
      102


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1 minute ago, Big_kat said:

SOmebody talk me out of Matt Campbell.  I realize he is not the fancy, splash hire that most of us want, but he is what we need.  I have not seen many coaches do more with less than he has done at ISU.  He was also good at Toledo before.  I will take substance over flash any day of the week.  Can any of you say you don't fear having to play ISU with him as the coach?  I think that is a pretty good litmus test for a candidate.  Hell, I know Lincoln fears him.  Here is his record:

 

Year Team Overall Conference Standing Bowl/playoffs Coaches# AP°
Toledo Rockets (Mid-American Conference) (2011–2015)
2011 Toledo 1–0 0–0   W Military    
2012 Toledo 9–4 6–2 T–2nd (West) L Famous Idaho Potato    
2013 Toledo 7–5 5–3 T–3rd (West)      
2014 Toledo 9–4 7–1 T–1st (West) W GoDaddy    
2015 Toledo 9–2 6–2 T–1st (West) Boca Raton*    
Toledo: 35–15 24–8 * Departed Toledo for Iowa State before bowl game
Iowa State Cyclones (Big 12 Conference) (2016–present)
2016 Iowa State 3–9 2–7 9th      
2017 Iowa State 8–5 5–4 T–4th W Liberty    
2018 Iowa State 8–5 6–3 T–3rd L Alamo    
2019 Iowa State 7–6 5–4 T–3rd L Camping World    
2020 Iowa State 8–2 8–1 1st      
Iowa State: 34–27 26–19  
Total: 69–42  
      National championship         Conference title         Conference division title or championship game berth

 

I get the bowl record is not the greatest, but again, these are with 3 star kids with a few 4 stars sprinkled in.  Now imagine what he could do with 4 star kids and some 5 stars.  Am I totally off base here?

Can't recruit worth shit.  But I know it's ISU

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7 minutes ago, longhornfreak said:

Don't shoot the messenger:

 

 

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And the neat thing is Santa will have brought us all shiny toys, in the meantime! I can't get back on that train. I hope this is all true. I doubt any of it is true. I'm going to watch some basketball and get mad all over again.

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2 minutes ago, UncleBuck said:

Hiring a lesser known fella for a short, easy contract to get out of and then extending them when they show they can be the real deal. Interesting concept. 

Trying to bribe the big names or overpaying for hype is not working so far.

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26 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

Would you rather talk about Jeff fucking Traylor or Jeff fucking Fischer?

I would be much happier to get Jeff fucking Traylor than Jeff fucking Fischer.  Fischer is a complete piece of shit and a garbage coach.  At least we all agree Jeff Traylor isn't an asshole.

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17 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

Can't recruit worth shit.  But I know it's ISU

Give him the talent Texas has currently and he'll win enough that recruiting will work itself out, with a little help from a good recruiting staff. It's hard to recruit people to Aimes, IA, where the main attraction is watching a flock of geese fly into a wind turbine. 

Edited by UncleBuck
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25 minutes ago, Big_kat said:

Somebody talk me out of Matt Campbell.  I realize he is not the fancy, splash hire that most of us want, but he is what we need.  I have not seen many coaches do more with less than he has done at ISU.  He was also good at Toledo before.  I will take substance over flash any day of the week.  Can any of you say you don't fear having to play ISU with him as the coach?  I think that is a pretty good litmus test for a candidate.  Hell, I know Lincoln fears him.  Here is his record:

 

Year Team Overall Conference Standing Bowl/playoffs Coaches# AP°
Toledo Rockets (Mid-American Conference) (2011–2015)
2011 Toledo 1–0 0–0   W Military    
2012 Toledo 9–4 6–2 T–2nd (West) L Famous Idaho Potato    
2013 Toledo 7–5 5–3 T–3rd (West)      
2014 Toledo 9–4 7–1 T–1st (West) W GoDaddy    
2015 Toledo 9–2 6–2 T–1st (West) Boca Raton*    
Toledo: 35–15 24–8 * Departed Toledo for Iowa State before bowl game
Iowa State Cyclones (Big 12 Conference) (2016–present)
2016 Iowa State 3–9 2–7 9th      
2017 Iowa State 8–5 5–4 T–4th W Liberty    
2018 Iowa State 8–5 6–3 T–3rd L Alamo    
2019 Iowa State 7–6 5–4 T–3rd L Camping World    
2020 Iowa State 8–2 8–1 1st      
Iowa State: 34–27 26–19  
Total: 69–42  
      National championship         Conference title         Conference division title or championship game berth

 

I get the bowl record is not the greatest, but again, these are with 3 star kids with a few 4 stars sprinkled in.  Now imagine what he could do with 4 star kids and some 5 stars.  Am I totally off base here?

I will have to say it over and over again. "Imagine what he can do with Texas talent" is an excuse line and does not mean shit. The same was said about Herman and he lost to SMU with superior talent at Houston. Campbell lost to the Raging Cajuns and Oklahoma State that is a paper giant! So stop with imagine what they can do with Texas talent. If they lose with superior talent to lesser talent with their current roster during their best year they will lose to inferior talent at Texas.

Final year before moving on to NC job:

Saban - Only lost to ranked talent in his last year. Purdue which was ranked lower than his team had Drew Brees

Urban - Did not lose

Mack Brown - Only lost to higher ranked Florida State

 

 

Edited by DanTheHorn
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5 minutes ago, USMCHorn said:

Why the FUCK is Art Briles being brought up?

Because he's one of only two Sure Deal candidates. Him and Urban. And neither of them are coming here. So we gotta stop pigeon holing ourselves on what an acceptable option is for the next Texas coach. No one will check all of the boxes. 

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20 minutes ago, Big_kat said:

Somebody talk me out of Matt Campbell.  I realize he is not the fancy, splash hire that most of us want, but he is what we need.  I have not seen many coaches do more with less than he has done at ISU.  He was also good at Toledo before.  I will take substance over flash any day of the week.  Can any of you say you don't fear having to play ISU with him as the coach?  I think that is a pretty good litmus test for a candidate.  Hell, I know Lincoln fears him.  Here is his record:

 

Year Team Overall Conference Standing Bowl/playoffs Coaches# AP°
Toledo Rockets (Mid-American Conference) (2011–2015)
2011 Toledo 1–0 0–0   W Military    
2012 Toledo 9–4 6–2 T–2nd (West) L Famous Idaho Potato    
2013 Toledo 7–5 5–3 T–3rd (West)      
2014 Toledo 9–4 7–1 T–1st (West) W GoDaddy    
2015 Toledo 9–2 6–2 T–1st (West) Boca Raton*    
Toledo: 35–15 24–8 * Departed Toledo for Iowa State before bowl game
Iowa State Cyclones (Big 12 Conference) (2016–present)
2016 Iowa State 3–9 2–7 9th      
2017 Iowa State 8–5 5–4 T–4th W Liberty    
2018 Iowa State 8–5 6–3 T–3rd L Alamo    
2019 Iowa State 7–6 5–4 T–3rd L Camping World    
2020 Iowa State 8–2 8–1 1st      
Iowa State: 34–27 26–19  
Total: 69–42  
      National championship         Conference title         Conference division title or championship game berth

 

I get the bowl record is not the greatest, but again, these are with 3 star kids with a few 4 stars sprinkled in.  Now imagine what he could do with 4 star kids and some 5 stars.  Am I totally off base here?

I agree with all this. He's taking the equivalent of Kansas or pre-Briles Baylor and turned them into a CCG team. They're a balanced, disciplined team and it's in our conference against the same teams he'd play here. Imagine him with better talent and a bigger assistant budget.

Recruiting is an unknown because he's at ISU but just make sure he's got a few rainmakers on staff and he should be fine there.

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41 minutes ago, closetojumping said:

 

 

Think about if Art Briles gets the Tech job because they suck it up and 86 the JAG they have there right now and realize that trading their soul for wins is the right Tech move and on brand. Briles has offered to take the Tech job for a few things:

1) $1 - literally, that's it.

2) Total control over football.

3) A big stack of money for his assistants and admins. 

He's told them they can negotiate a contract for him after 2 years when everyone sees where everything is at with the program. 

 

Seriously??? Jeez, we need this to hit the mainstream media so protests start erupting before the deal gets done.

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This is a real question, I'm not a troll, and I understand many will shit on me for even asking. 

 

I'll start by saying that it's clear to me that Herman is not a *bad* coach.  He obviously does not perform up to our standards and seems like a pompous ass who rubs many fans, admin. and BMDs the wrong way, but he is an above average college coach.  My personal view of college football over the past 15 years, and even more so over the past decade, is that there are 1-5 truly elite college coaches who can predictably and systematically win at the highest levels.  Then there are a bunch of coaches who, whether because they don't have truly elite talent, or get outcoached sometimes but not most of the time, lose 2-5 games every year.  This is totally variable from year to year, but generally these are coaches that win more than they lose to varying degrees.  Herman is obviously one of those coaches.  

 

Can someone who knows more about recruiting tell me why we should buy out Herman, pay another probably very comparable coach as much or more to come here, only to continue to lose a similar number of games year to year?  Having missed on Urban, why is it out of the question to simply ride with Herman, who is at least winning (more than we could say about Strong)?  I gather it's to save and re-invigorate recruiting, but I don't see evidence that there is someone out there who will keep Bama and Clemson and especially tOSU from taking the best recruits out of Texas for the foreseeable future.  It really seems like missing out on Urban means we are back at Herman being our best option, which at least means winning twice as many games as we lose until someone else emerges as a truly elite option.  Getting rid of him because we hate his personality and because he isn't one of the best 5 coaches in the country, when none of those dudes is available, seems like cutting your nose off to spite your face, but I honestly don't know enough about the damage to recruiting that this approach would do in the medium and long term.  Someone please enlighten me.

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13 minutes ago, DanTheHorn said:

I will have to say it over and over again. "Imagine what he can do with Texas talent" is an excuse line and does not mean shit. The same was said about Herman and he lost to SMU with superior talent at Houston. Campbell lost to the Raging Cajuns and Oklahoma State that is a paper giant! So stop with imagine what they can do with Texas talent. If they lose with superior talent to lesser talent with their current roster during their best year they will lose to inferior talent at Texas.

Final year before moving on to NC job:

Saban - Only lost to ranked talent in his last year. Purdue which was ranked lower than his team had Drew Brees

Urban - Did not lose

Mack Brown - Only lost to higher ranked Florida State

 

 

UNC, MSU, and Utah are all much, much more prestigious programs with a whole different level of talent than Iowa State. That's not really a fair comparison. Apples to Chainsaws.

It's also a really cherry-picked argument. In his six years, Campbell has lost to less talented teams twice, and one of those was his first game of his first season. I'm not going to go back and look, but I bet even Saban, Urban, and Mack had the same of bad losses, or more, prior to their NC jobs.

Edited by BradInATX
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Just now, Nuthn2CHere said:

This is a real question, I'm not a troll, and I understand many will shit on me for even asking. 

 

I'll start by saying that it's clear to me that Herman is not a *bad* coach.  He obviously does not perform up to our standards and seems like a pompous ass who rubs many fans, admin. and BMDs the wrong way, but he is an above average college coach. 

By the very definition of "average" and "average" or "above average" coach wouldn't consistently lose to garbage can teams with Texas' talent. 

An average coach would lose about 2.5 games per year at Texas.

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12 minutes ago, UncleBuck said:

Give him the talent Texas has currently and he'll win enough that recruiting will work itself out, with a little help from a good recruiting staff. It's hard to recruit people to Aimes, IA, where the main attraction is watching a flock of geese fly into a wind turbine. 

Iowa State has just as much NFL Talent on their roster as ours. They aren’t a team of scrubs.

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11 minutes ago, UncleBuck said:

Give him the talent Texas has currently and he'll win enough that recruiting will work itself out, with a little help from a good recruiting staff. It's hard to recruit people to Aimes, IA, where the main attraction is watching a flock of geese fly into a wind turbine. 

Well how good of a recruiter was Saban at Michigan State? I genuinely don’t know the answer to that, but it would stand to reason that if Campbell came here and had immediate success and competed for conference championships, his job as a recruiter would be a lot easier.

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2 minutes ago, Nuthn2CHere said:

This is a real question, I'm not a troll, and I understand many will shit on me for even asking. 

 

I'll start by saying that it's clear to me that Herman is not a *bad* coach.  He obviously does not perform up to our standards and seems like a pompous ass who rubs many fans, admin. and BMDs the wrong way, but he is an above average college coach.  My personal view of college football over the past 15 years, and even more so over the past decade, is that there are 1-5 truly elite college coaches who can predictably and systematically win at the highest levels.  Then there are a bunch of coaches who, whether because they don't have truly elite talent, or get outcoached sometimes but not most of the time, lose 2-5 games every year.  This is totally variable from year to year, but generally these are coaches that win more than they lose to varying degrees.  Herman is obviously one of those coaches.  

 

Can someone who knows more about recruiting tell me why we should buy out Herman, pay another probably very comparable coach as much or more to come here, only to continue to lose a similar number of games year to year?  Having missed on Urban, why is it out of the question to simply ride with Herman, who is at least winning (more than we could say about Strong)?  I gather it's to save and re-invigorate recruiting, but I don't see evidence that there is someone out there who will keep Bama and Clemson and especially tOSU from taking the best recruits out of Texas for the foreseeable future.  It really seems like missing out on Urban means we are back at Herman being our best option, which at least means winning twice as many games as we lose until someone else emerges as a truly elite option.  Getting rid of him because we hate his personality and because he isn't one of the best 5 coaches in the country, when none of those dudes is available, seems like cutting your nose off to spite your face, but I honestly don't know enough about the damage to recruiting that this approach would do in the medium and long term.  Someone please enlighten me.

Those Herman wins are empty calories against bottom feeders. Look we are 0-6 in our last 6 meetings with OU, ISU, and TCU. And next year we are breaking in a new QB, LT, and pass rusher

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5 minutes ago, CastHorn said:

Iowa State has just as much NFL Talent on their roster as ours. They aren’t a team of scrubs.

Did I say NFL talent? 

Texas is ranked #5 in this years College Football Team NFL "Talent" Composite. Iowa Steak is #57. Yah, there's a big difference.

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4 minutes ago, Nuthn2CHere said:

This is a real question, I'm not a troll, and I understand many will shit on me for even asking. 

 

I'll start by saying that it's clear to me that Herman is not a *bad* coach.  He obviously does not perform up to our standards and seems like a pompous ass who rubs many fans, admin. and BMDs the wrong way, but he is an above average college coach.  My personal view of college football over the past 15 years, and even more so over the past decade, is that there are 1-5 truly elite college coaches who can predictably and systematically win at the highest levels.  Then there are a bunch of coaches who, whether because they don't have truly elite talent, or get outcoached sometimes but not most of the time, lose 2-5 games every year.  This is totally variable from year to year, but generally these are coaches that win more than they lose to varying degrees.  Herman is obviously one of those coaches.  

 

Can someone who knows more about recruiting tell me why we should buy out Herman, pay another probably very comparable coach as much or more to come here, only to continue to lose a similar number of games year to year?  Having missed on Urban, why is it out of the question to simply ride with Herman, who is at least winning (more than we could say about Strong)?  I gather it's to save and re-invigorate recruiting, but I don't see evidence that there is someone out there who will keep Bama and Clemson and especially tOSU from taking the best recruits out of Texas for the foreseeable future.  It really seems like missing out on Urban means we are back at Herman being our best option, which at least means winning twice as many games as we lose until someone else emerges as a truly elite option.  Getting rid of him because we hate his personality and because he isn't one of the best 5 coaches in the country, when none of those dudes is available, seems like cutting your nose off to spite your face, but I honestly don't know enough about the damage to recruiting that this approach would do in the medium and long term.  Someone please enlighten me.

 

well partly because it's going to be harder for Herman to attract elite position coaches since most don't like him. Look at the fiasco with finding (and failing) a WR coach. Numerous stellar coaches were talked about only for Herman to strike out on attracting any of them and to have to default with Andre Coleman who was already on staff. The second part is recruiting. We may pull in LJ Johnson this year but I think we're done getting much top 25 talent in 22 and beyond.

 

The big question that changes all this is if he can learn and grow as a coach. Most signs point to no. Will he take the team's offensive performance against KSU as a lesson to take the limiter off Yurcich or will he go back to his ways.

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1 minute ago, UncleBuck said:

Did I say NFL talent? 

Texas is ranked #5 in this years College Football Team NFL "Talent" Composite. Iowa Steak is #57. Yah, there's a big difference.

Im just saying the talent differential isn’t as broad as you guys make it seem. We have bigger athletes on the defensive line & a couple of our WRs have dynamic straight line speed. I think that’s about it. 

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9 minutes ago, CastHorn said:

Iowa State has just as much NFL Talent on their roster as ours. They aren’t a team of scrubs.

But where they NFL projections to start outor has the ISU staff made them NFL caliber?  One of, If not the, most glaring issue with this staff is players that do not develop.  Yes, you will have high 4 and 5 stars that are busts but nowhere at the rate it happens here.  he develops kids.  Can that be said here?

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