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Posted (edited)
11 hours ago, pacman said:

 

 

This is really good, really good. But Dems will get their assets handed to them in a shut down. Trump will absolutely destroy them on who is at fault. Dems are afraid of their lives if they speak out, they are afraid of Trump if they speak out, and if the speak up they will sound like the corruption because Trump I’ll call them that and win the narrative. 

and people wonder why the base has said, “no, not this time we aren’t giving you a dime!” $15m on hand for the DNC is absolutely absurd.

His depiction of where we are in the historical cycle is chilling. 

 

 

Edited by troph
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Posted
46 minutes ago, troph said:

This is really good, really good. But Dems will get their assets handed to them in a shut down. Trump will absolutely destroy them on who is at fault. Dems are afraid of their lives if they speak out, they are afraid of Trump if they speak out, and if the speak up they will sound like the corruption because Trump I’ll call them that and win the narrative. 

and people wonder why the base has said, “no, not this time we aren’t giving you a dime!” $15m on hand for the DNC is absolutely absurd.

His depiction of where we are in the historical cycle is chilling. 

 

 

Ballgame?

Posted
Just now, chainsaw said:

I'm not convinced.

They need to toss the wrench in and let that shit seize up. Grind the gears of government to a halt. But I can already see ways that this gets so fucked up Trump wins again. 

Posted
Just now, David Dennison said:

It's September 2025.

Let's circle back in a year.

Watch the video, compelling argument we don’t have the time for that.

Posted
4 minutes ago, troph said:

They need to toss the wrench in and let that shit seize up. Grind the gears of government to a halt. But I can already see ways that this gets so fucked up Trump wins again. 

At least they went down fighting.

Trump’s only knows how to measure success with the stock market. 

If dems hold out, Taco Don will sell out his party to keep the market from tanking.

All he knows is bullying, leverage, postering, and brinkmanship. It’s all he respects. He will continue to take, take, take unless someone stands up to him over and over and over again. The minute you give in is the minute he gets his retribution so you just always, at every turn , fight him. 

But that would also require Dems to grow a spine, brain, and a set of balls as opposed to the usual plan…. acquiesce and try to wait it out for some magical moment where this all just goes away.

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Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Just out of curiosity, does Ezra propose a solution and if so, where is that in the video?

He does I’m eluding to it, but I didn’t pay attention to time stamp. Basically the reasons why the Schumer reasons won out last time just aren’t there and so even if he was right last time he’s not going to be this time. The solution is to shut down the government, create an acute crisis, then grab the bullhorn and pick 2-3 issues and drive it home - rogue ICE agents, corruption by the Trump family to use the federal government to line his pockets and already double his wealth at the expense of American strength in the world, and there may have been another one. The problem that causes this to fail is Trump is the expert in messaging in a crisis and he already has the court. The Supreme Court said he could withhold money appropriated by Congress, they will read an emergency power somewhere into the constitution allowing him to do whatever he wants. Game set match Congress has no power at all. 

Edited by troph
Posted
1 minute ago, troph said:

He does I’m eluding to it, but I didn’t pay attention to time stamp. Basically the reasons why the Schumer reasons won out last time just aren’t there and so even if he was right last time he’s not going to be this time. The solution is to shut down the government, create an acute crisis, then grab the bullhorn and pick 2-3 issues and drive it home - rogue ICE agents, corruption by the Trump family to use the federal government to line his pockets and already double his wealth at the expense of American strength in the world, and there may have been another one. The problem that causes this to fail is Trump is the expert in messaging in a crisis and he already has the court. The Supreme Court said he could withhold money appropriated by Congress, they will read an emergency power somewhere into the constitution allowing him to whatever he wants. Game set match Congress has no power at all. 

You know, one of these days the Senate is going to get rid of the filibuster. That time might be sooner than we think.

Voila! No shut down. Suck it, Dems.

Posted
8 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

You know, one of these days the Senate is going to get rid of the filibuster. That time might be sooner than we think.

Voila! No shut down. Suck it, Dems.

That too.  But that’s less catastrophic and honestly in the long run gives the Dems a fighting chance at legislative and executive full control without forcing the Dems to have the guts to do it.

Posted
4 hours ago, troph said:

He does I’m eluding to it, but I didn’t pay attention to time stamp. Basically the reasons why the Schumer reasons won out last time just aren’t there and so even if he was right last time he’s not going to be this time. The solution is to shut down the government, create an acute crisis, then grab the bullhorn and pick 2-3 issues and drive it home - rogue ICE agents, corruption by the Trump family to use the federal government to line his pockets and already double his wealth at the expense of American strength in the world, and there may have been another one. The problem that causes this to fail is Trump is the expert in messaging in a crisis and he already has the court. The Supreme Court said he could withhold money appropriated by Congress, they will read an emergency power somewhere into the constitution allowing him to do whatever he wants. Game set match Congress has no power at all. 

image.gif.9dc43287b59fe76a39e204e6b221ecce.gif

Posted
12 hours ago, David Dennison said:

Just out of curiosity, does Ezra propose a solution and if so, where is that in the video?

I posted the text version and summary earlier in the thread.  He thinks the Dems should use a shutdown as leverage to restore cuts to Medicaid or to enforce corruption hearings.  
 

I’m on team shut-down and don’t really see that the Dems have anything to lose.  The right will blame them for the shut down, they will blame them for funding cuts they fought against, they will blame them for Trump’s miscellaneous failures of character, etc.  We can’t keep pretending there’s a way to reason with today’s GOP that results in a compromise.  
 

I’m going to start sounding like @Brisketexan, but it’s win the public or go ahead and be a collaborator like Vichy France.  Step one is proving to Dem voters that their representatives are willing to do more than make public statements and enjoy the big shot treatment from Congressional staff.  

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Posted
7 minutes ago, LCHorn said:

I’m on team shut-down and don’t really see that the Dems have anything to lose.  The right will blame them for the shut down, they will blame them for funding cuts they fought against, they will blame them for Trump’s miscellaneous failures of character, etc.  We can’t keep pretending there’s a way to reason with today’s GOP that results in a compromise.  

I tend to agree, but I also know that Senate Republicans can change the rules to eliminate a Democratic filibuster. That doesn't mean they will.

Kenan Thompson Eating GIF by Saturday Night Live

Posted
6 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

I tend to agree, but I also know that Senate Republicans can change the rules to eliminate a Democratic filibuster. That doesn't mean they will.

Kenan Thompson Eating GIF by Saturday Night Live

I'm sure this isn't a novel thought, particularly here, but the filibuster should have been abandoned in 2022.  At this point, there's no reckoning to come for the party that abandons it first.  

Posted
1 minute ago, LCHorn said:

I'm sure this isn't a novel thought, particularly here, but the filibuster should have been abandoned in 2022.  At this point, there's no reckoning to come for the party that abandons it first.  

I'm all for ditching it and I wish Democrats had done it, but it is a legislative guard rail of sorts. Republicans know this, which is why I'm not sure they have enough votes to get rid of it.

 

Posted
5 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

I hope everyone sees why I keep saying Ezra Klein is a fucking moron now

The factual part of his video was pretty good but the Dems will get their asses handed to them in a shut down. 

the authoritarian consolidation phase discussion was very frightening. The time to get off this ride pretty much is over.

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Posted
26 minutes ago, troph said:

The factual part of his video was pretty good but the Dems will get their asses handed to them in a shut down. 

the authoritarian consolidation phase discussion was very frightening. The time to get off this ride pretty much is over.

I'm referring to the Charlie Kirk puff piece he put out

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Posted
36 minutes ago, troph said:

Dems will get their asses handed to them in a shut down. 

Dems will get their asses handed to them if they continue with their fecklessness

Posted
14 minutes ago, chainsaw said:

Dems will get their asses handed to them if they continue with their fecklessness

I know 

we are fucked, lose lose.

Posted
7 minutes ago, David Dennison said:

Ezra Klein is everything wrong with the liberal establishment.

he at least called Trump an active authoritarian in that video, a helluva lot more than the fucking elected leaders are saying.

Posted

Eh, I don’t think the Texas Senate primary is going to better reward a “clear the field” candidate.  More the merrier.  
 

Plus Talarico has zero sex appeal.  Maybe a little of Beto’s energy will rub off on him.  

Posted (edited)

I like Talarico a lot and it doesn’t hurt that he looks like a poster boy for conservatives.  

That must grind their gears to no end. 

Edited by VABuckeye
Posted
12 hours ago, Pancho said:

 

While I applaud the sentiments in the post (didn't watch the video), I don't think that is a message preachable by someone with a D or R associated with their name.  I mean, there is no way half the country doesn't see it as completely disingenuous.

Posted
13 minutes ago, Goredho said:

While I applaud the sentiments in the post (didn't watch the video), I don't think that is a message preachable by someone with a D or R associated with their name.  I mean, there is no way half the country doesn't see it as completely disingenuous.

How so?  I think I agree with you, but I'm interested in your reasoning.

To me, the problem is the fundamental incompatibility of religion, practiced authentically, and politics.  It's not just the election part, but the actual governing part, as well.

Talarico is trying to run a Christ-like, or more Christ-like. campaign than the alleged Christians, but without invoking Christ by name.  I applaud the notion in the abstract, but I think it's going to be a tough go.

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Posted
1 hour ago, TwiceHorn said:

How so?  I think I agree with you, but I'm interested in your reasoning.

To me, the problem is the fundamental incompatibility of religion, practiced authentically, and politics.  It's not just the election part, but the actual governing part, as well.

Talarico is trying to run a Christ-like, or more Christ-like. campaign than the alleged Christians, but without invoking Christ by name.  I applaud the notion in the abstract, but I think it's going to be a tough go.

Knowing the prevailing mindset here, and the prevailing mindset among conservatives that I know, I just think the opposing party is dead to these people.  I don’t think there is anything that can be said or done to convince them otherwise.  These people see an R or D and their decision is effectively made, and little else matters.

I think Talarico’s message would need to come from an independent, or perhaps a new party founded by people who are eschewing both parties.  If he could find a like mind from the Republican Party and get some monied people behind them, start a new party focused on de-escalation, unity, preserving the Republic and populist economics.  That might pull a decent number of people from both parties that currently have been essentially forced to choose between two warring factions.

The problem when people make their decision between R or D right now, they fall into an information bubble provided by that side that has more to do with motivating them to join the fight than it has with promoting any sort of common ground.  You are presented with the best of “your” side and the worst of the “other” side.  And outside forces (Russia, others) contribute their weight to ensuring that half the people view the other half as a mortal threat and vice versa.


I fully know one or both parties would be trying to undermine these efforts of a new, upstart party and it very well might fail.  But the alternative is a continuation of current trends, which likely means the extinction of the Democratic Party and 20th century liberalism.  It might mean worse than that.

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Posted
47 minutes ago, Chuckie Finster said:

Talarico still obviously believes most people are good, and this is why he doesn't stand a fucking chance.

Slight correction-Talarico falsely believed that VOTERS want to elect someone who, morally speaking, is “good”.  
 

And it’s not totally unfounded, but it’s at odds with a GOP that has the high ground on “good” with older low information voters and the MAGA/MAHA/young low information voters have been fed a diet almost purely of empty, showbiz and social media calories for so long that they can’t tell sincerity from bullshit, expertise from idiocy, and lies from truth.  

Posted
1 hour ago, Chuckie Finster said:

Talarico still obviously believes most people are good, and this is why he doesn't stand a fucking chance.

This.  The vast majority of Americans are racist pieces of shit.

Posted
26 minutes ago, Goredho said:

I fully know one or both parties would be trying to undermine these efforts of a new, upstart party and it very well might fail. 

The problem is we haven't seen any new party that seems even remotely serious with any ideas that would peel off votes. Just a general "Republicans and Democrats bad" isn't going to do it.

Posted
1 hour ago, Valmy77 said:

The problem is we haven't seen any new party that seems even remotely serious with any ideas that would peel off votes. Just a general "Republicans and Democrats bad" isn't going to do it.

I don't disagree, but this message from Talarico:

 

Quote

I’m tired of being pitted against my neighbor.  I’m tired of being told to hate my neighbor. People across the political spectrum are hungry for a new kind of politics.

Is essentially saying "I want to reconcile with my countrymen who I might disagree with politically so we can find a path forward together"  But it's coming from a Democratic Party member in a deeply red state, and Democrats are at their lowest point of appeal, power and influence in my lifetime.  So it seems pretty disingenuous and self serving coming from a member of the party that is, from what I can tell, on life support while the other party has a hand on the power cord.  Add into that the decades of conditioning that all things left, liberal and with a D attached to it are evil, and Talarico the Democrat isn't going to pull any meaningful number of voters from the right with that message at this stage of our devolution.

For that idea to be embraceable by people who have been voting right, it's going to have to come from someone not on the left.  And for that idea to be embraceable by people who have been voting left, it's going to have to come from someone not on the right.  Maybe someone like Arnold Schwarzenegger (Republican, demonstrably not MAGA) could form a new party around that idea and get people to buy into it.  But, I dunno.



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