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UT's next basketball coach - discussion/debate


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5 hours ago, hobbes2702 said:

Both of those coaches have significantly less to show for their talent than Cal does. If your point was that Cal did more with his talent than either of those two did then we made the same point. You’re welcome to look at the data and attempt whatever point you think you made, but you’ll find that those two examples are poor comparisons to Cal because they won significantly less.


Yes I don’t give a shit about vacated titles because I’m not 12 years old. Oh no he cheated on Rose’s grades? It’s almost like college one and dones aren’t real student athletes. I guess I’m a piece of crap for being happy that a guy who’s money making potential was tied to his ability to play basketball wasn’t denied his opportunity because of stupid rules that make players go to college. 

Go ahead and mention the up and comers that you would take over Cal? Let’s hear it. Who’s the Coach K for us?

Yes your intellect is truly dizzying. We should all bow down to your 1950s understanding of basketball and the world.

Did you ever meet Bill Little lol? Again I encourage you to talk to some baseball players, longtime baseball fans, and former coaches. I have no problem saying Bill Little is a douchebag. I’m not sure how that’s a cheap shot but I guess you can cry more about it if you’d like.

As a former player, I knew Bill Little well. He came with us on many road trips. We were good friends for years. If he had problems with some of the baseball people, I don't care just like you don't care if coaches cheat. As far as the up and comers, I have no clue. That's CDC's job. I bet you never heard of the LSU football coach when he was at Grand Valley State I believe or when Urban was at Bowling Green. Coach K came from powerhouse Army Huggie Bear coached at Walsh College and Akron and the list goes on and on. Derrick Rose making a lot of money is irrelevant. Goof for him but Cal cheated to get him into Memphis.

As far as the 1950s, the fundamentals are the same. See you just learned something.

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2 minutes ago, realgreggym said:

As a former player, I knew Bill Little well. He came with us on many road trips. We were good friends for years. If he had problems with some of the baseball people, I don't care just like you don't care if coaches cheat. As far as the up and comers, I have no clue. That's CDC's job. I bet you never heard of the LSU football coach when he was at Grand Valley State I believe or when Urban was at Bowling Green. Coach K came from powerhouse Army Huggie Bear coached at Walsh College and Akron and the list goes on and on. Derrick Rose making a lot of money is irrelevant. Goof for him but Cal cheated to get him into Memphis.

As far as the 1950s, the fundamentals are the same. See you just learned something.

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33 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Why wouldn't he. 

first he coached at Xavier from 2001-2009, and then after being fired by arizona they gave him a nice, soft landing spot and welcomed him home. you'd have to be one epically huge scumbag to turn around and leave again after having just been back for one season. 

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10 minutes ago, shadow_operative said:

first he coached at Xavier from 2001-2009, and then after being fired by arizona they gave him a nice, soft landing spot and welcomed him home. you'd have to be one epically huge scumbag to turn around and leave again after having just been back for one season. 

He was the head coach from 2004-2009. Assistant before that. I can promise you he isn't making $5M a year currently. Texas could throw him 5/30 easily.

God fucking forbid the University of Texas hires a basketball coach with some questionable moral characteristics. Last time I checked Sean Miller doesn't have a history of getting arrested after maybe or maybe not choking his fiancee. I'd warrant that - all evidence considered - he's probably a better human being than Chris Beard.

You and @SL Xpress need to both drop the high-horse card unless you're both cool with Texas basketball again becoming a total, irrelevant afterthought. 

But I'd bet y'all they hire Cal. In which case I'm sure one of you will bitch. If not both of you. 

Holy fucking fuck Batman. I want to punch a hole through a wall, too. But Beard is done and he's never coming back. Time for plan B. 

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1 minute ago, ztejas said:

He was the head coach from 2004-2009. Assistant before that. I can promise you he isn't making $5M a year currently. Texas could throw him 5/30 easily.

God fucking forbid the University of Texas hires a basketball coach with some questionable moral characteristics. Last time I checked Sean Miller doesn't have a history of getting arrested after maybe or maybe not choking his fiancee. I'd warrant that - all evidence considered - he's probably a better human being than Chris Beard.

You and @SL Xpress need to both drop the high-horse card unless you're both cool with Texas basketball again becoming a total, irrelevant afterthought. 

But I'd bet y'all they hire Cal. In which case I'm sure one of you will bitch. If not both of you. 

Holy fucking fuck Batman. I want to punch a hole through a wall, too. But Beard is done and he's never coming back. Time for plan B. 

I'm not dropping shit. I'll probably become bitterwhiteguy2 and write novellas about what a piece of shit Calipari is if Texas hires him. But I honestly don't see that happening, so not that concerned. I don't have an opinion on Sean Miller. 

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10 minutes ago, SL Xpress said:

I'm not dropping shit. I'll probably become bitterwhiteguy2 and write novellas about what a piece of shit Calipari is if Texas hires him. But I honestly don't see that happening, so not that concerned. I don't have an opinion on Sean Miller. 

Who do you think we get?

And I'm not trying to put words in your mouth - just commenting on the trend of acting like Texas is above certain hires while the last coach is still facing felony charges. 

I think if UK disappoints again then Cal coming here is extremely realistic. 

And by extremely realistic I mean that I bet he's the next coach at Texas*.

*(again - IF Kentucky disappoints again)

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2 minutes ago, ztejas said:

Who do you think we get?

And I'm not trying to put words in your mouth - just commenting on the trend of acting like Texas is above certain hires while the last coach is still facing felony charges. 

I think if UK disappoints again then Cal coming here is extremely realistic. 

And by extremely realistic I mean that I bet he's the next coach at Texas*.

*(again - IF Kentucky disappoints again)

It's not like he was arrested for felonious assault BEFORE Texas hired him. They fired him. I don't know what more anyone could possibly expect if they're bound and determined to be on a high horse, as you say. 

Calipari will be the first coach ever hired at Texas in its history that has been administered severe penalties from the NCAA, up to and including two vacated Final Fours. I guess people think that's a high horse. I will be stunned if Calipari is hired by Texas. As in, I don't think there's a chance in hell. 

I don't know who Texas gets. I hope Del Conte gets someone good. It won't be until April after the tournament is finished, so this year will count. Unless it's someone who is not a head coach in the tournament. But I honestly don't have a strong opinion right now. I don't even have a good feel for if they are willing to pay top dollar or not. Maybe they hire Grant McCasland for a song and we're all incredibly disappointed. Including me. I honestly don't know. 

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1 hour ago, ztejas said:

He was the head coach from 2004-2009. Assistant before that. I can promise you he isn't making $5M a year currently. Texas could throw him 5/30 easily.

God fucking forbid the University of Texas hires a basketball coach with some questionable moral characteristics. Last time I checked Sean Miller doesn't have a history of getting arrested after maybe or maybe not choking his fiancee. I'd warrant that - all evidence considered - he's probably a better human being than Chris Beard.

You and @SL Xpress need to both drop the high-horse card unless you're both cool with Texas basketball again becoming a total, irrelevant afterthought. 

But I'd bet y'all they hire Cal. In which case I'm sure one of you will bitch. If not both of you. 

Holy fucking fuck Batman. I want to punch a hole through a wall, too. But Beard is done and he's never coming back. Time for plan B. 

when have i played the high horse card? that has nothing to do with why sean miller won't leave xavier, and i never even opined on his firing from arizona in the first place. also, i've spent the last three pages trying to explain to people why coach cal is one of the best hires we could realistically make, so i have no idea why you think i'd be bitching if we hired him. 

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It will be interesting to monitor how the Kentucky coaching search runs in parallel with ours. Sounds like they’re kicking tires right now and the top of their list is probably identical to ours, with the exception being Calipari. Does Kentucky have the gall to go after Beard should he be legally cleared by March?

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8 hours ago, SL Xpress said:

I will be stunned if Calipari is hired by Texas. As in, I don't think there's a chance in hell. 

Well seeing as how you already made the “bitterwhiteguy of calipari” joke I was going to make when I got to the end of this thread, all I got left is

So what you’re saying is you’d be stunned. You’d be pissed. If it’s John Calipari?

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Just now, CheesePie said:

It will be interesting to monitor how the Kentucky coaching search runs in parallel with ours. The top of the list for both schools is probably identical, with the exception being Calipari. Does Kentucky have the gall to go after Beard should he be cleared legally by March?

100% they do. They hired cal when his vacated final fours were much more recent and when paying players was still technically against the rules. 
 

If Texas takes Calipari off their hands I’d bet your life savings they will hire Beard. Maybe not mine, but yours for sure. 

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23 minutes ago, Jebus said:

If Texas takes Calipari off their hands I’d bet your life savings they will hire Beard. Maybe not mine, but yours for sure. 

I wouldn’t take that bet.

Even if he doesn’t land at Kentucky, that job opening up expedites his return. The threat of him going to Kentucky is enough for a lesser school to jump on him the second his name is cleared. I’m with you though, Kentucky has to be the odds on favorite to be Beards next gig.

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55 minutes ago, closetohumping said:

Actually Bennett seems like a guy cdc would go after.   Boring ass offense right?

52-44 games aren’t sexy. And your defense to offense philosophy can lead to weird things like losing to a 16 seed by 20 points. But can’t deny the man has a .732 winning %, a national title, 5 regular season titles and 2 tournament titles. And he’s only 53

However he has 1 F4 in 13 seasons at UVA. Blah 

We could do better but we could also do way worse 

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37 minutes ago, CheesePie said:

I wouldn’t take that bet.

Even if he doesn’t land at Kentucky, that job opening up expedites his return. The threat of him going to Kentucky is enough for a lesser school to jump on him the second his name is cleared. I’m with you though, Kentucky has to be the odds on favorite to be Beards next gig.

I still think A&M would hire him. 

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1 hour ago, CTC2 said:

I still think A&M would hire him. 

Of course they would, but they probably won’t get the chance when Kentucky or some other school that is actually good at basketball and/or not in a shit tier backwater city offers him a job too

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16 hours ago, SL Xpress said:

I refuse to believe the administration would actually hire Calipari, the sleaziest basketball coach in the history of the sport, IMO. 

He's also not a good coach. 

Not that it means anything, but I won't be able to follow Texas basketball with that guy as head coach. He makes me sick on every level. As far as I'm concerned he's the worst kind of scumbag. 

Honestly, Calipari is very close to being a completely amoral psychopath. Not the serial killing kind, but absolutely the kind with no conscience, who has to mimic other people so he can pretend he has any level of empathy towards others whatsoever. Might as well hire a reptile. 

Yea, but other than that...

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Just now, HookEm said:

I'm liking the thought of Tommy Lloyd the more I look at him.  While he will only have 2 years of major head coaching experience, he is crushing it at Arizona - a school that historically cares about basketball more than Texas.  He also has 20 years of coaching experience under Mark Few... yet is only 48 yrs old.  He is currently making $2.9M and his buyout is only $5M.  I think there is a good chance we could money whip him.

Last year Arizona finished 33-4 and won the Pac 12, finishing #2 in the final AP poll.  This year they are 14-2 and ranked 9th.  They are also 7th in the country in PPG, 9th in offensive efficiency, 2nd in assists per game, 10th in fast break points. He would bring an exciting brand of basketball to the Moody Center.

I think he is a lower risk hire than Calipari or Dennis Gates.

I'd like a little more of a resume though on the recruiting front - He brought in Larsson last year and Ramey this year.  He inherited a nice roster last year with Mathurin, Tubelis, Kriisa and Koloko last year.  Lost Koloko and Mathurin and brought in Ramey and still doing very well. 

Only one player in the 2022 Top 100 and has none for 2023. 

But I do like what I see on his coaching.  He can work the portal, so he could do the same thing here. 

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Just now, Rickylovesweed said:

I'm not worried about Lloyd's recruiting. He just recruits international players and the portal. 

https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/33982384/top-international-basketball-prospect-henri-veesaar-commits-arizona-wildcats

Arizona does love those Europeans. 

Veesar - Estonia
Borovicanin - Serbia
Bal - France
Larrson - Sweden
Tubelis (both of them) - Lithuiania
Kriisa - Estonia

Ballo is from Mali

Arizona is the fucking UN of basketball rosters lol
 

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Just now, Js1 said:

Arizona does love those Europeans. 

Veesar - Estonia
Borovicanin - Serbia
Bal - France
Larrson - Sweden
Tubelis (both of them) - Lithuiania
Kriisa - Estonia

Ballo is from Mali

Arizona is the fucking UN of basketball rosters lol
 

Yeah, like 80% of their roster is internationals. It's also why they've been one of the best offensive teams under Lloyd. He had a good model to follow at Gonzaga and it's working. 

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1 hour ago, HookEm said:

I'm liking the thought of Tommy Lloyd the more I look at him.  While he will only have 2 years of major head coaching experience, he is crushing it at Arizona - a school that historically cares about basketball more than Texas.  He also has 20 years of coaching experience under Mark Few... yet is only 48 yrs old.  He is currently making $2.9M and his buyout is only $5M.  I think there is a good chance we could money whip him.

Last year Arizona finished 33-4 and won the Pac 12, finishing #2 in the final AP poll.  This year they are 14-2 and ranked 9th.  They are also 7th in the country in PPG, 9th in offensive efficiency, 2nd in assists per game, 10th in fast break points. He would bring an exciting brand of basketball to the Moody Center.

I think he is a lower risk hire than Calipari or Dennis Gates.

Lloyd’s buyout, if he were to be terminated without cause, is 65 percent of his remaining contract. If he were to leave for another job he’d owe Arizona $5 million at any point during his first two seasons, $2.5 million if during the third year, $1.5 million during the fourth year and $1 million if during the fifth year. He also cannot coach within the Pac-12 for one year if he leaves Arizona voluntarily.

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8 minutes ago, tx 3 putt said:

Lloyd’s buyout, if he were to be terminated without cause, is 65 percent of his remaining contract. If he were to leave for another job he’d owe Arizona $5 million at any point during his first two seasons, $2.5 million if during the third year, $1.5 million during the fourth year and $1 million if during the fifth year. He also cannot coach within the Pac-12 for one year if he leaves Arizona voluntarily.

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39 minutes ago, Rickylovesweed said:

Yeah, like 80% of their roster is internationals. It's also why they've been one of the best offensive teams under Lloyd. He had a good model to follow at Gonzaga and it's working. 

There was an article I read talking about how he and his wife backpacked across Europe as a couple after college. Dan Monson had apparently offered him the volunteer assistant job at Gonzaga if he wanted to get out of coaching when he was playing for another team. Don't know the story on that, but he impressed him somehow. Said he couldn't play for him, but he could coach. So maybe didn't impress him that much.

In any case, by the time he was ready to get into coaching Monson had moved on and Few had taken over. Few told Lloyd he needed to find a way to differentiate himself. Because he loved his experience in Europe so much, he concentrated on recruiting Europe, developing different contacts and understanding the process.

He apparently had a contract with Gonzaga that guaranteed him the job if he was still there when Few departed. 

Probably read the article off a link on this thread, actually. 

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4 hours ago, Herpa Derpa said:

I'm just here for the repetitive chastisement by a typical self-absorbed Boomer. Most useless generation ever. Unless you're really into smelling your own farts as they perfected that art.

 

Gen X, actually. The self absorbed part is almost certainly right on, though. Can't speak much for my generation. I liked Sub Pop music, though. I felt like the music of my generation was pretty darn good, but I guess that's what most generations think. 

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Lloyd with a legit defensive minded assistant seems like it would be a homerun. 

AdjO rankings for Lloyd in his first two years at Arizona are #7 and #5. Then at Gonzaga they were almost always near the top in adjusted offense. You're almost certainty getting a top 10ish offense with Lloyd based on his history. 

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1 minute ago, Rickylovesweed said:

Lloyd with a legit defensive minded assistant seems like it would be a homerun. 

AdjO rankings for Lloyd in his first two years at Arizona are #7 and #5. Then at Gonzaga they were almost always near the top in adjusted offense. You're almost certainty getting a top 10ish offense with Lloyd based on his history. 

I like that. Students would show up for that. Greatest show on turf kinda thing. Especially since it’s been decades of Barnes ball, Shakablah and Beard’s offenses, at times, can be painful to watch 

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3 hours ago, Js1 said:

I'd like a little more of a resume though on the recruiting front - He brought in Larsson last year and Ramey this year.  He inherited a nice roster last year with Mathurin, Tubelis, Kriisa and Koloko last year.  Lost Koloko and Mathurin and brought in Ramey and still doing very well. 

Only one player in the 2022 Top 100 and has none for 2023. 

But I do like what I see on his coaching.  He can work the portal, so he could do the same thing here. 

I like Lloyd a lot but also have real worries about his recruiting. I think I would still have him as maybe my 2nd choice behind Muss

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If recruiting rankings are your thing you aren't going to like Lloyd. 

He recruits international players and portal players that don't go into high school recruiting rankings. I don't know why anybody would think Lloyd can't recruit though. He was starting to land 5 stars at Gonzaga, landed the best international player this past recruiting cycle, and landed top transfers like Ramey/Henderson.

He just recruits a different type player. 

 

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10 minutes ago, hobbes2702 said:

I like Lloyd a lot but also have real worries about his recruiting. I think I would still have him as maybe my 2nd choice behind Muss

Oats is my #1, full stop. Lloyd and Muss are up there though. 

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