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Alec Baldwin Shoots and Kills Cinematographer, Wounds Director


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3 hours ago, Michael Knight said:

 

damn AB for bringing hundreds of rounds of live ammo onto the set!!!! /immortal13

 

but in seriousness, this is crossing into criminal negligence territory to have a whole range trip's worth of ammo on a film set where they're using real-ass guns instead of prop guns. What kind of slapdick operation were they running? I wonder how much exposure AB will have since by all accounts it was his production and show to run. 

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5 hours ago, bad_teammate said:

Yeah that clip of the guy shooting a bunch of different guns looks bad. Good enough for a lot of people, I guess, but creative types tend to be picky.

How did it look that bad?  Serious question? The action of the bolt, the spent cartridge ejection, and the muzzle flash of what looked like an MP5 and an ACR looked good to me, but I only saw the GIF here and did not slow it down.

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11 minutes ago, Captainant said:

but in seriousness, this is crossing into criminal negligence territory to have a whole range trip's worth of ammo on a film set where they're using real-ass guns instead of prop guns. What kind of slapdick operation were they running? I wonder how much exposure AB will have since by all accounts it was his production and show to run. 

i said this initially, but i'll repeat that i think this ends with his production company losing whatever deal they had and going away.  i don't think people really grasp the basic idea of what a production company is, but it's not like a regular business and they go away all the time.

i would be absolutely shocked if he faced any personal responsibility here on the civil side, and there's less chance of anything criminal.  maybe some bombshell comes out in the coming days or weeks that will serve as a metaphorical smoking gun, but i doubt it. 

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39 minutes ago, williemackgarza said:

So if the beloved Mr Baldwin, his holiness (not pointing blame, dont want to trigger a certain poster) was practicing the scene why was he pulling the trigger?
The non culpable and innocent Sir Baldwin seems like a pretty good shot, 2 hits and 1 kill with a single blast. Pretty efficient.

Can't really practice a quick draw without shooting at the proper time. I mean, it doesn't matter how fast you shuck your gun, if you don't shoot it you're pretty much dead.

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The armorer allegedly pissed off Nicolas Cage on her last film.

According to The Wrap, the 24-year-old rookie was allegedly complained about a lot ... not just by Cage, but by other seasoned people who noticed -- she was out of her element.

As for the supposed NC blowup ... Sharon Waxman reports after the second time in 3 days of Gutierrez-Reed testing a weapon near everyone else unexpectedly, Cage yelled -- "Make an announcement, you just blew my f***ing eardrums out!" Then, he stormed off.


https://www.tmz.com/2021/10/27/nicolas-cage-yelled-hannah-gutierrez-reed-rust/

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1 hour ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Can't really practice a quick draw without shooting at the proper time. I mean, it doesn't matter how fast you shuck your gun, if you don't shoot it you're pretty much dead.

This and marksmanship. History tells us that most everyone ever involved in a gunfight was really, really fucking drunk

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The armorer allegedly pissed off Nicolas Cage on her last film.

According to The Wrap, the 24-year-old rookie was allegedly complained about a lot ... not just by Cage, but by other seasoned people who noticed -- she was out of her element.

As for the supposed NC blowup ... Sharon Waxman reports after the second time in 3 days of Gutierrez-Reed testing a weapon near everyone else unexpectedly, Cage yelled -- "Make an announcement, you just blew my f***ing eardrums out!" Then, he stormed off.


https://www.tmz.com/2021/10/27/nicolas-cage-yelled-hannah-gutierrez-reed-rust/

Jesus. That alone should have ended her as an armorer.
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So if the beloved Mr Baldwin, his holiness (not pointing blame, dont want to trigger a certain poster) was practicing the scene why was he pulling the trigger?
The non culpable and innocent Sir Baldwin seems like a pretty good shot, 2 hits and 1 kill with a single blast. Pretty efficient.

^Don’t mind this asshole, he was an abused child.
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3 hours ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Can't really practice a quick draw without shooting at the proper time. I mean, it doesn't matter how fast you shuck your gun, if you don't shoot it you're pretty much dead.

 The armorer should have reminded him NOT to pull the trigger in this instance since there was no shield in place to protect the people he was pointing towards. He should have remembered this for himself but them having an incompetent armorer that wasn't even there really was a wild west shitshow. 

 

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Nah, he shouldn't have been practicing it at all without safeguards in place. Make a gun with your finger. Stick it down by your waist on the opposite side like where a cross draw holster would be. Now pretend you are drawing it out to point at something in the room. Your finger will point in a nice wide arc accross the room. That is what his gun would be pointing at while making the motion. Now you also have to practice cocking the hammer while drawing it. And your finger pretty much has to be in the trigger gaurd on a Colt Single Action Revolver to maintain control while cocking the hammer, but also because it doesn't do much good to practice the wrong way. Finger on the trigger plus hammer cocked on a single action revolver is a recipe for unintentionally pulling said trigger.

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4 hours ago, Captainant said:

damn AB for bringing hundreds of rounds of live ammo onto the set!!!! /immortal13

 

but in seriousness, this is crossing into criminal negligence territory to have a whole range trip's worth of ammo on a film set where they're using real-ass guns instead of prop guns. What kind of slapdick operation were they running? I wonder how much exposure AB will have since by all accounts it was his production and show to run. 

Funny

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9 hours ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Nah, he shouldn't have been practicing it at all without safeguards in place. Make a gun with your finger. Stick it down by your waist on the opposite side like where a cross draw holster would be. Now pretend you are drawing it out to point at something in the room. Your finger will point in a nice wide arc accross the room. That is what his gun would be pointing at while making the motion. Now you also have to practice cocking the hammer while drawing it. And your finger pretty much has to be in the trigger gaurd on a Colt Single Action Revolver to maintain control while cocking the hammer, but also because it doesn't do much good to practice the wrong way. Finger on the trigger plus hammer cocked on a single action revolver is a recipe for unintentionally pulling said trigger.

I don't know why he would need to practice as though he were working with a gun with bullets. What you are describing is as if though he is going to fire a bullet. He was not. He should be practicing to make it look like he would win a duel with a cross fire draw. He was told "cold gun", which means no blanks that go bang should be in the weapon. That should mean he can get used to the weight of the gun and  even cock it without worry of any bang from a blank. But an armorer and actor would still need to be mindful of the safety of the situation. No shield in place should mean don't point toward people and pull the trigger. This would protect everyone from the Brandon Lee type incident.  

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Just heard reporting on NPR as they were discussing this tragic incident baldwin himself said I should’ve checked closer and made sure that the weapon was safe.

interesting even he freaking Recognized some common sense after the fact of course.

 

Which one are you gonna be the first one to call him out and say it wasn’t his responsibility or his job

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Just heard reporting on NPR as they were discussing this tragic incident baldwin himself said I should’ve checked closer and made sure that the weapon was safe.
interesting even he freaking Recognized some common sense after the fact of course.
 
Which one are you gonna be the first one to call him out and say it wasn’t his responsibility or his job

He shouldn’t be giving interviews. Yeah, I think going forward he and many others will check all weapons for the next 3 years until this fades from their memories.

That he said he should have checked, underscores how movies are made and how much faith is placed in the armorer.
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7 minutes ago, Nivek said:


He shouldn’t be giving interviews. Yeah, I think going forward he and many others will check all weapons for the next 3 years until this fades from their memories.

That he said he should have checked, underscores how movies are made and how much faith is placed in the armorer.

Maybe he didn't have your experience with accidental shootings.

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1 hour ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Just heard reporting on NPR as they were discussing this tragic incident baldwin himself said I should’ve checked closer and made sure that the weapon was safe.

interesting even he freaking Recognized some common sense after the fact of course.

 

Which one are you gonna be the first one to call him out and say it wasn’t his responsibility or his job

Are you intentionally this obtuse or are you just a moron?

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On 10/27/2021 at 10:20 AM, Captainant said:

IMO, Baldwin the actor isn't at fault here. The people responsible for safety on the set told him it was "cold" meaning no blanks or anything in it. 

 

Yeah, and those same people should have made sure that when he was practicing, he was doing it safely.

 

 

I can imagine a scenario where an armorer does his job perfectly, hands a triple-checked gun to an actor, and then the actor starts to check the ammo by taking the clip out and the armorer yells "what the fuck you are doing doing fucking with my gun and ammo, you fucking dipshit? You don't fucking remove a clip that I just triple checked!! Goddamit mother fucker, now I have to recheck everything!!"

 

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Onboard 2.0 said:

Once again you prove yourself to be One of the rudest biggest assholes on all surly and that’s saying something

You're the fucking asshole claiming a grieving Alec Baldwin wishing he could have done something different instead of killing someone somehow validates your political beliefs. Forgive me for giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming your were just stupid and not actually just a piece of shit. Good job owning the libs as usual.

Edited by Michael Knight
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12 minutes ago, Michael Knight said:

You're the fucking asshole claiming a grieving Alec Baldwin wishing he could have done something different instead of killing someone somehow validates your political beliefs. Forgive me for giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming your were just stupid and not actually just a piece of shit. Good job owning the libs as usual.

Wow you manage to add a little bit more to the dumb ass pool every time you post

not even what I was posting in that context.I was pointing out that even Alec Baldwin agreed that he probably should’ve checked behind the person when they already had three safety issues on the set.

 

I’m quite sure he’s grieving as most any person would

I’m sure in that grieving process he’s gone over it in  his head several times and the point that he probably should’ve verified the gun was empty is probably front and center in his Thought process

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One thing that really proves how fucked up this production was is that AB did not question why the AD was handing him the gun and not the armorer. How is that normal? If they disrespected the armorer so much that they were bypassing her even before this event then how could the AD hand over a gun without tripple checking the rounds? How would Alec not be questioning of the cold gun call? 

In hindsight, it seems obvious to be suspicious of the weapon. Damn.

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I think the main question regarding all this is, who brought live ammunition to a movie set, and why was it there?

After that I have a few more questions:

1. Is it normal for a movie set to have some live ammunition available? Is there ever a reason to use live ammunition when shooting a movie?

2.  Who on the Rust movie set knew there was live ammunition available?  Was this common knowledge?

3. Who participated in the target practice they did while working on the movie?  Was it common knowledge among the staff that people were shooting live rounds for fun away from the movie?

4. Did Baldwin or the Assistant Director know about the live rounds being present on/around the movie set? 

5. Are either Baldwin or the AD capable of declaring a gun "cold" or is that duty always supposed to be performed by the armorer? 

 

I think a lot of this is uncommon, and the answers to these questions will result in a lot of finger pointing, with no one really being held accountable for this avoidable death. We shall see, it will be interesting to see what the investigation results are. I have always loved action movies and gun fights, but never really thought much about what all goes into the maintenance and stewardship required to manage all the guns on a big movie set. Sounds like a pretty awesome job, but you gotta be extremely careful, smart, sober and professional to do it right. 

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