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The Robert Mueller Investigation


Hugo Stiglitz

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31 minutes ago, The People’s Elbow said:

I laughed at the “do a deal” bit. If that’s true, it’ll be like his first Apprentice deal when he asked for $1M and settled for $60K. 

I think we should 'do a deal' and agree to build a 30 foot x 30 foot (beautiful) wall on the southern border and hoist his ass to the top, then give him a gentle push over.  It will be our version of "Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall."   

We'll take suggestions on who should play Reagan and what he should say. 

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To be honest, if the campaign coordination solely exists of Manafort giving internal polling numbers to a Russian operative, I see that as weak.  Yes it shows that trump is wrong if not lying again, but that occurs daily anyway.   Now if  we see Russia giving info to trump and team, that’s a different issue.

its seems fair to say that anything that Manafort knew, he passed onto his Russian creditors.  That’s who he was.

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2 minutes ago, TornACL said:

Lol, why is it that every time a new thing is brought to light, someone jumps on this thread and says "Well, if that's the ONLY thing..." 

It's not the only thing. It's just yet another piece that's been revealed which makes it increasingly probable that the Mueller case will tie this thing all together soup to nuts. 

Dude, I think he should be impeached.  Obama would have been run out of DC with 10% of what we’ve learned about trump.

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3 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

To be honest, if the campaign coordination solely exists of Manafort giving internal polling numbers to a Russian operative, I see that as weak.  Yes it shows that trump is wrong if not lying again, but that occurs daily anyway.   Now if  we see Russia giving info to trump and team, that’s a different issue.

its seems fair to say that anything that Manafort knew, he passed onto his Russian creditors.  That’s who he was.

If you’ve been paying attention you’ll notice many of the developments have been leaked from the Trump side of the investigation, not Mueller.  

This is part of a political strategy to minimize the outrage and shock of the Mueller report.  The idea is when Mueller puts the whole picture together, it will be made of many pieces that have already been made public.  This will hopefully minimize the political consequences.

However, when you put ALL the pieces together, it is going to paint a picture nothing short of a seditious conspiracy and cover up.

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34 minutes ago, TornACL said:

Lol, why is it that every time a new thing is brought to light, someone jumps on this thread and says "Well, if that's the ONLY thing..." 

It's not the only thing. It's just yet another piece that's been revealed which makes it increasingly probable that the Mueller case will tie this thing all together soup to nuts. 

It's not the one thing, it's the dismal tide. 

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46 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

To be honest, if the campaign coordination solely exists of Manafort giving internal polling numbers to a Russian operative, I see that as weak.

That's a ridiculously improbable big "if." Manafort wasn't alone in the Trump Tower collusion meeting. There's no way Roger Stone wasn't involved in the effort. Google "Occam's razor." The simplest explanation is that there really was a fairly massive conspiracy. The only question is how much they managed to give Don Donald plausible deniability as the head of a criminal syndicate. The chance that he didn't know about and didn't endorse what was going on would defy everything we know about The Boss and how he runs his business. 

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If Trump didn’t know, he would have been furious he didn’t know. He wouldn’t have protected Russia every step of the way including up to today.  He wouldn’t have fired the guy investigating Russia and then bragged about it to the Russians in the Oval Office.  He wouldn’t have repeatedly lied over and over again about the Russian interference. 

I’m sorry, but if you think Trump didn’t know, you’re a moron.  

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4 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

If Trump didn’t know, he would have been furious he didn’t know. He wouldn’t have protected Russia every step of the way including up to today.  He wouldn’t have fired the guy investigating Russia and then bragged about it to the Russians in the Oval Office.  He wouldn’t have repeatedly lied over and over again about the Russian interference. 

I’m sorry, but if you think Trump didn’t know, you’re a moron.  

If you still support Trump at all you're a moron.

There are a lot of morons out there.

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2 hours ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

If you’ve been paying attention you’ll notice many of the developments have been leaked from the Trump side of the investigation, not Mueller.  

This is part of a political strategy to minimize the outrage and shock of the Mueller report.  The idea is when Mueller puts the whole picture together, it will be made of many pieces that have already been made public.  This will hopefully minimize the political consequences.

However, when you put ALL the pieces together, it is going to paint a picture nothing short of a seditious conspiracy and cover up.

I understand the rationale for TrumpCo leaking stuff to control the flow, get out in front of it, and minimize political reaction.  But that ultimately cuts both ways - people won't be shocked and WILL believe it when it all comes out.  No riots over perceived insurrection, no upheaval of our collective conscience over something so out of the blue that it's anything but true.  

The other half of this equation that will help consolidate acceptance and support for Mueller's work when it all comes out will be detailing the illicit cash flow.  People grasp that at a visceral level.

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2 hours ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

 

To be honest, if the campaign coordination solely exists of Manafort giving internal polling numbers to a Russian operative, I see that as weak.

The context this take is missing is Manafort’s skill set and previous work with social media micro-targeting in Ukraine using polling data.

Also, about the candidate Manafort was working for in Ukraine...

“Yanukovych has been charged with high treason, complicity in an aggressive war against Ukraine, and complicity in premeditated activities aimed at altering Ukraine's state borders.”

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.rferl.org/amp/29437344.html

 Manafort wasn’t just some coffee boy. 

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2 hours ago, HenryJames said:

 

This is excellent.  I read the indictment yesterday  and wondered how the hell the US attorney‘s office got those emails that made up the substance of the indictment. The answer is, it sounds like, MSNBC was involved in a little espionage and handed them over. Enemy Of The (Russian) People!

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7 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

It’s also important to remember Rosenstein is a witness in the obstruction of justice investigation. 



 

So this is immediately after we find out Manafort was pumping campaign information to Kilimnik.  So do we have all the information?


(Admitted felon) Manafort is campaign director for Trump -- not in dispute.

Manafort meets Kremlin cut out to give proprietary polling information -- not in dispute, detailed in cooperation agreement.

Manafort meets with currently indicted Kremlin lawyer at Trump tower about Hillary dirt -- not in dispute.

Russian corporation targets voters based on the polling information -- in dispute.  Subject of indictment from early 2018.

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3 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

we find out Manafort was pumping campaign information to Kilimnik. 

We didn’t discover this information from Mueller.  It came from the Trump/Manafort side.  They are only showing what they want us to see. 

The only thing Mueller has really disclosed is the Russian side of the conspiracy.  The bulk of the Trump side and cover up of the conspiracy is still missing in the Mueller documents. 

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14 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

My guess is everything is fine.  Rosenstein leaving appears to be voluntary.  He wouldn't if his departure put the investigation at risk.

 

Many have speculated that the report will be completed and presented in mid Feb. 

others believe it’s already mostly and ready to release as soon as shit goes south. They are slow playing it right now and putting all the info of the report  in redacted documents in the charge of a fed judge. 

Muller is not a chump and his team has 4 of the best attorneys in the country and they are putting forth a precedent for these unprecedented times. 

For me, my granddad was part of the treasury/secret service agent for almost 30 years. He was the stereotypical ridged ‘Dragnet’50’s G-man. It made him a tough guy to have as your dad but a great agent/investigator.

my point is, Muller is sorta cut from the same cloth. It’s a bad day if he is waiting in your office to talk to you. You can’t discourage or bribe this guy or outsmart him or run. If you’re the bad guy, he will get you.

 

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18 minutes ago, Doc Reeves said:

Many have speculated that the report will be completed and presented in mid Feb. 

others believe it’s already mostly and ready to release as soon as shit goes south. They are slow playing it right now and putting all the info of the report  in redacted documents in the charge of a fed judge. 

There's obviously a lot of redacted info in the indictments and ongoing court filings, but there's also a lot already in public view in the indictments.  In light of the botched filing by Manafort's lawyers disclosing Manafort was sharing polling info with a Russian linked to RUS military intelligence, Kilimnik, info visible in existing indictments startes to make more sense:

 

 

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5 minutes ago, triplehorn said:

There's obviously a lot of redacted info in the indictments and ongoing court filings, but there's also a lot already in public view in the indictments.  In light of the botched filing by Manafort's lawyers disclosing Manafort was sharing polling info with a Russian linked to RUS military intelligence, Kilimnik, info visible in existing indictments startes to make more sense:

 

 

Jesus Christ with this QAnon style writing.  Write with clarity.  I'm not decoding the fucking Oracle of Delphi.

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3 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

Jesus Christ with this QAnon style writing.  Write with clarity.  I'm not decoding the fucking Oracle of Delphi.

Reading Spicey is a beating.  Don't get bogged down.  The meat is in the embedded links to text from the indictments.  You can glean enough from her(?) garbled phrases to understand what to look for.

Edited by triplehorn
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41 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

Don't miss

 

Robert Mueller

 

in

 

THE FEDERAL BUREAU OF INTIMIDATION

 

Oh, they will talk rough to you and maybe turn you upside down and shake you to see what falls out, but they don’t deal with bull shit. 

If they are in your office they’ll have damn good reason, and you’ll probably know it.

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Just now, ADHD said:

Is it just me or does all this Russia stuff seem a little treasonous. 

That Natalia Veselnitskaya indictment and LawFare interview about her really underscored that for me.  If the country as issue was just a random out-of-the-hat country -- say Argentina -- that Trump was cooperating with it would be one thing.  Argentina wants Trump elected, they have secret communications with them, they help Trump get elected.  Laws would be broken along the way, FEC violations, whatever.  But they wouldn't really offend me that much.  But Russia actively works to harm us, and that Veselnitskaya indictment really put a point on that for me.  N. Veselnitskaya (a vaguely Kremlin connected person) works to undermine our court system in cooperation with Russian prosecutors (in no way *vaguely* connected to the Russian government).  It was an attack on our system by the Russian government.  And, as Veselnitskaya makes clear, the work they do isn't just to Make Russia Great Again, but to Make America Worse.

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5 minutes ago, Ted Lange said:

 

Man, that kind of dissembling just screams "I took rubles, nttawwt !"

In this this same vein, I'm surprised there hasn't been an attempt to point out that Manafort's trip to Madrid where polling data was shared with Kilimnik occurred in 2017, after the election.  So if it's not election related, no problem, right ?  Now remember that our intel heads testified to Congress in 2017 that the Russian multi-pronged digital social media assault was ONGOING.  It didn't end in Nov. 2016.  Would it shock anyone here to realize that TrumpCo has maintained an ongoing relationship of cooperation in sharing various kinds of information, including day to day polling information to Russian actors to target their continuous assault ?

You don't etherize a subject with mind-altering propaganda for a brief result and let it wear off.  You keep pushing it to maintain the spell while trying to navigate.  That's the best explanation I have for why Manafort lied to Feds about sharing polling info with RU in 2017.

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The dossier is one of the better roadmaps of the conspiracy but just think about all the damning developments that aren’t even mentioned in the dossier.  

Namely the June 2016 Trump Tower meeting, the Butina NRA connection, the Trump Tower Moscow Project, the compromising of Flynn, the role of Rick Gates, Papadoplous, and Felix Sater.

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indeed, Lankford's argument in defense of Trump is in fact an admission that the relationship was "ongoing".

It's virtually impossible to rhetorically defend Trump. Doing so paints you in one corner after another. Only Rudy does it brilliantly. By pre-pleading insanity then having a stroke half way through his eye-popping jabberwocky.

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5 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

The dossier is one of the better roadmaps of the conspiracy but just think about all the damning developments that aren’t even mentioned in the dossier.  

Namely the June 2016 Trump Tower meeting, the Butina NRA connection, the Trump Tower Moscow Project, the compromising of Flynn, the role of Rick Gates, Papadoplous, and Felix Sater.

they should really appoint a special counsel to investigate some of that stuff. 

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Just now, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

So Rosenstein is leaving. That good or bad (for us good guys)?

It sucks because we lose a great public servant in one of the most important jobs in America. 

I don’t think it has any influence on the Mueller investigation.  This has likely been planned out for a while.  Rosenstein probably gave Mueller a heads up a long time ago.

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No shit Matt.  You didn't want the thing to get buried in the GOP obstruction machine?   I love that he calls the shit Gowdy, Nunes, and their ilk were doing oversight.  Overseeing the suppression of evidence and collaborating with the WH.  These fucking clowns all realize there is going to be record of this.  History will not be kind, but he does have a way with words.  

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54 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

The dossier is one of the better roadmaps of the conspiracy but just think about all the damning developments that aren’t even mentioned in the dossier.  

Namely the June 2016 Trump Tower meeting, the Butina NRA connection, the Trump Tower Moscow Project, the compromising of Flynn, the role of Rick Gates, Papadoplous, and Felix Sater.

The dossier also didn't touch on the inter-communicating servers between RU Alfa Bank <--> Trump Tower <--> Spectrum Health (DeVos/Prince).

That coming down the pike.

 

Quote

While the dossier didn’t posit any relationship between Alfa Bank and Trump, much has been made of the mysterious communication between one of the bank’s computer servers and a server owned by the Trump Organization. The communication occurred at a time, during the campaign, when very few other serves in the world were trying to communicate with the Trump server. (Most of the other attempts to communicate with the Trump server during that period apparently came from a Michigan company owned by the family of Trump’s future education secretary, Betsy DeVos, the sister of international-man-of-intrigue Erik Prince.)

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