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Official Thread for Abortion Demagoguery


bad_teammate

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11 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Correct.  When -- in many jurisdictions -- the "test" for whether an abortion procedure was necessary for the life or health of the mother is going to impose the same burden as asserting a defense of self-defense after being charged with a crime....that's beyond fucked up.  Yet, here we are.

If I was advising a physician in such a jurisdiction, I would honestly advise him that unless it was an immediate, no-doubt, "if she doesn't get this procedure in the next 10 minutes, she will die" sort of scenario, he should not perform any such procedures, even if his clear medical judgment tells him they are necessary.  Because his clear medical judgment will mean precisely nothing when some asshole like Ken Paxton wants to score some political points by showing how super-duper "pro-life" anti-libtard he is, and prosecutes him just for the headlines.

Then when the mother dies because of inaction, you get a malpractice suit filed against you. All the practices in our area are going with a business as usual approach and making sure their documentation is sound and they have concurring physician sign off for now. That includes the ultra pro life Catholic doctor of one the groups and the ultra R one in another group. Their beliefs are that these reasons aren’t intended to be caught up in this law which we’ve told them is a pretty naive view. Attorneys are all recommending that they go ahead and petition the court for every scenario they can come up with which is what I think a few groups are going to band together and do.


It’s an f-ed up situation. Some doctors are going to get caught up in it and hung out to dry and potential mothers are going to needlessly suffer in those states that are taking an all or nothing approach. RvW is driving the issue, but state legislature passed trigger laws are the problem that has to be deal with right this moment. The idiots that passed some of them have no idea of the medical consequence of some of those decisions based on what is starting to trickle out now.

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4 minutes ago, Brew said:

Then when the mother dies because of inaction, you get a malpractice suit filed against you. All the practices in our area are going with a business as usual approach and making sure their documentation is sound and they have concurring physician sign off for now. That includes the ultra pro life Catholic doctor of one the groups and the ultra R one in another group. Their beliefs are that these reasons aren’t intended to be caught up in this law which we’ve told them is a pretty naive view. Attorneys are all recommending that they go ahead and petition the court for every scenario they can come up with which is what I think a few groups are going to band together and do.


It’s an f-ed up situation. Some doctors are going to get caught up in it and hung out to dry and potential mothers are going to needlessly suffer in those states that are taking an all or nothing approach. RvW is driving the issue, but state legislature passed trigger laws are the problem that has to be deal with right this moment. The idiots that passed some of them have no idea of the medical consequence of some of those decisions based on what is starting to trickle out now.

wait, you're telling me that ken paxton, dade phelan, dan patrick, and briscoe cain are not the ideal people to be designing health care procedural guidelines?

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SIAP

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/supreme-court/texas-state-funded-crisis-pregnancy-centers-gave-medical-misinformatio-rcna34883

Quote

Across the U.S., more than 2,500 crisis pregnancy centers (CPCs) provide free services and counseling for women struggling with unplanned pregnancies. They outnumber abortion clinics 3 to 1 nationwide, and as some states shutter clinics after Roe’s reversal, that ratio will grow. 

But when two NBC News producers visited state-funded CPCs in Texas to ask for counseling, counselors told them that abortions caused mental illness and implied abortions could also cause cancer and infertility.

 

The nation’s largest national obstetricians’ group, the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists, says that’s medical misinformation.

The centers, which are often faith-based, frequently get funding from religious groups and individual donors, but many also depend partly on taxpayer dollars. CPCs have long been accused of providing what experts have called “misleading or false” information to discourage women from getting abortions, as NBC News witnessed firsthand after sending two producers to CPCs in Texas to request pregnancy counseling.

The producers did not tell the CPCs they were with NBC News.

 

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19 hours ago, Captainant said:

Why the fuck are you voting republican again?

 

18 hours ago, Porterhouse said:

Taxes. But, I haven’t found a R worthy of voting for since ‘12, and I haven’t done so, yet posters like @Brisketexan and you will falsely claim that’s exactly what I’ve done. GOP has such a serious problem moving forward that I find myself embarrassed to be associated with the party.  I weep for the future. 

This is such a cop out.  

18 hours ago, Captainant said:

Have you voted against republicans, or merely abstaining from the vote and your duty as an American citizen?

 

18 hours ago, Porterhouse said:

Abstained from 2016 onwards. If these two parties want to put a worthy candidate in front of me, I’d vote.  But they haven’t and so I won’t. I wonder if that will change in ‘24. I’m not hopeful. You can talk about “duty” all you want; I’m very purposely carrying out what I believe should be carried out. 

I disagree with fatty in that, I don’t care that a certain party wants to move on from my industry; it cannot and it tends to do things to make it more profitable.  And therefore I’m generally not complaining. 

Again, a cop out.  Not voting against a party with whom you're embarrassed to be associated is roughly equivalent to voting for them.

Be better.  Join those of us whose embarrassment with our party forced us to vote for the lesser of two evils.  Voting for the lesser of the evils is the first step to eradicating the greater evil.

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14 hours ago, fattyflattie said:

I’m on record in first few pages ON Jan 6 stating my feeling on it.  I’ll just say I shed no tears for Ashli Babbit (sp?).   I’m also on record with my thoughts on this stripping of women’s rights, and it aligns with the centrist D’s (what we’ve had in place my entire adult life).  I even spoke a bit when it was overturned about my wife’s (unexpected to me) visceral reaction.  I’m not on record on LGBQT+ threads but I’m a big don’t fuck with peoples lives type.  People have misconstrued what I’ve said in threads about tax policy to paint me as someone who hates the poor, but I really dgaf. There’s ~15 posters on this board that I’d worry about how they feel about me (yourself included) so it’s easy for it to fall off my back.    I’ll admit, I’m probably on record starting id prefer a more “conservative” court, but I never thought we’d get to where we are over the last few weeks.  If I understood that then, I wouldn’t have had that opinion. 

1cbfbf30-1e8a-4628-b74b-8db7b2c380ea_100

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14 hours ago, troph said:

One day maybe. Right now I honestly don’t think so. I would LOVE to one day have the privilege to consider voting Republican but not only does my queer ass not have that privilege I honestly and sincerely as a human, a lawyer, a Texan and outdoorswoman and a parent of three ostensibly straight cisgender boys can’t see how me or any of us have the privilege to sit this one or the next few out. It’s a grave grave crisis right now. 

Good to see you're back posting again, btw.

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There was a time where I would have applauded someone abstaining from voting because the candidates simply weren’t good enough. I understand that thinking for sure.
The problem is we aren’t in regular times where that is enough. The only political message you are sending by abstaining is that both parties are equally bad. That’s just not true, and currently is not acceptable if your goal is to preserve democracy. You can be unhappy with Dems but they are the only thing preventing the pubs from overthrowing democracy for good. Sack up, hold your nose, whatever it is that makes you feel better about it. Either vote democracy or you are supporting authoritarianism because you still believe the fairy tales that the GOP has been selling about evil dems.

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38 minutes ago, DDD Dad said:

 

This is such a cop out.  

 

Again, a cop out.  Not voting against a party with whom you're embarrassed to be associated is roughly equivalent to voting for them.

Be better.  Join those of us whose embarrassment with our party forced us to vote for the lesser of two evils.  Voting for the lesser of the evils is the first step to eradicating the greater evil.

I’ll never vote for subpar candidates. If Obama were running for a second term, I’d vote for him. I’m not going to vote Biden. He’s a disaster that has the good fortune of being trumped by…Trump. You can call it a cop out and say I’m tacitly voting for a Republican and I feel zero shame. One party has got to put someone worthy out there, or I’ll very willfully exercise my right to not vote. 

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, Porterhouse said:

I’ll never vote for subpar candidates. If Obama were running for a second term, I’d vote for him. I’m not going to vote Biden. He’s a disaster that has the good fortune of being trumped by…Trump. You can call it a cop out and say I’m tacitly voting for a Republican and I feel zero shame. One party has got to put someone worthy out there, or I’ll very willfully exercise my right to not vote. 

Something worthy like democracy? Seems like something worth voting for.

Edited by hobbes2702
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32 minutes ago, Porterhouse said:

I’ll never vote for subpar candidates. If Obama were running for a second term, I’d vote for him. I’m not going to vote Biden. He’s a disaster that has the good fortune of being trumped by…Trump. You can call it a cop out and say I’m tacitly voting for a Republican and I feel zero shame. One party has got to put someone worthy out there, or I’ll very willfully exercise my right to not vote. 

That is certainly your right.  I'd personally rather you exercise that right more effectively by canceling out someone else who is exercising their right to vote in the bigger shitbag/disaster/subpar candidate.

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12 minutes ago, hobbes2702 said:

Seriously tell me the thing so abhorrent about Dems that you are willing to bring about the end of American democracy as we know it? Talk about missing the forest for the trees.

You guys are repeating this so much I am convinced you believe it. Why don’t we wait and see who the candidate is?  If Trump or a Trump-approved minion, I’m voting Biden. 

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Posted (edited)
22 minutes ago, Porterhouse said:

You guys are repeating this so much I am convinced you believe it. Why don’t we wait and see who the candidate is?  If Trump or a Trump-approved minion, I’m voting Biden. 

There’s no one in the Republican Party that isn’t trump approved. This is just dumb. And it’s not even a trump problem. The whole party is anti democracy. What are you missing? What don’t you believe?

Edited by hobbes2702
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12 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

wonder how many young women looking at colleges or are already there are now looking to transfer to a state that hasn't lost its goddamn mind? good have large impact on red state unis

Mine are a few years off but I’m getting them far from here. 

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1 hour ago, Porterhouse said:

You guys are repeating this so much I am convinced you believe it. Why don’t we wait and see who the candidate is?  If Trump or a Trump-approved minion, I’m voting Biden. 

You know there are elections this year, right?

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6 minutes ago, hobbes2702 said:

There’s no one in the Republican Party that isn’t trump approved. This is just dumb. And it’s not even a trump problem. The whole party is anti democracy. What are you missing? What don’t you believe?

I’m not fast forwarding 2 years just yet. 

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Mine are a few years off but I’m getting them far from here. 

We are visiting schools in Colorado and the Pacific NW over the next year. My girls aren’t allowed to entertain the idea of staying in Texas.
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44 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

wonder how many young women looking at colleges or are already there are now looking to transfer to a state that hasn't lost its goddamn mind? good have large impact on red state unis

I am exactly the kind of person a state wants to keep in-state.  Thus, 30+ years ago, the State of Texas purposefully invested in me, and it has paid off quite a bit (I am a large economic positive to the state, from more than just my regular BBQ purchases).

My kids are even more the kind of person a state wants to keep in-state.  They couldn't GTFO of here fast enough.  The chances of either returning are quite low.

Then add a layer, and think of drawing talent.  If you are LGBT, or you are a minority, or a young woman, when you look at job postings in Texas, are you much more inclined to "nope" right past them?  Hell yes you are.  If you are an OB=GYN looking for a placement, are you going to do all you can to avoid a state that would imprison you for following the Hippocratic oath?  Yep, folks on this board have already relayed such stories.

Texas is effectuating a brain-drain.  Favorable tax treatment and creating a regulation-free hellscape are only going to go so far.  An enterprise might move its 100 person HQ here for tax purposes, but it's 5,000 person highly educated workforce is going to be in places where the company can attract talent.  Texas is consuming its seed stock.  The intellectual crop yield in the coming years is going to plummet.  

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I am exactly the kind of person a state wants to keep in-state.  Thus, 30+ years ago, the State of Texas purposefully invested in me, and it has paid off quite a bit (I am a large economic positive to the state, from more than just my regular BBQ purchases).
My kids are even more the kind of person a state wants to keep in-state.  They couldn't GTFO of here fast enough.  The chances of either returning are quite low.
Then add a layer, and think of drawing talent.  If you are LGBT, or you are a minority, or a young woman, when you look at job postings in Texas, are you much more inclined to "nope" right past them?  Hell yes you are.  If you are an OB=GYN looking for a placement, are you going to do all you can to avoid a state that would imprison you for following the Hippocratic oath?  Yep, folks on this board have already relayed such stories.
Texas is effectuating a brain-drain.  Favorable tax treatment and creating a regulation-free hellscape are only going to go so far.  An enterprise might move its 100 person HQ here for tax purposes, but it's 5,000 person highly educated workforce is going to be in places where the company can attract talent.  Texas is consuming its seed stock.  The intellectual crop yield in the coming years is going to plummet.  
Don't care; owned Libs.

Seriously, the people in Belton and Marshall don't care about attracting anybody to Texas, much less "those kinds of people". Qualifications be damned. Besides, that's a problem for the big cities. Hell, the people of Midland and Baytown don't care as long as O&G is paying out.

How am I farther out on the ledge than you on this?
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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Porterhouse said:

You guys are repeating this so much I am convinced you believe it.

Guilty. Been asking for examples of the radical D accomplishments, which are often mentioned but not defined. OTOH, the new right is on the record, and funded by billionaire Peter Thiel. I linked you the Yarvin piece. Maybe a more general look at the players will help you understand why this election and the next are described as existential threats

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2022/04/inside-the-new-right-where-peter-thiel-is-placing-his-biggest-bets/amp

Edited by Willfully Horn
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14 minutes ago, tchookem said:

Don't care; owned Libs.

Seriously, the people in Belton and Marshall don't care about attracting anybody to Texas, much less "those kinds of people". Qualifications be damned. Besides, that's a problem for the big cities. Hell, the people of Midland and Baytown don't care as long as O&G is paying out.

How am I farther out on the ledge than you on this?

Oh, you're not.  What the Belton and Marshall crowd doesn't get is that -- as much as they want to believe their local O&G and ranching pays the bills for this state -- intellectual capital is where Texas' growth and prosperity lies.  Want to have even shittier roads, shittier universities, shittier everything?  Drive out the economic engine of the new economy.  A declining state hurts all of them, but I agree......they ain't gonna see it until it's WAY too late.

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2 hours ago, Brisketexan said:

I am exactly the kind of person a state wants to keep in-state.  Thus, 30+ years ago, the State of Texas purposefully invested in me, and it has paid off quite a bit (I am a large economic positive to the state, from more than just my regular BBQ purchases).

My kids are even more the kind of person a state wants to keep in-state.  They couldn't GTFO of here fast enough.  The chances of either returning are quite low.

Then add a layer, and think of drawing talent.  If you are LGBT, or you are a minority, or a young woman, when you look at job postings in Texas, are you much more inclined to "nope" right past them?  Hell yes you are.  If you are an OB=GYN looking for a placement, are you going to do all you can to avoid a state that would imprison you for following the Hippocratic oath?  Yep, folks on this board have already relayed such stories.

Texas is effectuating a brain-drain.  Favorable tax treatment and creating a regulation-free hellscape are only going to go so far.  An enterprise might move its 100 person HQ here for tax purposes, but it's 5,000 person highly educated workforce is going to be in places where the company can attract talent.  Texas is consuming its seed stock.  The intellectual crop yield in the coming years is going to plummet.  

The tech company I work for posted it’s weekly “open jobs” internal email today and the austin openings were about triple the normal volume. I attribute it to our refusal to allow full time remote, but to your point, filling these roles may be even harder now. 

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3 hours ago, hobbes2702 said:

Then give us the deets

isn't it kinda implied? if she is one of the "the friends" then she is already spilling the beans. i don't think there is much more to it. unfortunately. but still, Ivanka got an abortion. whose? I dunno, whose lap has she been in the most?....

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1 hour ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

isn't it kinda implied? if she is one of the "the friends" then she is already spilling the beans. i don't think there is much more to it. unfortunately. but still, Ivanka got an abortion. whose? I dunno, whose lap has she been in the most?....

If her pregnancy was...ahem...the result of incest then I fully support the choice to terminate it.

271A67E4-415B-4A5A-9BBF-4A4204E829E3.thumb.png.92f07dfb5ac6bde1938ed9aa265184af.png

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9 hours ago, Willfully Horn said:

You’re pissed at Joe for making a faustian deal with McConnell, too? Cool, cool. Joe served his purpose. Primary him.

 

Doubt that will happen, but if they do who would be a good choice to primary him? 

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9 hours ago, Willfully Horn said:

You’re pissed at Joe for making a faustian deal with McConnell, too? Cool, cool. Joe served his purpose. Primary him.

All we need is a bloc of D senators with spines to block this nom, right?

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7 minutes ago, Longhorn_Fan68 said:

is.... is it finally happening? are these chucklefucks finally tripping over their dicks to the point that even the corporations are gonna have to stand up to them? I just don't understand it

 

Glad I moved to California, yeah we have our problems but jfc Texas is fucking nuts.

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