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Posted
3 minutes ago, troph said:

 

 

I was preparing a post to give him credit. but then he would think he's absolved of the more important aspects here. there is unequivocally an existential threat on my right to (1) live, and (2) do so in peace, in the United States of America. That is actually not even in question anymore. so while I appreciate him saying she in other posts, he continues to have extreme animus toward me given his vote and his positions, despite him claiming otherwise.

I am admittedly not well versed in all opposition you face in life. Please do not group me in as a whole with other people. Just wanted discussion. You should be respected as a person first and foremost. 

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Posted
Just now, Texasborn91 said:

I am admittedly not well versed in all opposition you face in life. Please do not group me in as a whole with other people. Just wanted discussion. You should be respected as a person first and foremost. 

You did that yourself.

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Posted
1 hour ago, Texasborn91 said:

But when it comes to legal documentation and representation in athletic events I think you should be grouped into the gender that you were genetically born into. I’m not trying to start any kind of shit. Just trying to add to the convo. 

Ok fine.  But, seriously, what difference does it make what your gender is on your drivers license and birth certificate?

Do you really think a competitiveness issue like men in women's sports should be the subject of legislation?  Especially when it is a tiny fraction of competitors?

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Posted
Just now, Texasborn91 said:

I am admittedly not well versed in all opposition you face in life. Please do not group me in as a whole with other people. Just wanted discussion. You should be respected as a person first and foremost. 

I'm not grouping you with anyone. I'm explaining to you that your actions have consequences. You do not get to vote for those that want to DESTROY my life and then say I should be respected first and foremost. Those are incompatible.

and the mere fact that I'm disagreeing with you does not mean we aren't having a conversation.

you are correct, you are not well versed in the opposition I face, I'm trying to tell you. Please listen, your vote matters and it is destroying people's lives. not about sports, about families, healthcare, mental health, suicide, violence, access to housing, insurance, jobs, and the right to have access to the very promise of America - the pursuit of happiness.  There is zero reason for the government to target me and my people to the extreme degree they are. It's HORRIBLE. It's wrong and it has fundamental consequences I hope you never have to face.

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Posted
8 minutes ago, troph said:

 

 

I was preparing a post to give him credit. but then he would think he's absolved of the more important aspects here. there is unequivocally an existential threat on my right to (1) live, and (2) do so in peace, in the United States of America. That is actually not even in question anymore. so while I appreciate him saying she in other posts, he continues to have extreme animus toward me given his vote and his positions, despite him claiming otherwise.

I'm not defending him. I'm pointing out that this convo has gotten heated enough that it's best to not let anybody use accidentally escalate it even more, lest it get even further beyond anything remotely productive.

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Paper_jam said:

It's great that the free world was plunged into 500 years of darkness, as long as we guard the purity of amateur sports for girls.

 

The upside here is that the 1000 year reich only lasted 12.  Getting out of it left a hell of a hangover though. 

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Posted
8 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

Were you as reasonable and equanimious during covid when there was years of supply chain issues and worldwide inflation, of which America had the lowest inflation in the world comparatively? 

The supply and demand issue of killing off birds (thus driving up the price) to prevent the spread of disease to more flocks nearby isn’t a political issue. It’s a common sense issue. That price is set by a market.

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Texasborn91 said:

I am admittedly not well versed in all opposition you face in life. Please do not group me in as a whole with other people. Just wanted discussion. You should be respected as a person first and foremost. 

This a good post and thought. It seems like you are coming from a perspective of love for humanity. 

So why not just go all the way with it?

 

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Posted

by the way, if you think my driver's license should say M on it - why?  give me the justification.

The reality is when my passport is changed to M, I'm immediately outed. That can put me in extreme danger in many places where I would otherwise be fine. I could be detained at an airport or customs station simply out of morbid curiosity, subject to searches, harassment, etc. Same for my driver's license. That's just the tip of the iceberg.  discrimination in lending, housing, job searches, etc. all open wide up when I'm outed.

Fact is there is not one compelling reason to prohibit my gender marker being left as F in this world that overrides the risk I face if my gender marker is M, none.

 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

Because it's a fucking stupid thing to discuss in light of all the massively illegal/corrupt shit that's going on.

Or, let's put it in terms of the things the republican party used to pretend to care about: limited government.  Do you know how many transgender people are competitive swimmers in this country?  I made a rough calculation at one point and, to no one's surprise, it is an infinitesimally small number; it is a small fraction of one percent.  Why in the hell does the so-called party of limited government place this issue toward the tip of the spear, much less include it on its policy platform at all?  We all know the real answer.

Edited by dcbc
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Posted
Just now, Hank Kingsley said:

This a good post and thought. It seems like you are coming from a perspective of love for humanity. 

So why not just go all the way with it?

 

I think there is hope for him actually. I'm trying to share my personal lived experience hoping he is listening. I think he sort of is.  I'd post a picture of me and my family so he could see the humanity but that would be a mistake. suffice it to say, I'm no different than anyone here, just trying to live in peace, unfortunately the politicians he supports have declared an out right war for my existence. I hope he sees that.

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Posted
1 minute ago, dcbc said:

Or, let's put it in terms of the things the republican party used to pretend to care about: limited government.  Do you know how many transgender people are competitive swimmers in this country?  I made a rough calculation at one point and, to no one's surprise, it is an infinitesimally small number; it is a small fraction of one percent.  Why in the hell does the so-called party of limited government place this issue toward the tip of the sphere, much less include it on its policy platform at all?  We all know the real answer.

Maybe he just wants to get the job checking all the girl athletes to make sure they're girls. 

Posted
1 minute ago, wildcat09 said:

Maybe he just wants to get the job checking all the girl athletes to make sure they're girls. 

Naah, it's almost always a toxic stew of 1) self-loathing because of ambiguous inner sexual thoughts, like being attracted to a trans person once, and 2) good old-fashioned punching down: weak people feel powerful when they find someone to bully.

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Posted
1 hour ago, David Dennison said:

So it's the left wing version of stop the steal.

 

No, it's realized that for them, every accusation is a confession.

You really think the piece of shit who tried a coup on 1/6/21 (and all this other shit) is going to go quietly this time?

But go ahead, ana2, both sides this.

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Posted
7 minutes ago, Texasborn91 said:

The supply and demand issue of killing off birds (thus driving up the price) to prevent the spread of disease to more flocks nearby isn’t a political issue. It’s a common sense issue. That price is set by a market.

That's not the question I asked you at all. I asked you THIS question:

 

Quote

Were you as reasonable and equanimious during covid when there was years of supply chain issues and worldwide inflation, of which America had the lowest inflation in the world comparatively? 

Would you be so good as to answer that very simple and direct question(s)?

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Posted
58 minutes ago, Texasborn91 said:

That’s fine. I have no ill will towards troph whatsoever. I just don’t think your gender is something that can officially be changed. If you want to live your life that way then more power to you. 

My wife’s sister is a pediatric urologist and has worked with families to choose a child’s gender in cases where the child’s sex characteristics are ambiguous. She has created penises and vaginas. Say the parents and doctor choose male (which is what a Dad chose after my wife’s sister gently recommended female based on the situation). What happens later as the child is growing up and identifies more as female? Is that person a male or female?

 

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Posted
Just now, softlynow said:

No, it's realized that for them, every accusation is a confession.

You really think the piece of shit who tried a coup on 1/6/21 (and all this other shit) is going to go quietly this time?

But go ahead, ana2, both sides this.

Dennison is low-key one of our worst posters. 

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Posted
6 minutes ago, troph said:

by the way, if you think my driver's license should say M on it - why?  give me the justification.

The reality is when my passport is changed to M, I'm immediately outed. That can put me in extreme danger in many places where I would otherwise be fine. I could be detained at an airport or customs station simply out of morbid curiosity, subject to searches, harassment, etc. Same for my driver's license. That's just the tip of the iceberg.  discrimination in lending, housing, job searches, etc. all open wide up when I'm outed.

Fact is there is not one compelling reason to prohibit my gender marker being left as F in this world that overrides the risk I face if my gender marker is M, none.

 

See this is reasoning I find very compelling. You often don't think of things like this until you hear from people who have to live it.

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Posted
5 minutes ago, bolverk said:

Given your posts in the NJ UFO thread, you seem like the type who's skeptical of government authority and doesn't take a shine to the government dictating your life. Am I correct on that assumption, based on that posting history?

What if I were to tell you that in this bolded sentence, you're ceding to the government an immense amount of power to a central authority over an extremely personal thing that you take for granted with the comforting knowledge your gender expression conforms to the wishes of the ruling regime?

If you're a religious person, consider that you are imposing a "man's natural order" mindset on God's glorious creation in all its various permutations where the combination of X & Y chromosomes and the infinite mix of hormones allows for (nay, insists on) an astonishing spectrum of possibilities. If you're a nonreligious person, simply replace "God" with "universe."

Now, consider this question:
Who the fuck are you or this government to impose this simplistic, black-and-white, or binomial stricture on a fluid, dynamic, and infinite reality, and under what authority?

Authority. You're giving it away, freely, willingly, an immense amount of it, and that has wide fucking implications for those of us who are just plain old straight vanilla. And it's not because I fear the government suddenly misgendering me, but I do fear one that is emboldened to start making all kinds of other judgments and rulings over other parts of my personal life and right to privacy.

Sure, right now, their focus is on this one small group of people, of which a vanishingly tiny subset play competitive sports. Like Brisket said, the number in NCAA sports is in the single digits. That's your stated concern, right? "Men" playing in "women's" sports.

Why the fuck do you or anyone wish to turn this trivial sports shit that can be (and is) taken care of by the governing body of that sport into some epic, gargantuan fucking issue and place it into the hands of one old man? Do you understand what kind of power you're ceding to a singular individual who has demonstrated throughout his life that he thinks no one can contain his insatiable desire for more?

Have you not picked up on the fact that he has a habit of slicing us up into all these little minority interest groups and individually picking them out for abuse?

If you already understood all that and voted for the man anyway, you are undeniably fascist adjacent, at the very least, and have enabled a dictator. If you didn't grasp this shit, open your fucking eyes. 

 

 

Yes I’m very skeptical of govt. I think all politicians are pieces of shit and on the hook for the most part. The gender in sports debate is just a small part of my beliefs. It’s how I feel. And I stated my reasoning. What’s the problem? 
im more concerned with school shootings and gun control. But thats point has been looked over until the next big one that happens and draws us back in. I think drug control in this country is fucked and our lackadaisical enforcement on the border is a part of it.  All of these conversations are just media controlled talking points to drive the country apart. If there was a democrat that I sympathized with I’d have no problem voting that way. But to immediately taking to someone being  called a Nazi is shallow and short minded and just drives a wedge. I’m here trying to discuss shit. But ppl want to take pot shots and be on their way. Thats cool, I knew how this would go. 

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Posted

Imagine defending an indefensible position so staunchly on the internet. The only thing Republicans enjoy more than molesting genitalia is discussing genitalia. 

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Posted
5 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Maybe he just wants to get the job checking all the girl athletes to make sure they're girls. 

For a second, I thought about responding with a Mick Dundee photo captioned, "Job's taken."  But although my usual stance is "funny is funny," this thread doesn't need that levity right now.

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Posted
3 minutes ago, HornPhD said:

My wife’s sister is a pediatric urologist and has worked with families to choose a child’s gender in cases where the child’s sex characteristics are ambiguous. She has created penises and vaginas. Say the parents and doctor choose male (which is what a Dad chose after my wife’s sister gently recommended female based on the situation). What happens later as the child is growing up and identifies more as female? Is that person a male or female?

 

the right decision is to wait. essentially a biological expression of non-binary and wait for the brain to develop enough for the child to signal their gender.  I have no ill will toward the medical establishment on this issue but I do know people devastated by these early decisions.

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Posted
4 minutes ago, wildcat09 said:

Dennison is low-key one of our worst posters. 

Has anyone ever seen him and bad teammate in a room together?

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Posted
12 minutes ago, troph said:

by the way, if you think my driver's license should say M on it - why?  give me the justification.

The reality is when my passport is changed to M, I'm immediately outed. That can put me in extreme danger in many places where I would otherwise be fine. I could be detained at an airport or customs station simply out of morbid curiosity, subject to searches, harassment, etc. Same for my driver's license. That's just the tip of the iceberg.  discrimination in lending, housing, job searches, etc. all open wide up when I'm outed.

Fact is there is not one compelling reason to prohibit my gender marker being left as F in this world that overrides the risk I face if my gender marker is M, none.

 

But Troph you are missing a key part of this. What if he found you hot? WHAT IF HE FOUND YOU HOT!?

One might then have to wrestle with their own sexuality and the implications of not being where they thought they were on the spectrum. That is unacceptable.

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Posted
Just now, HornPhD said:

My wife’s sister is a pediatric urologist and has worked with families to choose a child’s gender in cases where the child’s sex characteristics are ambiguous. She has created penises and vaginas. Say the parents and doctor choose male (which is what a Dad chose after my wife’s sister gently recommended female based on the situation). What happens later as the child is growing up and identifies more as female? Is that person a male or female?

 

I’m more open to that. I know not everything is absolutes. But to let a pre pubescent child with clearly defined genitals take hormones bc they identify differently? I disagree with.

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Posted
5 minutes ago, Texasborn91 said:

Yes I’m very skeptical of govt. I think all politicians are pieces of shit and on the hook for the most part. The gender in sports debate is just a small part of my beliefs. It’s how I feel. And I stated my reasoning. What’s the problem? 

I think the problem is you've allowed people from the government - that you say you are skeptical of - to dictate a small part of your beliefs. 

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Posted
8 minutes ago, softlynow said:

No, it's realized that for them, every accusation is a confession.

You really think the piece of shit who tried a coup on 1/6/21 (and all this other shit) is going to go quietly this time?

But go ahead, ana2, both sides this.

Quietly, probably not.

But he's going to go. I have no doubt about that.

Posted
1 minute ago, Texasborn91 said:

I’m more open to that. I know not everything is absolutes. But to let a pre pubescent child with clearly defined genitals take hormones bc they identify differently? I disagree with.

it's not really the government's place if you mistrust government. and I'm not ignoring the severity of these decisions. It's just not the place for the government by fiat to ban it out right when doctors, mental health professionals, patient and parent are ground zero on the issue for years before any such decision is made.

2 minutes ago, SimonBolivar said:

But Troph you are missing a key part of this. What if he found you hot? WHAT IF HE FOUND YOU HOT!?

One might then have to wrestle with their own sexuality and the implications of not being where they thought they were on the spectrum. That is unacceptable.

IF?

Men hit on me all the time. I am attractive.

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Hank Kingsley said:

I think the problem is you've allowed people from the government - that you say you are skeptical of - to dictate a small part of your beliefs. 

These are my personal beliefs. I’ve given plenty of examples of how I disagree with Trump and republican beliefs. 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Texasborn91 said:

Better golfing then napping. All the meanwhile doing exactly what he said he would do. Clear up the gender fiasco, begin to secure the southern border, expose government misappropriation of funds. Not saying I agree with any one thing more than the other but he’s done what his voters elected him for.

2 hours ago, TwiceHorn said:

Exactly how is he clearing up the "gender fiasco,"  and what is it exactly?

What government "misappropriation of funds" are you talking about?

And what has he done to secure the southern border?

How about inflation and the price of gas?

Yep, he's already dismissed lowering prices as "really hard to do" (yeah, no shit, Dotard) after berating Biden for it for years. And then there's all the batshit crazy, illegal, and/or authoritarian shit he IS doing that was never mentioned during the campaign. Or how about trying to destroy the judiciary and the legislative branches following P2025 to the letter, despite claiming during the campaign that he knew nothing about it?

"Done what the voters elected him for"? LOL, gtfo with that idiotic shit, @Texasborn91.

Quote

I’m not stupid enough to bitch about the price of eggs in the middle of a bird flu outbreak.

OK then how about all those other prices he's gonna lower, like grocery prices in general? Oh wait. That's right. He already gave up on that, because it's hard. 

Edited by wood
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Posted
Just now, troph said:

the right decision is to wait. essentially a biological expression of non-binary and wait for the brain to develop enough for the child to signal their gender.  I have no ill will toward the medical establishment on this issue but I do know people devastated by these early decisions.

Agree. The situation I mentioned happened a few years before COVID. I am sure best practices have been updated. I’m sure that a designation of non-binary is frightening to some people. 

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Posted
6 minutes ago, Texasborn91 said:

I’m more open to that. I know not everything is absolutes. But to let a pre pubescent child with clearly defined genitals take hormones bc they identify differently? I disagree with.

why do you think you have the right to decide for others?

 

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Posted
1 minute ago, C-Man said:

The idea of that we are on Steve Bannon's side with regard to anything is, quite frankly, terrifying but here we are.

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/steve-bannon-warns-republicans-the-oligarchs-will-abandon-them-theyre-with-us-but-only-temporarily/

That's an argument over strategy, not goals. Bannon is smart enough to realize that Elon's poor impulse control is hurting them in the long term. 

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Texasborn91 said:

I’m more open to that. I know not everything is absolutes. But to let a pre pubescent child with clearly defined genitals take hormones bc they identify differently? I disagree with.

You need to stop focusing on genitals.  

Ironically, I was given the option to take male hormones (I am male) around the 5th grade because I was short.  Fortunately, my parents and I asked about future effects and the docs said "well, he'll probably end up taller if he just waits for it all to shake out than he would be if he took the hormones".  I was like "fuck that, I'll wait".  So it was perfectly legal for this male-identifying kid to take some version of testosterone but it shouldn't be legal to take something akin to estrogen?  Sure, I wouldn't have done it for gender identity reasons, but that doesn't really move the needle for me.

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Posted
3 minutes ago, troph said:

it's not really the government's place if you mistrust government. and I'm not ignoring the severity of these decisions. It's just not the place for the government by fiat to ban it out right when doctors, mental health professionals, patient and parent are ground zero on the issue for years before any such decision is made.

It must be done to keep some sort of order. What jail should a transgender person go to? if they haven’t had gender reassignment surgery? Government is the one that allowed all of this to be so misconstrued.  Nobody is saying you cannot live your life as a transgender. Where is the line drawn?

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Posted
1 minute ago, Texasborn91 said:

It must be done to keep some sort of order. What jail should a transgender person go to? if they haven’t had gender reassignment surgery? Government is the one that allowed all of this to be so misconstrued.  Nobody is saying you cannot live your life as a transgender. Where is the line drawn?

You realize, of course, all of these arguments used to be made with regard to race and sexuality.

Posted
2 hours ago, troph said:

That’s funny. We are prepared to stay in Texas for 3 years but know our signals, we’ve been preparing for loss of proper identification - avoid government interactions, how I would drive less or not at all, avoid police interaction, possibly move my residency, then researching states and countries to move too, making moves for early retirement, and all the while and this is probably THE most important …. My friends tell me I have a magical ability to “alchemize” events and circumstances from the negative to the positive so the problems I face become challenges not to overcome but opportunities to triumph. If I’m forced to leave we will live twice as legendary as if we stay. I don’t know how I do it, I just don’t have the innate ability to suffer the plight of a victim, and while there is some ableism in that statement even when I was severely sick, I worked my ass of to triumph through it. I guess the “what if?” line of questioning always leads me to opportunity. They circle the firing squad so to speak on me and my people, what if we went on an adventure? Instead of OMFG we are going to have to flee. And then I just ignore the negative what if’s… I do not think about what if I had more time to think about ordinary things, what if I was cisgender and could run for office, what if I was still a guy, how much money have I lost because I’m not a dude…. What if I get tossed in a men’s jail cell. Those thoughts are not ones I entertain. Instead what if we live on in the mountains of Mexico and wake up to the vibrant cool air, the slow pace of life and without the American soulless social media and for profit industry for everything bearing down on us? I could go on and on. There is a winning mindset in times like these. I lucked into it about the age of 5 in a train wreck or a family of origin. How I chose adaptive behaviors instead of maladaptive behaviors at such a young age? I don’t know, maybe Jesus really does love me.

well that all sounds like a damn gender fiasco! 😋

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Posted
1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

You need to stop focusing on genitals.  

Ironically, I was given the option to take male hormones (I am male) around the 5th grade because I was short.  Fortunately, my parents and I asked about future effects and the docs said "well, he'll probably end up taller if he just waits for it all to shake out than he would be if he took the hormones".  I was like "fuck that, I'll wait".  So it was perfectly legal for this male-identifying kid to take some version of testosterone but it shouldn't be legal to take something akin to estrogen?  Sure, I wouldn't have done it for gender identity reasons, but that doesn't really move the needle for me.

You telling me to stop focusing on genitalia while debating gender is moving the goal post for sure. 

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Posted
5 minutes ago, Texasborn91 said:

These are my personal beliefs. I’ve given plenty of examples of how I disagree with Trump and republican beliefs. 

this is likely the last I will add, again it's incongruent with your core belief that government shouldn't be trusted. just like you say (and I think you believe you have no ill will for me as a human) your choices for who you vote for - I am telling you as someone directly impacted by those choices - are not consistent with what you say matters to you.

 

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