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Posted
1 hour ago, Hookem2147 said:

It should come as no surprise, but Texas wants DJ Lagway (Florida) and John Mateer (OU) at full strength when Texas meets them in the next few weeks.

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Posted
53 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

I don't remember that one, but my god, that is fantastic.

 

It was a big ad campaign a little over 20 years ago. They made a few long clips, then cut a lot of commercials out of it. They’re all on youtube.

They still make me laugh, and may be more relevant today that when they came out. 

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Posted
18 hours ago, TexArcher said:

It's almost October, aggy is undefeated and in the top 10 for a moment, and Looch can't stop making excuses for how many games Texas is about to win.

They all know what is coming.

And it isn’t the sheep…

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Posted
Quote

They want teams at their best as a way to measure where the defense is at. Maybe for some other reasons, too…

 

WTF is that 2nd part supposed to mean?

Posted
2 minutes ago, elguapo said:

 

WTF is that 2nd part supposed to mean?

My guess is the talking heads that try to influence the CFP rankings may only give you partial credit for beating a team without their star player.  

"Well they weren't at full strength without Mateer, so not sure you can really count this as a good win on their resume" 

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Posted
3 minutes ago, Park Gothic said:

I voiced something similar to this yesterday and everyone called me an idiot. I was firm in my beliefs however and sure that everyone else was wrong. 

Now that I see IT may be agreeing with me, I have serious doubts about my position. 

Looch already started it and now it's been parroted that we have had insane luck with opposing QBs and that means we aren't/weren't as good as we appeared.

Posted
4 minutes ago, Park Gothic said:

I voiced something similar to this yesterday and everyone called me an idiot. I was firm in my beliefs however and sure that everyone else was wrong. 

Now that I see IT may be agreeing with me, I have serious doubts about my position. 

The voters left Illinois in the top 25 after that 63-10 beatdown. The voters are stupid.

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Posted
12 minutes ago, Park Gothic said:

I voiced something similar to this yesterday and everyone called me an idiot. I was firm in my beliefs however and sure that everyone else was wrong. 

Now that I see IT may be agreeing with me, I have serious doubts about my position. 

Strength of schedule is supposed to be emphasized this year. If Mateer comes back after this 3 game stretch and OU does well, the win is going to boost the Texas SOS. That is a fact, no matter how much Lucci bitches. 

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Posted (edited)

Spoiled below is Alex Dunlap's full OL write-up for SHSU. For those who don't want to go through his entire write-up, here are the grades for the season so far, along with the grading scale he uses.

Deep-Dig-2025-OL-Grades-by-Week-.jpg

Deep-Dig-2021-OL-GRADING-SCALE.jpg

Spoiler

Here, we'll go over Texas Longhorns offensive snap-count data, offensive line grades, offensive line disruption-allowed statistics, and give historical context about Arch Manning and the Texas Longhorns offense coming out of the Sam Houston State game as they begin to prepare for SEC play.

Click Images to Enlarge

Skill Player Snap Counts and Game-by-Game Percentages of Offensive Snaps (Through Week 4)
Deep-Dig-2025-Skill-Player-Participation-3.jpg



***please note that exact snap-count numbers may differ from other sources at times, as the Deep Dig does not count plays as offensive player snaps that are blown dead due to penalty, punts, extra points, field goals, spiked balls, victory formations, kneel-downs, etc.***

Personnel-Grouping Frequency Overall and by Game (Through Week 4)
Deep-Dig-2025-Personnel-Utilization-by-Game-3.jpg



Tight End Total Snap Counts and Alignment Data (Through Week 4)
Deep-Dig-2025-TE-Usage-Chart-3.jpg



Team Target Share By Week (Through Week 4)
Deep-Dig-2025-Target-Share-By-Game-3.jpg



Deep Dig OL Grading Scale (each snap by each player is graded as its own independent event)
Deep-Dig-2021-OL-GRADING-SCALE.jpg

OL Grades (SHSU)

LT Trevor Goosby - 44 snaps
1 pressure allowed
1 false-start penalty
DEEP DIG GRADE: 80

LG Connor Stroh - 44 snaps
No disruption allowed
DEEP DIG GRADE: 79.32

C Conner Robertson - 57 snaps
1 QB pressure, 1 QB hit allowed
1 holding penalty, 1 false-start penalty
2 knockdowns
DEEP DIG GRADE: 76.11

RG DJ Campbell - 44 snaps
1 run-stuff allowed
3 knockdowns
DEEP DIG GRADE: 79.32

RT Brandon Baker - 57 snaps
1 holding penalty
2 pins, 1 knockdown
DEEP DIG GRADE: 79.56

Reserves

LT Jordan Coleman - 11 snaps
No disruption allowed
DEEP DIG GRADE: N/A
LG Neto Umeozulu - 24 snaps
No disruption allowed
DEEP DIG GRADE: 76.67

C Daniel Cruz - 11 snaps
No disruption allowed
DEEP DIG GRADE: N/A

RG Nate Kibble - 24 snaps
1 pressure, 1 run-stuff allowed
1 knockdown
DEEP DIG GRADE: 74.58

RT Nick Brooks - 24 snaps
No disruption allowed
DEEP DIG GRADE: 77.08


OL Grades by Week

Deep-Dig-2025-OL-Grades-by-Week-.jpg


OL Snaps-per-Disruption Allowed (Through Week 4)

Deep-Dig-2025-OL-Snaps-Per-Disruption-3.jpg


OL Snaps-per-Disruption by Week (Cumulative, Post-Week)
Deep-Dig-2025-S_DIS-OL-BY-WEEK-2.jpg


OL Snaps-per-Disruption Allowed (2025) vs. Historical Context
Deep-Dig-2025-OL-Historical-Comparison-2.jpg



2025 OL Inclusions to Historical 80-Plus Point Game List

Deep-Dig-2025-OL-GRADES_WEEK-80-Context-2.jpg


QUICK FINAL THOUGHTS

This was a good game to get a longer look (and sometimes a first look) at some of the depth on the Texas offensive line as Arch Manning and the starters got pulled after two quick series in the second half.

It was, by far, Connor Stroh's best game of his young Texas career, and it would stand to reason considering the opponent. He's likely to continue to grow into his own through the SEC gauntlet, and we could look back at this being his highest-graded game of the season, but in a matchup where that big guy can just lean on smaller, less-skilled opponents and wear them down is exactly the ideal situation for his current skill-set that he would want to dial up. While Neto Umeozulu hasn't been bad (and has actually been at his best since coming to Texas) when getting his own run this season, it's clear that Stroh has sent Neto to the realm of the backups. Stroh's disruption-allowed numbers have, for now, climbed out of the pit of the basement and into reasonable territory, not far off from any other starter not named Trevor Goosby.

And Goosby would have graded out like a monster if not for one pressure allowed and one penalty in this game. Since they only played 44 total snaps among starters (Baker and Robertson stayed in with the twos with Baker moving to LT and Robertson staying at center for 13 more snaps) allowing two acts of disruption brought down Goosby's season-long numbers a good little bit, but otherwise he played very well.

The numbers and the eyeballs continue to clearly show that Brandon Baker is continuing to improve and play at a very high level following a decidedly rocky start against Ohio State in his first start. Even given the fact that he's played one unacceptable game in his first four, his average grade in the Deep Dig over his first four starts (78.07; median 78.94) is not that far off from Kelvin Banks in his first four starts at Texas (79.19; median 79.26). Now, Baker has only played against one elite team (Ohio State) and three bad ones in his first four starting career at Texas, while Banks played one elite team (Alabama), one "good" team (Texas Tech) and two bad ones, but it's still some good early signal on Baker, along with his steady and strong progress in snaps/disruption, going from allowing production once every 11.17 snaps following the Ohio State game, to a cumulative 16.25 following San Jose, to a cumulative 23.33 following UTEP, to now a second-best-on-team cumulative 26.7 following Sam Houston. We can't say that Baker is on a Kelvin Banks trajectory because of the differences in their profiles: Baker is a second-year player while Banks was a true freshman and Baker is playing RT and not LT at this time (although he is clearly being cross-trained there for the future). But we can say that the trajectory is similar and very strong.

Baker's current trajectory is best explained as somewhere less-rocket-fueled than Banks, but probably more like Cam Williams. In Williams' second season, he only had two starts (Kansas State and Texas Tech) and he scored an average Deep Dig grade of 78.24 while allowing disruption once every 27.75 snaps. Williams, of course, also played right tackle like Baker, but did not come into a full-fledged starting role until his third season at Texas, while Baker did so in his second season and also comes with a more impressive recruiting pedigree.

A few other quick notes:

- Cole Hutson has struggled at center, but at this time, Conner Robertson certainly does not look any better.

- Among the backup OL, Nick Brooks is a lot of fun to watch and looks like the most impressive among the group. Nate Kibble has some nice flashes to his game, but also had some blow-ups and graded out as having the worst game versus SHSU.

- We may be crazy, but we like the idea of having Ryan Niblett in a role that reminds you of the previous versions of a Keilan Robinson at RB -- he brings a level of dynamism to a position room at RB that is more chug-along-and-accumulate than slash-and-burn. He's an explosive element that can help and is coming along nicely week after week with more and more highlight plays. His use as an RB this week was cool to see.

- Nick Townsend is about as complete a player you could ask for in a young TE. We would not be surprised if he is the co-starter with Endries by the time the season is over. Just a hellacious get-after-you blocker in space and a terrific athlete.

 

Edited by Hookem2147
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Posted
On 9/23/2025 at 12:32 PM, fellside said:

Some of y'all talk football like Texas is the only team you ever watch and you hate watch every second of it.

Except for 2005 in my lifetime?

giphy.gif

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Posted
44 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

Spoiled below is Alex Dunlap's full OL write-up for SHSU. For those who don't want to go through his entire write-up, here are the grades for the season so far, along with the grading scale he uses.

Deep-Dig-2025-OL-Grades-by-Week-.jpg

Deep-Dig-2021-OL-GRADING-SCALE.jpg

  Hide contents

Here, we'll go over Texas Longhorns offensive snap-count data, offensive line grades, offensive line disruption-allowed statistics, and give historical context about Arch Manning and the Texas Longhorns offense coming out of the Sam Houston State game as they begin to prepare for SEC play.

Click Images to Enlarge

Skill Player Snap Counts and Game-by-Game Percentages of Offensive Snaps (Through Week 4)
Deep-Dig-2025-Skill-Player-Participation-3.jpg



***please note that exact snap-count numbers may differ from other sources at times, as the Deep Dig does not count plays as offensive player snaps that are blown dead due to penalty, punts, extra points, field goals, spiked balls, victory formations, kneel-downs, etc.***

Personnel-Grouping Frequency Overall and by Game (Through Week 4)
Deep-Dig-2025-Personnel-Utilization-by-Game-3.jpg



Tight End Total Snap Counts and Alignment Data (Through Week 4)
Deep-Dig-2025-TE-Usage-Chart-3.jpg



Team Target Share By Week (Through Week 4)
Deep-Dig-2025-Target-Share-By-Game-3.jpg



Deep Dig OL Grading Scale (each snap by each player is graded as its own independent event)
Deep-Dig-2021-OL-GRADING-SCALE.jpg

OL Grades (SHSU)

LT Trevor Goosby - 44 snaps
1 pressure allowed
1 false-start penalty
DEEP DIG GRADE: 80

LG Connor Stroh - 44 snaps
No disruption allowed
DEEP DIG GRADE: 79.32

C Conner Robertson - 57 snaps
1 QB pressure, 1 QB hit allowed
1 holding penalty, 1 false-start penalty
2 knockdowns
DEEP DIG GRADE: 76.11

RG DJ Campbell - 44 snaps
1 run-stuff allowed
3 knockdowns
DEEP DIG GRADE: 79.32

RT Brandon Baker - 57 snaps
1 holding penalty
2 pins, 1 knockdown
DEEP DIG GRADE: 79.56

Reserves

LT Jordan Coleman - 11 snaps
No disruption allowed
DEEP DIG GRADE: N/A
LG Neto Umeozulu - 24 snaps
No disruption allowed
DEEP DIG GRADE: 76.67

C Daniel Cruz - 11 snaps
No disruption allowed
DEEP DIG GRADE: N/A

RG Nate Kibble - 24 snaps
1 pressure, 1 run-stuff allowed
1 knockdown
DEEP DIG GRADE: 74.58

RT Nick Brooks - 24 snaps
No disruption allowed
DEEP DIG GRADE: 77.08


OL Grades by Week

Deep-Dig-2025-OL-Grades-by-Week-.jpg


OL Snaps-per-Disruption Allowed (Through Week 4)

Deep-Dig-2025-OL-Snaps-Per-Disruption-3.jpg


OL Snaps-per-Disruption by Week (Cumulative, Post-Week)
Deep-Dig-2025-S_DIS-OL-BY-WEEK-2.jpg


OL Snaps-per-Disruption Allowed (2025) vs. Historical Context
Deep-Dig-2025-OL-Historical-Comparison-2.jpg



2025 OL Inclusions to Historical 80-Plus Point Game List

Deep-Dig-2025-OL-GRADES_WEEK-80-Context-2.jpg


QUICK FINAL THOUGHTS

This was a good game to get a longer look (and sometimes a first look) at some of the depth on the Texas offensive line as Arch Manning and the starters got pulled after two quick series in the second half.

It was, by far, Connor Stroh's best game of his young Texas career, and it would stand to reason considering the opponent. He's likely to continue to grow into his own through the SEC gauntlet, and we could look back at this being his highest-graded game of the season, but in a matchup where that big guy can just lean on smaller, less-skilled opponents and wear them down is exactly the ideal situation for his current skill-set that he would want to dial up. While Neto Umeozulu hasn't been bad (and has actually been at his best since coming to Texas) when getting his own run this season, it's clear that Stroh has sent Neto to the realm of the backups. Stroh's disruption-allowed numbers have, for now, climbed out of the pit of the basement and into reasonable territory, not far off from any other starter not named Trevor Goosby.

And Goosby would have graded out like a monster if not for one pressure allowed and one penalty in this game. Since they only played 44 total snaps among starters (Baker and Robertson stayed in with the twos with Baker moving to LT and Robertson staying at center for 13 more snaps) allowing two acts of disruption brought down Goosby's season-long numbers a good little bit, but otherwise he played very well.

The numbers and the eyeballs continue to clearly show that Brandon Baker is continuing to improve and play at a very high level following a decidedly rocky start against Ohio State in his first start. Even given the fact that he's played one unacceptable game in his first four, his average grade in the Deep Dig over his first four starts (78.07; median 78.94) is not that far off from Kelvin Banks in his first four starts at Texas (79.19; median 79.26). Now, Baker has only played against one elite team (Ohio State) and three bad ones in his first four starting career at Texas, while Banks played one elite team (Alabama), one "good" team (Texas Tech) and two bad ones, but it's still some good early signal on Baker, along with his steady and strong progress in snaps/disruption, going from allowing production once every 11.17 snaps following the Ohio State game, to a cumulative 16.25 following San Jose, to a cumulative 23.33 following UTEP, to now a second-best-on-team cumulative 26.7 following Sam Houston. We can't say that Baker is on a Kelvin Banks trajectory because of the differences in their profiles: Baker is a second-year player while Banks was a true freshman and Baker is playing RT and not LT at this time (although he is clearly being cross-trained there for the future). But we can say that the trajectory is similar and very strong.

Baker's current trajectory is best explained as somewhere less-rocket-fueled than Banks, but probably more like Cam Williams. In Williams' second season, he only had two starts (Kansas State and Texas Tech) and he scored an average Deep Dig grade of 78.24 while allowing disruption once every 27.75 snaps. Williams, of course, also played right tackle like Baker, but did not come into a full-fledged starting role until his third season at Texas, while Baker did so in his second season and also comes with a more impressive recruiting pedigree.

A few other quick notes:

- Cole Hutson has struggled at center, but at this time, Conner Robertson certainly does not look any better.

- Among the backup OL, Nick Brooks is a lot of fun to watch and looks like the most impressive among the group. Nate Kibble has some nice flashes to his game, but also had some blow-ups and graded out as having the worst game versus SHSU.

- We may be crazy, but we like the idea of having Ryan Niblett in a role that reminds you of the previous versions of a Keilan Robinson at RB -- he brings a level of dynamism to a position room at RB that is more chug-along-and-accumulate than slash-and-burn. He's an explosive element that can help and is coming along nicely week after week with more and more highlight plays. His use as an RB this week was cool to see.

- Nick Townsend is about as complete a player you could ask for in a young TE. We would not be surprised if he is the co-starter with Endries by the time the season is over. Just a hellacious get-after-you blocker in space and a terrific athlete.

 

This would be so much better if his grading scale made any sense. 

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Posted
1 minute ago, Codaxx said:

This would be so much better if his grading scale made any sense. 

He said a while back he learned it from an NFL scout.

I do think it's beneficial that he has used this for 10+ years, so you can compare players and performances. Here are the current season grades vs last year:

Deep-Dig-2025-OL-Grades-by-Week-.jpg

Deep-Dig-2024-OL-Grades-by-Week-.jpg

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Posted

Roster building is a thing. 

If you got to spring camp and had to spend all your money on a transfer QB because your room didn't have any usable parts in it, that's on you. Football is a physical game, and players get hurt frequently. You know the season won't stop until they heal, so just picking 22 starters and deciding that'll get you through the season isn't smart.

 

Posted
10 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

He said a while back he learned it from an NFL scout.

I do think it's beneficial that he has used this for 10+ years, so you can compare players and performances. Here are the current season grades vs last year:

Deep-Dig-2025-OL-Grades-by-Week-.jpg

Deep-Dig-2024-OL-Grades-by-Week-.jpg

How did he arrive at Trevor Goosby getting an 81.32 for TAMU?  Like, what algorithm or formula is used to arrive at that number given some sort of input?

Posted
32 minutes ago, Hookem2147 said:

He said a while back he learned it from an NFL scout.

I do think it's beneficial that he has used this for 10+ years, so you can compare players and performances. Here are the current season grades vs last year:

Deep-Dig-2025-OL-Grades-by-Week-.jpg

Deep-Dig-2024-OL-Grades-by-Week-.jpg

I get it. A scale that essentially goes from 75 to 85 is just not intuitive. How much easier would it be for people if he went 1-10 on his rankings? 

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Posted
3 hours ago, Codaxx said:

This would be so much better if his grading scale made any sense. 

 

 

 

I mean ... he tells you that the "highest graded games" in the HISTORY of the DEEP DIG system came from ...  TOP GUYS like ... JOEL BITONIO!!! And LARRY WARFORD!!!

That says it all!

 

Indiana Jones Conspiracy GIF

 

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Posted

I feel the Texas offense is missing a component. They get shut down against teams with strong DLs. So it was interesting to hear Joel Klatt talking about the Tech offense.

He said he’s in love with what they are doing, that they’ve taken the Leach offense, combined it with the Gus Malzahn running game and the Briles deep game to create an offense that can respond to whatever a defense tries to stop.

I don’t know specifically what that means, but it sounds intriguing and now I want to watch Tech play to see what they are doing. They also won against Utah with a true freshman backup QB who supposedly played great. So it has to be an offense that isn’t too difficult to learn. 

Posted (edited)
30 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

I feel the Texas offense is missing a component. They get shut down against teams with strong DLs. So it was interesting to hear Joel Klatt talking about the Tech offense.

He said he’s in love with what they are doing, that they’ve taken the Leach offense, combined it with the Gus Malzahn running game and the Briles deep game to create an offense that can respond to whatever a defense tries to stop.

I don’t know specifically what that means, but it sounds intriguing and now I want to watch Tech play to see what they are doing. They also won against Utah with a true freshman backup QB who supposedly played great. So it has to be an offense that isn’t too difficult to learn. 

So they run the air raid, hurry up, no huddle gang rape offense?

Edited by Goredho
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Posted
56 minutes ago, Dbeasy said:

I feel the Texas offense is missing a component. They get shut down against teams with strong DLs. So it was interesting to hear Joel Klatt talking about the Tech offense.

He said he’s in love with what they are doing, that they’ve taken the Leach offense, combined it with the Gus Malzahn running game and the Briles deep game to create an offense that can respond to whatever a defense tries to stop.

I don’t know specifically what that means, but it sounds intriguing and now I want to watch Tech play to see what they are doing. They also won against Utah with a true freshman backup QB who supposedly played great. So it has to be an offense that isn’t too difficult to learn. 

That is complaint I see leveled at Sark occasionally. He does not run a college friendly offense. I dont have the playbook or ever been in a meeting, so I am just parroting. I believe Golden mentioned the issues he had learning the system. There are not a ton of easy spread offense stuff in there. Heard a lot of moving parts and adjustments to coverages. It is heavily influenced by the West Coast offense, so there are a ton of timing routes in there. I think that is part of the Wingo/Arch issues. There something going on there. Wingo is at 28 targets for 13 catches and 190 yards. That is 46% and 6.8 yards/target. Livingstone is 15 targets for 11 catches and 232 yards. That is 73% and 15.5 yards/attempt. Endries is 10 targets for 7 catches and 106. That is 70% comp and 10.6 yards/target. I am guessing there is fault on both side of the Arch/Wingo connection, but hard to figure out what exactly the issue is. I think getting that connection to viable level over the bye week would do wonders for the offense. 

(I found those targets using AI, so I am not sure they are 100% accurate.  I could not find Moore.) 

Posted
1 hour ago, Codaxx said:

That is complaint I see leveled at Sark occasionally. He does not run a college friendly offense. I dont have the playbook or ever been in a meeting, so I am just parroting. I believe Golden mentioned the issues he had learning the system. There are not a ton of easy spread offense stuff in there. Heard a lot of moving parts and adjustments to coverages. It is heavily influenced by the West Coast offense, so there are a ton of timing routes in there. I think that is part of the Wingo/Arch issues. There something going on there. Wingo is at 28 targets for 13 catches and 190 yards. That is 46% and 6.8 yards/target. Livingstone is 15 targets for 11 catches and 232 yards. That is 73% and 15.5 yards/attempt. Endries is 10 targets for 7 catches and 106. That is 70% comp and 10.6 yards/target. I am guessing there is fault on both side of the Arch/Wingo connection, but hard to figure out what exactly the issue is. I think getting that connection to viable level over the bye week would do wonders for the offense. 

(I found those targets using AI, so I am not sure they are 100% accurate.  I could not find Moore.) 

I don't really get how you can overthink this so much.

When the quarterback is missing as often as Manning was the first three games - inexplicably so - it's not because of the system. It's because of what's been going on between his ears. It ends up affecting the performance of everyone on offense. Everyone else starts playing tense as well, feeling like they need to be perfect or the offense is going to stall again, and even if they do play perfect, the QB may throw the ball into the stands. Livingstone it can be as simple as they practiced together a ton as the twos last year. As a tight end, Endries routes are different. Maybe there's something to it, but I think it's more about Manning pressing and getting out of rhythm than it is something remarkably complicated about the offense Texas runs, or Manning being some kind of racist QB who loves his white targets. 

Wadlington and Moore from Inside Texas had a film study of a few plays for Sam Houston State where they focused on a simple 9 yard gain to Wingo that's an easy pass and catch. They rightly emphasized it because it's the exact kind of throw Manning has been skipping to his receiver or throwing it over their head. I do not believe Manning is suddenly "cured" but I do know how he performed against Sam Houston - regardless of the level of competition they represented - was a step in the right direction. Now we have to see if he can duplicate it to some degree against a Florida team that is very close to quitting on their season. 

 

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, SL Xpress said:

I don't really get how you can overthink this so much.

When the quarterback is missing as often as Manning was the first three games - inexplicably so - it's not because of the system. It's because of what's been going on between his ears. It ends up affecting the performance of everyone on offense. Everyone else starts playing tense as well, feeling like they need to be perfect or the offense is going to stall again, and even if they do play perfect, the QB may throw the ball into the stands. Livingstone it can be as simple as they practiced together a ton as the twos last year. As a tight end, Endries routes are different. Maybe there's something to it, but I think it's more about Manning pressing and getting out of rhythm than it is something remarkably complicated about the offense Texas runs, or Manning being some kind of racist QB who loves his white targets. 

Wadlington and Moore from Inside Texas had a film study of a few plays for Sam Houston State where they focused on a simple 9 yard gain to Wingo that's an easy pass and catch. They rightly emphasized it because it's the exact kind of throw Manning has been skipping to his receiver or throwing it over their head. I do not believe Manning is suddenly "cured" but I do know how he performed against Sam Houston - regardless of the level of competition they represented - was a step in the right direction. Now we have to see if he can duplicate it to some degree against a Florida team that is very close to quitting on their season. 

T

 

 

what does the complexity of the offense have to do with you responded with?

 

 

Edited by BurntOrange&White
Posted
3 minutes ago, BurntOrange&White said:

 

 

what does the complexity of the offense have to do with you responded with?

 

 

I don't understand the question. I responded to the post.

Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, SL Xpress said:

I don't really get how you can overthink this so much.

When the quarterback is missing as often as Manning was the first three games - inexplicably so - it's not because of the system. It's because of what's been going on between his ears. It ends up affecting the performance of everyone on offense. Everyone else starts playing tense as well, feeling like they need to be perfect or the offense is going to stall again, and even if they do play perfect, the QB may throw the ball into the stands. Livingstone it can be as simple as they practiced together a ton as the twos last year. As a tight end, Endries routes are different. Maybe there's something to it, but I think it's more about Manning pressing and getting out of rhythm than it is something remarkably complicated about the offense Texas runs, or Manning being some kind of racist QB who loves his white targets. 

Wadlington and Moore from Inside Texas had a film study of a few plays for Sam Houston State where they focused on a simple 9 yard gain to Wingo that's an easy pass and catch. They rightly emphasized it because it's the exact kind of throw Manning has been skipping to his receiver or throwing it over their head. I do not believe Manning is suddenly "cured" but I do know how he performed against Sam Houston - regardless of the level of competition they represented - was a step in the right direction. Now we have to see if he can duplicate it to some degree against a Florida team that is very close to quitting on their season. 

 

When you see other starters catching 70% of their targets and 1 below 50%, it stands out. Perhaps I am overthinking it, but it seems incredibly simplistic to say Arch just throws bad balls to Wingo. There is obviously something off between the 2. I wish I knew the answer. Also wish I had the data on Moore as a comparison. 

Edited by Codaxx
Posted

One thing that infuriates me with Wingo is his refusal to use his size and power to body the opposition.  There was a pass in the end zone against SHSU that was a 50/50 ball that Wingo just passively let fall to the ground.  GO UP AND ATTEMPT TO GET THAT FUCKING BALL!

He let Ohio State bully him in the CFP last year on 2-3 straight plays.

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Posted
1 minute ago, Codaxx said:

When you see other starters catching 70% of their targets and 1 below 50%, it stands out. Perhaps I am overthinking it, but it seems incredibly simplistic to say Arch just throws bad balls to Wingo. There is obviously something off between the 2. I wish I knew the answer. 

I think we have a relatively small data set to work with. To me, it just seems like Wingo and Arch weren't on the same page for the first few games. When Wingo was in a good position to catch the ball, Arch threw it at his feet. When Arch threw a catchable ball, Wingo was out of position. 

"Why aren't they on the same page?" is a fair question, but at this point I'm still willing to chock it up to happenstance. If it becomes something we see repeated as the season goes along, then maybe there's more to it. 

Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, Fondren & Main said:

One thing that infuriates me with Wingo is his refusal to use his size and power to body the opposition.  There was a pass in the end zone against SHSU that was a 50/50 ball that Wingo just passively let fall to the ground.  GO UP AND ATTEMPT TO GET THAT FUCKING BALL!

He let Ohio State bully him in the CFP last year on 2-3 straight plays.

He’s an athlete playing WR. He’s just not a good WR

Edited by BurntOrange&White
Posted
1 minute ago, Codaxx said:

When you see other starters catching 70% of their targets and 1 below 50%, it stands out. Perhaps I am overthinking it, but it seems incredibly simplistic to say Arch just throws bad balls to Wingo. There is obviously something off between the 2. I wish I knew the answer. 

He's thrown bad balls to a number of receivers. He's also missed even seeing wide open receivers. If he keeps playing like he did against Sam Houston State we won't have to overthink it so much. If his play against Ohio State, San Jose State for most of 3 quarters, and UTEP shows up again, then we can once again parse his throws as to what is going on. I can tell you what is going on. He's pressing, he's overthinking things, the game is moving too fast for him still, and his mistakes then compound into more mistakes. He's hardly the first person to have this happen to him. The only cure for it is to execute when the moment matters. You do that enough then you earn the confidence to go out and do it again. It's the same in pretty much any avenue of life.

Wingo also needs to catch the catchable balls thrown his way. Same type of concept. 

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