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Adding to the pit bull argument


Beau Vine

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Did this thread not make it over?  (If so, Search sucks.)

Moron owner:

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A San Antonio man is accused of shooting two pit bulls on the city's North Side Friday evening after the dogs allegedly mauled his cat to death.

Victor Senon Valdez, the 38-year-old cat owner, was arrested on suspicion of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon and two counts of animal cruelty following the attack, police said.

 

Jaws, the older dog who was turning six that day, sustained a bullet to the nose. He was taken to VCA Becker Animal Hospital and Pet Resort for treatment and is now recovering at home, though the bullet is still lodged in his body, said his owner, Amanda Espinosa. Jaws' son, Zeus, who was nearly two years old, was shot four to six times and died at the scene, Espinosa said.

"It was a very horrible day," Espinosa told mySA.com, describing it as "dealing with the death of a family member, basically."

 

Valdez could not be reached for comment.

 

For the past two years, Espinosa's good friend and dog walker has been taking her dogs on runs daily, typically along the same route, Espinosa said.

In Espinosa's five years living in the area, neighbors had never complained about the dogs, and neither of the animals had hurt an animal or a person, Espinosa said.

On Friday evening, the dog walker was riding his bike while Jaws and Zeus ran beside him off-leash, according to the police report. Shortly before 6 p.m. near the corner of Schmeltzer Lane and Allena Drive, the two dogs spotted a cat, ran toward it, and mauled it, right outside the cat's home, the dog walker told police.

 

Valdez walked outside his home and asked if the dogs had killed his cat. The dog walker confirmed they had. Valdez then pulled out a gun and pointed it at the dog walker, according to police.

"I'll (expletive) shoot you and those dogs," he allegedly said, before firing the gun multiple times at the animals. The dog walker stepped back, later telling the police he felt his life was in danger.

Jaws was shot in the nose and ran off, leaving a bloody trail, Espinosa said. Zeus was shot multiple times in the torso area while several witnesses ‚ÄĒ including a young girl ‚ÄĒ watched, Espinosa said. The dog walker ran off and found Jaws, and neighbors took them both to the animal hospital.

"My dog walker wasn't being aggressive with the owner at all. There was no anger, no argument, no nothing. It was out of nowhere," Espinosa said. "These dogs are not violent, they're not aggressive. I get it: they're pit bulls and they have a stereotype to go with them. But at the same time, what happened was uncalled for."

Valdez told police he shot the dogs while his pet cat was being mauled in order to save his pet. Witnesses told officers they didn't know whether or not the dogs had killed the cat, but when the cat's owner pulled a gun on them, they were "not actively mauling the cat and (the witnesses) felt the threat of the dogs was not present," according to the police report.

Witnesses still on scene told Espinosa Valdez had picked up Zeus from the street and laid him on his own property, she said. A neighbor called 911 and police were dispatched to the area for a shooting. By the time Espinosa arrived on scene, police were investigating and would not allow her to see Zeus, she said.

Espinosa said neither she nor the neighbors she spoke with had met the man with the gun.

 

In the days since, Espinosa has been trying to care for Jaws. She didn't have enough money to leave him at the animal hospital, so she's treating him on her own, she said. He's having trouble breathing, but is otherwise in stable condition.

"He's trying to do things like he normally does, but of course he has restrictions so it's kind of hard," she said. "He's a little depressed because he knows his fun is not allowed any more."

She’s raising money through a GoFundMe campaign in the hopes of removing the bullet that’s still lodged in his body.

 

She told her two young daughters that one of their dogs ran away and the other was hit by a car, she said. She's still trying to figure out how to explain the blood-trail left by Jaws.

Her words to other dog owners? Leash your dogs.

"I know it's wrong to have them off leashes and I regret not having them on the leash," Espinosa said. "People should not think that the city's being a little bit too dramatic about the leash law because it's not just for (the dogs') own good, but it's for their owners good because otherwise you have to deal with something like this. It's not a good feeling, and if I'd just had them on leashes maybe this wouldn't have happened. Maybe."

https://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local/crime/article/Police-investigating-after-San-Antonio-family-s-13272049.php#photo-7369168

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Had a run-in with a pit bull this past summer. 

Neighbor's pit chewed a hole through their fence.  They're across the alley, so I'd neither met them nor knew that they were out of town at the time.  I didn't even know it was a pit bull.  I started to walk across my front yard to tell them their dog was out and the effer charged at me.  I probably yelled like a little girl as I sprinted back inside.  It got within about a foot of my leg before I got to my front door.  Cops came but couldn't do anything about it as the dog had retreated back inside the fence.

Next evening, the dog got out again.  This time it was still early in the evening.  My house backs against a park and their were several children on the playground.  I called the cops, got my gun, and parked my truck in the alley between where the dog was running around and the kids.  I was really, really praying that the dog would stay put and that I wouldn't have to use the gun.  (I was actually trying to line up trajectory angles so the bullets would not end up through someone's front window.)  Luckily, the cops got there soon after and removed the dog.  Happy ending as the dog was returned after the hole was fixed.

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1 hour ago, Knoxtnhorn said:

Had a run-in with a pit bull this past summer. 

Neighbor's pit chewed a hole through their fence.  They're across the alley, so I'd neither met them nor knew that they were out of town at the time.  I didn't even know it was a pit bull.  I started to walk across my front yard to tell them their dog was out and the effer charged at me.  I probably yelled like a little girl as I sprinted back inside.  It got within about a foot of my leg before I got to my front door.  Cops came but couldn't do anything about it as the dog had retreated back inside the fence.

Next evening, the dog got out again.  This time it was still early in the evening.  My house backs against a park and their were several children on the playground.  I called the cops, got my gun, and parked my truck in the alley between where the dog was running around and the kids.  I was really, really praying that the dog would stay put and that I wouldn't have to use the gun.  (I was actually trying to line up trajectory angles so the bullets would not end up through someone's front window.)  Luckily, the cops got there soon after and removed the dog.  Happy ending as the dog was returned after the hole was fixed.

A happy ending would have been had you shot that mofo dead. That was your chance. I would move if I were you. 

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CSB: Buddy of mine had a pit bull that killed a 500 lb bull while visiting his parents’ country place. Dad was mad. Dog survived only because son stood between dad’s gun and the dog. Dog later killed a couple cats that wandered into buddy’s backyard. Also killed an off leash dog while buddy was walking around the neighborhood with pit bull on a leash. Pit Bull’s name was Fred. 

Bernard

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3 hours ago, ernest_t_bass said:

A pit bull did this.  Pit bull ded.

https://imgur.com/a/6v794Wv 

That's my biggest problem with them. They're just too fucking dangerous. A normal dog doesn't just go around attacking horses like that. And a 500lb bull? Holy fuck! And what stupid motherfucker takes pits out on a jog off leash? That is just asking for trouble. And I would be team shooter were it not for the fact that he lied that he shot during the attack. I'm no cat lover, actually I very much dislike those nasty things, but if it was in it's own yard then I think the man would have been justified in capping both dogs to protect his pet. 

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Why would someone want a breed that is despised by so many people who otherwise love dogs? I understand the tough guy owner or the fact that some people self-identify with a breed that - in their mind - is misunderstood and rejected. I’m asking why normal people would want one. 

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1 hour ago, ImissWallyPryor said:

Why would someone want a breed that is despised by so many people who otherwise love dogs? I understand the tough guy owner or the fact that some people self-identify with a breed that - in their mind - is misunderstood and rejected. I’m asking why normal people would want one. 

Owning the toughest dog on the block has got to be the appeal for the majority of owners.  I think the rest would be people that truly believe it's not the dog it's the owner and are attempting to prove that point.  I feel the majority of dog owners are shitty owners anyways so they would still fail even if it that adage were true.

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1 hour ago, ImissWallyPryor said:

Why would someone want a breed that is despised by so many people who otherwise love dogs? I understand the tough guy owner or the fact that some people self-identify with a breed that - in their mind - is misunderstood and rejected. I’m asking why normal people would want one. 

I agree with you completely.

I also have a friend who has a pit bull.  She insists that he's such a sweet dog. 

I'm like, "You've been to my house and met my dogs." 

"Oh, yes, he's as sweet as them." 

"So then why didn't one like them instead of a dog that has a non-zero chance of snapping and mauling you?"

She didn't like that. 

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All dogs can be sweet.  Why pit owners think pits being sweet is more special than any other breed is beyond me.  Outside of their intimidating looks and build there isn't anything special about a pit that isn't duplicated in countless other breeds.

Edited by Gene Parmesan
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2 hours ago, NotActuallyALonghorn said:

Some folks use them as catch dogs for hog hunting, but that is more of a legitimate purpose than just having them as pets.

CSB: My ex-brother in law used to breed pits for hog hunting, sold a lot of them, too. His favorite male used to go over to his neighbor's property and fuck with the cows. He'd latch onto their snouts/necks and the cows would try like hell to fling him off, neighbor hated him (rightly so). He lost almost all of his teeth doing this and catching hogs, they just loosened over time and fell out. They had to soak his food in water so he could eat. 

 

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44 minutes ago, Gene Parmesan said:

All dogs can be sweet.  Why pit owners think pits being sweet is more special than any other breed is beyond me.  Outside of their intimidating looks and build there isn't anything special about a pit that isn't duplicated in countless other breeds.

Pits are ugly.

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1 hour ago, Sandman said:

CSB: My ex-brother in law used to breed pits for hog hunting, sold a lot of them, too. His favorite male used to go over to his neighbor's property and fuck with the cows. He'd latch onto their snouts/necks and the cows would try like hell to fling him off, neighbor hated him (rightly so). He lost almost all of his teeth doing this and catching hogs, they just loosened over time and fell out. They had to soak his food in water so he could eat. 

 

Was hoping that ended with neighbor shooting the dog, at the very least. 

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6 minutes ago, bluto said:

Was hoping that ended with neighbor shooting the dog, at the very least. 

Ex-BIL said the neighbor hated him and the dog, threatened to shoot the dog on more than one occasion. So either he was a smooth talker or a smooth cocksucker, because the dog eventually died of old age. 

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As usual, whole lot of dumb going on in the story and in the thread so I'll just stick to the points. 

Dumbass dog owner not having dogs on leashes, regardless of breed. 

Dumbass dog owner proceeds to play victim card for their stupidity. 

Dumbass cat owner letting their cat live outside. Be prepared to have bad shit happen when you let your pet roam freely. Case in point your dead fucking cat. 

Dumbass cat owner shoots up neighborhood for something he could've prevented. Disregarding who was outside or where those bullets end up (4-6 shots to kill any 1 thing is wayyy too many and you know he had to fire more than that.)

Irresponsible pet owners know no breed. You hear more about pit bulls in a negative light because that's what has grabbed the public's and media's attention ever since Michael Vick. 

You don't have to be a Billy badass or some emotional weirdo to own a pit. They're great dogs who unfortunately are owned by a lot of dumbasses.

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9 minutes ago, BigHorn'13 said:

As usual, whole lot of dumb going on in the story and in the thread so I'll just stick to the points. 

Dumbass dog owner not having dogs on leashes, regardless of breed. 

Dumbass dog owner proceeds to play victim card for their stupidity. 

Dumbass cat owner letting their cat live outside. Be prepared to have bad shit happen when you let your pet roam freely. Case in point your dead fucking cat. 

Dumbass cat owner shoots up neighborhood for something he could've prevented. Disregarding who was outside or where those bullets end up (4-6 shots to kill any 1 thing is wayyy too many and you know he had to fire more than that.)

Irresponsible pet owners know no breed. You hear more about pit bulls in a negative light because that's what has grabbed the public's and media's attention ever since Michael Vick. 

You don't have to be a Billy badass or some emotional weirdo to own a pit. They're great dogs who unfortunately are owned by a lot of dumbasses.

So much wrong in this post

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19 hours ago, Bernard said:

CSB: Buddy of mine had a pit bull that killed a 500 lb bull while visiting his parents’ country place. Dad was mad. Dog survived only because son stood between dad’s gun and the dog. Dog later killed a couple cats that wandered into buddy’s backyard. Also killed an off leash dog while buddy was walking around the neighborhood with pit bull on a leash. Pit Bull’s name was Fred. 

Bernard

Your buddy is a huge asshole.

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15 minutes ago, bluto said:

Here weeee gooooooo! 

 

Seriously, Michael Vick stuff is what started the pit stigma? Every article I've seen traces it to the 80s.

Nope. Just saying that event is how the majority of people came to learn of pitbulls and formulated their opinions based on what they saw and heard thereafter. 

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10 hours ago, ImissWallyPryor said:

Why would someone want a breed that is despised by so many people who otherwise love dogs? I understand the tough guy owner or the fact that some people self-identify with a breed that - in their mind - is misunderstood and rejected. I’m asking why normal people would want one. 

Normal people don't want them. Normal people don't take chances with animals that have been bred to kill.

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3 hours ago, BigHorn'13 said:

You hear more about pit bulls in a negative light because that's what has grabbed the public's and media's attention ever since Michael Vick. 

Click my link.  That pit didn't do that in the name of Michael Vick.  That pit, who I saw at one time as a slight-aggressive dog, decided that he'd like to go ape on my horses.  Fuck the entire breed.  I don't care if a pit saves my child, I will still want it dead. 

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3 hours ago, BigHorn'13 said:

As usual, whole lot of dumb going on in the story and in the thread so I'll just stick to the points. 

Dumbass dog owner not having dogs on leashes, regardless of breed. 

Dumbass dog owner proceeds to play victim card for their stupidity. 

Dumbass cat owner letting their cat live outside. Be prepared to have bad shit happen when you let your pet roam freely. Case in point your dead fucking cat. 

Dumbass cat owner shoots up neighborhood for something he could've prevented. Disregarding who was outside or where those bullets end up (4-6 shots to kill any 1 thing is wayyy too many and you know he had to fire more than that.)

Irresponsible pet owners know no breed. You hear more about pit bulls in a negative light because that's what has grabbed the public's and media's attention ever since Michael Vick. 

You don't have to be a Billy badass or some emotional weirdo to own a pit. They're great dogs who unfortunately are owned by a lot of dumbasses.

The fact that people have to offer qualifiers for pit bulls and their owners says a lot. There is no need for apologists for labs or retrievers because bad labs or retrievers are rare.

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16 minutes ago, ImissWallyPryor said:

The fact that people have to offer qualifiers for pit bulls and their owners says a lot. There is no need for apologists for labs or retrievers because bad labs or retrievers are rare.

Au contraire, those Lab bastards are always jumping all over you, in your face, licking it, and viciously wagging their tails......

 The REAL black, brown and yellow menace in this country !!!!!

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4 hours ago, Chewbacca said:

Your buddy is a huge asshole.

Why? For saving the dog from a shotgun blast? Because the dog killed cats that came into his fenced backyard uninvited? For walking his dog on a leash as required by City of Houston ordinance? For not saving someone else's unleashed dog in a fight that lasted like three seconds?

For the record, the bull kicked the dog in the head before the dog went straight murderous. 

Also the record. I'm no fan of pit bulls. I don't think they are any more aggressive than other dog breeds. Any dog can bite you when provoked. The problem with pit bulls is their bites are often fatal. 

Bernard 

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2 minutes ago, Bernard said:

Why? For saving the dog from a shotgun blast? Because the dog killed cats that came into his fenced backyard uninvited? For walking his dog on a leash as required by City of Houston ordinance? For not saving someone else's unleashed dog in a fight that lasted like three seconds?

For the record, the bull kicked the dog in the head before the dog went straight murderous. 

Also the record. I'm no fan of pit bulls. I don't think they are any more aggressive than other dog breeds. Any dog can bite you when provoked. The problem with pit bulls is their bites are often fatal. 

Bernard 

All fair points, then you lost me at, not a more aggressive breed than other dogs.  Their rate of attacks, and or bites would tend to counter that argument a bit.

 

 

 

Edited by Onboard 2.0
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