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UT Pro-Palestine Protest Thread


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Just now, BabaYaga said:

Just leave them alone?  Ignore them?  Shit, if you want to get creative build "protective barriers" around them, see how it takes one to break ranks and have to take a growler.  

Nope, they bring in riot geared cops holding batons because they cannot tolerate speech that they disagree with. 

This is what early stage fascism looks like

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Who could have seen that coming? All they had to do was let them protest last week. If they started to camp out, try to move them later in the evening. If they refuse, just accept that they aren't causing much harm, and the academics should step in and let them know they've been heard but cant camp overnight. If that doesn't work, let them tire themselves out. Unless and until there is violence, let them be for fucks sake. The only violence is coming from the response. 

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This is what they brought the riot cops out for?

bafkreib2zc7q4qgf35bsqqzrezwl6eeh5bjpfzj

The way you know that this is what the cops really signed up for is that if it wasn't, they'd all be ashamed to be dressed like they're going into fucking Fallujah. 

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Do what the employees at the Porsche plant in Germany did.  Eco-group broke in and glued their hands to the floor, so Porsche just ignored them wrapped up the day, turned off the lights and left.  Protestors who flummoxed, eventually needed the police because their hands were fucked from the glue and no bathrooms, and then tried to turn around and sue Porsche for "how they were treated".

Hopefully the case was laughed away into the trashcan.   

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CNN saying UT might close the campus. Um, right before finals? Over 50 people? What about the dorms? Um sorry, you have to move out.

Again, we did larger rallies for Students for Nader, the Latin American Students group, etc.

What have been planned is a sister protest at the LBJ, McCombs, etc. DPS would get lost and end up attacking UTPD.

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2 minutes ago, InkaUtexas said:

CNN saying UT might close the campus. Um, right before finals? Over 50 people? What about the dorms? Um sorry, you have to move out.

Again, we did larger rallies for Students for Nader, the Latin American Students group, etc.

What have been planned is a sister protest at the LBJ, McCombs, etc. DPS would get lost and end up attacking UTPD.

For fucks sake

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1 minute ago, InkaUtexas said:

CNN saying UT might close the campus. Um, right before finals? Over 50 people? What about the dorms? Um sorry, you have to move out.

Again, we did larger rallies for Students for Nader, the Latin American Students group, etc.

What have been planned is a sister protest at the LBJ, McCombs, etc. DPS would get lost and end up attacking UTPD.

I know many folks consider all cops evil, but I've had encounters with UTPD twice in the past several days moving into/out of meetings in buildings that were on "lockdown."  And they have been very respectful, non-confrontational, and professional.  Obviously that could all change, but I found them both times to be wanting to show their presence but not be in anybody's space intimidating them.  DPS, on the other hand has been an absolute shitshow.  They are just rolling up the last 3 times looking to start shit like somebody's looting Dobie Mall or something.  completely unnecessary.  /rant 

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2 minutes ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

It's the tents/encampment that's the issue right? I could see a slippery slope if tents are allowed to stay up where it got out of control quick.

Then rope them off.  Here's your "space" and right to protest.  And when it's 90 and sunny, and you start to wilt like a fucking flower and your buddies no longer want to bring you starbucks and uber eats, then you can figure this out for yourself.  After a day or two, that group's going be rather "ripe"

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1 minute ago, chainsaw said:

Damn some of you really hate having to see people express viewpoints you disagree with. "Rope them off?"

Jesus man, take the joke.  Give them their space but contain it and shut off the "slippery slope" argument before it can be thrown out.  Then just leave them alone.  They're not doing anything that should really bother anyone

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Just now, Frank Drebin said:

 

 

They are correct.

You know who said so?  The Legislature and the Governor.  We the Motherfucking People.  It is a public space, they are allowed - by both a statute and the First Amendment - to peacefully assemble and express their views there, subject only to reasonable time, place, and manner restrictions like a curfew (no overnight camping).  That's the whole fucking point.  It IS "our lawn."  All of us. Which includes them.

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3 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

It's not a slippery slope.  If the reasonable rule is "no overnight camping, including structures like tents," and overnight starts at 10:00 pm., then you tell the folks there that they're free to conduct their activities till 10, then they'll need to clear out.  And we're asking them to do it nicely.  Y'all can come back and do it all over again starting at 8:00 am tomorrow.

If it hits 10, and they aren't clearing out, then tell them one final time, then clear them out.

This shit isn't hard.  It's only hard if you want to go full-on fascist because you don't like their viewpoint.

I agree - in this case the “reasonable rule” was no tents ever right? I mean i guess it can be debated if it was reasonable but everyone knew what the “red line” was going to be. 

I think it’s dumb and you should just let students protest, i would be curious if the people they are pulling out so far at the ones that were criminally trespassed (the non-students from last week). 

Edited by hornbri
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3 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

They are correct.

You know who said so?  The Legislature and the Governor.  We the Motherfucking People.  It is a public space, they are allowed - by both a statute and the First Amendment - to peacefully assemble and express their views there, subject only to reasonable time, place, and manner restrictions like a curfew (no overnight camping).  That's the whole fucking point.  It IS "our lawn."  All of us. Which includes them.

The University of Texas has articulated a list of other rules besides no overnight camping.  Including no tents.  And no masks.  Whether those are reasonable time, place, and manner restrictions will likely determine, in a court, the lawfulness of removing/arresting any of these individuals who are violating these rules.

Edited by Frank Drebin
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1 minute ago, Frank Drebin said:

There are other rules besides no overnight camping.  Including no tents.  And no masks.  Whether those are reasonable time, place, and manner restrictions will likely determine, in a court, whether removing/arresting these individuals is lawful.

So now there is a rule that they "can't" wear masks?  Is that for identification purposes?  Not surgical masks, right?

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3 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

It's not a slippery slope.  If the reasonable rule is "no overnight camping, including structures like tents," and overnight starts at 10:00 pm., then you tell the folks there that they're free to conduct their activities till 10, then they'll need to clear out.  And we're asking them to do it nicely.  Y'all can come back and do it all over again starting at 8:00 am tomorrow.

If it hits 10, and they aren't clearing out, then tell them one final time, then clear them out.

This shit isn't hard.  It's only hard if you want to go full-on fascist because you don't like their viewpoint.

The tents are against the rule at all time unless pre-approved: https://secure4.compliancebridge.com/utexas/public/getdoc.php?file=8-1050

In this case the tents are obviously being used to escalate the situation into more than a peaceful protest knowing they will get the police to show up to remove them.

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Just now, hornbri said:

I agree - in this case the “reasonable rule” was no tents ever right? I mean i guess it can be debated if it was reasonable but everyone knew what the “red line” was goin got be. 

Right and let's not pretend if the rule was Brisket's "reasonable rule" of 10PM cut-off, then this same thing wouldn't be happening at 10PM.   They got what they wanted. 

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17 minutes ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

It's the tents/encampment that's the issue right? I could see a slippery slope if tents are allowed to stay up where it got out of control quick.

What is it with the sudden fear of tents? 

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2 minutes ago, BabaYaga said:

So now there is a rule that they "can't" wear masks?  Is that for identification purposes?  Not surgical masks, right?

Plenty of courts have upheld a state actors right to prohibit masks or disguises in public spaces.  Some of the earliest cases were to prevent KKK members from wearing hoods to shield their identity and to make it difficult to identify lawbreakers among those lawfully protesting.

The University of Texas has said wearing masks in protests violates University policy.

https://www.texastribune.org/2024/04/24/ut-austin-israel-hamas-war-palestine-student-arrests/

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Just now, Frank Drebin said:

Plenty of courts have upheld a state actors right to prohibit masks or disguises in public spaces.  Some of the earliest cases were to prevent KKK members from wearing hoods to shield their identity and to make it difficult to identify lawbreakers among those lawfully protesting.

The University of Texas has said wearing masks in protests violates University policy.

https://www.texastribune.org/2024/04/24/ut-austin-israel-hamas-war-palestine-student-arrests/

I wear a daily mask of decency and intelligence, but this boards knows otherwise.....

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8 minutes ago, Frank Drebin said:

The University of Texas has articulated a list of other rules besides no overnight camping.  Including no tents.  And no masks.  Whether those are reasonable time, place, and manner restrictions will likely determine, in a court, the lawfulness of removing/arresting any of these individuals who are violating these rules.

Got it -- had not seen the strict "no tents, no masks" rules.  And yes, the challenge would have to be to those rules in particular.

The no masks/no concealing your identity is an interesting discussion.  I am surprised that our current leadership would put that in place, being that it would put some of their preferred groups at risk.  But then, I strongly suspect the policy will only be enforced when the State doesn't like the content of the speech.  That is, the rules are pretextual, and not applied in a content-neutral fashion.  We shall see.

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3 minutes ago, Brisketexan said:

Well, from what I have learned from my reading of Surly, people will have sex in them.  Sex tents are the scourge of our time.

Guys, guys, guys, if I stay here it's totally going to finally happen....

image.png.a075e8897ba81159e2edc96db4db1ae5.png

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5 minutes ago, Skipper said:

Right and let's not pretend if the rule was Brisket's "reasonable rule" of 10PM cut-off, then this same thing wouldn't be happening at 10PM.   They got what they wanted. 

And the point has been that you can't arrest someone for a violation that hasn't actually occurred yet. Destroying a protest on the grounds that someone might violate a rule is fundamentally immoral and unconstitutional. 

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Just now, Brisketexan said:

Got it -- had not seen the strict "no tents, no masks" rules.  And yes, the challenge would have to be to those rules in particular.

The no masks/no concealing your identity is an interesting discussion.  I am surprised that our current leadership would put that in place, being that it would put some of their preferred groups at risk.  But then, I strongly suspect the policy will only be enforced when the State doesn't like the content of the speech.  That is, the rules are pretextual, and not applied in a content-neutral fashion.  We shall see.

If they can prove the regulations are not content neutral, then a court will strike them down.

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Just now, crash_davis said:

Fuck Abbott. Fuck DPS. Fuck these protesters. Fuck Israel. Fuck Hamas. Fuck everyone who's an asshole. So tired of everyone looking for reasons to be assholes.

If these fucking protests even hint at shutting down graduation, I'm going dress up in DPS gear and beat some motherfuckers.

That's the spirit!

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9 minutes ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

In this case the tents are obviously being used to escalate the situation into more than a peaceful protest knowing they will get the police to show up to remove them.

Wow. Today I learned that tents = escalatory. Gee, I would have thought the riot police and arrests last week were the escalating factor. But no, turns out, it is Coleman.

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Just now, Dahobbs said:

And the point has been that you can't arrest someone for a violation that hasn't actually occurred yet. Destroying a protest on the grounds that someone might violate a rule is fundamentally immoral and unconstitutional. 

Well that wasn't actually the rule.  That was Brisket's interpretation of what a reasonable rule would be.  The actual rule (dating back to at least 2012 apparently) is no tents.  So the rule WAS violated.  Intentionally of course.  So they could escalate this shit for media attention.  

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3 minutes ago, Skipper said:

Well that wasn't actually the rule.  That was Brisket's interpretation of what a reasonable rule would be.  The actual rule (dating back to at least 2012 apparently) is no tents.  So the rule WAS violated.  Intentionally of course.  So they could escalate this shit for media attention.  

It is pretty questionable whether "no tents" ever on a public forum is a reasonable restriction. More to the point, I've seen a photo of maybe 1 tent from last week. Enforcing the rule is removing the tent and maybe the person who put it up. Not kicking out everyone. I get that you don't like their speech. I get that you don't like these students. I don't get how you don't give a fuck about a pretty blatant and violent violation of civil rights. 

Edited by Dahobbs
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5 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

It is pretty questionable whether "no tents" ever on a public forum is a reasonable restriction. More to the point, I've seen a photo of maybe 1 tent from last week. Enforcing the rule is removing the tent and maybe the person who put it up. Not kicking out everyone. I get that you don't like their speech. I get that you don't like these students. I don't get how you don't give a fuck about a pretty blatant and violent violation of civil rights. 

But we are talking about that happened today right? There were clear tents on campus today and it is clear they did that today to escalate the situation. Maybe now that tent question will get answered in court. 

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8 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

Wow. Today I learned that tents = escalatory. Gee, I would have thought the riot police and arrests last week were the escalating factor. But no, turns out, it is Coleman.

 

5 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

It is pretty questionable whether "no tents" ever on a public forum is a reasonable restriction. More to the point, I've seen a photo of maybe 1 tent from last week. Enforcing the rule is removing the tent and maybe the person who put it up. Not kicking out everyone. I get that you don't like their speech. I get that you don't like these students. I don't get how you don't give a fuck about a pretty blatant and violent violation of civil rights. 

The protesters encircled the tents and chained tables together to protect the encampment. They knew exactly what they were doing. Credit to them as it worked exactly as they hoped it would.

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2 minutes ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

 

The protesters encircled the tents and chained tables together to protect the encampment. They knew exactly what they were doing. Credit to them as it worked exactly as they hoped it would.

so...assholes. Fuck them.

I hope Abott and DPS unleash hell. And fuck them too.

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1 minute ago, Dahobbs said:

 More to the point, I've seen a photo of maybe 1 tent from last week. Enforcing the rule is removing the tent and maybe the person who put it up. Not kicking out everyone. I get that you don't like their speech. I get that you don't like these students. I don't get how you don't give a fuck about a pretty blatant and violent violation of civil rights. 

Look at the picture from today dude.  They made a lame little tent city and encircled it locking arms.   They could have easily protested within the stated parameters and chose not to.  It was a fucking strategy.  At least see it for what it is.

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5 minutes ago, hornbri said:

But we are talking about that happened today right? There were clear tents on campus today and it is clear they did that today to escalate the situation. Maybe now that tent question will get answered in court. 

fine, we'll get opaque tents

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