Michael Cohen Investigation

[Gil Bang 25509]

He just hired Lanny Davis

 

Yeah, the Clinton Admin guy

 

[Hugo Stiglitz 23245]

 

[David Dennison 17660]

Can we do something about Seth Davis?

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

Making the rounds on Facebook now. Baerwald is one of the founders of the Tuesday Night Music Club, the Sheryl Crow rode to fame and then crushed beneath her stiletto heels. (I think it was Baerwald who once called her "the toughest whore in Babylon.") 

 

Anyway, here's his anecdote. No reason to think he's lying, IMO:

 

Only in New York. Last night, walking up 58th St with Hillary Bratton. Hillary says, hey look, there’s Michael Cohen. Sure enough, there he is, looking relaxed in a loose, collarless shirt, with I think his mother, another woman in her forties, and a tall, bald man in spectacles. We exchanged eye contact but didn’t exchange words. A couple of hours later we’re walking down Park Ave, and there he is again. So Hillary and I say, “well, once is peculiar, but twice is destiny” Then this happened.
ME: I beg your pardon, sir.

He turns to look at me, a little nervous.

ME: I never do this kind of thing, but we keep on running into each other, and this feels like destiny. It must be strange for you, finding yourself suddenly so central to our national debate.

COHEN: You got that right.

ME: It must feel like you’re in the spin cycle of an industrial washing machine.

He concurred.

ME: Well, I just want to say that the hopes and prayers of America are with you. We hope you’ll do the right thing.

COHEN: The truth will set me free.

ME: That’s exactly right. The truth will set you free. Eventually.

COHEN: The Zen Buddhists say, “There are three things in the world. The trees, the sun, and the truth.

ME: That is so true. Ultimately all we have is the truth. And it will set us free.

COHEN: The truth will set us free.

ME: The hopes and prayers of America are with you. I’m sure you will do the right thing.

COHEN: I will.

ME: It’s an amazing opportunity to help to liberate us from this national debacle.

COHEN: The more you run away from the truth, the more people call you a liar.

ME: The more you run away from the truth, the more you are a liar.

COHEN: Touché.

ME: Well, I hope you enjoy the rest of your evening, and good luck to you.

COHEN: Thank you, you too.

It was a very friendly encounter. Hillary and I got a coffee after that.

ME: He’s gonna flip on Trump, sooner rather than later
HILLARY: I can’t believe you just did that.

PS The woman who I think was his mother agreed with me.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23245]

Michael Cohen can spill the fucking beans to the American people anytime he wants if he cared about anyone but himself.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23245]

Does Barack Obama still have a law license?  

Maybe he can represent Michael Cohen to get Trump to go ballistic?

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

1 hour ago, jimmyjazz said:

Baerwald is a fantastic songwriter, and a bit of a weirdo.  He lived in Austin for awhile.  I'm friends with one of the other Tuesday Night Music Club guys, and they're all a little off-center.  I never got a real good feel that what they say about Sheryl is the complete truth.  This "encounter" with Cohen seems right in line with plenty of other fanciful shit I've read by those guys.

That Hillary Hatton chick backed him up, FWIW. 

[jimmyjazz 45055]

6 minutes ago, MaybeACoordinator said:

That Hillary Hatton chick backed him up, FWIW. 

No doubt, but look at the "dialog".  Who speaks like that?  

I'm sure they ran into Cohen and had a general "I hope you do the right thing for America" exchange.  Beyond that, it seems like a bad script.

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

1 minute ago, jimmyjazz said:

No doubt, but look at the "dialog".  Who speaks like that?  

I'm sure they ran into Cohen and had a general "I hope you do the right thing for America" exchange.  Beyond that, it seems like a bad script.

I've been around weirdos all my life and I've seen many conversations as wacky as that. 

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

It just seems stranger that he would be able to make all that shit up than for it not to be true. But you know the guy and I don't, so who knows. And really it doesn't make a shit until Cohen sings, or doesn't. 

[jimmyjazz 45055]

No, I don't know Baerwald, I've barely met him.  I know one of his bandmates.  Baerwald was famously reclusive in his time here.

[TwiceHorn 30715]

I've seen the ants.  They have a good time.

 

Curious conversation.

[retread 2951]

 

[Hornius Emeritus 12332]

I can't see Michael Cohen quoting Zen Buddhists.

 

[Blotto 23227]

24 minutes ago, Hornius Emeritus said:

I can't see Michael Cohen quoting Zen Buddhists.

 

I'd give Cohen +300 odds on whether or not he can spell Zen correctly.

[MaybeACoordinator 8349]

33 minutes ago, Hornius Emeritus said:

I can't see Michael Cohen quoting Zen Buddhists.

 

I haven't looked it up, but I bet he is perfectly capable of incorrectly quoting some shit he read in HS, back when smoked weed and was still and idealist.  

[Ted Lange 15827]

 

[Gil Bang 25509]

On 7/5/2018 at 4:00 PM, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Does Barack Obama still have a law license?  

Maybe he can represent Michael Cohen to get Trump to go ballistic?

no.  he's "retired" according to the IL state bar.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23245]

19 minutes ago, Ted Lange said:

 

I fucking hate this bullshit.  Michael Cohen is a POS that is only out to save his own skin.  

[Chad Fuck 17259]

4 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

I fucking hate this bullshit.  Michael Cohen is a POS that is only out to save his own skin.  

Well if he can take out the whole rotten house, that'd make it not necessarily all good, but as close as we could get.   I'd be willing to let him keep some skin for that.

[Gil Bang 25509]

cross post 

 

 

 

[DDD Dad 14060]

Lordy.  There are tapes.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23245]

26 minutes ago, Gil Bang said:

 

 

Edited July 20, 2018 by Hugo Stiglitz

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

26 minutes ago, Gil Bang said:

cross post 

 

 

 

That communication would be very much core atty-client privileged under any normal analysis.  

 

Whatever exception / exclusion they are using must be very broad.

[zork 629]

5 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

 

 

Edited July 20, 2018 by zork

[Pig Bellmont 8637]

 

[Gil Bang 25509]

5 minutes ago, SuingToGetAMessageBoard? said:

That communication would be very much core atty-client privileged under any normal analysis.  

 

Whatever exception / exclusion they are using must be very broad.

if they're discussing diverting campaign funds?

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

Just now, Gil Bang said:

if they're discussing diverting campaign funds?

yeah, i guess i don't know the context of the conversation.  also, as pig bellmont just posted, it can't be too broad if thousands of things are still being treated as privileged.

[Hugo Stiglitz 23245]

2 minutes ago, Gil Bang said:

if they're discussing diverting campaign funds?

Seems like the crime-fraud exception would be at play here. 

[Brisketexan 103148]

12 minutes ago, Pig Bellmont said:

 

Not unusual.  That's perhaps a bit above a normal hit-rate for a court deciding that a privilege doesn't apply, but it doesn't shock the conscience.

8 minutes ago, Gil Bang said:

if they're discussing diverting campaign funds?

 

5 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Seems like the crime-fraud exception would be at play here. 

But THAT would be unusual and interesting.  We'll see what it shakes out to be.

[Paul Wesley 3273]

(not an attorney)

Yeah, that was my reaction too.  Seems like if there was even passing reference to the campaign, then a credible case could be made that campaign finance laws come into play.   But I don't know.  Maybe Trump's defense is that he routinely pays off all kinds of women whether running for office or not  (which is probably true).

[Ghost of LL 15225]

I can't imagine the circumstances in which I would record a conversation with a client.  That right there is a tip-off that things aren't really on the up-and-up.

[SmokeyTheBear 5551]

Giuliani made a statement and says there are other recordings and that the FBI has them. Trumps words on hearing about this latest revelation was that he wasn't aware he was recording and that "I can't believe he is doing this to me."

[Texas73 419]

Just now, SmokeyTheBear said:

Giuliani made a statement and says there are other recordings and that the FBI has them. Trumps words on hearing about this latest revelation was that he wasn't aware he was recording and that "I can't believe he is doing this to me."

Get the popcorn. This gonna get good.

[zork 629]

3 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

I can't imagine the circumstances in which I would record a conversation with a client.  That right there is a tip-off that things aren't really on the up-and-up.

Aren't the laws on it different here in Texas vs NY? (reportedly a one party vs two party rule, or something)  What if the law in Texas was like it is in NY on recording a conversation?  Would it change your opinion on it even if you wouldn't do it?

[Mojo Hand 4580]

4 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

I can't imagine the circumstances in which I would record a conversation with a client.  That right there is a tip-off that things aren't really on the up-and-up.

It's kind of like in Office Space, where Peter says that not all chicks would have a threesome for a million bucks, and Lawrence says "Well the kind of chicks that'd double up on a dude like me do."    Most lawyers wouldn't do this, but the kind of lawyers who would be Trump's fixer sure would. 

[SuingToGetAMessageBoard? 3861]

 Yeah. Different strokes for different folks. I can see you recording a client if the client was incredibly erratic and claimed he didn’t say what he just said. I can think of someone involved in this news story that meets that description. 

[Nice Guy Eddie 13269]

Trump must be livid about this.  He must have had hundreds of conversations with Cohen that he wouldn't want broadcast.  

[SmokeyTheBear 5551]

More than likely, Trump knew he was recording everything (if not requested it). The shock is that Cohen didn't burn the recordings before the FBI raided. 

[deech 2222]

[shnsajax 3589]

This is currently the lead on every news site except for one, which is no surprise. And of course they aren't even covering it at all. 

[Ghost of LL 15225]

9 minutes ago, zork said:

Aren't the laws on it different here in Texas vs NY? (reportedly a one party vs two party rule, or something)  What if the law in Texas was like it is in NY on recording a conversation?  Would it change your opinion on it even if you wouldn't do it?

What?  No--it has nothing to do with that.  It has everything to do with the fiduciary duty that a lawyer owes to his client.  The only possible reason to record someone is if you anticipate using it against him/her in the future.  And as a lawyer with a fiduciary duty to my client, I can't even contemplate creating evidence to use against my client in the future.

With respect to Suing's scenario, I have had occasion in which a client took a course of action that I thought unwise.  In that case, I've written a letter saying, "my advice is to do X, and here are the consequences of doing Y."  But I would never record my client on the telephone telling me about how he was going to do Y.  That goes way above the standard covering of the lawyer's ass.

Edited July 20, 2018 by Ghost of LL

[SmokeyTheBear 5551]

1 minute ago, shnsajax said:

This is currently the lead on every news site except for one, which is no surprise. And of course they aren't even covering it at all. 

It's that whole Fair and Balanced strategy. When everyone states something, they do the opposite...thus balancing the narrative. 

[Tuco 5003]

She was paid by the LLC that Cohen set up, right?  If Cohen had recorded Trump saying how he would fund that LLC to reimburse Cohen, regardless if is was campaign funds, would that be privileged?  This is more than a lawyer giving advice and set up a contract for Trump to directly pay the other party.  It seems more like accounting business records, which, considering the case likely revolves around the bank fraud with that LLC, would be pertinent to the case. 

 

[Bozo_Casanova 25501]

Giuliani made a statement and says there are other recordings and that the FBI has them. Trumps words on hearing about this latest revelation was that he wasn't aware he was recording and that "I can't believe he is doing this to me."

Source?

[jimmyjazz 45055]

2 minutes ago, Ghost of LL said:

What?  No--it has nothing to do with that.  It has everything to do with the fiduciary duty that a lawyer owes to his client.  The only possible reason to record someone is if you anticipate using it against him/her in the future.  And as a lawyer with a fiduciary duty to my client, I can't even contemplate creating evidence to use against my client in the future.

With respect to Mojo's scenario, I have had occasion in which a client took a course of action that I thought unwise.  In that case, I've written a letter saying, "my advice is to do X, and here are the consequences of doing Y."  But I would never record my client on the telephone telling me about how he was going to do Y.  That goes way above the standard covering of the lawyer's ass.

Would your position change if your client knew and approved of the recordings?  (Not saying that's what happened here with Cohen, I don't know.)

[Nice Guy Eddie 13269]

1 minute ago, SmokeyTheBear said:

It's that whole Fair and Balanced strategy. When everyone states something, they do the opposite...thus balancing the narrative. 

Fox News will eventually cover it but when it comes to Trump, I imagine their mgmt team has a meeting to discuss the impact including pissing off Trump.  Even they can't ignore something forever.

[Ghost of LL 15225]

2 minutes ago, jimmyjazz said:

Would your position change if your client knew and approved of the recordings?  (Not saying that's what happened here with Cohen, I don't know.)

That's one of those courses of action that would prompt me to send one of those CYA letters.

[SmokeyTheBear 5551]

9 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

Source?

Cnn anchors were reading the statement out live. Waiting for link to be published. 

[Tuco 5003]

12 minutes ago, Tuco said:

She was paid by the LLC that Cohen set up, right?  

 

Nevermind...I'm getting my covert payoffs confused.  McDougall was paid off by the Enquirer.  According to Giuliani. the recordings don't indicate Trump knew ahead of time.