It’s coaching vs we need new players thread

[WinningIsHard 4002]

52 minutes ago, pacman said:

You don't get blown out 102 to 27, in the second half of 4 straight comeback losses, due to your players.

That thompson pick 6 against Ok state was the scheme? Worthy giving the ball to oklahoma on the kickoff was Banks? Moore dropping those TD passes was coleman? Jerrin Thompson getting butt fucked in the hole by caleb williams is on gideon? There's 81 to 62 now in about 5 plays big boy. 

 

I forgot to subtract the total I gave back to horns for our coaches not being able to teach simple things like don't throw to the other team, tackle the qb in the hole when you're holding him already, and never just hand the ball to the other team on the kickoff. These corches suck, am I right? 

 

Edited November 8, 2021 by WinningIsHard
math is hard

[Codaxx 5552]

40 minutes ago, RaysBoomBoomRoom said:

"Our Coaches Suck"

 

I have watched Foster 7 times and I cant stop laughing. That is the most amazing display of a tackle attempt I have ever seen. 

[WinningIsHard 4002]

7 minutes ago, mdmost said:

What exactly is 25 doing there? Throwing his entire body at Breece Hall to try to stop him?

His leg gets caught up in our LB being manhandled by an iowa state player who according to this board is worse than everybody we have. The BJ foster we signed out of high school is long gone my friend, and now we have a bulkier, slower shell of a 5 star safety. PK's fault no doubt, sigh. 

[texasstrong12 4668]

2 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

I have watched Foster 7 times and I cant stop laughing. That is the most amazing display of a tackle attempt I have ever seen. 

Foster is excruciating to watch. He costs us 7 to 10 points a game just based on the fact he can't tackle. 

These are the type players people will argue "have talent". Big sigh. 

[WinningIsHard 4002]

5 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

I have watched Foster 7 times and I cant stop laughing. That is the most amazing display of a tackle attempt I have ever seen. 

I can't tell for sure but I think that's Jaylan Ford who is getting treated like a 1 star LB. That's the guy who I've read about ad nauseam on here should be starting over brockermeyer because he's more athletic. Hard to confirm but whoever it is that trips foster is fucking useless. I find it hard to believe that Choate is teaching our LB's to sit back on their heels and accept punishment from blockers. lol 

[pacman 7282]

18 minutes ago, WinningIsHard said:

That thompson pick 6 against Ok state was the scheme? Worthy giving the ball to oklahoma on the kickoff was Banks? Moore dropping those TD passes was coleman? Jerrin Thompson getting butt fucked in the hole by caleb williams is on gideon? There's 81 to 62 now in about 5 plays big boy. 

 

I forgot to subtract the total I gave back to horns for our coaches not being able to teach simple things like don't throw to the other team, tackle the qb in the hole when you're holding him already, and never just hand the ball to the other team on the kickoff. These corches suck, am I right? 

 

You edited your post and didn't take out the very first question?

I stopped reading there since that pick six was in the 1st half.

Go home, you're too emotional to talk with the adults.

Epic self-own. You editing to post the Theranos gif makes it pure gold.

Edited November 8, 2021 by pacman

[Codaxx 5552]

2 minutes ago, WinningIsHard said:

I can't tell for sure but I think that's Jaylan Ford who is getting treated like a 1 star LB. That's the guy who I've read about ad nauseam on here should be starting over brockermeyer because he's more athletic. Hard to confirm but whoever it is that trips foster is fucking useless. I find it hard to believe that Choate is teaching our LB's to sit back on their heels and accept punishment from blockers. lol 

I dont even comment on the LBs anymore, that play is now my expectation for them. 

[WinningIsHard 4002]

1 minute ago, pacman said:

You edited your post and didn't take out the very first question?

I stopped reading there since that pick six was in the 1st half.

Go home, you're too emotional to talk with the adults.

Epic self-own.

Well played sir, my apologies for not being an adult on surly. Oh the irony 

[Droopy 2623]

I know Sark didn't want this to be a rebuild, at least not publically, but that is what he has. I take issue if he saw it and didn't temper expectations, but he also was hired in January and didn't get to really view the team until the Spring. That still should have been enough time to get into the portal to get some need positions filled. "All Gas. No Brakes." is a nice thought, but we just don't have the guys we need to build any type of team worthy of competing. 

To me this team has a leadership problem. It starts with the head coach for sure, but you also need guys on the field that can echo that leadership during the games and keep guys accountable. This is where you see Texas fail during the games. Sark gets them ready for that first half during prep and practices, but the players just go out flat AF during the game and they have a loser mentality that kills their drive at the first sign of adversity. You could feel it in the Cotton Bowl and you can feel it every game since. Like a dude that just started taking boner pills, our (team) confidence is at 0. 

Casey Studdard pointed out something this morning that is also troubling. The fact that our Oline has no perceivable attitude about the game or the person they are playing against whatsoever cannot even be described as football. Those guys are supposed to be nasty and fired up to be blocking for a "Heisman" like RB in Bijan, but they seem to not give a shit. Team full of pride-less pussies, ready to get pushed around and prodded until they turn into a broken dam allowing free reign. How those guys walk into the football complex and aren't embarrassed to show their faces is beyond me. 

[texasstrong12 4668]

Just now, WinningIsHard said:

I can't tell for sure but I think that's Jaylan Ford who is getting treated like a 1 star LB. That's the guy who I've read about ad nauseam on here should be starting over brockermeyer because he's more athletic. Hard to confirm but whoever it is that trips foster is fucking useless. I find it hard to believe that Choate is teaching our LB's to sit back on their heels and accept punishment from blockers. lol 

Our defense is just completely devoid of talent. It's sad to watch really. 

Cook has been pretty good this year. Overshown might be the most overrated player on the team-athletic player than can make plays but he's just as likely to run himself out of a play as he is to make a positive play. I would say Ojomo has been somewhat consistent but he's nothing spectacular. 

I don't think there's a single NFL caliber player currently on this defense unless one of the FR shows flashes in the next couple of years. Overshown is going to get drafted purely based on athletic traits but he's a total flip of the coin based on the film. Somebody might take Ojomo in the late rounds. 

 

[westexhorn 2005]

13 minutes ago, Codaxx said:

I have watched Foster 7 times and I cant stop laughing. That is the most amazing display of a tackle attempt I have ever seen. 

he tripped off a foot of someone i think

[DanTheHorn 4884]

It the coaching. We got here due to coaching:

and things have not improved due to coaching.

We all have seen how good coaching makes a significant difference in a small amount of time. Robinson fixed things mid stream for god sake. If the talent can perform for a half and then can't after adjustments it is coaching most of all. Better players are needed to win championships but they should not be needed to win you 9 games in this conference. Good coaching should get you to nine wins with what we got.

Edited November 8, 2021 by DanTheHorn

[Had Enough 2033]

Didn’t much see any lineman eating up blocks. It’s a small sample of the clips that are shown but damn if every one doesn’t show opposing olinemen with free releases to the next level.

Foster got tripped but at least the safeties are semi-aggressively heading towards the ball carrier.

[Yankee 39]

Team definitely lacks player leadership, and Sark seems to be more a player friendly coach than a drill Sargent. Was it Herman that made the team mentally stronger or Sam? Seemed like Ro was the only player getting mad on Saturday. So maybe it is the wrong coach for this team, or wrong players for this coach.

[alphahorn 1637]

5 hours ago, Codaxx said:

There is a bit of a disconnect with Nahlin. He continues to say the LBs are fast and finesse players that need to be kept clean to run and make plays. At the same time he rails against the DL for 2 gapping and holding up blockers, which he said is necessary for the LBs to play well.  Texas has at least one very athletic LB and he claims that Brock was clocked at the highest MPH amongst the LBs, so I am not sure why he is saying the LBs are unathletic at this point. They are just bad at LB play. They dont read their keys. Bare minimum for any defender is protecting your gap. You can be a very good defense if every player just gets a C and protects his gap. They dont even do that. Ovie is a train wreck on setting the edge. On any given play I will bet that Ovie gets hooked and pinned inside or is 5 yards up the field opening up a huge gap for the RB. 

I hear as saying high IQ, which is Brock and athletic which is O, unfortunately neither contain both

[HtownHorn 14395]

Bob Stoops lost 5 games in 1st season. He lead in 4 of those losses, and got outscored 117 to 39 after taking the biggest lead of the game. Surly would have been calling for his head after Tech.

Edited November 8, 2021 by HtownHorn

[HtownHorn 14395]

2 hours ago, RaysBoomBoomRoom said:

"Our Coaches Suck"

 

I don't know what if funnier, Foster getting leg whipped by his team mate or Schooler's superman dive and slide at the end. The crazy part is Schooler made that fucking tackle.

[Dark Horse 2257]

Schooler led the fucking team with 12 tackles, that’s all that really needs to be said about our defense. 

[hookem48 4630]

18 hours ago, Had Enough said:

Overall, you are likely correct but didn’t they use a trick play for a 50 yard TD in the second half? Sometimes you need a perfectly timed play call.

And the Breece Hall TD run was a pretty great call. No idea whether they’d run that previously. It should have been stopped for 10 yards though.

After that, we were broken. That was more likely to happen easier after the last 3 games. The offense wasn’t doing Jack then the defense wilted.

if you want to say running a trick play is making halftime adjustments go ahead.

[bullet 1596]

3 hours ago, Dark Horse said:

Schooler led the fucking team with 12 tackles, that’s all that really needs to be said about our defense. 

I keep reading on the game threads about how bad Schooler is, but he is the one who makes the open field tackles.

[Rockethorn1978 6061]

4 hours ago, HtownHorn said:

Bob Stoops lost 5 games in 1st season. He lead in 4 of those losses, and got outscored 117 to 39 after taking the biggest lead of the game. Surly would have been calling for his head after Tech.

We need to stop bringing up other coaches as our example. Since Charlie I’ve heard about Saban first season and dabo and now stoops. It’s the kiss of death apparently. When we find the guy we won’t be needing to compare him to hall of fame coaches. 

[Knighthawk 284]

23 minutes ago, bullet said:

I keep reading on the game threads about how bad Schooler is, but he is the one who makes the open field tackles.

ISU was targeting schooler all game.  Weak link.  

[Knighthawk 284]

5 hours ago, HtownHorn said:

Bob Stoops lost 5 games in 1st season. He lead in 4 of those losses, and got outscored 117 to 39 after taking the biggest lead of the game. Surly would have been calling for his head after Tech.

This was my take after the ou game … predicted a big run next year just like ou.   Really long odds with our o line and qb at this point.  Maybe Ewers puts it back in play?

[Doc Reeves 6434]

3 minutes ago, Knighthawk said:

This was my take after the ou game … predicted a big run next year just like ou.   Really long odds with our o line and qb at this point.  Maybe Ewers puts it back in play?

Nope.

it’s gonna be warm beer in a can for Longhorns in ‘22

[alphahorn 1637]

7 hours ago, Droopy said:

I know Sark didn't want this to be a rebuild, at least not publically, but that is what he has. I take issue if he saw it and didn't temper expectations, but he also was hired in January and didn't get to really view the team until the Spring. That still should have been enough time to get into the portal to get some need positions filled. "All Gas. No Brakes." is a nice thought, but we just don't have the guys we need to build any type of team worthy of competing. 

To me this team has a leadership problem. It starts with the head coach for sure, but you also need guys on the field that can echo that leadership during the games and keep guys accountable. This is where you see Texas fail during the games. Sark gets them ready for that first half during prep and practices, but the players just go out flat AF during the game and they have a loser mentality that kills their drive at the first sign of adversity. You could feel it in the Cotton Bowl and you can feel it every game since. Like a dude that just started taking boner pills, our (team) confidence is at 0. 

Casey Studdard pointed out something this morning that is also troubling. The fact that our Oline has no perceivable attitude about the game or the person they are playing against whatsoever cannot even be described as football. Those guys are supposed to be nasty and fired up to be blocking for a "Heisman" like RB in Bijan, but they seem to not give a shit. Team full of pride-less pussies, ready to get pushed around and prodded until they turn into a broken dam allowing free reign. How those guys walk into the football complex and aren't embarrassed to show their faces is beyond me. 

Sark cannot air it publicly or to his team that he has a rebuild on his hands.  But, I'd be shocked if he didn't tell CDC this is a fucking dumpster fire he was left and to not expect big things the first couple of years. Hell I would have said that to CDC under almost any circumstance let alone being bequeathed this unflushed toilet of a roster

Edited November 9, 2021 by alphahorn

[WinningIsHard 4002]

42 minutes ago, Rockethorn1978 said:

We need to stop bringing up other coaches as our example. Since Charlie I’ve heard about Saban first season and dabo and now stoops. It’s the kiss of death apparently. When we find the guy we won’t be needing to compare him to hall of fame coaches. 

Those examples are so this petulant bratty ass fan base understands that it doesn’t always look good or even serviceable at first. That stoops example is great but we aren’t going 13-0 next year like he did lol. I’ll admit that. Rhule, Aranda, hell even Matt Campbell and Jimbo were given a chance to put their system in place, took some awful lumps and it worked out. We hire a guy, see something bad and shit on the coach. If herman hadn’t gone off the rails maybe we give him a chance to mature and become a good head coach. He fucked that up and didn’t let us even try the patient approach lol. Let’s try the patient approach this time maybe? 

[Rockethorn1978 6061]

12 minutes ago, WinningIsHard said:

Those examples are so this petulant bratty ass fan base understands that it doesn’t always look good or even serviceable at first. That stoops example is great but we aren’t going 13-0 next year like he did lol. I’ll admit that. Rhule, Aranda, hell even Matt Campbell and Jimbo were given a chance to put their system in place, took some awful lumps and it worked out. We hire a guy, see something bad and shit on the coach. If herman hadn’t gone off the rails maybe we give him a chance to mature and become a good head coach. He fucked that up and didn’t let us even try the patient approach lol. Let’s try the patient approach this time maybe? 

I don’t think we’ve knee jerk with strong who got 3 years and Herman who got 4 years. That’s not being patient? We know sark isn’t getting fired we are worries with 4 straight losses and second half no adjustment meltdowns. You can be the guy and show improvement through a full season and not get worse literally every game with the same mistakes over and over. 

[WinningIsHard 4002]

9 minutes ago, Rockethorn1978 said:

I don’t think we’ve knee jerk with strong who got 3 years and Herman who got 4 years. That’s not being patient? We know sark isn’t getting fired we are worries with 4 straight losses and second half no adjustment meltdowns. You can be the guy and show improvement through a full season and not get worse literally every game with the same mistakes over and over. 

We fired Mack thinking we had saban, then made a splash hire in chuckles. We pursued urban which went public immediately and then fired herman and went with option B. I don’t think strong, herman, or sark were real coaching search hires. My point is all 3 of those guys need longer than 3 or 4 years to figure out how to coach Texas but we aren’t patient enough for that kind of long game. TCU did it with Patterson, leach at tech, Snyder at k-state. Those guys had ROUGH years but they also had some damn good ones. Given the talent difference we are able to acquire maybe just maybe a long term coach could work itself out. It’s maddening that we hire guys who aren’t ready and when they prove they aren’t ready we fire them lol. 

[Fletch 5798]

Cross post but it seems more appropriate here 

In regards to shit talent mixed with shit coaching. We have no fucking talent outside of a handful of guys. Our o line is 2014 bad. Our safeties and our “linebackers” are so fucking bad they make Scott Derry and Marcus Griffin look like first round picks. Our db’s are terrible. We can’t tackle. We can’t block a 3 man front on passing downs. Casey has gotten significantly worse throughout the year. Our tight ends are a net negative. But sark and co haven’t done a single fuckin thing to help these dudes out. I could’ve lived with a 7-5 year as long as we showed progress and  fight and no quit and and clear week to week mechanics improvement. But nope. Haven’t gotten any of that. Then losing 4 straight, all of which we had leads at halftime, then play like complete shit in the in the 2nd half for us to choke the game away. So yeah. We have shitty talent and shitty coaches. 
 

This whole bull shit argument is so fucking stupid

“It’s shit talent!”

”No!!! It’s shit coaching!!!”

Its possible for it to be both and it appears to be that way right now 

[Longboard Horn 40006]

On 11/7/2021 at 7:17 PM, Grandioso said:

Same question for UH’s roster, UTSA, and SMU. What is their recruiting edge?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

SMU's is the transfer portal. They own it!

[MonkeyDoughnut 10098]

11 hours ago, bullet said:

I keep reading on the game threads about how bad Schooler is, but he is the one who makes the open field tackles.

Agree, and It's the fact he hadn't played on the defensive side of the ball since freshman year yet we need him to convert from his WR role and start on our "veteran" defense and lead in tackled that should be a sign as to the talent we are lacking.

[hpslugga 4026]

On 11/7/2021 at 3:19 PM, RaysBoomBoomRoom said:

Easiest thing to do is simply ask yourself who on our team would start at UGA,BAMA, or Ohio State? Pretty simple

Hell, dial it back and ask yourself who starts for OU or OSU. There are players who would, but I’ll tell you who it’s not. It’s literally none of the interior players on either side of the ball. If anyone was watching this OL and thought “oh this is just Greg Davis squandering talent all over again,” one would be living in Bizarro World.

We’re watching a fairly mobile QB getting constantly harassed almost every time he drops back (which is what’s led him to do his best impressions of Patrick Mahomes when he runs around and forces some ball into coverage) and literally the best RB in the country not being able to spring into the second level because there’s nowhere for him to go. I said it a while ago on one of my Grading threads, but I’ve never seen such a contrast in talent than what we see here between the offensive skill players and the offensive linemen. 

[Thatguy 8393]

3 hours ago, hpslugga said:

Hell, dial it back and ask yourself who starts for OU or OSU. There are players who would, but I’ll tell you who it’s not. It’s literally none of the interior players on either side of the ball. If anyone was watching this OL and thought “oh this is just Greg Davis squandering talent all over again,” one would be living in Bizarro World.

We’re watching a fairly mobile QB getting constantly harassed almost every time he drops back (which is what’s led him to do his best impressions of Patrick Mahomes when he runs around and forces some ball into coverage) and literally the best RB in the country not being able to spring into the second level because there’s nowhere for him to go. I said it a while ago on one of my Grading threads, but I’ve never seen such a contrast in talent than what we see here between the offensive skill players and the offensive linemen. 

  This post is pretty solid!

 

   I really do not know why everyone is losing their minds here when its pretty cut and dry whats happening.

 

1) O-line cannot hold blocks for any decent amount of time. Someone almost always comes free quickly. Bijan is a big part of the problem too.

2) QBs have been getting popped all season and they are in full PTSD mode.

3) Our two best receivers are less than 170lbs, and need longer routes to get free from physical defenders. This circles back to the line struggling to block leading to QBs already giving up on the play when the receivers come free.

4) We get stoned at snap and cannot get blockers to the second level on the line. OZ works for a quarter or so and then teams adjust and it starts creating negative plays.

5) D-line is slow and fat. We used to have tall physically imposing dudes who struck fear in opponents and could run you down sideline to sideline. Now our D-line struggles with anything requiring them to redirect.

6)The back end of the defense is OK, but is being asked to defend for way too long due to not being able to get pressure on the QB. You can be aggressive if you know you only have to cover for 3 seconds. Not when every play the opposing QB is running around free back there like Aaron Rodgers.

7) LBs are being asked to do too much and thus failing. D-line is not eating up blocks so LBs are having to fight through blocks to get home. This causes them to guess a lot to avoid people getting hands on them. They guess wrong and we are here bitching, but if they were kept clean they would be adequate.

 

    And even though we have all these problems if we just had Sam here we would've still won a lot of those games down the stretch. I don't think people appreciate how tough Sam was and how much fight he had in him. He willed us to wins in a lot of games and fought to the end in the ones we lost. That's the biggest loss in all of this. Sam was really good. Too bad he couldn't of played for us right after Colt. We would kept rolling with him.

Edited November 9, 2021 by Thatguy

[Dbeasy 14931]

These are the 247 Composite Ratings of the 2 deep for Iowa State

[alphahorn 1637]

2 hours ago, Dbeasy said:

These are the 247 Composite Ratings of the 2 deep for Iowa State

Now show Bama's, oh wait, I guess all 5*/5*

[Js1 84995]

Awful lots of 3s and even a 2 in there for the Texas Longhorns. 

[texasstrong12 4668]

Look at the OL and DL comparisons for Flood and Bo Davis prior to Texas. 

Kyle Flood's OL before Texas for non-Alabama teams: 

Rutgers '15 (31st sack rate)

Rutgers '14 (22nd sack rate)

Kyle Flood at Texas: 

Texas '21 (102nd sack rate)

I would take the Rutgers OL under Flood in a heartbeat over our OL. 

Bo Davis DL before Texas for non-Alabama teams:

UTSA '17 (39th sack rate)

Bo Davis DL at Texas: 

Texas '21 (118th in sack rate)

This is obviously a small sample but go look at the '17 UTSA DL. Davenprt was a 1st round pick and better than anything we have on the DL. Kevin Strong JR has been in the NFL. I would take either of these guys over anyone on our DL. Yes, UTSA in '17 had a more talented DL than our current DL under Bo Davis. 

Bo Davis has been great at getting to the QB everywhere he's been. Kyle Flood has been great in pass pro everywhere he's been. Out of nowhere they all of sudden suck at both..... who do you think the problem is? Rutgers OL (under Flood) and UTSA's DL (under Davis) were more talented than our current position groups-it's sad but the truth. You can blame the sack rate numbers on Kwiatkowski's scheme, I guess, but Davis had no issue getting to the QB with Golding as the DC at UTSA who runs a fairly conservative D. 

Explain to me how Bo Davis and Kyle Flood can produce better position groups at UTSA and Rutgers? How does that not scream the current roster sucks? 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 9, 2021 by texasstrong12

[Slacks 6787]

On 11/7/2021 at 3:43 PM, Blotto said:

our losses this year are to Ark, OU, OSU, and Baylor, not UGA OSU or Bama (although they would rape us as well)

247 team rankings
	Tex	Ark	OU	OSU	Baylor
2021	15	25	10	30	41
2020	8	29	12	40	50
2019	3	23	6	38	35
2018	3	45	9	34	29
2017	25	27	8	38	40
Average	10.8	29.8	9	36	39

 

That consensus was largely acheived on UT message boards, and means exactly jack shit with zero games coached. 

YGo look at the OL from those classes and see who is playing now.

As I've already done...

F a rank.

[LTtxfan 48823]

Fuckin' Awesome -- Thanks for this @Burntcowboy   

Josh fuckin' nails it: 

 "What can I do for the team"  vs  "What can TEXAS do for me"

Too many "Brand" focused players -- not enough "Ball" focused players

 

 

Edited November 10, 2021 by LTtxfan

[Nuthn2CHere 34]

I originally posted this in the wrong thread:

I’m not even sure this is possible but there are recruiting service gurus on this site so it’s worth a shot…could we take this year’s roster and put players back through the class calculators from the years they were signed in order to see what kind of class rankings we actually would have had if the class was composed of just the guys left on the roster? Might give a much better indication of how under talented we actually are…

I get sick of my Tech family saying how Texas always gets the best recruits and we lose with five stars blah blah blah…the talent on this roster is very obviously sub par, especially on the offensive line. We are much closer to TCU level talent than Ohio State, despite the recruiting rankings saying otherwise over the past five seasons.

The notion that we do less with more is so fucking old and a tired idea. We do about how you would expect given middling talent with actual bad talent along the o line. We have two really talented players as best I can tell.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[KeysPhoneWallet 807]

We need better players in key spots: Offensive line,
Schooler and linebackers not named overshown, defensive lineman expected to generate pass rush.

Defensive scheme/play calling is coaches. We should be fabricating some pass rush but we don’t. We give up these bullshit wear down plays that kill our second halves too


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[Eggo 3974]

15 hours ago, alphahorn said:

Now show Bama's, oh wait, I guess all 5*/5*

I know this is a popular narrative amongst those who want to paint with broad strokes, but Alabama has one 5* o-lineman on their 2 deep. 

 

Pos	Player 1	Recruit Rate	Player 2	Recruit Rate
OFFENSE
WR-X	Metchie III, John JR	4	Hall, Agiye FR	4
WR-Z	Williams, Jameson JR/TR	4	Holden, Traeshon SO	4
WR-H	Bolden, Slade RS JR	3	Earle, JoJo FR	4
LT	Neal, Evan JR	5	Kight, Amari RS SO	4
LG	Cohen, Javion SO	4	Brown, Tommy RS JR	4
OC	Dalcourt, Darrian JR	4	Owens, Chris RS SR	4
RG	Ekiyor Jr., Emil RS JR	4	Roberts, Jaeden FR	4
RT	Owens, Chris RS SR	4	Randolph, Kendall RS SR	4
TE	Latu, Cameron RS JR	4	Tennison, Major RS SR	4
QB	Young, Bryce SO	5	Tyson, Paul RS SO	4
RB	Robinson Jr., Brian RS SR	4	Williams, Roydell SO	4

[westexhorn 2005]

1 minute ago, Eggo said:

I know this is a popular narrative amongst those who want to paint with broad strokes, but Alabama has one 5* o-lineman on their 2 deep. 

 

Pos	Player 1	Recruit Rate	Player 2	Recruit Rate
OFFENSE
WR-X	Metchie III, John JR	4	Hall, Agiye FR	4
WR-Z	Williams, Jameson JR/TR	4	Holden, Traeshon SO	4
WR-H	Bolden, Slade RS JR	3	Earle, JoJo FR	4
LT	Neal, Evan JR	5	Kight, Amari RS SO	4
LG	Cohen, Javion SO	4	Brown, Tommy RS JR	4
OC	Dalcourt, Darrian JR	4	Owens, Chris RS SR	4
RG	Ekiyor Jr., Emil RS JR	4	Roberts, Jaeden FR	4
RT	Owens, Chris RS SR	4	Randolph, Kendall RS SR	4
TE	Latu, Cameron RS JR	4	Tennison, Major RS SR	4
QB	Young, Bryce SO	5	Tyson, Paul RS SO	4
RB	Robinson Jr., Brian RS SR	4	Williams, Roydell SO	4

lot of those 4 star guys are probably 0.97-0.98.  Borderline 5 stars vs 0.89

[Eggo 3974]

42 minutes ago, westexhorn said:

lot of those 4 star guys are probably 0.97-0.98.  Borderline 5 stars vs 0.89

Do you even bother to check before you say things? Mean OL rating is .93, median is .93. Same is true for the whole Offense 2-deep.

Their starting LG is .89, starting RT .92. Their backup RT is officially listed as a TE. 

 

Biggest difference you can spot between our OL roster is depth. Alabama has 20 OL on the roster, mostly 4* and capable of playing. 

Texas only has 17 OL, many 3*, and few ready for action. 

Edited November 10, 2021 by Eggo

[Codaxx 5552]

On 11/8/2021 at 2:10 PM, HtownHorn said:

I don't know what if funnier, Foster getting leg whipped by his team mate or Schooler's superman dive and slide at the end. The crazy part is Schooler made that fucking tackle.

I know the list of what is the most annoying thing about Texas football is a long one, but the soft play outside is absolutely killing me. Somehow Texas CBs have velcro jerseys and get manhandled by WRs on outside runs. Opposing CBs are lathered in grease and Texas WRs slip off of them constantly. This is another great example of that re-occurring theme. 

[hornchaud 4]

2 hours ago, Eggo said:

I know this is a popular narrative amongst those who want to paint with broad strokes, but Alabama has one 5* o-lineman on their 2 deep. 

 

Pos	Player 1	Recruit Rate	Player 2	Recruit Rate
OFFENSE
WR-X	Metchie III, John JR	4	Hall, Agiye FR	4
WR-Z	Williams, Jameson JR/TR	4	Holden, Traeshon SO	4
WR-H	Bolden, Slade RS JR	3	Earle, JoJo FR	4
LT	Neal, Evan JR	5	Kight, Amari RS SO	4
LG	Cohen, Javion SO	4	Brown, Tommy RS JR	4
OC	Dalcourt, Darrian JR	4	Owens, Chris RS SR	4
RG	Ekiyor Jr., Emil RS JR	4	Roberts, Jaeden FR	4
RT	Owens, Chris RS SR	4	Randolph, Kendall RS SR	4
TE	Latu, Cameron RS JR	4	Tennison, Major RS SR	4
QB	Young, Bryce SO	5	Tyson, Paul RS SO	4
RB	Robinson Jr., Brian RS SR	4	Williams, Roydell SO	4

^^^^THIS

And the tired narrative of "well we had a good class, but where are they now?"  What team has an intact recruiting class from 3 years ago on the 2-deep? 

Missing on evaluations, failure to develop, medical retirements happen at EVERY.DAMN.PROGRAM.  This is not something unique to Texas.  The issue here is the neverending focus on the skill positions in an era where the offense and defense are built from the inside-out.  Alabama has very mediocre skill position players this season, but continues to perform at a high level because of their line experience.  Notice they have exactly ONE sophomore (and no FR) on their starting OL.  

It's understandable that being "O-line U" isn't as glamourous as "DB U" or "QB U," but having a 5* RB means nothing if they can't get out of the backfield.  SEC teams have figured out how to recruit and develop the lineman.  Texas has not.

[Thatguy 8393]

2 hours ago, Eggo said:

I know this is a popular narrative amongst those who want to paint with broad strokes, but Alabama has one 5* o-lineman on their 2 deep. 

 

Pos	Player 1	Recruit Rate	Player 2	Recruit Rate
OFFENSE
WR-X	Metchie III, John JR	4	Hall, Agiye FR	4
WR-Z	Williams, Jameson JR/TR	4	Holden, Traeshon SO	4
WR-H	Bolden, Slade RS JR	3	Earle, JoJo FR	4
LT	Neal, Evan JR	5	Kight, Amari RS SO	4
LG	Cohen, Javion SO	4	Brown, Tommy RS JR	4
OC	Dalcourt, Darrian JR	4	Owens, Chris RS SR	4
RG	Ekiyor Jr., Emil RS JR	4	Roberts, Jaeden FR	4
RT	Owens, Chris RS SR	4	Randolph, Kendall RS SR	4
TE	Latu, Cameron RS JR	4	Tennison, Major RS SR	4
QB	Young, Bryce SO	5	Tyson, Paul RS SO	4
RB	Robinson Jr., Brian RS SR	4	Williams, Roydell SO	4

 

2 hours ago, westexhorn said:

lot of those 4 star guys are probably 0.97-0.98.  Borderline 5 stars vs 0.89

 

2 hours ago, Eggo said:

Do you even bother to check before you say things? Mean OL rating is .93, median is .93. Same is true for the whole Offense 2-deep.

Their starting LG is .89, starting RT .92. Their backup RT is officially listed as a TE. 

 

Biggest difference you can spot between our OL roster is depth. Alabama has 20 OL on the roster, mostly 4* and capable of playing. 

Texas only has 17 OL, many 3*, and few ready for action. 

 

11 minutes ago, hornchaud said:

^^^^THIS

And the tired narrative of "well we had a good class, but where are they now?"  What team has an intact recruiting class from 3 years ago on the 2-deep? 

Missing on evaluations, failure to develop, medical retirements happen at EVERY.DAMN.PROGRAM.  This is not something unique to Texas.  The issue here is the neverending focus on the skill positions in an era where the offense and defense are built from the inside-out.  Alabama has very mediocre skill position players this season, but continues to perform at a high level because of their line experience.  Notice they have exactly ONE sophomore (and no FR) on their starting OL.  

It's understandable that being "O-line U" isn't as glamourous as "DB U" or "QB U," but having a 5* RB means nothing if they can't get out of the backfield.  SEC teams have figured out how to recruit and develop the lineman.  Texas has not.

  O-line development is dependent upon a D-line that can push them. You cannot learn how to defend Kyrie Irving's crossover by playing the little neighbor boy in your driveway. That's the current problem I see. People wonder why the mid 2000's O-lines were solid, it's because look who was playing across from them. As our talent along the D-line has waned so has our ability to play up front. It's all circular. Face Von Miller in practice everyday and John Smith from Baylor seems like a cakewalk.

   

[Eggo 3974]

1 hour ago, Thatguy said:

 

 

 

  O-line development is dependent upon a D-line that can push them. You cannot learn how to defend Kyrie Irving's crossover by playing the little neighbor boy in your driveway. That's the current problem I see. People wonder why the mid 2000's O-lines were solid, it's because look who was playing across from them. As our talent along the D-line has waned so has our ability to play up front. It's all circular. Face Von Miller in practice everyday and John Smith from Baylor seems like a cakewalk.

   

Ta'Quon Graham - Atlanta Falcons

Malcom Brown - Jacksonville Jaguars

Malcolm Roach - New Orleans Saints

Hassan Ridgeway - Philadelphia Eagles

Poona Ford - Seattle Seahawks

Charles Omenihu - San Francisco 49ers

Alex Okafor - Kansas City Chiefs

Joseph Ossai - Cincinnati Bengals

vs.

Connor Williams - Dallas Cowboys

Trey Hopkins - Cincinnati Bengals

Calvin Anderson - Denver Broncos

Sam Cosmi - Washington Football Team

 

So no, I would not say our D-line is the problem with our O-line.

[bullet 1596]

On 11/8/2021 at 9:21 PM, WinningIsHard said:

We fired Mack thinking we had saban, then made a splash hire in chuckles. We pursued urban which went public immediately and then fired herman and went with option B. I don’t think strong, herman, or sark were real coaching search hires. My point is all 3 of those guys need longer than 3 or 4 years to figure out how to coach Texas but we aren’t patient enough for that kind of long game. TCU did it with Patterson, leach at tech, Snyder at k-state. Those guys had ROUGH years but they also had some damn good ones. Given the talent difference we are able to acquire maybe just maybe a long term coach could work itself out. It’s maddening that we hire guys who aren’t ready and when they prove they aren’t ready we fire them lol. 

Charlie was never going to get it.  3 straight losing seasons for the first time since the 1930s and 2nd time ever.

Herman was failing at recruiting, whether because of rumors he was out or because of his own failings I don't know.

They didn't need any more time.

[bullet 1596]

You don't blow out teams for 3 quarters, including OU, without having talent.

We don't have top 10 level talent and yes it needs to get better, but we've got plenty to compete for 2nd in the Big 12.

But they aren't playing well.  They aren't playing hard.  As someone said, Greg Robinson turned a horrible defense around in 2 games.  So that is on the coach.  He needs to set the culture.

I went to two different high schools.  The first had won 9 games in 6 years.  Our group moved in from junior high where we won in everything from football to track to band to chess.  And they won 7 games that year.  They didn't have another losing season for two decades and they never had the size the other good programs in Houston had.

The 2nd school in Dallas went 4-4-2 one year with 2 future all SWC players.  After starting 4-1 with a win over a top 10 team, I could tell nobody was hungry and they were going to lose game 6 and they lost badly.  in the last 4 games they lost two, tied a team that went 0-9-1 and tied a team that was state runnerup.  Sometimes they were hungry and sometimes they weren't.  Its not always easy to fix that, but just changing players doesn't automatically change the culture.

Sark needs to figure out how to get them hungry.  It will take time to get top 10 level talent, but it won't matter if you can't get them hungry.  And they have regressed from last year.