Jump to content

2024 Presidential Election Thread - Let's keep the party going.


Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, troph said:

 

now it is. but it didn't have to be fait accompli.

and I get the age issue, but if the party rallied around Joe and his accomplishments instead of doing what they did, we'd already be much better off. the complicity of the party and the media and most specifically left leaning media did this.

And if Biden hadn't completely sucked ass in the debate we wouldn't be here. Everyone wants to blame the media for something we all saw with our own eyes. Yeah, he's still better than Trump. But not to people other than diehard Democrats. You can't win an election in swing states with just those people. Biden's performance in that debate put a magnifying glass on his age and made it the single greatest negative in his ledger. He steps down, you remove that negative. You put the negative then on Trump for his old age since being himself doesn't really seem to be an issue any longer. 

Edited by mdmost
  • Hook 'Em 1
  • Like 1
Posted
1 hour ago, Js1 said:

I'm ready for this face to come out before she eviscerates him for being a felon at their first debate

giphy.gif

Trump won't debate anyone not named Biden. The GOP and Trump's opinion will be that any replacement is invalid. This would be their position that they would take the SCOTUS if they lost in Nov.

Posted
Just now, Firemans4Horn said:

Biden and his inner circle did this. He has lost his fastball and they kept it under wraps for over a year. The first 30 seconds of the debate were shocking. He looked like a corpse, moved like a corpse, and spoke with a whisper. 

no they didn't "do this" because on the other side you have all of that (old senile man) PLUS convicted felon, rapist, child rapist, insurrectionist, etc. etc. and not a peep about him being unfit for office.

If you rank ordered the two candidates in who should objectively step down from the campaign it's Trump first and Biden second and NO ONE is clamoring for Trump to step down. and the back drop is Biden has objectively had the best 4 year run of any president in our lifetimes with a scandal free Administration that has knocked it out of the park.

WHAT. THE. FUCK?

  • Hook 'Em 3
  • Rage+1 1
Posted
Just now, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Trump won't debate anyone not named Biden. The GOP and Trump's opinion will be that any replacement is invalid. This would be their position that they would take the SCOTUS if they lost in Nov.

They can argue that but the candidate for president is the one selected by the party at the nomination during the convention. That's what the law recognizes. And if he doesn't agree to the debate, there is nothing stopping Kamala from asking for a full 2 hours on primetime TV when the debate would've been to argue her case uncontested. 

  • Hook 'Em 2
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, troph said:

no they didn't "do this" because on the other side you have all of that (old senile man) PLUS convicted felon, rapist, child rapist, insurrectionist, etc. etc. and not a peep about him being unfit for office.

If you rank ordered the two candidates in who should objectively step down from the campaign it's Trump first and Biden second and NO ONE is clamoring for Trump to step down. and the back drop is Biden has objectively had the best 4 year run of any president in our lifetimes with a scandal free Administration that has knocked it out of the park.

WHAT. THE. FUCK?

You're living in a world where things should be a certain way. But it's not that way like the gif above says. For some reason, Trump's crimes and personality are not held against him. You just have to make peace with that reality. No one is clamoring for Trump to step down because he IS the Republican Party now. They should just rename it The Trump Party. 

And I will argue that a lot of people in here need to step out of their bubbles and see what's happening in the real world. The economy is not as great as you may think. Yes, inflation has come down but shit is still expensive. That is not Biden's fault but he'll get the blame just like any president does when people feel the economy is not good for them. Housing is out of control. Grocery prices are high. Homelessness is rampant in big cities. All of that has an effect on the middle to lower class. That's where Biden is failing. Why if things are so great are people not behind Biden? It's not just the media's fault. It's the entire messaging that Biden puts out.

Edited by mdmost
  • Hook 'Em 7
  • Like 1
Posted
2 minutes ago, troph said:

no they didn't "do this" because on the other side you have all of that (old senile man) PLUS convicted felon, rapist, child rapist, insurrectionist, etc. etc. and not a peep about him being unfit for office.

If you rank ordered the two candidates in who should objectively step down from the campaign it's Trump first and Biden second and NO ONE is clamoring for Trump to step down. and the back drop is Biden has objectively had the best 4 year run of any president in our lifetimes with a scandal free Administration that has knocked it out of the park.

WHAT. THE. FUCK?


he’s had terrible polling related to age/mental ability for 2+ years and went on stage and confirmed everyone’s worst fears. 
 

he’s done an awesome job legislatively and done an atrocious job getting on tv/tiktok and telling everyone. You don’t win re-election by hiding away in Delaware for the last 2 years of your presidency. 

  • Hook 'Em 5
Posted
1 hour ago, C-Man said:

I really like Shapiro, BTW. Kamala+Shapiro is a ticket I could get pretty excited about.

 

Screenshot2024-07-18at11_22_07AM.thumb.png.72ae4f74fb48d0a9a3abcede73b96a25.png

And come out blasting w both barrels

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

too soon?

  • Haha 1
Posted
1 minute ago, Firemans4Horn said:


he’s had terrible polling related to age/mental ability for 2+ years and went on stage and confirmed everyone’s worst fears. 
 

he’s done an awesome job legislatively and done an atrocious job getting on tv/tiktok and telling everyone. You don’t win re-election by hiding away in Delaware for the last 2 years of your presidency. 

waynes world party GIF

  • Haha 2
Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Firemans4Horn said:


he’s had terrible polling related to age/mental ability for 2+ years and went on stage and confirmed everyone’s worst fears. 
 

he’s done an awesome job legislatively and done an atrocious job getting on tv/tiktok and telling everyone. You don’t win re-election by hiding away in Delaware for the last 2 years of your presidency. 

he's not the only one with terrible polling, he's just the only one with allies eating him alive. FUCK man, even Nikki Haley slobbered all over Trump. Dems SUCK at campaigns, absolutely suck. There *was* a path to help Biden and get the polls up and secure victory, but the Dems pissed that away attacking their own. Now we have a brokered convention and total wildcard election coming for the most important election of our lifetimes. Good job Dems. FUCK.

Edited by troph
  • Hook 'Em 3
  • Haha 1
  • Rage+1 1
Posted
Just now, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Biden has been a great President but a horrible candidate. And it's not like he was a good candidate in 2020. He just wasn't Trump.

 

when was the last time Biden lost an election?

Posted
46 minutes ago, Firemans4Horn said:


you spend hours a week on a political message board and haven’t heard of the governor of Pennsylvania that won his election by 10 points?

Tbf there’s a porn forum and stupid shit from Facebook thread. Hard to maintain focusness

Posted
1 minute ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Stop arguing that Biden is doing well.

Policy wise I thinks he's done very well. Current health and optics are shit. I still think he has the capacity to do the job, but I also think he's unelectable at this point. 

  • Hook 'Em 3
  • Rage+1 1
Posted
3 minutes ago, troph said:

 

now it is. but it didn't have to be fait accompli.

and I get the age issue, but if the party rallied around Joe and his accomplishments instead of doing what they did, we'd already be much better off. the complicity of the party and the media and most specifically left leaning media did this.

you aren't wrong about the differences in the party participants. it will be interesting to see how that plays out.

when trump incites an insurrection and breaks numerous criminal laws stemming from stealing classified docs, paying off a porn star he fucked around on his pregnant wife with, and trying to intimidate a state secretary of state into falsifying an election outcome, the supreme court says he's immune, a federal judge dismisses a case, a state party gets the d.a. put on trial for an affair, and the party rallies around him being a criminal piece of shit and wears it like a badge.

when biden has a bad night at a debate, we get everything from competing 100 page wannabe thinkpieces crawling all over each other from every national media outlet down to surly cr folks losing their minds on message boards. no attempt at spin and rallying to the cause whatsoever.

strong argument for dems to say "hey, we are better than them and we are not subject to a cult of personality like them." that would generally be my position. and fwiw, i think it is obvious that if there was a clear torch bearer to take over for biden, it is the likely outcome.

but in the world of presidential electoral politics, i am somewhat curious to see how this one plays out because gotv matters a lot in this one and if all the marginal folks become ambivalent after witnessing their zealous left leaning friends become despondent while their culty weirdo friends that want to suck donald trump's dick are fully on board, then the ability to mobilize the (minority, but unwavering core) cult may be enough.

the narrative is now all about biden being old and trump being shot at when the narrative should be women being hunted on inter-state roads for seeking medical care and republicans crowing about mental health needs leading to people being needlessly murdered by mass shooters on the reg while making absolutely no effort to actually create resources to actually confront it.

  • Hook 'Em 1
  • Rage+1 3
Posted
9 minutes ago, troph said:

he's not the only one with terrible polling, he's just the only one with allies eating him alive. FUCK man, even Nikki Haley slobbered all over Trump. Dems SUCK at campaigns, absolutely suck. There *was* a path to help Biden and get the polls up and secure victory, but the Dems pissed that away attacking their own. Now we have a total wildcard election coming.

Correct. Dems will have to unite behind Harris now and actually focus on Trump. I have doubts that they can do it. 

  • Hook 'Em 1
Posted
2 minutes ago, Dahobbs said:

The video was posted. I don't agree with the description. He said "black man" as a parenthetical to emphasize a point in an interview with BET. 

What is black Twitter saying?

Posted
Just now, Dahobbs said:

The video was posted. I don't agree with the description. He said "black man" as a parenthetical to emphasize a point in an interview with BET. 

When people are thinking you have dementia you damn well better be able to name drop the members of your cabinet. 

  • Hook 'Em 1
Posted
2 minutes ago, Sawbonz said:

When people are thinking you have dementia you damn well better be able to name drop the members of your cabinet. 

I'm not disagreeing. I'm just saying I don't think that was actually the issue in the interview. The appearance was bad, but I just don't think that was what Biden was focused on. 

Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, mdmost said:

You're living in a world where things should be a certain way. But it's not that way like the gif above says. For some reason, Trump's crimes and personality are not held against him. You just have to make peace with that reality. No one is clamoring for Trump to step down because he IS the Republican Party now. They should just rename it The Trump Party. 

And I will argue that a lot of people in here need to step out of their bubbles and see what's happening in the real world. The economy is not as great as you may think. Yes, inflation has come down but shit is still expensive. That is not Biden's fault but he'll get the blame just like any president does when people feel the economy is not good for them. Housing is out of control. Grocery prices are high. Homelessness is rampant in big cities. All of that has an effect on the middle to lower class. That's where Biden is failing. Why if things are so great are people not behind Biden? It's not just the media's fault. It's the entire messaging that Biden puts out.

you aren't wrong in your premise that I live in a world that just isn't the way I think it should be. but I think your reasons for why it is the way it is aren't entirely correct. My critique - well hatred really - goes to the inability for facts to rise to the top and win the day. I have a strong sense of right and wrong, I want justice and I want the truth to prevail.

TRUTH on the economy, I get it, the economy isn't great, it's bifurcated, good for some, bad for others. My family is heavily impacted by interest rates given my wife is a home builder, so we have a front row seat on housing issues. Homelessness from a camping in public spaces perspective was a 9th circuit court ruling until a few weeks ago, had nothing to do with Biden. Inflation was and is a bitch and once contained it will still take 2-3 years to feel okay. If Biden gets any credit, it's for helping it come down, he did not create the problem. And, we are looking like a soft landing and expansion is coming, so we are just going to hand that to Trump? The reality is the media isn't doing a @StassneyHorn touting the all time stock market highs under Biden, no they won't even touch it? Why? Positive record doesn't get ratings, we are addicted to DOOM. So, there is little chance Biden can get the traction on his record compared to Trump blasting everyone. The fact that we cannot as a citizenry evaluate Biden's record and compare to Trump's record as the paramount question in this election is just maddening to me.

the only critique I have of Biden is the same for the Democrats, they won't take the gloves off and attack Trump like they should. If positive record won't win the day then blast your opponent to smithereens. Biden started but his allies drowned him out with demands he resign from the campaign.

The other problem is we can't evaluate the alternative universe where the Dems rallied around Biden, blamed a cold and Trump's unrelenting lies for stymieing the president in the debate. I actually drafted the statement way back when it happened, it wouldn't have been hard and we would be off to the races. so what if it was a lie, lies work, just ask Trump.

Edited by troph
  • Hook 'Em 1
  • Rage+1 2
Posted
32 minutes ago, Vegas64 said:

I'll caveat by saying 1) I agree with you competely just playign devil's advocate and b) I think our best bet is Biden/Harris still.

But the question from your post is-- is she ATL / Detroit / Philly type black? To take from the recent reports from the other VP, she seems more likely to have a kid named Vivek than Darrel, and she was a former cop which the GQP memes as a horrible thing while also purporting to be the party of "Back the Blue" so the irony is THICK

Definitely a risk.  But I think her intellectual/cop background will take a back seat to the fact that at the end of the day, she is a black woman.  I think she can reach black women in Atlanta, and that’s really all it’ll take.

  • Hook 'Em 2
Posted

Again though, he's the oldest candidate for President and President ever. That does carry weight with people. He barely won before and it took Covid and a complete stopdown of our economy to do that. Yes, he's done good things but the reality of his age was always there. Then a bad debate and interviews make it worse. 

  • Hook 'Em 2
Posted
2 hours ago, Aqua Buddha said:

The Tucker Carlson/Candace Owens wing of the Republican Party would be literally frothing at mouth about a Harris/Shapiro ticket and we all know why.

That's fucking good news for moderates. 

  • Hook 'Em 1
Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, mdmost said:

Again though, he's the oldest candidate for President and President ever. That does carry weight with people. He barely won before and it took Covid and a complete stopdown of our economy to do that. Yes, he's done good things but the reality of his age was always there. Then a bad debate and interviews make it worse. 

that's half the equation. the second half is how the Party and the media reacted. Trump led an insurrection for Christ's sake and he's still in the running. The circumstance + the reaction = the result. You are correct about the circumstance but you are ignoring the reaction. The Party turbo fucked Biden in their reaction to the circumstance and the media seeking ratings and readers for profit jumped on it.

as for close elections, we won't have wide margins of victories for at least another 4-5 cycles. Biden actually did quite well against an incumbent and the second highest margin of victory since 2000.

image.png.3a3aa6143a3be07b373362321a8f44c5.png

 

Edited by troph
  • Hook 'Em 1
Posted
12 minutes ago, immamac said:

What is black Twitter saying?

Top 5 hottest political posts in order on r/BlackPeopleTwitter (I refuse to go to Elmo Mush's site):

 

  • Hook 'Em 1
  • Haha 3
Posted (edited)
29 minutes ago, Nice Guy Eddie said:

Stop arguing that Biden is doing well.

He's toast man. I'm fucking livid about it. The last thing we need for this election is a brokered convention and a scramble to the end with a new candidate. but now we have no choice.

 

27 minutes ago, Mo Horn said:

Policy wise I thinks he's done very well. Current health and optics are shit. I still think he has the capacity to do the job, but I also think he's unelectable at this point. 

At this point he is unelectable and the fact that Trump is electable and Biden isn't has nothing to do with the underlying circumstance and has EVERYTHING to do with the disparate reactions to the circumstances.

Edited by troph
  • Hook 'Em 2
  • Like 1
Posted

Biden’s biggest failure was neglecting the rising fascist movement which will destroy him and many others.  Obama made the same mistake with the tea party but him being the first Black President, I imagine, made it more politically difficult to combat with a frontal assault.  Biden had all the white privilege in the world and his administration decided to do as little as possible to stop Trump’s GQP movement.  No expanding the courts, no real push to dismantle the electoral college, appointed possibly the weakest attorney general in history, and didn’t do much to tangibly improve the lives of everyday working folks during one of the more difficult times in American history.  Yeah the stock market and the “economy” are doing great but only the rich give a shit about that stuff and only a few make a connection to politics.

There’s also a laundry list of stuff he campaigned on in 2020 that he made no real effort to even advocate for, such as a public option on healthcare. And most notably missing from Biden’s agenda was a robust anti-corruption legislation package, which would have been massively popular across the political landscape if marketed properly and highly needed. 

You can say Biden did some good things as president, and that’s true but on the whole he catastrophically missed the moment with his presidency and that’s partially why we’re in this dark place.  

  • Hook 'Em 2
Posted
2 hours ago, gmr548 said:

The fuck does Andy Beshear bring to the ticket? I promise you 75% of America has no idea who that is.

He puts Ohio in play.

My Veep power rankings

1) Whitmer (wins Michigan, but don’t think she wants it. Could win a floor vote at the convention and Will come into 2028 as the prohibitive favorite for the presidential nom if Biden/Harris loses)

2) Bashear (puts Ohio in play, raises his profile)

3) Shapiro (wins, PA but I don’t think he wants it)

4) Coop (puts NC in play)

5) Pete (best talker)

6) Kelly (too important to lose as a senator)

  • Hook 'Em 2
  • Like 1
Posted
42 minutes ago, troph said:

the other side you have all of that (old senile man) PLUS convicted felon, rapist, child rapist, insurrectionist, etc. etc. and not a peep about him being unfit for office.

Starship Troopers GIF

  • Hook 'Em 1
Posted
3 minutes ago, troph said:

He's toast man. I'm fucking livid about it.

 

At this point he is unelectable and the fact that Trump is electable and Biden isn't has nothing to do with the underlying circumstance and has EVERYTHING to do with the disparate reactions to the circumstances.

So you want to keep showing up here bitching about how fucked up American society is, how stupid and amoral much of it has become, and ignoring how Biden isn't treated the same as Trump by completely different people and the media...to the people that generally agree with you. Ok. 

2 minutes ago, Bozo_Casanova said:

He puts Ohio in play.

My Veep power rankings

1) Whitmer (wins Michigan, but don’t think she wants it. Could win a floor vote at the convention and Will come into 2028 as the prohibitive favorite for the presidential nom if Biden/Harris loses)

2) Bashear (puts Ohio in play, raises his profile)

3) Shapiro (wins, PA but I don’t think he wants it)

4) Coop (puts NC in play)

5) Pete (best talker)

6) Kelly (too important to lose as a senator)

Why exactly does Beshear put Ohio in play? I'm not sure Jim Brown revived from the dead as a white democrat puts Ohio in play, much less a Governor of Kentucky. 

  • Hook 'Em 4
Posted
2 minutes ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Biden’s biggest failure was neglecting the rising fascist movement which will destroy him and many others.  Obama made the same mistake with the tea party but him being the first Black President, I imagine, made it more politically difficult to combat with a frontal assault.  Biden had all the white privilege in the world and his administration decided to do as little as possible to stop Trump’s GQP movement.  No expanding the courts, no real push to dismantle the electoral college, appointed possibly the weakest attorney general in history, and didn’t do much to tangibly improve the lives of everyday working folks during one of the more difficult times in American history.  Yeah the stock market and the “economy” are doing great but only the rich give a shit about that stuff and only a few make a connection to politics.

There’s also a laundry list of stuff he campaigned on in 2020 that he made no real effort to even advocate for, such as a public option on healthcare. And most notably missing from Biden’s agenda was a robust anti-corruption legislation package, which would have been massively popular across the political landscape if marketed properly and highly needed. 

You can say Biden did some good things as president, and that’s true but on the whole he catastrophically missed the moment with his presidency and that’s partially why we’re in this dark place.  

I agree the DOJ should crack down on white nationalist extremists, that's been a growing issue since even before GWB. Not sure how much of that can be blamed on Biden.

Inflation is the only thing that really matters right now (with high employment) to everyone but the wealthiest. That shit takes time, go back to the 1970's and 1980's and see how long that shit stuck. Record speed in inflation reduction here. Not his fault, not his credit but if we are assigning blame and credit to presidents for inflation, he gets an A+ gold star. How that's even debatable is maddening.

Could he be more progressive, yes I agree.

He did not catastrophically miss though, that's a laughable position. He rebuilt a cratered Executive Branch, expanded NATO in the face of the Russian threat, had more bipartisan legislation pass than anyone in decades - despite (variation on a theme) his own party getting in the way. Still passed an historic climate bill that needs to be passed every other year but hey the first happened on his watch.

But it doesn't matter, this he's toast and it's fucking stupid.
 

  • Hook 'Em 2
Posted
2 minutes ago, SydneyCarton said:

So you want to keep showing up here bitching about how fucked up American society is, how stupid and amoral much of it has become, and ignoring how Biden isn't treated the same as Trump by completely different people and the media...to the people that generally agree with you. Ok. 

 

What the fuck do you think this board is for? Yeah I'll bitch as loud and as often as I want. and actually people here don't agree with me, most are arguing the exact opposite with me. They want him to step down. I think the reaction to Biden's debate (including most here) was a devastating response that puts the election in jeopardy.

 

Posted

Watching Pete tear JD Vance limb from limb in the VP debate sure would be fun. 

Dems need someone to articulate the case right now. No one can do that better than Pete. 

  • Hook 'Em 2
  • Like 1
Posted
2 minutes ago, Chuckie Finster said:

Look, it's fine to be frustrated with the situation, but I will not accept that millions of people collectively agreeing at the same time that this dude cannot be our President is a bad thing.

This wasn't some power grab or coup based on difference in policy.  This wasn't some long simmering feud where everyone was waiting for a moment to strike.  Biden had 100% party support prior to June 27.  This was a genuine, impromptu reaction to what was playing out before our eyes, and I do not accept that the answer is blind loyalty.

Additionally, being able to effectively and persuasively communicate is like THE most important skill for a President, and it's silly to blame the media for pointing out when a candidate clearly can no longer do this.

Biden has done a great job and I hate that he is in this current state.  But asking Democrats to ignore their eyes and vote for Joe no matter what, especially after 8 straight years of demonizing Republicans who do the same, is not the path to victory.  

win at (almost) all costs is the goal in politics. that to me meant rally around Biden. the Republicans get it, they will do anything with their win at all costs mentality. it means we are already playing against a stacked deck.

  • Hook 'Em 1
Posted
1 minute ago, Zonahorn said:

And there’s the answer for what is actually happening. 

Season 4 Wow GIF by The Office

 

Citzens United to the rescue.

Fuck my life.

  • Haha 1
  • Rage+1 1


×
×
  • Create New...