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Active shooter thread

Hugo Stiglitz

By Hugo Stiglitz
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Biff Tannen

Biff Tannen 45439

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1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Right now, one thing is more clear than ever:  our entire system needs massive reform and we’re going to need strong leadership with unwavering moral clarity to get there.   It’s a long shot at this point but not an impossibility. 

There is one candidate right now that I think embodies this.  Warren.

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4th&Five
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Fuck off. You vote for this shit. Explain that to your kids. 

Pancho
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3rd leg of my move from Houston to the Bay Area, and I made it to LA.   I’m just now catching up on the news in my hotel.  I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again—I don’t have kids, but this e

royiv
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WTF world are we living in when people are having a discussion about survival rates of certain rounds? People are being terrorized by gun violence and we're discussing which bullet has worse/better ch

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23355

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2 minutes ago, Biff Tannen said:

There is one candidate right now that I think embodies this.  Warren.

Obviously I agree but even if she wins, it will be an insanely uphill battle to overcome what we’re facing.  I try to avoid viewing her as a savior or the only answer because she is still human.  I just don’t think we’re going to get a better shot at this without her leading the way. 

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Guest Lobo

Guest Lobo

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Now, it's over-medication that's the problem?  Are the characters in our violent video games not taking the right medications for their mental health issues?  Are the peer-to-peer gaming platforms suffocating under an impractical system of background checks?  

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bad_teammate

bad_teammate 13115

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I hate the right as much as anyone, but the underlying thread is male violence. The Dayton shooter killed his sister before going to the bar; typical male family desire to control female sexuality. While it's obvious that right-wing ideologies (nationalism/nativism) lead to more violence, it wouldn't shock me to see male violence from the left as well. That leftist murderous violence far less likely to be ideological (they don't have their own version of replacement theory), but men with guns can be compelled to use them for MANY different reasons.

Marianne Williamson is more right than basically anyone else in the 2020 Dem primary regarding the source and nature of the violence.

The problem isn't just guns, it's guns PLUS men.

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23355

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3 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

I hate the right as much as anyone, but the underlying thread is male violence. The Dayton shooter killed his sister before going to the bar; typical male family desire to control female sexuality. While it's obvious that right-wing ideologies (nationalism/nativism) lead to more violence, it wouldn't shock me to see male violence from the left as well. That leftist murderous violence far less likely to be ideological (they don't have their own version of replacement theory), but men with guns can be compelled to use them for MANY different reasons.

Marianne Williamson is more right than basically anyone else in the 2020 Dem primary regarding the source and nature of the violence.

The problem isn't just guns, it's guns PLUS men.

I’ll go one further and say it’s aggression vs compassion.  

The difference between the political parties right now might be that simple. 

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Doc Sam Beckett

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59 minutes ago, NowThis said:

i've know him since middle school, he's fun to mess with, really conservative.  So anyway, what's a good answer? Chicago is f'n west beirut in the 80s right? Why doesn't that get attention. 

The answer is to take away all guns. Maybe leave some bolt action rifles for hunting, but the only reason you need semi auto high mag rifles and fucking hand cannons are to protect yourself from others with semi auto high mag rifles and hand cannons. Fuck it.

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DixonHur

DixonHur 11017

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15 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

The problem isn't just guns, it's guns PLUS white men.

fify

Edit: watch the Right only focus on the Dayton shooter's ideology since he described himself as a "leftist", while the El Paso shooter will be blamed on video games, lack of prayer in schools, and mental health.

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MNLonghornFUKM

MNLonghornFUKM 8795

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5 minutes ago, Doc Sam Beckett said:

The answer is to take away all guns. Maybe leave some bolt action rifles for hunting, but the only reason you need semi auto high mag rifles and fucking hand cannons are to protect yourself from others with semi auto high mag rifles and hand cannons. Fuck it.

buy why?? remember all of the CHL people who carry every day all over the place that  have stopped so many shootings sparing hundreds of lives the last 20 years.

 

Oh yea, this hero is the only one who comes to mind

 

Image result for texas church shooting hero

Edited by MNLonghornFUKM
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scottsins

scottsins 1951

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meaning guns can be taxed just like cigs, alcohol, gasoline, anything - even if the tax rate is much higher than the typical 8.25%.  Then as we have property tax and some states even tax auto ownership, we can tax gun ownership. Easy. 


Of course they CAN be taxed, but there is a line at which the tax becomes infringement.
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scottsins

scottsins 1951

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meaning guns can be taxed just like cigs, alcohol, gasoline, anything - even if the tax rate is much higher than the typical 8.25%.  Then as we have property tax and some states even tax auto ownership, we can tax gun ownership. Easy. 

 

Of course they CAN be taxed, but there is a line at which the tax becomes infringement.

 

ETA: There already is a separate additional federal tax on firearms/ammo sales. It’s the “tax the F out of them” that becomes an issue at some point. Where the line is, who knows?

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Art Vandelay

Art Vandelay 1710

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The answer is to take away all guns. Maybe leave some bolt action rifles for hunting, but the only reason you need semi auto high mag rifles and fucking hand cannons are to protect yourself from others with semi auto high mag rifles and hand cannons. Fuck it.

Are shotguns ok in your scenario? Dove season is coming up, after all.

 

 

 

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Biff Tannen

Biff Tannen 45439

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1 hour ago, Hugo Stiglitz said:

Obviously I agree but even if she wins, it will be an insanely uphill battle to overcome what we’re facing.  I try to avoid viewing her as a savior or the only answer because she is still human.  I just don’t think we’re going to get a better shot at this without her leading the way. 

Ok.  So you agree.  Good.  Yes, we don't get a better shot.  We are already trying to bullseye a womp rat.  Let's take our best shot.  Use the fucking force and whatnot.

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Mojo Hand

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30 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

I hate the right as much as anyone, but the underlying thread is male violence. The Dayton shooter killed his sister before going to the bar; typical male family desire to control female sexuality. While it's obvious that right-wing ideologies (nationalism/nativism) lead to more violence, it wouldn't shock me to see male violence from the left as well. That leftist murderous violence far less likely to be ideological (they don't have their own version of replacement theory), but men with guns can be compelled to use them for MANY different reasons.

Marianne Williamson is more right than basically anyone else in the 2020 Dem primary regarding the source and nature of the violence.

The problem isn't just guns, it's guns PLUS men.

This appears to be a Facebook post from someone who knew him who says exactly that (can't confirm the identity of the author, but I checked fb and the post appears legit):

 

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Doc Sam Beckett

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18 minutes ago, Art Vandelay said:

Are shotguns ok in your scenario? Dove season is coming up, after all.

 

 

 

 

Yeah, you can have a snake charmer shotgun. Step ya game up and hit those doves on your one shot. Look, I don't like it any more than you men, but we have proven that we can't handle guns. 

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Grade of D as in David

Grade of D as in David 13253

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1 hour ago, Francisco 2.0 said:

Shit, I missed where Dan Patrick dusted off that old GOP standard,  the lack of prayer in schools:

 

 

Well one way to push for prayer in schools is to do absolutely nothing to curb gun violence so that perhaps during the next school shooting while children are being hunted classroom to classroom they might offer up a prayer that the shooter chooses the door across the hall instead of theirs.

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Hank Kingsley

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24 minutes ago, bad_teammate said:

I hate the right as much as anyone, but the underlying thread is male violence. The Dayton shooter killed his sister before going to the bar; typical male family desire to control female sexuality. While it's obvious that right-wing ideologies (nationalism/nativism) lead to more violence, it wouldn't shock me to see male violence from the left as well. That leftist murderous violence far less likely to be ideological (they don't have their own version of replacement theory), but men with guns can be compelled to use them for MANY different reasons.

This is correct. But the outcry over white nationalism terrorism and the GOP's complicity is legitimate.

Republicans in Congress have actively sabotaged gun control proposals.  They are traitors to the American people. It's time we focus our anger on the elected politicians who do nothing. Loved seeing all the D candidates fucking HAMMER Trump and the GOP on TV today. It's the right thing to do and good politics as well.  

The #1 goal should be to vote all of these GOP shitbags out of office. 

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Biff Tannen

Biff Tannen 45439

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1 hour ago, Hank Kingsley said:

The #1 goal should be to vote all of these GOP shitbags out of office. 

It's our only hope and we have to do that in spite of foreign interference.  This is not a great option, but it's our only one.  Voter turnout.  After 2020 there may be no other chance.  TURN OUT.  The people need to vote.  We have to overcome it. 

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Hugo Stiglitz

Hugo Stiglitz 23355

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51 minutes ago, DixonHur said:

fify

Edit: watch the Right only focus on the Dayton shooter's ideology since he described himself as a "leftist", while the El Paso shooter will be blamed on video games, lack of prayer in schools, and mental health.

It is a radicalization problem.  

The causes of the radicalization is what the Right tries to muddy the waters on by saying video games, prayer, mental health...anything to deflect blame from the rhetoric, propaganda, and love of gun culture. 

The hard part is even ethno-fascists are radicalized in different places from different things.  They don’t all become militarized killers on 8chan.  They get indoctrinated in different communities and ecosystems which makes this a much more difficult problem to tackle. 

Trump/Fox News rhetoric is a common thread that runs through these communities. 

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SmokeyTheBear

SmokeyTheBear 5562

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1 hour ago, bad_teammate said:

I hate the right as much as anyone, but the underlying thread is male violence. The Dayton shooter killed his sister before going to the bar; typical male family desire to control female sexuality. While it's obvious that right-wing ideologies (nationalism/nativism) lead to more violence, it wouldn't shock me to see male violence from the left as well. That leftist murderous violence far less likely to be ideological (they don't have their own version of replacement theory), but men with guns can be compelled to use them for MANY different reasons.

Marianne Williamson is more right than basically anyone else in the 2020 Dem primary regarding the source and nature of the violence.

The problem isn't just guns, it's guns PLUS men.

Be careful not to swing the pendulum too far out and generalize. This is used by bad actors to justify hate on a larger group than intended.

This problem is an antisocial problem which resides mainly in young white men whose life is built around the internet. They don't have parents to force them into social situations. Being grown up into communities that sound appealing to teenagers who hate the real world. They build up a false reality within the internet, able to feed on unlimited knowledge from any silo they feel comfortable with, reinforcing any bad idea they may have. In a way it's like a dog that you don't socialize when it's a puppy. When they get older and capable of destruction, they are afraid and lash out in typical social situations. 

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Foosters

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6 minutes ago, SmokeyTheBear said:

Be careful not to swing the pendulum too far out and generalize. This is used by bad actors to justify hate on a larger group than intended.

This problem is an antisocial problem which resides mainly in young white men whose life is built around the internet. They don't have parents to force them into social situations. Being grown up into communities that sound appealing to teenagers who hate the real world. They build up a false reality within the internet, able to feed on unlimited knowledge from any silo they feel comfortable with, reinforcing any bad idea they may have. In a way it's like a dog that you don't socialize when it's a puppy. When they get older and capable of destruction, they are afraid and lash out in typical social situations. 

I tend to agree. There was an excellent article I read a few months ago (of course I can't find it now) wherein a mother chronicled her normal, well adjusted son's descent into the alt-right. He got out just before it was too late. This was a normal family, loving parents, siblings all normal.

Scary shit

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tantric superman

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I tried, but can't find an essay written by Richard Rodriguez, the author of the great "Hunger of Memory".  In the essay, he talks about how the Indians, at least through the mestizos, survived the conquistadors, and would inevitably survive the hardships they faced in the US Southwest, and would essentially take over.  It wasn't fearful or racist or particularly political -- the Children of Mexico would just make a life in the US, no matter how hard US politicians or even citizens made it.

Probably worth rereading some of this guys stuff.  If I can find that essay, I will post it.

So bizarre.  Having grown up in San Antonio, I always assumed lower income hispanics would be taken advantage of, just like all lower income folks are, but its hard to for me to believe that anyone could hate Mexican Americans, or fear us, whether we have assimilated or not.

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David Dennison

David Dennison 18487

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13 minutes ago, tantric superman said:

I tried, but can't find an essay written by Richard Rodriguez, the author of the great "Hunger of Memory".  In the essay, he talks about how the Indians, at least through the mestizos, survived the conquistadors, and would inevitably survive the hardships they faced in the US Southwest, and would essentially take over.  It wasn't fearful or racist or particularly political -- the Children of Mexico would just make a life in the US, no matter how hard US politicians or even citizens made it.

Probably worth rereading some of this guys stuff.  If I can find that essay, I will post it.

So bizarre.  Having grown up in San Antonio, I always assumed lower income hispanics would be taken advantage of, just like all lower income folks are, but its hard to for me to believe that anyone could hate Mexican Americans, or fear us, whether we have assimilated or not.

I think the essay is called Mixed Blood. I found it in the November 1991 of Harper's Magazine. 

See if this works.

Edited by David Dennison
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JimmyJames

JimmyJames 12271

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2 hours ago, Jive Turkey said:

Tomi Lahren got the memo.  She's going strong today.  Must be making a play for a position in the Trump administration.

 

Actually it’s trump and the NRAs fault you dumbass. I’ll come together with you when you acknowledge that fact. 

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tantric superman

tantric superman 4667

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...had an interesting phone conversation with my 90ish Aunt in Missoula on Friday.  She's a tiny force of nature, and she lost her husband a few years ago -- he was a Vietnam and Korea vet (recon pilot) who spent his retired years helping to put out fires and just doing all sort of cool outdoor shit in Montana.  He was an awesome guy but had FOX on all day, and after he died she starting standing up to some of their old friends and has lost a few since then (she being an intelligent person, hates Trump).

She suffered discrimination down in Hondo back in the day, and it was interesting hearing her talk about things in Montana.  She said that she went to a play recently with her dark skinned son and darkish grand daughters and she said she had never felt as if people were staring at her and her kids as they were at this play.  And she has been in Montana for 40 years.

Educated Mexican Americans of my generation need to realize that we grew up in a time of affirmative action in education and just because we have ours, we need to realize that this shit is opening old wounds with our parents and new wounds with people who simply aren't coming across the river at a time as fortunate as our great great grandparents did.

We need to join the forces that made headway in 2018 and keep working to vote out every shitbird  in the statehouse and congress who isn't already standing tall against Trump.  With time, $$$ and shoe leather.

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EMAWesome

EMAWesome 101

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5 hours ago, Pancho said:

 

 

It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.  If you don't go on the cable news networks after this you will get accused of not caring about the victims or the issue itself.  If you do go on the cable news networks after this you will get accused of politicizing the tragedy or trying to exploit the tragedy for political gain.

No responsible campaign director for a Republican politician would let that politician go within a hundred miles of a CNN microphone today.  The media is not like a court of law.  You don't get to cross examine them.  

Edited by EMAWesome
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Hank Kingsley

Hank Kingsley 20592

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5 minutes ago, EMAWesome said:

It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.  If you don't go on the cable news networks after this you will get accused of not caring about the victims or the issue itself.  If you do go on the cable news networks after this you will get accused of politicizing the tragedy or trying to exploit the tragedy for political gain.

No responsible campaign director for a Republican politician would let that politician go within a hundred miles of a CNN microphone today.  The media is not like a court of law.  You don't get to cross examine them.  

That's a lot of words to describe gutless, spineless, and heartless cowards. 

 

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