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Super Bowl LVII - Las Vegas


tx 3 putt

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8 hours ago, Dutchrudder said:

I don't understand why "Mahomes was most expensive cap hit in NFL at $37M" would matter. His extension kicks in next year and he will be making close to 60 million, which has to be top 3 in the league for cap hits. Chris Jones was a huge factor in the win tonight and he's a free agent, they will need to use most if not all of their cap space to keep him. If they lose Jones, then this defense will drop off considerably, and it isn't going to get considerably better, unless they have some stud young players develop. 

He's got two void years in his contract they can use to play around with the numbers and defer that. His contract gives the team a lot of flexibility while he still gets paid:

https://overthecap.com/player/patrick-mahomes/5594

 

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There has been a triple overtime NFL playoff game before, guys. I hope I'm missing sarcasm here about the game possibly just ending still tied.

Dammit my childhood memory failed me. The above is not accurate (well the part about it being silly to think it would just end in a tie was accurate).

Edited by Huckleberry
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Just now, tx 3 putt said:


that’s what i thought

2nd OT was the final OT ?

There is no final OT. There is only does one team get the final score. Each team got a possession and chance to score. If both scored a TD, the game would've gone on and the next score wins it. That's why the Chiefs said they would've just gone for 2 if SF had already gotten a TD in OT. It would've gone on until someone got the final score. 

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https://operations.nfl.com/the-rules/nfl-overtime-rules/

Play until a winner.

As far as I can tell, there's no need for a game clock in the playoff overtime, right? Each team gets a possession. If you lead after that, you win. If it's still tied, then you keep playing until someone scores.

Edit: The only reason for the game clock seems to be that there is a "two-minute intermission" between each period. So the game clock tracks when the intermission is if the game is still going.

Edited by FirstTimeCaller
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The playoff overtime rules are different.

Each team gets a possession, there is a timed quarter but the game keeps going until AT LEAST both teams have a possession.

If the game is still tied after both teams have a possession, then you go to sudden death and the team that had the ball first goes on offense. 
 

You always want to gauge the state of your team and the opponent, but the numbers say you usually want the ball first.

Ideal  is to score a TD and kick the XP.  Then the other team has to score a TD and 2, which is the lowest probability outcome, to beat you outright.
 

Otherwise you get the ball and kick the FG to win. 

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https://operations.nfl.com/the-rules/nfl-overtime-rules/
Play until a winner.
As far as I can tell, there's no need for a game clock in the playoff overtime, right? Each team gets a possession. If you lead after that, you win. If it's still tied, then you keep playing until someone scores.
Edit: The only reason for the game clock seems to be that there is a "two-minute intermission" between each period. So the game clock tracks when the intermission is if the game is still going.

I would assume the clocked is needed to switch ends of the field too after completion of the quarter. Not necessarily a huge deal here but if played outdoors or in some dome in which kicking is more difficult, it could matter. Again an assumption, but the clock runs just as though it’s another full game.
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59 minutes ago, South Austin said:

I’ve had no problem with the Taylor Swift coverage this season, but as much as the NFL is a whore for eyeballs on the TVs, I’m surprised at how little they showed her during the game.

They showed Brock Purdy's parents for about a minute or so, obviously going hard after that christian conservative market.

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9 minutes ago, 956 Worldwide said:

The playoff overtime rules are different.

Each team gets a possession, there is a timed quarter but the game keeps going until AT LEAST both teams have a possession.

If the game is still tied after both teams have a possession, then you go to sudden death and the team that had the ball first goes on offense. 
 

You always want to gauge the state of your team and the opponent, but the numbers say you usually want the ball first.

Ideal  is to score a TD and kick the XP.  Then the other team has to score a TD and 2, which is the lowest probability outcome, to beat you outright.
 

Otherwise you get the ball and kick the FG to win. 

I thought you always want to play defense first, then you know what you have to do the win or to tie.
If KC had the ball first, and they score then Shanahan doesn't kick the shorty FG in OT; and KC doesn't know that they have 4 downs every series to get the first because it is score of go home.
But then what would I know - growing up as a Lions fan, and then becoming an Oilers fan (fuck Bud Adams) after college.

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And it’s funny to read all the responses about how the Swift stuff isn’t a big deal. Enjoy all of next season when she’s shoved down your throat even more and the league puts the Chiefs in the SB again. And you’re insane if you think the league isn’t going to try and cash in on more female viewers. Look for more culture war stuff, and more rule changes to make the game even more less violent and aggressive, and more feminine. 

Jesus another Swift conspiracist.

Those guys were knocking the shit out of each other last night. The league is going to protect QBs because no one wants to watch scrubs playing that role. And I’m a fan of the league’s Play60 and flag football efforts. It gets kids outside and playing football at younger ages and gets single moms involved. They are the key to letting their kids play.
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2 hours ago, Helobious said:

And it’s funny to read all the responses about how the Swift stuff isn’t a big deal. Enjoy all of next season when she’s shoved down your throat even more and the league puts the Chiefs in the SB again. And you’re insane if you think the league isn’t going to try and cash in on more female viewers. Look for more culture war stuff, and more rule changes to make the game even more less violent and aggressive, and more feminine. 

So the Chiefs aren't getting the 3-peat? Good to know.

30 minutes ago, utxmike05 said:

I read that the super bowl OT is basically a new 4qtr game...there would have even been a short OT halftime.  Per NFL site.

More Usher? Thank God we dodged that bullet.

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The Kelce/Swift madness didn't bother me, but the reality is that it is highly unlikely they are still together Week 1 of next season.  Given Taylor's dating history and the realities of celebrity romance.  

So for anyone that it bothers, rest easy.

Edited by Incredulity
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8 minutes ago, Wally Fairway said:

I thought you always want to play defense first, then you know what you have to do the win or to tie.
If KC had the ball first, and they score then Shanahan doesn't kick the shorty FG in OT; and KC doesn't know that they have 4 downs every series to get the first because it is score of go home.
But then what would I know - growing up as a Lions fan, and then becoming an Oilers fan (fuck Bud Adams) after college.

That holds except in the NFL playoffs.  You always want the ball first if the game goes to sudden death, which is what happens if the game is tied after the first two possessions. 
 

There are more paths to an outright win OR to getting the ball first in sudden death if you go first.  

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32 minutes ago, mdmost said:

There is no final OT. There is only does one team get the final score. Each team got a possession and chance to score. If both scored a TD, the game would've gone on and the next score wins it. That's why the Chiefs said they would've just gone for 2 if SF had already gotten a TD in OT. It would've gone on until someone got the final score. 

This is why I would still want to be on defense first. Mahomes had 4 downs to get a first down every time because they knew punting wasn't an option. Even after that terrible 1st down that left them in 2nd and 14 instead of 2 and 4 they knew they had 3 downs to get it instead of only 2. That completely changes the play calling and mindset. I understood the "rest the defense" part of the decision for Shanahan, but I would have thought not giving Mahomes 4 downs to get first downs would have outweighed resting your defense. Taking the ball first is a huge advantage if it goes to 3 possessions, but you have to hope that you can actually get to that third possession before you have that advantage.

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4 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

The Kelce/Swift madness didn't bother me, but the reality is that it is highly unlikely they are still together Week 1 of next season.  Given Taylor's dating history and the realities of celebrity romance.  

So for anyone that it bothers, rest easy.

Enjoy Swift dropping her breakup album on February 9, 2025 at kickoff of the Chiefs going for the three peat 

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2 minutes ago, hook me said:

This is why I would still want to be on defense first. Mahomes had 4 downs to get a first down every time because they knew punting wasn't an option. Even after that terrible 1st down that left them in 2nd and 14 instead of 2 and 4 they knew they had 3 downs to get it instead of only 2. That completely changes the play calling and mindset. I understood the "rest the defense" part of the decision for Shanahan, but I would have thought not giving Mahomes 4 downs to get first downs would have outweighed resting your defense. Taking the ball first is a huge advantage if it goes to 3 possessions, but you have to hope that you can actually get to that third possession before you have that advantage.

I'll need to find the story I read about the Chiefs strategy for the OT but I'm pretty sure the Chiefs player interviewed said they would've gone on defense if they won the toss. Then the 49ers won the toss and took the ball, not realizing going on defense was the better move. They thought it was just get the TD first. The 49ers had so many questionable coaching moves and strategies last night. 

Edited by mdmost
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8 minutes ago, mdmost said:

I'll need to find the story I read about the Chiefs strategy for the OT but I'm pretty sure the Chiefs player interviewed said they would've gone on defense if they won the toss. Then the 49ers won the toss and took the ball, not realizing going on defense was the better move. They thought it was just get the TD first. 

ESPN had the reporting. That's shocking honestly. Looks as if the coaches were still aware, but the players not knowing is surprising. 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/39511676/49ers-players-say-know-super-bowl-rules

 

Edited by hook me
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2 hours ago, MonkeyDoughnut said:

I think being on offense knowing your playing with 4 downs vs 3 (if opponent scores) and knowing what you need to win/continue trumps all that. I kick first.

This was my first inclination but I see the merit of playing for the first sudden death possession if the first two drives are even. The kicking team risks losing overtime having only one possession while the receiving team gets two. But last night shows the risk, giving Mahomes and Reid a full drive with four down playcalling. I think it’ll be pretty rare for two possessions to take 15 full minutes so just a bizarre overtime.

Edited by 'stache
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2 hours ago, Helobious said:

And it’s funny to read all the responses about how the Swift stuff isn’t a big deal. Enjoy all of next season when she’s shoved down your throat even more and the league puts the Chiefs in the SB again. And you’re insane if you think the league isn’t going to try and cash in on more female viewers. Look for more culture war stuff, and more rule changes to make the game even more less violent and aggressive, and more feminine. 

What's Q been up to lately?

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5 minutes ago, hook me said:

ESPN had the reporting. That's shocking honestly. Looks as if the coaches were still aware, but the players not knowing is surprising. 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/39511676/49ers-players-say-know-super-bowl-rules

 

Yes and there's the difference in the coaching staffs and gives you an idea why one side has won 3 Super Bowls and the other has lost 2 and been a part of another losing one in Atlanta. 

 

The Chiefs, conversely, said they were well prepared for an overtime contingency in the postseason. Defensive lineman Chris Jones told reporters that Kansas City "talked for two weeks about new overtime rules," while safety Justin Reid said their preparation began in training camp.

"We've talked about it all year," Reid said. "We talked about it in training camp about how the rules were different in regular season versus the playoffs. Every week of the playoffs we talked about the overtime rule."

Jones said that if the Niners had scored a touchdown on their opening overtime possession to take a seven-point lead, the Chiefs were prepared to "go for two" if they scored on their ensuing possession.

"We knew what our game plan was -- had we won the coin toss, whether we want to defer or not, and what our plan was from there," Reid said.

Edited by mdmost
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12 minutes ago, mdmost said:

I'll need to find the story I read about the Chiefs strategy for the OT but I'm pretty sure the Chiefs player interviewed said they would've gone on defense if they won the toss. Then the 49ers won the toss and took the ball, not realizing going on defense was the better move. They thought it was just get the TD first. The 49ers had so many questionable coaching moves and strategies last night. 

I really want him to be successful but Shanahan really is becoming the king of blowing super bowls 

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The other thing that could tip going on defense first.  Say the team that gets the ball first has some shitty return or even if they get the ball at the 25.  You 3 and out them with minimal gain you have a good chance for some solid field position on your first possession without the downside risk of sudden death ending it.  

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1 hour ago, South Austin said:

I’ve had no problem with the Taylor Swift coverage this season, but as much as the NFL is a whore for eyeballs on the TVs, I’m surprised at how little they showed her during the game.

The Houston Chronicle tracked it. During the game broadcast, she was shown 12 times for a total of 53 seconds. 

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1 minute ago, TonyTexas said:

The Houston Chronicle tracked it. During the game broadcast, she was shown 12 times for a total of 53 seconds. 

something, something....30 second commercial 7.5 million...something, something......Billionaire....something, something.....fix is in, average looks,....something, something... conspiracy MAGAt....

 

There done.

 

The End GIF

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8 minutes ago, 'stache said:

If overtime went straight to 2-pt conversion shootouts soccer style neither team gets a coin flip advantage. I’d be good with that system.

Most (all?) major soccer tournaments have periods of sudden death before it goes to penalties.

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Talking heads always need things to talk about, and this 49ers OT thing looks like one of those classic overblown stories. It starts with two players flippantly saying they didn't know the rule and turns into "Kyle Shanahan failed to prepare his team so they lost in OT." Can someone explain to me how Arik Armstead would play differently if he "knew the rule"? Did he let the Chiefs score a TD because he thought it'd help the 49ers win? Did he play with hesitation not knowing the rule and thinking maybe the defenses goal was to not stop the offense? I'm pretty positive after the Patriots-Falcons Super Bowl a Patriots player said he didn't know the overtime rule, but I can't find it after a quick search. But, there is this. I guess Mecole probably slept through all the meetings the Chiefs had on it.

“Can I tell a quick funny story? I threw a touchdown to this dude to end the game, and he had no idea,” Mahomes said, with his arm around Hardman. “I said, ‘Dude, we just won the Super Bowl.’ He had no idea. He didn’t even celebrate at the beginning.”

https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/mecole-hardman-didnt-know-overtime-rule-patrick-mahomes-had-to-tell-him-he-won-the-game

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43 minutes ago, Incredulity said:

The Kelce/Swift madness didn't bother me, but the reality is that it is highly unlikely they are still together Week 1 of next season.  Given Taylor's dating history and the realities of celebrity romance.  

So for anyone that it bothers, rest easy.

 

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6 minutes ago, hook me said:

Most (all?) major soccer tournaments have periods of sudden death before it goes to penalties.

Soccer doesn’t have set “possessions” like American football or downs. Any advantage to first possession works itself out over 15 minutes. Any system in American Football that includes a clock and possessions in overtime provides a coin flip advantage to one side or the other. Straight to conversion shootouts is the only system that doesn’t have any advantage. It would also be fewer plays almost every time since player safety is an issue.

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I guarantee a team could have 3 meetings a week all season long and special daily practice sessions for the two weeks focused on playoffs overtime rules/coin toss strategy leading up to the game and some of the players wouldn't know the overtime rules.  Some are too stupid, others are too focused on the 11 million other things a football player needs to remember, but mostly they really don't give a shit.  Those decisions are on the coaching staff.

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