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Posted
23 minutes ago, Armybrat said:

WTF is VPN?

I barely know what IP is from the IPIHB forum.

An IP is an identifier used by your computer to use the internet. Typically you get assigned the same IP by your cable modem. If you leave your cable modem off for few hours, you’ll get assigned a new IP. But most people don’t do this & pretty consistently get assigned the same IP for months at a time  

When your account gets banned, you can no longer use the account but you can create a new account & start over. 

When you get permaban’d, your account gets banned AND Surly tracks your home IP and won’t let you create a new account from that IP anymore (and maybe even prevent access to the website at all). This effectively prevents a specific person from using the website. 

A VPN is a service that is used to encrypt/prevent others from looking at your web traffic. But it also has the added benefit of changing the IP address Surly sees when you visit. If he used a VPN,  Derka’s account would be still deactivated but the permaban wouldn’t completely work since he could create new accounts & use the site. 

This then would most likely lead to imamac playing wack-a-mole & permabanning each account & IP that Derka use. Identifying Derka would be relatively easy due to his known writing style but requires annoying work by Imamac.

And this is one example of why people get burned out running message boards. 

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Posted
29 minutes ago, troph said:

But repeatedly insulting and railing on the owner won’t help. And in fact it will get you banned. But to acknowledge Derka’s considerable short comings without acknowledging grown men with no mental health excuse engage him and gas light him - because we are surly assholes - is disingenuous. 

No doubt, but I’ve also seen plenty of threads over the years where disagreeing with Derka on something that is strictly an opinion results in Derka saying people are bullying him or going scorched earth. It has happened more times than I can count. Usually he steps away and comes back and is in a better place for a while until it comes up again.

Using the term bully in today’s online environment can be problematic. I don’t participate in the same threads he does, so I cannot speak to whether it is or isn’t. However, I can speak to a fairly easy solution to dealing with it, which is put him on ignore instead of trying to be a moderator. It’s an online community, you hold all the control over who you interact with and Derka is making the active choice not to do his part to control it. Instead he is choosing scorched earth which is the most “Derka” thing he can do.

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Posted
13 minutes ago, aggie08 said:

What gets me is that posters antagonize Derka even in the fucking Rick Barnes thread. Almost a decade after his firing. If ever there was a place on the internet to let Derka cook, it's there. Instead, some purposely seek him out to prod him, then act indignant when he "Derkas it up". No shit, Sherlock. It's the RICK BARNES thread. Derka is INCREDIBLY easy to avoid with almost zero effort. Unlike the trolls, he sticks to a small handful of threads. But it's clear that some take pleasure in the drama that Derka creates.

You don't have to like him; you don't have to sympathize with him; it's not your responsibility as an anonymous message board poster to look after his mental health or make him better

...but how big of a piece of shit do you have to be to actively try to make him worse, so you can point and laugh?

 

That said, I understand the predicament that it puts the mods in having someone who takes his standing and treatment within the community so deeply personally. Deriving self worth from the internet is a dangerous game, so, if this ban is permanent, I sincerely hope a lot of good comes out of it in the long run.

Was thinking the same thing with regard to the Barnes thread, sharks be circling whenever Rick loses a game or is knocked out of the NCAAT.  You said it much better than I could have. 

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Posted

It’s going to feel odd without Derka around. He’s been on the same site as some of us for twenty years. I see both points but to me he’s a net positive for the board and has definitely gotten better over the years.  I’ve disagreed with him before of course, but I’ve never had a problem with him because I don’t sit there and keep egging him on like many do.  People have been combative with him for no reason for years just because they know they can get under his skin.  Some posters are much worse than Derka and it seems like a 1/4th of their post are calling people dumbass, ect and straight up attacking people.  Also doesn’t bother me because I just keep scrolling because people with that much hate must be miserable in their everyday life.  

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Posted
54 minutes ago, troph said:

I’ve explained to Derka he needs to bide his time, ignore mo and accept imma’s approach. It took damn well near 7-8 years to convince this place that tranny and other similar slurs are offensive and should be off limits and I fucking left right before they made that decision. Johnny Sack’s and immortal13, immaculate vibes and a bunch of other trolls view points were held in more esteem than mine - for years. Let that sink in for a hot minute.

The gay mafia here spent at least as long getting the term faggot on the bannable list of slurs.
 

mental health challenges is even harder because the self-sabotage. At least I was able to weather the storm, advocate for myself and be patient. Change takes time.
 

But repeatedly insulting and railing on the owner won’t help. And in fact it will get you banned. But to acknowledge Derka’s considerable short comings without acknowledging grown men with no mental health excuse engage him and gas light him - because we are surly assholes - is disingenuous. 

Hey, @Frank Drebin why did you change your username? Have you ever owned up to your bigoted viewpoints?

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Posted
8 minutes ago, Brew said:

No doubt, but I’ve also seen plenty of threads over the years where disagreeing with Derka on something that is strictly an opinion results in Derka saying people are bullying him or going scorched earth. It has happened more times than I can count. Usually he steps away and comes back and is in a better place for a while until it comes up again.

Using the term bully in today’s online environment can be problematic. I don’t participate in the same threads he does, so I cannot speak to whether it is or isn’t. However, I can speak to a fairly easy solution to dealing with it, which is put him on ignore instead of trying to be a moderator. It’s an online community, you hold all the control over who you interact with and Derka is making the active choice not to do his part to control it. Instead he is choosing scorched earth which is the most “Derka” thing he can do.

I like Derka's contributions on the basketball board, but the abuse and name calling (dare I say bullying?) from Derka towards Immamac is banworthy. I don't want Derka to leave and enjoy his tennis contributions as well, but the first pages were beyond offensive. 

 

I think we need a truly impartial and objective view @JosephStang 

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Posted

Punk ass bitches go all the way back to the big bang of the innernets.

Shit I remember when I was bullied by some assholes on shaggy then I showed up at their tailgate party.

Those pussies had nothing to say then.

The Wire Code GIF

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Posted
8 minutes ago, chainsaw said:

Truly prime content would be a livestream of Surly Court, immamac presiding, with real lawyers on both sides arguing the case.

Only if they wear white wigs, frilly tops, hose and high heels, because horse riding you know. 

Posted
7 minutes ago, troph said:

How could I forget pilots error. Silly me. 

 

IMG_4534.jpeg

This site has an ugly history of harboring bigots and somehow the line is drawn with Derka.

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Posted
2 hours ago, Brew said:

There was a simple solution to this issue

bob and i were 99.9% of the way to that solution, and im not the one who came in and blew the whole thing up. 

again, you either trust bob’s judgment or immamac’s. bob was ready to permaban motown for bullying/directly and repeatedly disobeying the one rule bob gave him. since when do you know bob to take IP banning lightly? 

then immamac comes in, totally out of the loop, overrides and undoes everything bob has been doing in this matter, suddenly threatens to ban ME, the guy who has been following bob’s insteuctions/working with no IRL, then makes this thread a banner at the top of every page to draw attention to it and, in his mind, start a derka pile-on. he’s proud of himself for this.

so you either trust bob’s judgment or immamac’s. it really is that simple. and if you trust bob, then you cannot possibly condone a single decision that immamac has made throughout this entire process.

Posted (edited)

The choice is not between the judgment or character of either Immamac or BL.

It is a question of rank between an owner and a mod.

The owner has offered remedies to the situation, which have been refused.  Now all of your hopes lie with what a mod told you in a side discussion, and even with that, it is a direct result of your own refusal to remedy the situation in a manner that is reasonable, yet differs from your preference.

Edited by Iceman
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Posted
15 minutes ago, Iceman said:

what a mod told you in a side discussion

What I want to know is why this mod's judgment was abruptly disregarded. It might make sense to me if motown was some sort of elite poster who drives engagement and good for business, or if what motown was being banned for was not even arguably bannable.

Like I said before, I don't like disputes to be resolved on the basis of who has more rep (clearly that's Derka), but that's less problematic to me than the particular circumstances being reported by Derka. According to him, an attempt to handle this matter face-to-face by a mod who went above and beyond and all his work that went into that was totally scrapped.

Like Iceman says,

22 minutes ago, Iceman said:

question of rank between an owner and a mod.

That can be true and unpersuasive at the same time. I'm expressing a Jeff Goldblum-ian concern about the should moreso than the could.

Posted

hE's ThE sItE oWnEr

Fuck off.

He doesn't own the community. He clearly thinks he does given his behavior in the past several months. I guess if he wants to be Katy then he'll end up blowing this site up in similar fashion.

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Posted (edited)
53 minutes ago, chainsaw said:

What I want to know is why this mod's judgment was abruptly disregarded. It might make sense to me if motown was some sort of elite poster who drives engagement and good for business, or if what motown was being banned for was not even arguably bannable.

Like I said before, I don't like disputes to be resolved on the basis of who has more rep (clearly that's Derka), but that's less problematic to me than the particular circumstances being reported by Derka. According to him, an attempt to handle this matter face-to-face by a mod who went above and beyond and all his work that went into that was totally scrapped.

Like Iceman says,

That can be true and unpersuasive at the same time. I'm expressing a Jeff Goldblum-ian concern about the should moreso than the could.

He laid out his reasoning earlier in the thread. On the mod/owner issue, I’m not going to speak for black lab, but that involvement sounds a whole lot more like trying to look out for / help Derka’s well being than dealing with a random poster from the internet. I commend him for the personal involvement. Derka is clearly in one of those times he could use it.

The issue with the other poster ultimately doesn’t matter, Derka can put him on ignore. Instead, Derka has said repeatedly he refuses to do it so he can see what he says about him to report it. Then he has a come apart on the site owner that clearly told him how to handle it. I’m not sure how he expected this to go at this point. Sometimes you have to remember that we are here because we are allowed to stay. That can always change just like the site can die on the vine if enough people don’t agree with the way it is run as has been proven in the past.

Edited by Brew
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Posted

I will say allowing this to play out in a thread is pretty shitty though. There is nothing positive for Derka that comes out of the slow burn. If you wanted to ban him, the best thing would have just been to ban him. Everyone knows his issues and this just feels like imma kicking him in the nuts a few times on the way out the door as he was never going quietly. He should have banned for some period, let things calm down, and then discuss whether he was coming back.

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, Brew said:

Derka can put him on ignore.

I find that unpersuasive because Ignore was always an option, and there would have been no need for all that intervention on black lab's part if Derka thought Ignore would be an adequate solution. For all that effort to go wasted is what I take issue with.

Edited by chainsaw
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Posted
23 minutes ago, Brian Fantana said:

hE's ThE sItE oWnEr

Fuck off.

He doesn't own the community. He clearly thinks he does given his behavior in the past several months. I guess if he wants to be Katy then he'll end up blowing this site up in similar fashion.

BANNED. 

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Brew said:

I will say allowing this to play out in a thread is pretty shitty though. There is nothing positive for Derka that comes out of the slow burn. If you wanted to ban him, the best thing would have just been to ban him. Everyone knows his issues and this just feels like imma kicking him in the nuts a few times on the way out the door as he was never going quietly. He should have banned for some period, let things calm down, and then discuss whether he was coming back.

After reading this, I completely agree. The thread as run its course and is not a goodbye thread. Time to do what you need to do Imma but letting this linger through Monday isnt right. And delete the thread after please. No reason to keep it running either.

Posted

I didn’t make the thread. Derka obviously wants to post about the tournament and people want that this isn’t a goodbye thread this is a thread to maintain a level of openness on what is going on. 

Posted
16 hours ago, troph said:

You and I could banter back and forth ok. Hey that’s a stupid take. Ok. Folks goat him into a reaction so they can argue with him and tell him how much he overreacts. The goal isn’t to converse but to cause the reaction and then blame him for it.  It’s more about intent. You tell me my take is stupid you’re probably pretty genuine about it. Those constantly goating derka do it to get the rise then slam him for it. Then tell him to take a break for his mental health. It’s fucking gas lighting and it’s bullying.

*goad / goading / to goad

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, nineliveslost said:

I don' think we can ever 100% agree on anything besides OU hate and cancer.

Wait. Are we for or against cancer?

2 hours ago, shadow_operative said:

so you either trust bob’s judgment or immamac’s

Star Trek Kirk GIF

5 hours ago, Armybrat said:

WTF is VPN?

I barely know what IP is from the IPIHB forum.

 

IP is Internet Protocol. It's how computers talk to each other all around the world. IP Address is your computer's address. It's 4 numbers between 0-255.

You'll note that's only 4 billion possible addresses, when there's definitely more devices than that in the world. So to allow more computers to talk, we have Private Networks. That little box that your internet company uses to connect you to the internet creates a private network -- you can have a bunch of devices in your house, each has its own address, but they all show the same IP Address to the rest of the world when they connect outside of that. So all the devices in your house show the same IP Address to Surly when they connect to it, and that box (the "router") your internet bozos gave you knows which device to send traffic to.

[Nerds: Yes, I know about IPv6. We're not going there today. Neither is the rest of the world LOL]

Now VPN is Virtual Private Network. It's like the private network in your house, but it does some funky things to make it look like your computer is actually in Sweden or the Bahamas or even someplace really obscure like Canada. When you connect to e.g. Surlyhorns.com from a VPN, the IP looks different from the one that's at your house.

 

4 hours ago, MissingInAction said:

JFC

 

@JFKFC?

 

3 hours ago, troph said:

How could I forget pilots error. Silly me. 

 

IMG_4534.jpeg

 

Ooooh, that guy. Yeah I don't know what his problem is.

Edited by Rimbo
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Posted
1 hour ago, immamac said:

Derka obviously wants to post about the tournament and people want that this isn’t a goodbye thread this is a thread to maintain a level of openness on what is going on. 

Have you really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?

Posted

I've been around since Shaggy but mainly as a lurker for sports but also for other topics and purposely stay off CR and appreciate the mods shutting down discussions that should be in CR - if I want that shit, I go to other sites. Talking shit - outside of the "normal" Surly shit most people give each other on here which I actually appreciate - should get you banned...  His site, his rules...  It's the frigging internet - who cares if you and you momma and a mod had discussions.  Go somewhere else if your feelings get hurt and you can't take it - you got thousands of other choices... (Yea, I'm old school but tough shit...) I've never blocked anyone and just ignore stupid people or just ignore those disagree with - at least on here. Opinions are like assholes - everyone has one but I can chose to ignore what I want... That's what the scroll wheel is for on your mouse. Bye Derka! Play with fire and get burned...

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Posted
12 minutes ago, CycleTex87 said:

*goad / goading / to goad

No

*she / her / hers god dammit.

 

Yeah I figured that one out. I failed all my spelling tests, sue me, I dare ya. Ha.

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Posted
6 minutes ago, Prepuce of Doom said:

Not so fast, my friend - you probably assumed I typed all that with my fingers, didn't you?

Dammit you used chatGPT and it hallucinated ? 

Posted
41 minutes ago, Prepuce of Doom said:

Speaking from personal experience, it can sometimes be hard to know when trying to defuse a situation with humor is a helpful and appropriate approach, and when it's just throwing gasoline on the fire. To me, this falls squarely into the second category.

I would like to think that if given the benefit of hindsight and an opportunity to go back in time ~36 hours, Derka and Immamac would each choose to do things differently both in terms of what led to this situation, but especially in terms of what's happened and how they've conducted themselves as it's unfolded. 

I don't think it's right for there to be such a gulf between what a moderator (and former site owner) promises and what the current site owner does instead, but I also don't think it's reasonable to expect Immamac, Blacklab, and all other mods to always be constantly up in each others' shit. We can't expect a hive mind to exist between them. They all have lives outside of Surly. 

Running a message board is thankless work. Immamac takes a lot of crap (mostly good natured, I think) when the tech side of things fuck up, but I don't think he ever gets the equivalent amount of appreciation when things are running smoothly. And that's wholly separate from the babysitting of personalities and all the human drama bullshit that he presumably has to endure. 

So thanks for doing all the tech shit and dealing with the drama too, @immamac. Your time and efforts are appreciated more than we collectively acknowledge.

But I think you've misplayed your hand here pretty significantly. 

And Derka - you take a lot of shit. Far more than anyone should have to. It's bullshit that the onus is mostly on you to change, but your coping, maturity, and self-awareness has improved dramatically over the years. I hope this doesn't come off as condescending, but you've made tremendous progress - don't throw it all away in a tantrum here. 

And it stinks that you feel betrayed by the "bait and switch" that you perceive between Blacklab's approach to the situation and Immamac's. But to borrow a phrase from The Wire, the price of the brick has changed.

Derka - just accept the imperfect solution of blocking your tormentors. Immamac - Derka certainly earned himself a timeout, but please rethink the permanence of it. Both of you can do better with each other. 

I think there's still a lot of room for sensible resolution and more mature behavior by both sides here, and I hope you both can see how you could have handled things differently and better, and how you each owe each other an apology. You can swallow a little pride, give each other the benefit of the doubt, and build a bridge and get the fuck over it, or else you can stick to your guns and needlessly fuck things up all over the place and shit on the rest of the community in the process. 

Banned. 

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Posted
1 minute ago, Prepuce of Doom said:

I was making the (admittedly oblique and nonsensical) implication that I typed it all out with my foreskin. 

Whats Going On What GIF by ABC Network

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Posted

Over the past years, I’ve moved into directing larger and larger teams and eventually a hard truth has to be learned all around: when things go sideways, it matters less about who was in the right and more about who’s more willing to cooperate to fix stuff. Not always satisfying but that’s how it is. 

I haven’t been around near as long in this community and haven’t got the history with Derka. He loves his school and adds a lot.

To put it in hoops terms, Derka, I know it looked like the three was open. It wasn’t and you can take the layup or come away with nothing. Just try out the ignore feature and then if it doesn’t work, you’ll likely find more receptiveness to your preferred solution. 

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Posted

 

26 minutes ago, Prepuce of Doom said:

Running a message board is thankless work. Immamac takes a lot of crap (mostly good natured, I think) when the tech side of things fuck up, but I don't think he ever gets the equivalent amount of appreciation when things are running smoothly. And that's wholly separate from the babysitting of personalities and all the human drama bullshit that he presumably has to endure. 

So thanks for doing all the tech shit and dealing with the drama too, @immamac. Your time and efforts are appreciated more than we collectively acknowledge.

just want to emphasize this. i almost posted something along these lines yesterday but decided to refrain...but yeah, sometimes i observe the drama or bitching that goes on and i'm just like wtf, as far as i know imma's not only doing this for free, it's actually costing him money, he's got a regular life, and job, and family, this is his spare time 'hobby' i assume, and it's pretty damn smoothly run all things considered. he has no analysts or QA/QC or testers, there are thousands of members, not to mention the organization of HHs, road trips, tailgates and NIL stuff in recent years...all ultimately to benefit the Texas Longhorns

and me, bc i love this community and frankly it's the only place that kept me out of a really deep, dark hole during covid.

i do know he has help, but ultimately he voluntarily took on a pretty unwieldy and unthankful role. maybe he did it for the fame lol. but my reaction is often 'holy crap' at the amount of shit he puts up with.

and i have made a point several times in the past to acknowledge and thank him for the efforts, exactly for the reasons you say, @Prepuce of Doom

in this particular instance, while i honestly pay no attention to basketball, i am pretty familiar with the online melodrama and persecution complex often played out with the poster. more than once i have thought 'oh my gawd just shut up and get over it already!' 🙄 while also 😆 at the whole thing. and i actually drafted something yesterday expressing that in this thread but didn't post it, bc I just thought 'meh, dude obviously has some more serious issues, he probably shouldn't be on surly at all with his sensitivities' and decided not to.

ultimately i don't have to put up with any of this, it's my choice and everybody else's to even be here. the owner can do as he pleases. i would be pretty distraught if i were banned (DON'T YOU DO IT!!)...but i'm pretty thick-skinned and also don't make a point of being a PITA to a guy that is basically just doing all of this for shits and giggles. 

🤘

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Posted

Credit where credit is due, I like Shadow_Operative2.0's tennis contributions.

*Please don't ban me until after I win the surly bracket. Thx. 

Posted
5 minutes ago, Welshy said:

Credit where credit is due, I like Shadow_Operative2.0's tennis contributions.

*Please don't ban me until after I win the surly bracket. Thx. 

Look out, 2.0 will go unhinged Gatling gun on you confusing him with 1.0. Crazy but a different kind and confirmed not derka. You’ve been warned, now duck.

 

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